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Old 2008-05-14, 22:19   Link #341
Voduar
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This is a bit more speculative, but I also wonder if her Cheese-kun obsession is meant to demonstrate a bit of a mental issue we have not dealt with as of yet? Her constant cuddling of it strikes me as a touch odd, and might be indicative of something. I can't quite tell if she is supposed to merely be immortal and depressed (sort of like Deedlit when she's down) or ancient and a touch disturbed(Like the old alien in Soultaker[sorry in advance for not having a more recent example]).
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Old 2008-05-15, 00:36   Link #342
Used Can
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I think Cheese-kun is just there for her to look cute, nothing too deep about it. However, one can say because of things like it, she's not a completely cold woman, as she would usually appear to be.
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Old 2008-05-15, 05:23   Link #343
Esper 28
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As to this, while I agree with you that the jewelry does not look like the western notion of Celts, it sort of jives with what seems to be the anime consensus on the topic. While its rather over the top even for an anime, this maybe meant to imply that those are all priests/druids/mages or something, and that we are seeing some big event. While rather speculative, it seems believable. That said, for some reason, that scene screams Atlantis to me. Perhaps its the weird combination of togas and pimp jewelry. Also, that seems to be a rather mixed looking crowd for an anime, which seems to be a supercivilization trait.

As to CC herself, I suspect we will find her to be descended from those people, rather than necessarily a member of them. She has sort of a tragic last of her people vibe, which juxtaposes with her ridiculous pizza obsession.
Hmm, you make a good point. Unfortunately, I'm not someone who watches a ton of anime, so I don't think I'm really qualified to say much on what would be considered norm or not. Though the idea of Atlantis certainly seems like a plausible suggestion.

And my personal feelings have C.C. being a type of like, demigod to those people. I'm not sure if that would make her one of them or not, that sort of depends on how you look at it. But I think both C.C. and V.V. may be demigods that had a cult following at some point and, like you suggested, having that cult consist of Atlanteans or something would make sense.

In fact, it could be a case that they were two competing demigods and their two separate cults may've had some sort of confrontation which would have ultimately had led to C.C.'s cult's destruction? The only reason I would say C.C. lost is because V.V.'s Geass user is the king of Brittannia while C.C.'s is like, the royal family's runt. This, if true, could also explain why it seems like V.V. and C.C. are at odds and why it kind of feels like C.C. wants to overthrow Charles.

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Originally Posted by Voduar View Post
This is a bit more speculative, but I also wonder if her Cheese-kun obsession is meant to demonstrate a bit of a mental issue we have not dealt with as of yet? Her constant cuddling of it strikes me as a touch odd, and might be indicative of something. I can't quite tell if she is supposed to merely be immortal and depressed (sort of like Deedlit when she's down) or ancient and a touch disturbed(Like the old alien in Soultaker[sorry in advance for not having a more recent example]).
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I think Cheese-kun is just there for her to look cute, nothing too deep about it. However, one can say because of things like it, she's not a completely cold woman, as she would usually appear to be.
I agree with Used Can on this topic. I think C.C. is a fan favorite and as a result, she has moments that are there purely for the fans. Cheese-kun is probably nothing more than a show mascot and, most likely, stemmed from C.C.'s provocative method of eating pizza where she's got the cheese hanging out of her mouth or whatever.

Not to say it's not absolutely adorable to see her clinging to this stuffed animal, I just don't know if it has any real significance.
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Old 2008-05-15, 06:32   Link #344
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C.C.'s attachment to the yellow guy serves to bring out her sense of (in)security. Doesn't have to be the mascot in particular. She's also seen hugging the cushions in the previous Turns while in the Chinese consulate.

It's one of those tiny hints at her vulnerable side, in which case I'm guessing the need for reassurance and fear of insecurity, seen by her need to physically hold onto something.

