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Old 2008-08-05, 15:07   Link #1081
stray
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lone_wolf View Post
The previous poster just needed a briefing of what occurred in the past regarding the person she had mentioned, and I simply provided my observation.

If you want to insist that is a personal attack, that's fine (I personally don't care what people assume) but I just call them like I see them since I myself am not heavily active in these debates. I'm like an outsiders POV and I just happen to be quite "frank" when recalling past events.
I wasn't trying to insist that at all, or single you out per se; but quite frankly after seeing people attack each other's character rather than any real issue on way too many occasions lately... let's just say my face is starting to hurt from all the facepalming. And... ani_d is a pretty charged subject...

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Originally Posted by Tak View Post
And by the end of the show, we will find out what we've been through, our arguments, debates, anger, and every emotion we express toward this show had been pointless, that and the outcome of the show had no impact whatsoever to our well being in real life.
Sheryl ganbatte!!!
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Old 2008-08-05, 15:58   Link #1082
Anh_Minh
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Quote:
Originally Posted by erfine View Post
Your original idea about Sheryl and Leon was meant to get a reaction from people. It's obviously a silly idea, which shouldn't be taken seriously.
Well done. That was indeed an attempt at humor. Have you caught, however, why I find it funny?

Quote:
But when Ranka was raised, if this was all in good fun, you would have said something like "Oh, Ranka's busy down on the other end" or something equally light-hearted as a show of good faith.
Too bad, you missed a turn. It started going pear shaped when, for making a tongue in cheek answer to a tongue in cheek comment, an answer that failed either to be reverential of Sheryl or spiteful of Leon enough, I'm not quite clear on this, I got accused of being a troll.

Quote:
Instead, you raised a series of formal arguments on why Ranka ought not to enter into a relationship with Leon, in an attempt to rationalize your earlier statements (which were supposedly a joke to begin with!)
It was a joke. But if I think about it (bad habit of mine - thinking about stuff), I truly have fewer complaints about Leon getting with Sheryl:
- age difference: Icky in both cases, but in Ranka's case, it's made worse by Ranka's lack of maturity, while in Sheryl's, it's mitigated by her adultness. Is it wrong, though? Debatable.
- Work relationship: Well, Leon isn't leading some project that suddenly took over Sheryl's career. Not officially, anyway. If he were to, you know, get Sheryl in the same program as Ranka, I'd have the same objections. Here? I don't. Except maybe for his relationship with Sheryl's manager, which remains to define. So, for that matter, is the relationship between Sheryl and her manager... Anyway, in Sheryl's case, it's all very vague. Needs more data. In Ranka's case? It'd look to suspiciously like sexual harassment.
- Infidelity: Same thing for both. Just because Kathy is trying to be unfaithful doesn't mean Leon should do the same. If they break up, though? It ceases to be relevant.

Quote:
As Magnus-kun pointed out earlier, you have some pent up aggression within you, and you want to displace it. But you're also very concious that your behavior is irrational, so you try to compensate by trying to provide a "rational" explanation for everything you wrote, including things that didn't require rational explanations in the first place (such as humor).

There's no problem about any of that, but let's all be frank about it.

Yah that's the way double standards usually work.

If Ranka's not mature enough to make that kind of choice, then she isn't mature enough to date Alto, either. Good luck trying to argue that Ranka isn't mature enough to date Leon but is mature enough to date Alto.
So you think a teenage relationship is the same as one with a large age difference? I don't. I'd have no problem with, say, a 12 year old kid making kissy faces at a 12 years old boy (or even 13 or 14). I'd have problems with her doing the same with a 30 years old guy. Or even 20.

It's the same here. But not as flagrant, because Ranka isn't as young. The wrongness is more debatable.

Quote:
Sure. That's a fine feeling right there. It's irrational, and it's honest. It doesn't feel right for me either.

Likewise, the reason why you have no problem putting Sheryl in that situation is simply because you just don't care as much about her.
I care differently. Ranka needs more protection and guidance. Sheryl needs companionship. Possibly she needs someone who won't take her bullshit, too, but I don't think she needs someone to tell her whom to date or not. She's past that.

Quote:
That's a fine sentiment to have too.

All this stuff about "Well, I've weighed the pros and cons of the situation, and my analysis leads to the conclusion that..." is utter nonsense. It's justification after the fact.
Maybe, maybe not. I like to think there is more to my feelings than mere knee jerk reflex.

