AnimeSuki Forums

Register Forum Rules FAQ Members List Social Groups Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   AnimeSuki Forum > Anime Discussion > Older Series > Code Geass

Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 2010-04-28, 06:54   Link #23241
Betteroffer
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by GundamFan0083 View Post
Actually that's not true.
It is actually. As has been said, the novels are not canon but in a Picture Drama after a little girl rages at Suzaku for killing her entire (civilian) family while conquering a territory in the EU, Gino plays it off by shrugging and happily saying "If you're strong you live, if you're weak you die. That is how things are." There is no hesitence in his voice or anything to imply he is dissatisfied with this policy.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GundamFan0083 View Post
Let us not forget that Gino is good friends with Suzaku (an eleven) and is attracted to Kallen (who he knows is half-Japanese).
Not too mention that Gino does become a Black Knight in the end of R2.
You don't have to hate something to be racist. All you have to do is believe that things should stay as they are when the situation is blatantly unfair for certain groups for arbitrary reasons. Britannia promoted Suzaku to KoR, but it doesn't stop being racist in every other facet of its existence, and Gino seemed quite happy, anxious even, to put down any rioting Japanese at the SAZ.

In any case, I would call the depth of Gino's interest in Suzaku and Kallen into question. Nothing is ever done to suggest there is anything beyond a novel fascination with "exotics" as he makes no clear attempts to understand them, but rather tries to get them to see things his way.

EDIT: As has also been mentioned, he rebelled against Lelouch when he was still playing the "Emperor of Justice" role and the last PD shows he was never made aware of Geass. He was rebelling against a ruler who valued equality, had assumed the throne for legitimate (by Britannia's standards) methods, and was (as far as he knew) endorsed by all of the core members of his nation's government (the nobels and royals of Pendragon).
Betteroffer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-04-28, 07:15   Link #23242
bladeofdarkness
Um-Shmum
 
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: at GNR, bringing you the truth, no matter how bad it hurts
Age: 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Betteroffer View Post
It is actually. As has been said, the novels are not canon but in a Picture Drama after a little girl rages at Suzaku for killing her entire (civilian) family while conquering a territory in the EU, Gino plays it off by shrugging and happily saying "If you're strong you live, if you're weak you die. That is how things are." There is no hesitence in his voice or anything to imply he is dissatisfied with this policy.
i completely forgot about that one
__________________
bladeofdarkness is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-04-28, 14:17   Link #23243
azul120
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by bladeofdarkness View Post
i don't mind "dirty fighter"
if you ever find yourself in a fair fight, its because your tactics suck
I know. Just tossing that out as a somewhat facetious aside. (see: Arson Murder And Jaywalking)

Though come to think of it, that he can be so nonchalant about it is a little unsettling in a way.
azul120 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-04-28, 20:51   Link #23244
Betteroffer
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
To add to my arguement that Gino's friendship with Suzaku was a shallow interest in something "exotic" there is the fact that he never once appears with Suzaku in the FLEIJA crater, nor is it implied that he had tried to contact him.

Instead he plays pool, and the role of grief counselor is left to Jeremiah.

When Suzaku comes back, talking about things that run completely contrary to his established character, Gino turns hostile on him rather than considering the possibility that blowing up a city may have had an adverse effect on his eighteen year-old psyche.

The creators point out that Kallen's defining trait is devotion, while Gino's seems to be anything but. Similarly there is the comment that while she would never cheat on her lover, she would never forgive one for cheating on her.

@Azul: What could be called unsettling is the fact that he uses this on Suzaku in Turn 22 at the same time as he is trying to talk him out of fighting for Lelouch. As well, he fires both of the harkens at the Albion's torso. These are kill-shots, not disarming or disabling shots.
Betteroffer is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-04-28, 20:59   Link #23245
GundamFan0083
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: classified
Quote:
Originally Posted by Betteroffer View Post
It is actually. As has been said, the novels are not canon but in a Picture Drama after a little girl rages at Suzaku for killing her entire (civilian) family while conquering a territory in the EU, Gino plays it off by shrugging and happily saying "If you're strong you live, if you're weak you die. That is how things are." There is no hesitence in his voice or anything to imply he is dissatisfied with this policy.
What Gino is clearly describing there is what is known as the Right of Conquest, which in the world of Code Geass would certainly still be enforce since there is no United States to help found the United Nations which ended that practice.
Thus, Gino (and Suzaku, heck all of the KOTR) are simply following international law for that universe.
Therefore, your example is moot and I stand by what I have already said.