While it hasn't been ascertained, C.C. and V.V. doesn't seem to be at odds. Since V.V. and Charles goal is to kill gods, C.C.'s eventual contract with Lelouch might be in direct opposition to their plans.
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Old 2008-05-15, 07:30   Link #345
Dann of Thursday
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Well, it could also just be that she missed Cheese-kun and wanted to hug something, but your idea isn't all that bad either. That actually makes her a bit more sad.

And Okouchi said of the relationship between V.V. and C.C.: "It seems they won't tolerate each other's existence." I think this might be speaking of R2 though since she didn't seem to want him dead and buried in season 1.

And I never thought of C.C. as a demigod myself. I always went with the idea that she may have once been human, but ended up the way she was for whatever reason. I also have a quote from an Animedia that says she was originally human, though I suppose that could always be wrong.

I'm somewhat curious sometimes if C.C. even remembers what the contract is. I'm pretty sure she does know, but I wonder how that relates to her not remembering everything.
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Old 2008-05-15, 07:35   Link #346
Esper 28
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While it hasn't been ascertained, C.C. and V.V. doesn't seem to be at odds. Since V.V. and Charles goal is to kill gods, C.C.'s eventual contract with Lelouch might be in direct opposition to their plans.
I look at it as though Charles is V.V.'s champion while Lelouch is C.C.'s. That being said, I think C.C. gave Lelouch the Geass power knowing full well that V.V. had given the Geass to Charles. I think it's fair to say that C.C. either has a problem with Charles or V.V. and she's using Lelouch as a weapon against one or both of them.

So, while you're right, there hasn't been any outward animosity between C.C. and V.V. as of yet, I can't shake the feeling that C.C.'s manipulation of Lelouch against Charles is really just her way of getting at V.V.
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Old 2008-05-15, 07:38   Link #347
Dann of Thursday
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Well, that makes it sound like all her other contracts were for nothing and since she has made several over the years (which include a few time periods where Charles and potentially V.V. weren't around).

Or she is just manipulating him and really could care less what happens to him, which is probably the more likely scenario.
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Old 2008-05-15, 07:45   Link #348
Esper 28
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Well, that makes it sound like all her other contracts were for nothing and since she has made several over the years (which include a few time periods where Charles and potentially V.V. weren't around).

Or she is just manipulating him and really could care less what happens to him, which is probably the more likely scenario.
How does it make other contracts count for nothing?

If C.C. is "immortal" then V.V. must be also. That means, V.V. has probably entered into just as many contracts as C.C. Couldn't it easily be explained that V.V. has been behind the success of the Brittannian empire the entire time? That he was the reason why Briton was able to fend off the Romans? And, as a result, he's been behind each and every King that Britannia has ever had?

As a result, C.C. would enter contracts with people she believed could help her overthrow V.V and her current champion, or rather, the current king of Brittannia. C.C. even remarks that she left Mao when she realized he couldn't fulfill their contract.

The "battle" between V.V. and C.C. stretches for centuries and, I don't think, at least, that it should be kept entirely to Charles and Lelouch.
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Old 2008-05-15, 07:50   Link #349
Dann of Thursday
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Yes, but we know nothing about how long he has been around. While it hasn't been confirmed for sure, if he really is Charles's brother than he couldn't be much older than him.

It's potentially possible, but there have never been any indications of such a thing.

But you're probably right so there is no point to this.
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Old 2008-05-15, 08:07   Link #350
Esper 28
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Yes, but we know nothing about how long he has been around. While it hasn't been confirmed for sure, if he really is Charles's brother than he couldn't be much older than him.
If he's actually Charles' older brother by blood, is there a reason he looks like a little boy? If I were to run with the train of thought from my above posts, it's easy to say that since V.V. has been involved so extensively with the Brittannian lineage, Charles may've met V.V. when he was but a mere boy. Since he was so young, instead of explaining to him who V.V. actually was, his parents (most likely the current Brittannian king of the time) simply said, "Oh, that's your older brother." Perhaps later on, once Charles ascended to power, V.V. came to him, as he would go to all of Brittannia's monarchs, and Charles would know him as older brother. Thus, despite the title of "brother" being a falsity, he's continued to call him as such.

