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Old 2008-09-18, 22:54   Link #2821
whiter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lovecakecookies View Post
Can I ask you something? I am just curious and want to clarify.. do you think that in all of C.C's 600 years the only person she truly cared for is Lulu?
I'll just quote Narona
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Originally Posted by Narona View Post
Surely not the only person, but Okouchi stated that her happiest days in her whole life were the one with lelouch.

So I guess we can say that he is the one for who she cares the most.
And how strongly she has cared for the others, is still quite unclear if she cared for some people, as there's no documentation over this issue.
But as, said it's quite hard to claim something that she hasn't spoken about. still judging how she's now, there's no guarantee at all, that she has had some one to truly care, highlighting the truly as you pointed it out.
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Old 2008-09-18, 22:55   Link #2822
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Originally Posted by Narona View Post
Surely not the only person, but Okouchi stated that her happiest days in her whole life were the one with lelouch.

So I guess we can say that he is the one for who she cares the most.
Yes, it was stated that perhaps her happiest days were with Lulu..I know that.. and I am not asking whether she cares about Lulu the most... that's obvious I think..
I am asking him something else..

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Originally Posted by whiter View Post
I'll just quote Narona


And how strongly she has cared for the others, is still quite unclear if she cared for some people, as there's no documentation over this issue.
So you think maybe?

I think she has cared for others besides Lulu, she might claim she lost her humanity and all.. but that's what she says and not her true feelings..
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Old 2008-09-18, 23:00   Link #2823
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Originally Posted by lovecakecookies View Post
So you think maybe?

I think she has cared for others besides Lulu, she might claim she lost her humanity and all.. but that's what she says and not her true feelings..
Ye, maybe and I would even say it's quite high possibility judging how she's, but as you stated: her feelings are quite unstable.
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Old 2008-09-18, 23:03   Link #2824
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Originally Posted by whiter View Post
Ye, maybe and I would even say it's quite high possibility judging how she's, but as you stated: her feelings are quite unstable.
A high possibility?

IMO.. I don't think so.. I believe that C.C has cared for many before Lulu, shes more human than what most people make her out to be.. its just C.C acts like she lost her humanity.. but I don't think its true
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Old 2008-09-18, 23:06   Link #2825
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Originally Posted by lovecakecookies View Post
A high possibility?

IMO.. I don't think so.. I believe that C.C has cared for many before Lulu, shes more human than what most people make her out to be.. its just C.C acts like she lost her humanity.. but I don't think its true
I would say she indeed lost her humanity, going through all the events that no human has ever experienced, living for couple of centuries and everything, she has the humanity inside her, but it's been hidden all along, dominated by the immortality and the consequences of it.
But it's just that we view things in different light.
Edit: off to school for now
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Old 2008-09-18, 23:15   Link #2826
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Originally Posted by whiter View Post
I would say she indeed lost her humanity, going through all the events that no human has ever experienced, living for couple of centuries and everything, she has the humanity inside her, but it's been hidden all along, dominated by the immortality and the consequences of it.
But it's just that we view things in different light.
Edit: off to school for now
hmmm.. ok I see.. yes, we see things differently I suppose..
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Old 2008-09-18, 23:18   Link #2827
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Originally Posted by whiter View Post
Immortality making her not gain friends alone is senseless in the first place.
don't tell me all that debacle was about making friends? If so, i'll seriously hit my head


Quote:
It's her charracter, the knowledge she posses, wisdom and above all experiecens, that have made her different from the other humans, as you should clearly see.
How do you think she is to gain friends and escape the solitude by just loosing immortality. the immortality alone shouldn't restrict you from getting friends, but the consequences of immortality; charracter which has been formed by the numberous experiences and events that no man could ever go throught.
It's her immortality that makes her different from everyone else. Regardless of losing her imortality, she can gain friends as she can gain enemies. It's not just about being alone or the fact that she had suffered all her life anymore, it's about getting tired of living all through those years and wanting to end all of that, that is by ending her life. That's what a person that lived for over 600yrs 's happiness.


Quote:
Also the fact that she's avoiding the warmth of friendship is caused by immortality, but in this case we don't know wether it would get removed by loosing the immortality as we can't get inside her head.
How can she not if she's unsure anymore if that person she is building her trust with is only using her for their own benefit? It's been long she experienced and seen many stuff you'd think she'd not learn anything throughout her life, she's wary because she learned.


