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Old 2008-07-01, 04:49   Link #381
Anh_Minh
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Westlo View Post
Maybe Sheryl became a lot more popular after this episode? Sympathy added to her already strong character can add a lot more fans... also people on the fence or just on Ranka's side may have got pissed off at Ranka's "Oh no I can't give my birthday present" reaction (please grow the fuck up Ranka by series end) to Sheryl's sickness and hostage situation. I know a few hardcore Ranka fans who didn't like that...
I think you took her "happy birthday" a bit too seriously. Sure, she angsted at the fact he choose to spend his birthday with Sheryl and not her, but she really came because she was worried about Alto and Sheryl (OK, mostly Alto...) Her first reaction, hearing the news, wasn't "Drat, I'll never get to wish him a happy birthday, now", but "Can't you go and save them?".

She just didn't want to embarass Alto, or herself, by saying "I came to save you!", so she kept it to a safer topic like "happy birthday". It was cute and somewhat humorous.

What she did was brave and selfless, just as when Alto jumped into Gilliam's cockpit. Nobody would have faulted her if she'd refused to jump into a firefight with her voice and a few loudspeakers as her only weapon. and that's not even taking into account the potential career wrecking aspect (what if the fold booster had malfunctionned and she missed her debut? For that matter, after that accident, she may yet miss it.)
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Old 2008-07-01, 05:02   Link #382
Wesley84
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Originally Posted by Anh_Minh View Post
, and that's not even taking into account the potential career wrecking aspect (what if the fold booster had malfunctionned and she missed her debut? For that matter, after that accident, she may yet miss it.)
True, but there's a fair chance they'll be able to put a nice spin on it. Making her into a hero after diffusing the hostage crisis is a given, but also turning it into a triumph over tradegy/survivor's story after the plane crash with the search leading to no avail, will generate all kinds of positive media attention, ranging from sympathy, relief, admiration...

Pretty much the only way missing her debut won't be the best thing that ever happened to her is if something more important than her takes place. Like a mass Vajra attack on Frontier. Basically she's completely forgotten in the chaos, and the only thing that people will remember in the aftermath was that she missed her own concert.
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Old 2008-07-01, 05:08   Link #383
Westlo
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Anh_Minh the scene I'm referring to is this.

Michael - It's just an excuse
Ranka - Alto-kun...
Ranka - Hey Michael-kun, aren't you going to save them, Alto-kun is in danger!
Michael - Impossible... we won't make it in time
Ranka - No way *I still haven't given him my present to Alto-kun yet, I still haven't complained about it yet... I...*

She wasn't dumb enough to say it out loud but since we get into her mind we can see what she really thinks... So what about a Zentradi rebellion and every other hostage but Alto, he hasn't got my present

One of my friends on another forum who's like the exact opposite of me when it comes to picking winners (me = 100%, him =... under 10%) is a massive Ranka fan, 12's the first episode he's enjoyed in a long time, he hates Sheryl a lot and wishes she would die. Even he was disappointed by the above conversation by Ranka...
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Old 2008-07-01, 05:17   Link #384
Wesley84
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Originally Posted by Westlo View Post
She wasn't dumb enough to say it out loud but since we get into her mind we can see what she really thinks... So what about a Zentradi rebellion and every other hostage but Alto, he hasn't got my present
That's somehow worse than Sheryl doing the nearly same exact thing, with only a little bit of personal guilt mixed in for the difference?
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Old 2008-07-01, 06:43   Link #385
Anh_Minh
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Westlo View Post
Anh_Minh the scene I'm referring to is this.

Michael - It's just an excuse
Ranka - Alto-kun...
Ranka - Hey Michael-kun, aren't you going to save them, Alto-kun is in danger!
Michael - Impossible... we won't make it in time
Ranka - No way *I still haven't given him my present to Alto-kun yet, I still haven't complained about it yet... I...*

She wasn't dumb enough to say it out loud but since we get into her mind we can see what she really thinks... So what about a Zentradi rebellion and every other hostage but Alto, he hasn't got my present

One of my friends on another forum who's like the exact opposite of me when it comes to picking winners (me = 100%, him =... under 10%) is a massive Ranka fan, 12's the first episode he's enjoyed in a long time, he hates Sheryl a lot and wishes she would die. Even he was disappointed by the above conversation by Ranka...
I'm not sure it's a sign of selfishness and messed up priorities as much as a sign of being afraid to lose him forever. It's practically cliché. Like, when a parent die, and the child can only think "Damn, I didn't say "have a good day" this morning", or "why did our last conversation have to be an argument?". Of course those things are inconsequential. But somehow, they're what floats at the surface of the mind, so we don't have to face the real tragedy.
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Old 2008-07-01, 09:17   Link #386
Tak
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Originally Posted by herbert View Post
It's strange. I wonder if Sheryl is really much more popular among Japanese, why it isn't reflected on jp polls as it shows so prominent in en and cn counterparts (in which you need count how many times more votes for Sheryl than as for Ranka).