Quote:
You don't have to hate something to be racist. All you have to do is believe that things should stay as they are when the situation is blatantly unfair for certain groups for arbitrary reasons. Britannia promoted Suzaku to KoR, but it doesn't stop being racist in every other facet of its existence, and Gino seemed quite happy, anxious even, to put down any rioting Japanese at the SAZ.
You clearly do not know what racism is.
Allow me to give you the basic definition (from Merriam-Webster's Colligiate Dictionary online):
Main Entry: rac·ism
Pronunciation: \ˈrā-ˌsi-zəm also -ˌshi-\
Function: noun
Date: 1933
1 : a belief that race is the primary determinant of human traits and capacities and that racial differences produce an inherent superiority of a particular race
2 : racial prejudice or discrimination

— rac·ist \-sist also -shist\ noun or adjective


Suzaku is Japanese yes?
Kallen is half-Japanese yes?
Then why would Gino want anything to do with either of them if he was a racist.
Nina was a good example of a real racist in Code Geass, and she disliked Suzaku because he was an "eleven."
Luciano was the same way. He hated "elevens" simply because he felt superior.
Cornelia was also that way, as was Gilford.

Gino said nothing of that sort and was even friends with Suzaku and wanted Kallen romantically.
By your definition I could say that Kallen was being a "racist" when she exclaimed how she hated Britannians.
Racism is not determined by ridiculous notions of social "justice," its a matter of whether or not a person or group actually believes they are superior due solely to their race and thus treats all other races as inferior to them.

Gino did not do that.
Sorry, nice try but no cigar on this one.
Gino is clearly NOT racist.
A selfcentered, womanizing Jackass? YES!
Britannian KKK member? NO!

Quote:
In any case, I would call the depth of Gino's interest in Suzaku and Kallen into question. Nothing is ever done to suggest there is anything beyond a novel fascination with "exotics" as he makes no clear attempts to understand them, but rather tries to get them to see things his way.
No offense Betteroffer but I call your reasoning into question on this.
You clearly are bias against this character for some reason.
Not sure why exactly.
You haven't shown me any proof whatsoever to your claim that Gino is a racist or a social Darwinist and I already know you can't because its not in the anime, or the books.
Therefore, I'll save you the trouble and just say your flat out wrong.
I said we don't know what Gino's feelings are because they're not explored in the anime and I know I'm right on that point.
We cannot say how much or how little Gino likes or cares for Kallen.
We don't know.
Anyone who says otherwise is simply in a state of their own dillusion, or is giving too much weight to their own opinions, end of story.

Quote:
EDIT: As has also been mentioned, he rebelled against Lelouch when he was still playing the "Emperor of Justice" role and the last PD shows he was never made aware of Geass. He was rebelling against a ruler who valued equality, had assumed the throne for legitimate (by Britannia's standards) methods, and was (as far as he knew) endorsed by all of the core members of his nation's government (the nobels and royals of Pendragon).
Whoa! That's a stretch there betteroffer.
Where does it say why Gino turned against Lelouch without knowing how Lelouch became Emperor?
If Schneizel told the Black Knights about Lelouch's Geass, I think it's safe to say Gino (as a KOTR under Schneizel) was informed.
On top of that, Gino was aware of Geass because of Suzaku spilling the beans right before Tokyo gets nuked.
Gino was in the room with Suzaku, Kannon, Nina, and Schneizel.
In fact, Gino gets angry at Schneizel and Suzaku when they plot against Charles because of it.
I'd say if he didn't already know how Lelouch became Emperor by episode 24/25, he had a pretty darn good idea Lelouch was not Emperor legitimately because of Schneizel.
After all, he was with Schneizel when Pendragon got hit with the FLEIJA.
He must have condoned that to stay with Schneizel and ally with the Black Knights right?

Also I find the idea that Gino was a Social Darwinist/Eugenicist laughable.
The guy didn't care about racial purity or the genocide of "inferior" races.
I think what you and Blade are looking for here is the term Nationalist.
And Gino was certainly a Nationalist loyal to Britainnia.