Quote:
For the previous point, though, you made a big deal about Ranka not being a mature adult, and that she wasn't ready to take responsibility for her choices. So on that principle, I would expect that you would be equally "reserved" about a relationship between Ranka and Alto.
Adulthood isn't a binary question. As kids grow older, you thrust more responsibility and choices to them, you let them take more risks. A relationship with a boy her age - a fundamentally good kid, too - is, to my mind, much less risky than one with a 30 year old man who's - even ignoring the hints of darker agendas - more insistent about his own desires. YMMV.

Quote:
Usually the problem with dating a boss is a conflict of interest issue. But that's not relevant to Ranka, because she sits outside of the rank structure.
She doesn't sit outside the "I can make or break you" structure.

Quote:
Opinions are inevitably irrational and unfair. I wouldn't dream of faulting you for that. But someone who appears to be "fair" doesn't have opinions that are any more valid than someone who appears to be "unfair".
Opinions are more or less supported by actual arguments.

Quote:
Sure. "It's wrong" means that "I don't like it and you've no choice but to dislike it too."
"It's wrong" means it goes contrary to consensual values that we assume protect the welfare of society. Which is why we seldom have to argue the wrongness of murder.

Here, it's about statutory rape and sexual harassment. The lines are a bit blurrier.
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Old 2008-08-05, 19:07   Link #1083
MaiHikari
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I don't know why you're arguing about this. I think anyone with Leon is equally disturbing--be it Sheryl or Ranka. Even Grace, a multi-persona cyborg seemed too good for him. That guy creeps me out. I wouldn't be surprised if he's an alien in human shell.

Back to Sheryl. I believe she's gonna pull through even if she finds out the truth from Grace. Going through betrayal and self-identity crisis will make her stronger. Like she said, her fame wasn't brought by luck but by hard work. That in itself defines who she is, regardless of her origin. For example, she said she hated Galaxy, but she still wanted to protect it. It doesn't matter that the ship she came from was a horrible place, she made the decision to protect it because she's that's just who she is. She's Sheryl Nome and Sheryl Nome defines herself by her decisions and actions, not her past and origin. I think that's a consistent theme in the series.
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Old 2008-08-08, 01:52   Link #1084
Darial
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A poster on the Chinese BBS pointed out that Sheryl was really grabbing on to her hopes and dreams in the Lion OP. Too funny not to share.

Spoiler:
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Old 2008-08-08, 01:58   Link #1085
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darial View Post
A poster on the Chinese BBS pointed out that Sheryl was really grabbing on to her hopes and dreams in the Lion OP. Too funny not to share.

Spoiler:

LOL, I wouldn't be surprised if the boob grabbing works.


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Old 2008-08-08, 08:01   Link #1086
Tak
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lone_wolf View Post
LOL, I wouldn't be surprised if the boob grabbing works.


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Apparently, she is saving the right side for Alto Thats his hopes and dreams.

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Old 2008-08-08, 15:47   Link #1087
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*spills starbucks on my desk*

Wow. That's boob grabbing without any inhibitions. I guess people's sense of privacy and inhibitions change in the future. I can see it's already changed from the past decade. But hey, if you got it, kudos to you. It makes Ranka's swimsuit picture on the VF look like an unclothed pikachu.
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Old 2008-08-08, 23:25   Link #1088
Lanis
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Is that a wardrobe malfunction? That dress is covering nothing.
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Old 2008-08-08, 23:47   Link #1089
Westlo
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The dress was tailor made so it will enable Sheryl to hold onto her hopes and dreams as tightly as she can!
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Old 2008-08-09, 02:29   Link #1090
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I thought she was putting her hand over her heart until I realized she was squeezing a bit too much.
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Old 2008-08-09, 06:24   Link #1091
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that is too much fanservice for a short clip. But Alto saw everything before so it wont matter to him.
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Old 2008-08-09, 06:58   Link #1092
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Quote:
Originally Posted by linage View Post
that is too much fanservice for a short clip. But Alto saw everything before so it wont matter to him.
Of course it will. Every single damn time Sheryl shows anything to him he will get all embarrassed his nose will probably explode into a shower of blood and he will suddenly act like a 2 year old. For once I would like to see a male teenager in an anime act like a real human being when a girl comes on to them. I don't know very many guys past the age of 16 that wouldn't jump on the opportunity, quite literally, if anything like this happened to them.

Oh and Leon and Grace is the perfect match. He can finally have someone who can satisfy his yaoi doujinshi like S&M lust. Grace has the ability to look like a guy and yet be a woman not to mention throw him around easily. Must be Leon's dream come true.
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Old 2008-08-09, 07:03   Link #1093
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kilroy0097 View Post
Of course it will. Every single damn time Sheryl shows anything to him he will get all embarrassed his nose will probably explode into a shower of blood and he will suddenly act like a 2 year old. For once I would like to see a male teenager in an anime act like a real human being when a girl comes on to them. I don't know very many guys past the age of 16 that wouldn't jump on the opportunity, quite literally, if anything like this happened to them.
Now, now. Compared to other anime characters, Alto is actually quite mature around Sheryl. No "nose-bleeding", or somesuch.