If we go to check jp polls, you'd find the Sheryl/Ranka votes ratios are very close to 1 in general.
I am not talking about the polls, I am talking about the immediate reaction after this episode (12). Sheryl supporting posts have been overwhelming. There were a few comments to Ranka (about how cute she is), but Sheryl currently > everything right now. I find virtually no posts supporting Ranka in her defense. Almost everyone feel Sheryl had been screwed over, big time. Of course, several extremists would go on and say something like "how dare Ranka do that to her!" ... etc.

- Tak
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Old 2008-07-01, 20:00   Link #387
justinstrife
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Anh_Minh View Post
I'm not sure it's a sign of selfishness and messed up priorities as much as a sign of being afraid to lose him forever. It's practically cliché. Like, when a parent die, and the child can only think "Damn, I didn't say "have a good day" this morning", or "why did our last conversation have to be an argument?". Of course those things are inconsequential. But somehow, they're what floats at the surface of the mind, so we don't have to face the real tragedy.
Sheryl also is Ranka's idol and somewhat of a friend. Sheryl's been throwing her support behind Ranka in her pursuing her career as a singer.

Ranka didn't once think about, or talk about Sheryl. It was Alto and his birthday. Nothing about Sheryl. She could have been dead and Ranka wouldn't have cared at that moment.

If The situation was reversed, do you really believe that Sheryl would react the same way? Ranka was obsessing about Alto's birthday, and didn't even give a second thought about her 'idol'.

This episode might have been great for you, but it knocked Ranka far down on my list of girls to like in this series. She was #2 or #3 depending on the episode, but she's put herself behind Lt. Glass and Grace now.
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Old 2008-07-01, 20:42   Link #388
Tak
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For a person who had helped pushed her career along, who encouraged her, who even offered her opportunities, Sheryl sure is being treated like sidewalk trash by the newly risen Ranka right now.

Alto notwithstanding, he doesn't know how to feel about Sheryl yet, but Ranka on the other hand, could have be a little bit more concerned for her "idol".

But she just left it to Mikhail and took off. According to Episode 13's summary, Sheryl will be looking for them. Its funny she is more concerned about their safety.

- Tak
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Old 2008-07-01, 20:49   Link #389
Westlo
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Originally Posted by justinstrife View Post
This episode might have been great for you, but it knocked Ranka far down on my list of girls to like in this series. She was #2 or #3 depending on the episode, but she's put herself behind Lt. Glass and Grace now.
Yeah Ranka was my 3rd fav behind Sheryl and Klan, but this episode combined with hot Cathy fan art has made me push Cathy to #3.
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Old 2008-07-01, 21:36   Link #390
ani_d
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tak
I am not talking about the polls, I am talking about the immediate reaction after this episode (12). Sheryl supporting posts have been overwhelming. There were a few comments to Ranka (about how cute she is), but Sheryl currently > everything right now. I find virtually no posts supporting Ranka in her defense. Almost everyone feel Sheryl had been screwed over, big time. Of course, several extremists would go on and say something like "how dare Ranka do that to her!" ... etc.
I think it's just that more Sheryl fans went online to find comfort and express themselves lol The Ranka fans are probably just too busy rejoicing and buying her album or laughing at the lamentations for Sheryl. When Kerry and Bush ran for US presidency, I thought for sure US of A was Kerry's nation since he was always leading the polls. In the end, Bush's supportees which were the oldies were just too bedridden to participate on polls but were able to vote in the elections.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Westlo
She wasn't dumb enough to say it out loud but since we get into her mind we can see what she really thinks... So what about a Zentradi rebellion and every other hostage but Alto, he hasn't got my present
Spoiler for tt!:


....so if Ranka looked ungrateful here then let it be. I'm not holding this against her though since her concern for Alto managed to save the day all the same.