Quote:
Immortality is the beginning of this chain, but just removing it now won't change the consequences.
But still it's the very cause/beginning for the solitude in this case, and hence immortality is the cause of solitude yet the solitude won't dissappear even if the immortality was taken away because her charracter and different way of behaviour will still chase to exist.
Yes, and it still is. But the solitude you speak of will disappear too if her immortality disappears. How? death.



as a side note.. i'm just happy this thread is lively again
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Old 2008-09-19, 01:17   Link #2828
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Utau View Post
don't tell me all that debacle was about making friends? If so, i'll seriously hit my head

It's her immortality that makes her different from everyone else. Regardless of losing her imortality, she can gain friends as she can gain enemies. It's not just about being alone or the fact that she had suffered all her life anymore, it's about getting tired of living all through those years and wanting to end all of that, that is by ending her life. That's what a person that lived for over 600yrs 's happiness.
The point is that immortality makes her character and her personal traits very different from the other humans, experiencing what no other human has ever experienced will make you different from the others, as your thoughts, character and almost everything that's not necessarily physical is influenced by experiences and the time you've spent.
Because you've experienced the centuries worth of experience, your interests and thoughts are not that of a average/normal human, and hence making friends would be as difficult as it's been with the immortality.
Ofcourse the immortality itself is different from normal human, but that shouldn't restrict her from gaining friends.
And why has she gotten tired of living?
Because she didn't have people to care for her, she lived in solitude and didn't see any reason to continue the suffering which was apparently caused by solitude, torturing, etc.

Quote:
How can she not if she's unsure anymore if that person she is building her trust with is only using her for their own benefit? It's been long she experienced and seen many stuff you'd think she'd not learn anything throughout her life, she's wary because she learned.
Didn't quite get what you were trying to say here.


Quote:
Yes, and it still is. But the solitude you speak of will disappear too if her immortality disappears. How? death.
We'r speaking about instance where removing code doesn't result into death nor memory loss.

Quote:
as a side note.. i'm just happy this thread is lively again
You bet!

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Originally Posted by lovecakecookies View Post
hmmm.. ok I see.. yes, we see things differently I suppose..
Btw, we've only seen her memories of the times in solitude. There was no memory of any friend, nor a people she cared for, wouldn't that be a bit odd if you assume she had someone she really cared for? Usually people remember the moments of happiness and the events that have had the most impact on them, but yet all we've been represented in her memories are those of solitude and suffering. There's a memory of C.C living with Charless, V.V and Marianne, but we don't know whether she really cared for them or was only pursuing her resolve to die, which seems the most likely.
Hence that would imply that she hasn't had a friend nor a person she really cared for, but still, who knows?
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Old 2008-09-19, 01:48   Link #2829
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Originally Posted by whiter View Post
Btw, we've only seen her memories of the times in solitude. There was no memory of any friend, nor a people she cared for, wouldn't that be a bit odd if you assume she had someone she really cared for? Usually people remember the moments of happiness and the events that have had the most impact on them, but yet all we've been represented in her memories are those of solitude and suffering. There's a memory of C.C living with Charless, V.V and Marianne, but we don't know whether she really cared for them or was only pursuing her resolve to die, which seems the most likely.
Hence that would imply that she hasn't had a friend nor a person she really cared for, but still, who knows?
Not really, maybe that's ONE of the reasons she doesn't want to live anymore right? she said something like "all those who were kind to me or hated me left with time or something" right? she has been alive soo long she probably saw people she came to care for die..

I know/hope she cared for others...she cared about Mao right? and if you think she didn't care about Mao.. then I dont know... unless you think that the only person C.C ever cared/cares about is Lulu...
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Old 2008-09-19, 01:51   Link #2830
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Originally Posted by lovecakecookies View Post
Not really, maybe that's ONE of the reasons she doesn't want to live anymore right? she said something like "all those who were kind to me or hated me left with time or something" right? she has been alive soo long she probably saw people she came to care for die..

I know/hope she cared for others...she cared about Mao right? and if you think she didn't care about Mao.. then I dont know... unless you think that the only person C.C ever cared/cares about is Lulu...
Maybe she saw those she cared for, but someone being kind to her doesn't necessarily involve getting attached to them, and hence it's unknown. Then all we've got are the memories of solitude and torturing which implies that there's no warmth / caring involved.

I've admitted that she cared for Mao, but how much, and that is eitherway quite recent event which L.L itself witnessed, it's not a memory of the past for us, in a sense.
And just to ask, why would they use "the ones that were kind ot her" instead of "the ones she cared for" or something similar, if they wanted to show that she had warmth of caring in her life?
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Old 2008-09-19, 12:28   Link #2831
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Originally Posted by Narona View Post
Surely not the only person, but Okouchi stated that her happiest days in her whole life were the one with lelouch.

So I guess we can say that he is the one for who she cares the most.
This is incorrect, IIRC. Okouchi said, in likely different words, that her days with Lelouch were possibly the happiest days in her whole life. Knowing that C.C. has forgotten people in the past who were kind to her, his statement would make sense and would answer nothing. We simply do not know whether or not Lelouch has been the kindest to her or if her time has been the happiest, she simply cannot remember.
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Old 2008-09-19, 14:01   Link #2832
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This is incorrect, IIRC. Okouchi said, in likely different words, that her days with Lelouch were possibly the happiest days in her whole life. Knowing that C.C. has forgotten people in the past who were kind to her, his statement would make sense and would answer nothing. We simply do not know whether or not Lelouch has been the kindest to her or if her time has been the happiest, she simply cannot remember.
You seem to know more about C.C than Okouchi does himself.
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Old 2008-09-19, 14:31   Link #2833
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Originally Posted by whiter View Post
Maybe she saw those she cared for, but someone being kind to her doesn't necessarily involve getting attached to them, and hence it's unknown. Then all we've got are the memories of solitude and torturing which implies that there's no warmth / caring involved.