As always, this is nothing but pure conjecture, but it certainly sounds more plausible then V.V. and Charles being actual brothers. I'm sorry, but I just don't buy into this brother nonsense, at least not in a literal sense as you seemingly do.

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But you're probably right so there is no point to this.
Nothing has been confirmed and that's why nobody is "right". People are simply closer to the truth than others, but by no means is anyone correct. If there's no point in discussing this, then there's really no point in discussing anything about C.C. other than how she enjoys pizza because, really, that's about all the truth we know about the character.
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Old 2008-05-15, 08:14   Link #351
Dann of Thursday
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Okay, V.V. could have become like he was when he was very young if he was Charles's brother. The other scenario is certainly possible and probably more likely though.
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Old 2008-05-15, 08:21   Link #352
Esper 28
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Okay, V.V. could have become like he was when he was very young if he was Charles's brother. The other scenario is certainly possible and probably more likely though.
Uhm...how would he "become like he was when he was very young"? Please, if you wouldn't mind, elaborate on what you mean.
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Old 2008-05-15, 08:25   Link #353
Dann of Thursday
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How should I know? It hasn't been stated exactly how C.C. is the way she is. If she was indeed a normal human at some point, than she could have become like she is now somehow. Same thing could have happened to V.V..

Like I said, this is all probably wrong and you are probably more correct.
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Old 2008-05-15, 08:32   Link #354
Esper 28
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How should I know? It hasn't been stated exactly how C.C. is the way she is. If she was indeed a normal human at some point, than she could have become like she is now somehow. Same thing could have happened to V.V..

Like I said, this is all probably wrong and you are probably more correct.
Wow, man, I know others in this thread have said this, but...you really are one of the hardest people to deal with. If you seriously can't give me any form of logical reason for what you're saying, why are you saying them at all?

I mean, hell, we could sit here and be like, "The ripped it all off of Highlander." C.C. and V.V. are the ages they are because in order to trigger their immortality, they had to die! See, in the Highlander universe, if you're an immortal, you're a regular human until you die...then you become immortal and you're stuck at whatever age you died, but the death has to be a violent one. Like, someone stabbing you or something. At least that has some sort of logical explanation!!

Anyway, yeah, you need to learn to back up what you're saying because, honestly, it just feels like you say things just to say them. To simply suggest that she can like, shape-shift and regulate her age without any sort of credible evidence to support that is ridiculous.
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Old 2008-05-15, 08:57   Link #355
Dann of Thursday
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"C.C. was originally a normal human being"

This was in a list of info given about the show during talks with the staff, primarily Okouchi. All the other info along with this has been accurate and there is not much point in lying about it. If it had been more vague, then sure I would question it myself.

You honestly haven't given very much reason for her to be a demigod. It's all just speculation in the end. You can't expect me to come up with something when I don't know all the answers about the Geass.

When the hell did I ever suggest she could shapeshift her age? All I'm saying is that it could be possible that she was once a normal human being, but became immortal somehow. No, I don't know how, but that doesn't make it ludicrous.
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Old 2008-05-15, 13:58   Link #356
Voduar
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I agree with Used Can on this topic. I think C.C. is a fan favorite and as a result, she has moments that are there purely for the fans. Cheese-kun is probably nothing more than a show mascot and, most likely, stemmed from C.C.'s provocative method of eating pizza where she's got the cheese hanging out of her mouth or whatever.

Not to say it's not absolutely adorable to see her clinging to this stuffed animal, I just don't know if it has any real significance.
That could very well be, I was sort of free forming that theory. That said, upon a second viewing of Geass, there is a low, but to me noticeable, creep factor in a few of her actions. Now, the more logical conclcusion may be to assume they were showing her vulnerability/cute, but it hit me as slightly disjarring. Then again, perhaps I am being unnecessarily observant.