Besides, if Ranka's "inconsiderate" for only thinking about Alto's safety and giving him her present, then Sheryl shouldn't get away too. Instead of feeling responsible for the other hostages and the chaos she caused, she could only think about 'Alto's present'. Not only that, instead of giving Ranka credit for saving everyone--including her--she felt the opposite. Proper reaction should be admitting her mistake (that she didn't take care of her body) and acknowledging Ranka's growth as an artist. Sheryl seems to always support her when it comes to her career--unless she never meant those from the start. ^_^ It's hard to tell though due to lack of focus.

Anyway, that sure wasn't the proper reaction, but I'm not going to take it against her too since the drama's better this way.
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Old 2008-07-01, 22:29   Link #391
Tak
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Originally Posted by ani_d View Post
I think it's just that more Sheryl fans went online to find comfort and express themselves lol The Ranka fans are probably just too busy rejoicing and buying her album or laughing at the lamentations for Sheryl.


... you don't know man, you just don't know...

See, I read these forums often, and when 12 aired, there were praises for Ranka (so they aren't just laughing or buying CDs), but also an overwhelming universal lamentation for Sheryl's fall. This also includes many (less extreme) Ranka fans.

Anyway there are talks about シェリルの反撃 (Sheryl's retaliation), and I am quite interested in finding out just how this will be accomplished in the later episodes...

- Tak
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Old 2008-07-01, 23:11   Link #392
daimonth
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She did try to apologize- by trying to crawl out of her sick bed to do her job. In response to Alto saying that 'isn't it a pros duty to take care of her body as well?' Sheryl reponded by saying that is right she doesn't have an excuse and tried to get up. Alto stopped her then she responded by saying that she said she would/promised to give him a present. She is simply adding to her arguement with another point that is personally relevant to the person that is stopping her. Which to Alto is the gift of flying.

As far as Galaxy survivor, again you need to read into the context of the scene as above. Sheryl was trying to explain her action and try to sing to fix everything. First of all the survivor is a rumour, a slim one at that. Second of all finding Galaxy survivor is not immediate relevant to the discussion as singing wont allow her to to find them. As a matter of fact I believe Sheryl most likely delegated that duty to Grace since her skill is more suited. With Grace's skill their imprisonment don't really mean much in locating and perhaps even communicating with the survivors.

Last edited by daimonth; 2008-07-01 at 23:25.
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Old 2008-07-01, 23:21   Link #393
SoldierOfDarkness
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tak View Post
For a person who had helped pushed her career along, who encouraged her, who even offered her opportunities, Sheryl sure is being treated like sidewalk trash by the newly risen Ranka right now.

Alto notwithstanding, he doesn't know how to feel about Sheryl yet, but Ranka on the other hand, could have be a little bit more concerned for her "idol".

But she just left it to Mikhail and took off. According to Episode 13's summary, Sheryl will be looking for them. Its funny she is more concerned about their safety.

- Tak
Never actually realized that kind of thought until now. Though I suspect that Sherly is the unfortunate vicitim of someone's machinations.
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Old 2008-07-02, 00:16   Link #394
Anh_Minh
I disagree with you all.
 
 
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Originally Posted by justinstrife View Post
Sheryl also is Ranka's idol and somewhat of a friend. Sheryl's been throwing her support behind Ranka in her pursuing her career as a singer.

Ranka didn't once think about, or talk about Sheryl. It was Alto and his birthday. Nothing about Sheryl. She could have been dead and Ranka wouldn't have cared at that moment.

If The situation was reversed, do you really believe that Sheryl would react the same way? Ranka was obsessing about Alto's birthday, and didn't even give a second thought about her 'idol'.

This episode might have been great for you, but it knocked Ranka far down on my list of girls to like in this series. She was #2 or #3 depending on the episode, but she's put herself behind Lt. Glass and Grace now.
Yeah, OK, she could have shown more concern for Sheryl. But as I said, I don't believe it's truly an obsession for Alto's birthday.
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Old 2008-07-02, 02:59   Link #395
Westlo
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Originally Posted by ani_d View Post
I think it's just that more Sheryl fans went online to find comfort and express themselves lol The Ranka fans are probably just too busy rejoicing and buying her album or laughing at the lamentations for Sheryl. When Kerry and Bush ran for US presidency, I thought for sure US of A was Kerry's nation since he was always leading the polls. In the end, Bush's supportees which were the oldies were just too bedridden to participate on polls but were able to vote in the elections.
Horrible analogy since it takes 5 seconds to type, "Ranka ftw lol @ Sheryl". As for being too busy buying cds there's still 8000 less Ranka fans compared to Sheryl going by opening week figures

Quote:
Spoiler for tt!:


....so if Ranka looked ungrateful here then let it be. I'm not holding this against her though since her concern for Alto managed to save the day all the same.
Yes that scene didn't make Hiromi look good, just as this scene didn't make Ranka look good.