I've admitted that she cared for Mao, but how much, and that is eitherway quite recent event which L.L itself witnessed, it's not a memory of the past for us, in a sense.
And just to ask, why would they use "the ones that were kind ot her" instead of "the ones she cared for" or something similar, if they wanted to show that she had warmth of caring in her life?
Huh? are you saying she wouldn't give a damn about the people that were kind to her?

I think she cared about others in the past, no matter what, that's ONE OF REASONS why life got hard for her..
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Old 2008-09-19, 15:39   Link #2834
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Well second try!, since I made the mistake to talk about the shinkirou in the spec thread which has annihilated the discussion about c.c. that I tried to start :/




What do you guys think that they are talking?

It seems interesting.

The way she put her hands behind her back make me think that they will have a personal discussion.

Since Lelouch could die maybe C.C. will say something to him (*wishful thinking* her feelings for him ), then after that,

Spoiler for spoil:


She seems to have questionned herself about if her and lelouch are just accomplice (ep 23 discussion between her and suzaku)

So I wonder if she will have the guts to say something to him about that. And I cross my fingers that what she feels for him is more than friendship (and not mother feelings)
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Old 2008-09-19, 16:19   Link #2835
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What is this gum line you're talking about ?
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Old 2008-09-19, 16:25   Link #2836
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What is this gum line you're talking about ?
Some Code Geass cards will be realeased in october. On those cards, there are the Key lines of the main character for the last episodes.

The key line for C.C. is:


Spoiler for spoil:
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Old 2008-09-19, 17:32   Link #2837
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Originally Posted by Narona View Post
Well second try!, since I made the mistake to talk about the shinkirou in the spec thread which has annihilated the discussion about c.c. that I tried to start :/




What do you guys think that they are talking?

It seems interesting.

The way she put her hands behind her back make me think that they will have a personal discussion.

Since Lelouch could die maybe C.C. will say something to him (*wishful thinking* her feelings for him ), then after that,

Spoiler for spoil:


She seems to have questionned herself about if her and lelouch are just accomplice (ep 23 discussion between her and suzaku)

So I wonder if she will have the guts to say something to him about that. And I cross my fingers that what she feels for him is more than friendship (and not mother feelings)
By the look on their faces its something serious.. C.C's feelings for Lulu are ambiguous at this point, they could be romantic or maternal...( I personally don't know... I don't like to make assumptions on things like that) the fact that the writers/directors never state what her feelings are towards him, makes me think it is left for us to ponder it..

But, with this scene, hopefully, we get something that lets us know what she thinks of him, and what he thinks of her.. (she's my.... WHAT?!?!) they are not going to leave this unanswered..

This might be a possibility too, though slim, the "Lelouch you don't hate me?" line could be said too... she might feel insecure or something, hence the hands behind her back? I mean he snapped at her after finding out Nunally is alive, so I assume Lulu still has some "issues" with the trust with her..
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Old 2008-09-19, 17:41   Link #2838
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Originally Posted by lovecakecookies View Post
By the look on their faces its something serious.. C.C's feelings for Lulu are ambiguous at this point, they could be romantic or maternal...( I personally don't know... I don't like to make assumptions on things like that) the fact that the writers/directors never state what her feelings are towards him, makes me think it is left for us to ponder it..

But, with this scene, hopefully, we get something that lets us know what she thinks of him, and what he thinks of her.. (she's my.... WHAT?!?!)

This might be a possibility too, though slim, the "Lelouch you don't hate me?" line could be said too... she might feel insecure or something, hence the hands behind her back? I mean he snapped at her after finding out Nunally is alive, so I assume Lulu still has some "issues" with the trust with her..
I don't think he has issues with her anymore, he was (once more) in shock, that's all imo.

But yeah, "she" could think that after the episodes 15 and 21 he might hate her.

But I hope the talk will not be only about that. I still hope that she will bring the whole "accomplice" subject on the table. Like asking him if they are "only accomplice" or more than that.

I really really really hope
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Old 2008-09-19, 17:44   Link #2839
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I don't think he has issues with her anymore, he was (once more) in shock, that's all imo.

But yeah, "she" could think that after the episodes 15 and 21 he might hate her.

But I hope the talk will not be only about that. I still hope that she will bring the whole "accomplice" subject on the table. Like asking him if they are "only accomplice" or more than that.

I really really really hope
Yeah, maybe shock? It was still mean of him to accuse/snap at C.C like that though..

I wouldn't be surprised.. she might say

"If we are no longer accomplices.. what are we?".. something like that..
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Old 2008-09-19, 17:50   Link #2840
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Yeah, maybe shock? It was still mean of him to accuse/snap at C.C like that though..

I wouldn't be surprised.. she might say

"If we are no longer accomplices.. what are we?".. something like that..
I still think that he is his true self with her. The true lelouch also gets angry sometimes. He tends to not hide his feelings with her. Is it something good? I think yes, because he doesn't lie to her about what he thinks.

And what do you think he could reply to that?

My guess:

"you're my.......... my"

And someone will interrupt them
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