I'd say that the big beef with Gino is the possibility of a Gino x Kallen in any sequel to R2 more than Gino being any of the outlandish things I've seen him called here on these boards.
GundamFan0083 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-04-28, 21:19   Link #23246
morbosfist
Spinning Lotus
 
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by GundamFan0083 View Post
Whoa! That's a stretch there betteroffer.
Where does it say why Gino turned against Lelouch without knowing how Lelouch became Emperor
If Schneizel told the Black Knights about Lelouch's Geass, I think it's safe to say Gino (as a KOTR under Schneizel) was informed.
On top of that, Gino was aware of Geass because of Suzaku spilling the beans right before Tokyo gets nuked.
Gino was in the room with Suzaku, Kannon, Nina, and Schneizel.
In fact, Gino gets angry at Schneizel and Suzaku when they plot against Charles because of it.
I'd say if he didn't already know how Lelouch became Emperor by episode 24/25, he had a pretty darn good idea Lelouch was not Emperor legitimately because of Schneizel.
After all, he was with Schneizel when Pendragon got hit with the FLEIJA.
He must have condoned that to stay with Schneizel and ally with the Black Knights right?
Schneizel only told the Black Knights. He didn't tell Gino or anyone else. For that matter, Suzaku never spilled the beans about Geass to Gino. Schneizel kept that info private. It was just between his men, Suzaku, and Lelouch. Gino was off trying talking to Kallen at the time.

Gino gets angry, as does Cornelia, because Suzaku is plotting treason. By all rights he should have been shot on the spot for his idiocy, but he's apparently good enough to recognize Schneizel's ambition and get away with his behavior.

Gino never knew how Lelouch became Emperor, but he obviously wasn't legitimate. Plus he's just following Bismarck's lead.
__________________
morbosfist is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-04-28, 21:40   Link #23247
GundamFan0083
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: May 2009
Location: classified
Dude now I'm gonna have to go watch episode 18 and 19 again.

You're right, I confused it with episode 20 (which I'm going to watch after this ).
I must say the DVD Limited set is very nice.
In episode 20 Gino and Suzaku have their tiff about betraying Charles etc. etc., so maybe Gino had no idea, but like you said, he knew it was illegit one way or the other.
Now *ahem* I'm going to go watch eps 20 and maybe 21 as well (yes I'm a CG addict I admit it).

BTW, I believe I've found Gino's turning point (where he has his change of heart).
It's in the introduction of episode 19 when after the FLEIJA had wiped out the Tokyo settlement (from 48:57 to 49:00 minutes on the DVD), he remarks how the "school was outside the blast radius, but this has gone beyond war." Then he scowls.
Anyhoo, I'll not derail this thread with Gino x Kallen any longer.

I would like to know what that energy ring is around the Guren-SEITEN when Kallen faces Luciano.
I wonder if it has a purpose besides making Kallen's machine look totally cool.

Last edited by GundamFan0083; 2010-04-28 at 22:11.
GundamFan0083 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-04-29, 01:26   Link #23248
Revolutionist
Puppet Master
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Behind You
Something that caught my eye earlier was the comment "Kallen is justified in killing Britannians". That made me lol. She's justified as much as Gino is justified in killing Elevens.

Gino kills Elevens and Britannians alike because it's his job. Kallen in the other hand kills Britannians ONLY, and specifically says she hates them more than once. So, if someone is a racist it's Kallen. Gino is just a laid back guy, which is why he can play pool and chill with Cecile after his friend Suzaku just killed 35 million people.

Name a SINGLE instance where Gino makes any racist or supremacist remarks...The guy just happened to be born into nobility and has good piloting skills. What was he supposed to do, make a resistance and fight his own people? Only fucked up characters like Suzaku and Lelouch and to an extent Kallen are able to do that ...
__________________
I cannot give you back your homes, or restore your dead to life, but perhaps I can give you justice, in the name of our King. ~ Ned Stark
Revolutionist is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-04-29, 01:46   Link #23249
morbosfist
Spinning Lotus
 
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by GundamFan0083 View Post
I would like to know what that energy ring is around the Guren-SEITEN when Kallen faces Luciano.
I wonder if it has a purpose besides making Kallen's machine look totally cool.
Suzaku's does it too, but it's more grainy and less solid. Kallen pulls off the look much better. As for why, apparently it has to do with activating the wings, and because it looks awesome.