Quote:
Besides, if Ranka's "inconsiderate" for only thinking about Alto's safety and giving him her present, then Sheryl shouldn't get away too. Instead of feeling responsible for the other hostages and the chaos she caused, she could only think about 'Alto's present'. Not only that, instead of giving Ranka credit for saving everyone--including her--she felt the opposite. Proper reaction should be admitting her mistake (that she didn't take care of her body) and acknowledging Ranka's growth as an artist. Sheryl seems to always support her when it comes to her career--unless she never meant those from the start. ^_^ It's hard to tell though due to lack of focus.
daimonth covered most of it but I think you missed something on Sheryl's reaction. Michael "Here's your birthday present Alto!!". Not only did Ranka save the day with her signing when Sheryl couldn't due to her sickness (Sheryl doesn't know she was just an excuse) but Ranka delivered her birthday present while she was unable to give hers to Alto. It was a combination of the two things and Grace just rubbed it in, if she didn't react like that she wouldn't be human.
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Old 2008-07-02, 03:59   Link #396
herbert
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Originally Posted by Westlo View Post
Yes that scene didn't make Hiromi look good, just as this scene didn't make Ranka look good.
Are you that Westlo I know of?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ani_d View Post
Spoiler for tt!:
Spoiler for True Tear:


Quote:
Originally Posted by Anh_Minh View Post
Yeah, OK, she could have shown more concern for Sheryl. But as I said, I don't believe it's truly an obsession for Alto's birthday.
No, you're right, it's not. The birthyday gift is more symbolic. It's in fact an obsession for Ranka's Alto.
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Old 2008-07-02, 04:57   Link #397
Anh_Minh
I disagree with you all.
 
 
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I'll also add, justinstrife: you say the episode was great for me, but with regards to the love triangle, I'm pretty much on the fence. I like both girls. So as happy as I was for Ranka, I felt sorry for Sheryl.

But thing is, I don't blame Ranka for it. It's not Ranka's fault Sheryl got sick, or that a bunch of Zentran lolicons rebelled.

And I don't begrudge her her time spent with Alto, or that she was too busy to go "wah wah Alto" to go "wah wah Sheryl". Just as I didn't begrudge Sheryl for offering her gift which, exceptional circumstances notwithstanding (starting with the mutiny and the very existence of the special fold booster), would have made Alto miss Ranka's first concert. Just as he missed her cookies.

Frankly, being the softy that I am, I'd have prefered more frequent switches between the two girls, but less violent ones. Sheryl's been pulling ahead for so long, the fall is only more brutal.
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Old 2008-07-02, 05:10   Link #398
TwilightHack
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Originally Posted by Anh_Minh View Post
But thing is, I don't blame Ranka for it. It's not Ranka's fault Sheryl got sick, or that a bunch of Zentran lolicons rebelled.
I rofled, quite hard because it's true.

Quote:
Frankly, being the softy that I am, I'd have prefered more frequent switches between the two girls, but less violent ones. Sheryl's been pulling ahead for so long, the fall is only more brutal.
I agree. In the future it'll probably be that way... seeing as Ranka and Sheryl are on almost equal footing atm.
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Old 2008-07-02, 05:37   Link #399
Slick_rick
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I don't see how you can call Ranka's worrying about Alto's gift and not about Sheryl anymore worse than Sheryl's own actions. When Ranka saved them, was she happy? Was she glad about that her and the other captives being saved? Was she happy about avoiding a senseless battle? Was she happy about the lives that were saved? Nope she was upset. Ranka showed her up and was able to do something she wasn't. Not only that but Ranka was able to give Alto his birthday present while she was unable too. So Sheryl's somehow now the victim and Ranka the bad person? How about all the other times when Sheryl showed her up? Are you going to break out the cross and burn Ranka in effigy for doing the same thing Sheryl's been doing for most of the series?
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Old 2008-07-02, 05:49   Link #400
Westlo
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^ I've missed your unique perspective!

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Are you that Westlo I know of?
Look at one stage I thought she wasn't going to call period and thought fuck she's finished. My favs I'm rather hard on...
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