As to whether or not CC and VV are gods, demigods, w/e, we run into one of the information problems in CG. In this case, I am referring to the fact that I don't believe its been stated what the Brittanians worship. While I have assumed that Japan remained Shinto, the Chinese Federations condition sort of suggests that there was no Buddha in the CG world. In fact, there is not any direct evidence on screen of monotheism as best I can recall.
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Old 2008-05-15, 14:11   Link #357
mechalord
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That could very well be, I was sort of free forming that theory. That said, upon a second viewing of Geass, there is a low, but to me noticeable, creep factor in a few of her actions. Now, the more logical conclcusion may be to assume they were showing her vulnerability/cute, but it hit me as slightly disjarring. Then again, perhaps I am being unnecessarily observant.

As to whether or not CC and VV are gods, demigods, w/e, we run into one of the information problems in CG. In this case, I am referring to the fact that I don't believe its been stated what the Brittanians worship. While I have assumed that Japan remained Shinto, the Chinese Federations condition sort of suggests that there was no Buddha in the CG world. In fact, there is not any direct evidence on screen of monotheism as best I can recall.
Her cuddling of stuffed animals could be something the writers put in to demonstrate an aspect of her persona. Just look at her relationship with Mao.

This goes along with my theory that she was pregnant when she was given immortallity and that in turn was also passed to the child in her womb.

Could it be that she was drawn to Mao because of his possible similarities to V.V?

Could it be that her dealings with Mao could be foretelling her confrontation with V.V?

Sometimes female animals that have lost young will adopt creatures not of their species or stuffed animals in captivity. C.C. acts like a mother with a lost child.
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Old 2008-05-15, 14:59   Link #358
SoldierOfDarkness
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Originally Posted by Voduar View Post
That could very well be, I was sort of free forming that theory. That said, upon a second viewing of Geass, there is a low, but to me noticeable, creep factor in a few of her actions. Now, the more logical conclcusion may be to assume they were showing her vulnerability/cute, but it hit me as slightly disjarring. Then again, perhaps I am being unnecessarily observant.

As to whether or not CC and VV are gods, demigods, w/e, we run into one of the information problems in CG. In this case, I am referring to the fact that I don't believe its been stated what the Brittanians worship. While I have assumed that Japan remained Shinto, the Chinese Federations condition sort of suggests that there was no Buddha in the CG world. In fact, there is not any direct evidence on screen of monotheism as best I can recall.
In comparison to other countries, China doesn't have a "god" or a "religion"

For the britannians they maybe catholic since Nunnally had asked Lelouch in the first drama DVD if the japanese had a pope like they had.
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Old 2008-05-15, 20:40   Link #359
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C.C. acts like a mother with a lost child.
Not precisely like a mother, but certainly as someone who seems to have lost something important. C.C. is that kind of character you can say has existed for a long time, but who hasn't really had the chance to actually live.

Certainly, she has experienced things like love and hate, but by the looks of it, she has gained nothing. She somewhat said it herself two times: The time she asked Lelouch why snow was white (in which she answered the reason for that is that snow forgot its true colours). The second time was when she told Lelouch the ones that loved her and the ones that hated her were no longer there; they were all lost in the endless flow of time.

She's someone who has no deep links with anyone; she has no attachments. This may be why she said the people involved with Geass were bound to live a lonesome life.

Perhaps, Cheese-kun is there to show she still can be attached to something?
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Old 2008-05-15, 20:53   Link #360
ashlay
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Perhaps, Cheese-kun is there to show she still can be attached to something?
*sigh*, completely ignoring her relationships with Mao and Lelouch, her falling apart over the name thing in 11, and her interactions with Nunnally and Kallen. (though those are mainly in the extra materials I suppose...)
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