Quote:
Originally Posted by GundamFan0083 View Post
BTW, I believe I've found Gino's turning point (where he has his change of heart).
It's in the introduction of episode 19 when after the FLEIJA had wiped out the Tokyo settlement (from 48:57 to 49:00 minutes on the DVD), he remarks how the "school was outside the blast radius, but this has gone beyond war." Then he scowls.
Anyhoo, I'll not derail this thread with Gino x Kallen any longer.
It obviously wasn't enough, seeing as how he went from that to playing pool. Not like there was much else to do, of course, but he got over it rather quickly. Compare with Cecile and Lloyd, who seem to have gotten tired of Suzaku's BS at this point and let it show.
__________________
morbosfist is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-04-29, 03:01   Link #23250
azul120
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by Revolutionist View Post
Something that caught my eye earlier was the comment "Kallen is justified in killing Britannians". That made me lol. She's justified as much as Gino is justified in killing Elevens.

Gino kills Elevens and Britannians alike because it's his job. Kallen in the other hand kills Britannians ONLY, and specifically says she hates them more than once. So, if someone is a racist it's Kallen. Gino is just a laid back guy, which is why he can play pool and chill with Cecile after his friend Suzaku just killed 35 million people.

Name a SINGLE instance where Gino makes any racist or supremacist remarks...The guy just happened to be born into nobility and has good piloting skills. What was he supposed to do, make a resistance and fight his own people? Only fucked up characters like Suzaku and Lelouch and to an extent Kallen are able to do that ...
And somehow Gino isn't fucked up himself, right after you say that he is just a laid back guy, to the effect that he can play pool and chill with Cecile? Truth: he's being frighteningly blase there.

And Kallen may vent out against Britannians, but she only does it against the enemy combatants who have only proven themselves too happy to massacre innocent Numbers. Against civilians, she does her part in avoiding that, and even feeling empathy for them. Even racist-tan herself, Nina.
azul120 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-04-29, 04:28   Link #23251
bladeofdarkness
Um-Shmum
 
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: at GNR, bringing you the truth, no matter how bad it hurts
Age: 30
Quote:
Originally Posted by Revolutionist View Post
Name a SINGLE instance where Gino makes any racist or supremacist remarks...The guy just happened to be born into nobility and has good piloting skills. What was he supposed to do, make a resistance and fight his own people? Only fucked up characters like Suzaku and Lelouch and to an extent Kallen are able to do that ...
the second PD where after the girl blames suzaku for killing her family, gino says "the strong live and the weak die, that just how it is"
ep 8, his pointing out that they could have a pretense to purge the crowd (killing a million people like its nothing)
ep 17, his talk with kallen about how she would be better off being britannian rather then an eleven

as for the whole "post flejia scene" bit
NOTHING about that scene makes sense in terms of suzaku's behavior
neither Lloyd nor cecile think he might have snapped, after seeing him behave like a completely different man (and they spent much more time with him)
and suzaku claiming responsibility for the flejia makes absolutely no sense
the guy just destroyed a BRITANNIA SETTLEMENT and killed tens of millions of innocent people
even if his status as KoR makes him immune to getting into trouble for it, claiming it as an achievement makes no sense

Quote:
Originally Posted by GundamFan0083 View Post
Also I find the idea that Gino was a Social Darwinist/Eugenicist laughable.
The guy didn't care about racial purity or the genocide of "inferior" races.
I think what you and Blade are looking for here is the term Nationalist.
And Gino was certainly a Nationalist loyal to Britainnia.
the problem with the idea of claiming that he's just being Nationalistic is that its an abstract title
saying he's a Nationalist is like saying he's an Idealist
Idealism, just like Nationalist is abstract concept, since you can be idealist towards ANY goals
the question is if the goals that you are an Idealist towards are, themselves good or bad
same with Nationalism
he is a Nationalist of a racist regime that openly preaches its supremacy over those it conquers

Gino, is Nationalistic towards his country
his country is openly racist AS ITS STATED POLICY
he supports its ideals and policy
hence, it makes him a supporter of racists ideals and policy
__________________

Last edited by bladeofdarkness; 2010-04-29 at 05:54.
bladeofdarkness is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-04-29, 06:11   Link #23252
lovelyzombie
you gotta know the enemy.
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: crypton.
Age: 24
Quote:
Originally Posted by GundamFan0083 View Post
Dude now I'm gonna have to go watch episode 18 and 19 again.

You're right, I confused it with episode 20 (which I'm going to watch after this ).
I must say the DVD Limited set is very nice.
In episode 20 Gino and Suzaku have their tiff about betraying Charles etc. etc., so maybe Gino had no idea, but like you said, he knew it was illegit one way or the other.
Now *ahem* I'm going to go watch eps 20 and maybe 21 as well (yes I'm a CG addict I admit it).