Although I concur that no 17 year old in his right mind could resist a girl such as Sheryl actually coming on to him.
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Old 2008-08-09, 09:49   Link #1094
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Quote:
Originally Posted by magnuskn View Post
Now, now. Compared to other anime characters, Alto is actually quite mature around Sheryl. No "nose-bleeding", or somesuch.

Although I concur that no 17 year old in his right mind could resist a girl such as Sheryl actually coming on to him.
I bet a really really really gay guy could.
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Old 2008-08-09, 09:56   Link #1095
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Originally Posted by Prov1 View Post
I bet a really really really gay guy could.
Maybe Bobby. But Alto is not gay, just very,very, very focused on flying and people not thinking hes a girl.
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Old 2008-08-09, 10:07   Link #1096
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All right, big pictures coming up. Dont get mad, mods! The multi-posting of the Ranshe Mei picture is to make sure everyone gets a picture vs. picture comparison without scrolling too much.

.....

I hope this gives everyone a good comparison as to how the character designs of Sheryl and Ranshe Mei are very similar.

Now, as to the why of that, we obviously dont know. But I think it is a pretty long leap of faith to say that the production crew of Macross Frontier just screwed up on that account, seeing how they gave everyone else so distinctive designs.

So, to reiterate it, my guess is still that Sheryl and Ranshe Mei ( or even Mao Nome ) are *somehow* related.

Sheryl could well be a survivor of the 117th fleet, who got transferred to Macross Galaxy, where she landed on the streets.
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Old 2008-08-09, 11:08   Link #1097
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Quote:
Originally Posted by magnuskn View Post
All right, big pictures coming up. Dont get mad, mods! The multi-posting of the Ranshe Mei picture is to make sure everyone gets a picture vs. picture comparison without scrolling too much.


I hope this gives everyone a good comparison as to how the character designs of Sheryl and Ranshe Mei are very similar.

Now, as to the why of that, we obviously dont know. But I think it is a pretty long leap of faith to say that the production crew of Macross Frontier just screwed up on that account, seeing how they gave everyone else so distinctive designs.

So, to reiterate it, my guess is still that Sheryl and Ranshe Mei ( or even Mao Nome ) are *somehow* related.

Sheryl could well be a survivor of the 117th fleet, who got transferred to Macross Galaxy, where she landed on the streets.
I like your theory and all, but the green doctor isn't Mao Nome. It's the purple haired grandma in the middle...Ranka is probably that lady's daughter, and sheryl is related to the Nome family of course. She may have a more important role than we think.

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Old 2008-08-09, 11:32   Link #1098
Tak
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Yeah, Dr. Nome probably never married because of what happened in her childhood, and Ranshee isn't her daughter. After all, Ranshee is clearly... Chinese (at least in name).

- Tak
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Old 2008-08-09, 11:52   Link #1099
magnuskn
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Originally Posted by Tsukiyomi View Post
I like your theory and all, but the green doctor isn't Mao Nome. It's the purple haired grandma in the middle...Ranka is probably that lady's daughter, and sheryl is related to the Nome family of course. She may have a more important role than we think.

I think you didnt read my post very clearly. I said that Sheryl and Ranshe Mei seem to be obviously related. I threw in a "or even Mao Nome", because we have nothing so far as of what happened to Mao in her life, besides "Shes a doctor of some sort".

Sheryl has the same surename as Mao. She looks like Ranshe Mei. Coincidences happen in real life all the time, but in a tightly plotted series, they normally add up to a connection of some type. Its called "foreshadowing".
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Old 2008-08-09, 11:53   Link #1100
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tak View Post
Yeah, Dr. Nome probably never married because of what happened in her childhood, and Ranshee isn't her daughter. After all, Ranshee is clearly... Chinese (at least in name).

- Tak
what happened in her childhood doesn't mean anything. Also, dam man... Mao Nome's still alive? It was like 1999 when the attacks first started but for some reason it seems like such a long time. I still think she got married even though the dude in Macross Zero went to space with Sara Nome. Anyways, if Mao Nome is still alive, then Lynn Minmei can still be alive. So can Sara Nome and that dude. Also, that means the other two from Super Dimension are still alive. That means their son or daugther can be some1 from macross f
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