BTW, I believe I've found Gino's turning point (where he has his change of heart).
It's in the introduction of episode 19 when after the FLEIJA had wiped out the Tokyo settlement (from 48:57 to 49:00 minutes on the DVD), he remarks how the "school was outside the blast radius, but this has gone beyond war." Then he scowls.
Anyhoo, I'll not derail this thread with Gino x Kallen any longer.

I would like to know what that energy ring is around the Guren-SEITEN when Kallen faces Luciano.
I wonder if it has a purpose besides making Kallen's machine look totally cool.
Did Gino ever had a change of heart? That guy was even more useless than a box of hair. And derail what? Gino x Kallen did not even exist, a few interactions there and there, where Kallen was busy mourning about Lelouch and Gino just...trying to think or something. Waste of epis with that guy. The only useful thing he ever did was catching Guren as it was falling, after its victory with Lancelot. Hell that was a nice battle btw, kinda expected the result though. Stupid Lelouch, with Kallen by his side, he could have wiped the whole Damocles you ask me. But no, he had to be romantic those days. Another waste.
lovelyzombie is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-04-29, 11:57   Link #23253
Revolutionist
Puppet Master
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Behind You
Quote:
Originally Posted by azul120 View Post
And somehow Gino isn't fucked up himself, right after you say that he is just a laid back guy, to the effect that he can play pool and chill with Cecile? Truth: he's being frighteningly blase there.

And Kallen may vent out against Britannians, but she only does it against the enemy combatants who have only proven themselves too happy to massacre innocent Numbers. Against civilians, she does her part in avoiding that, and even feeling empathy for them. Even racist-tan herself, Nina.
Episode 3, Rivalz plays around with Shirley and ends up soaking Kallen in champagne. While she's taking a shower she goes "oh this why I hate Britannians"... She just hates Britannians for no reason, or silly reasons rather. I mean, sure she was soaked but how is that a valid reason to hate someone? I could understand if she said damn I hate this Rivalz guy, such a jerk, but no, she hates Britannians...
__________________
I cannot give you back your homes, or restore your dead to life, but perhaps I can give you justice, in the name of our King. ~ Ned Stark
Revolutionist is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-04-29, 12:06   Link #23254
bladeofdarkness
Um-Shmum
 
 
Join Date: Dec 2007
Location: at GNR, bringing you the truth, no matter how bad it hurts
Age: 30
actually she makes it rather clear that its not so much a racial thing
she has friends in school before meeting Lelouch, and gets along rather well with the SC pretty early on

her REAL problem with britannians in general is perhaps best demonstrated in her phone call with Lelouch in ep 4 when he asks her to describe the two sides of the train tracks
on one side is the city of thieves that was built on japan's sacrifice
and on the other side is a dried up husk thats left behind
in other words, she views the britannians living in japan as thieves to a greater or lesser extent, and the source of her people's suffering
and guess what, shes not wrong, since this applies to pretty much ALL britannians in japan at that point

unrelated to that
i've rewatched the final part of the PD
i'm pretty sure kallen says "now theres no way i'd be able to forget you even if i wanted to"
__________________

Last edited by bladeofdarkness; 2010-04-29 at 12:36.
bladeofdarkness is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-04-29, 14:43   Link #23255
azul120
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by Revolutionist View Post
Episode 3, Rivalz plays around with Shirley and ends up soaking Kallen in champagne. While she's taking a shower she goes "oh this why I hate Britannians"... She just hates Britannians for no reason, or silly reasons rather. I mean, sure she was soaked but how is that a valid reason to hate someone? I could understand if she said damn I hate this Rivalz guy, such a jerk, but no, she hates Britannians...
Geesh. In addition to what blade said, you're just extrapolating on what was an early incident.
azul120 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-04-29, 15:13   Link #23256
Revolutionist
Puppet Master
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Behind You
Yeah, except she's blaming the student council for things they aren't responsible for. The only person who you can make a case against is Milly. The Ashford family was at one point heavily involved in Britannian nobility and their politics. Shirley's dad was just a businessman, Rivalz's and Nina's we know very little about but they're commoners and their families aren't in the military. None of them are responsible for building their awesome settlement on top of the elevens' sacrifices or drying up the ghettos. In fact I think Shirley might have even been in Area 11 before the war. Of course she was just acting as a spy for Britannia while her dad laid the foundation for the systematic oppression of the Japanese people and the maximization of profits from their exploitation. No?

As much as an asshole as Lelouch was he at least could differentiate between the people responsible, i.e his father and the nobility, and specifically told the Black Knights that the enemy was Britannia itself not innocent Britannians, something that they obviously didn't care about up until that point, Kallen included. They were terrorists after all, who were killing Elevens and Britannians alike in bombings and other such despicable acts of terrorism.
__________________
I cannot give you back your homes, or restore your dead to life, but perhaps I can give you justice, in the name of our King. ~ Ned Stark
Revolutionist is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-04-29, 15:31   Link #23257
Ten-Go
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: State of Clarity
Quote:
Originally Posted by Revolutionist View Post
Shirley's dad was just a businessman
As I remember from the R1, he served in the military until... Or it is wrong?
Ten-Go is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-04-29, 15:33   Link #23258
morbosfist
Spinning Lotus
 
 
Join Date: Jul 2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ten-Go View Post
As I remember from the R1, he served in the military until... Or it is wrong?
He wasn't military, at least not combat anyway. He was a geologist, or some kind of surveyor.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Revolutionist View Post
Yeah, except she's blaming the student council for things they aren't responsible for. The only person who you can make a case against is Milly. The Ashford family was at one point heavily involved in Britannian nobility and their politics. Shirley's dad was just a businessman, Rivalz's and Nina's we know very little about but they're commoners and their families aren't in the military. None of them are responsible for building their awesome settlement on top of the elevens' sacrifices or drying up the ghettos. In fact I think Shirley might have even been in Area 11 before the war. Of course she was just acting as a spy for Britannia while her dad laid the foundation for the systematic oppression of the Japanese people and the maximization of profits from their exploitation. No?

As much as an asshole as Lelouch was he at least could differentiate between the people responsible, i.e his father and the nobility, and specifically told the Black Knights that the enemy was Britannia itself not innocent Britannians, something that they obviously didn't care about up until that point, Kallen included. They were terrorists after all, who were killing Elevens and Britannians alike in bombings and other such despicable acts of terrorism.
This is a far cry from blaming them for the war, she just hates their carefree goofiness. She's not treating them like enemies.
__________________
morbosfist is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-04-29, 15:40   Link #23259
azul120
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Quote:
Originally Posted by Revolutionist View Post
Yeah, except she's blaming the student council for things they aren't responsible for. The only person who you can make a case against is Milly. The Ashford family was at one point heavily involved in Britannian nobility and their politics. Shirley's dad was just a businessman, Rivalz's and Nina's we know very little about but they're commoners and their families aren't in the military. None of them are responsible for building their awesome settlement on top of the elevens' sacrifices or drying up the ghettos. In fact I think Shirley might have even been in Area 11 before the war. Of course she was just acting as a spy for Britannia while her dad laid the foundation for the systematic oppression of the Japanese people and the maximization of profits from their exploitation. No?

As much as an asshole as Lelouch was he at least could differentiate between the people responsible, i.e his father and the nobility, and specifically told the Black Knights that the enemy was Britannia itself not innocent Britannians, something that they obviously didn't care about up until that point, Kallen included. They were terrorists after all, who were killing Elevens and Britannians alike in bombings and other such despicable acts of terrorism.
You forget, Kallen didn't want to release what was thought to be a poison gas capsule on innocent civilians.

Not to mention that when she said "...why I hate Britannians" in that episode, she might have been referring to their cultural habits encroaching on those of the Japanese. It's not as if she had thoughts of knifing each and every one of them in sight.

And again, I find it funny how you will immediately label their acts as "despicable acts of terrorism", while not doing the same for Britannia's equivalent, and more often than not, worse acts of barbaric repression of civilian Numbers.
azul120 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-04-29, 16:02   Link #23260
Revolutionist
Puppet Master
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2007
Location: Behind You
Those also despicable acts of repression by the Area 11 government were scattered acts that did not represent the overall policy. Surely if the goal was to eradicate all Elevens they would've been put into concentration/death camps. Instead we have two random acts by Clovis and Cornelia. Targeting civilians was teh exception not the rule whereas the terrorists, ahem, "freedom fighters" made it their rule to target not just Britannian civilians but honorary Britannians AND Elevens...
__________________
I cannot give you back your homes, or restore your dead to life, but perhaps I can give you justice, in the name of our King. ~ Ned Stark
Revolutionist is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 23:07.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
We use Silk.