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Old 2008-06-25, 14:44   Link #2221
Dream_Traveller
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And we have another Suzaku hater...
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Old 2008-06-25, 14:45   Link #2222
Orga777
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dynastya View Post
Ahh almost forgot another credit for Lelouch, he needs 1 for knowing that Suzaku wouldn't dare shoot the 1million 'Zeros' and using it to his advantage.
That doesn't get any credit at all actually. It was still a gamble on Lelouch's part. He gets credit for getting them out, and Suzaku gets credit for letting them go. That is truly it.

Quote:
Suzaku = 1 (this figure does not represent the true number of credits for this person as his betrayals, idiocy, irresponsibility, etc have not been taken into account yet)
Right... And Lelouch never had betrayals, idiocy, irresponsibility, etc before.
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Old 2008-06-25, 14:46   Link #2223
Silver Soul
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dynastya View Post
Ahh almost forgot another credit for Lelouch, he needs 1 for knowing that Suzaku wouldn't dare shoot the 1million 'Zeros' and using it to his advantage.

Lelouch = 3 (figure may be much higher than shown if all factors are considered)
Suzaku = 1 (this figure does not represent the true number of credits for this person as his betrayals, idiocy, irresponsibility, etc have not been taken into account yet)
Seriously if all your gonna do is kiss Lelouch's ass all day than post this at the Lelouch thread since you're not making any valid reasons to redeem Lelouc for his past sins.
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Old 2008-06-25, 14:46   Link #2224
Dynastya
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Originally Posted by Dream_Traveller View Post
And we have another Suzaku hater...
Never said I wasn't.
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Old 2008-06-25, 14:47   Link #2225
Eliarine
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Originally Posted by Orga777 View Post
Right... And Lelouch never had betrayals, idiocy, irresponsibility, etc before.
Of course not! Lelouch is perfect! How dare you suggest otherwise!
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Old 2008-06-25, 14:47   Link #2226
hanseo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dynastya View Post
Ahh almost forgot another credit for Lelouch, he needs 1 for knowing that Suzaku wouldn't dare shoot the 1million 'Zeros' and using it to his advantage.

Lelouch = 3 (figure may be much higher than shown if all factors are considered)
Suzaku = 1 (this figure does not represent the true number of credits for this person as his betrayals, idiocy, irresponsibility, etc have not been taken into account yet)
sigh another suzaku hater
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Old 2008-06-25, 14:48   Link #2227
Silver Soul
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Your statements differ, your making Lelouch as the better person which he is clearly not!

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Of course not! Lelouch is perfect! How dare you suggest otherwise!

I smell TROLL
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Old 2008-06-25, 14:49   Link #2228
m1thril
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Originally Posted by Orga777 View Post
He was never going to shoot. As Rising Dragon said, he may have been conflicted, but the thought of another massacre made up his mind real quick. Which was what happened there. Again, if he wasn't there, there would have been NOTHING to stop it from happening again.

Also, that isn't the only 'redeeming' thing people can find in Suzaku. Just that if people are going to credit Lelouch for getting 1 million people out, they better give credit to Suzaku for allowing that to happen in the first place.
he made up his mind to give the order to kill them all right before that girl tried to shoot them. then he had that euphie/nunally vision thingy and that's when he changed his mind.
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Old 2008-06-25, 14:50   Link #2229
Dynastya
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Silver Soul View Post
Seriously if all your gonna do is kiss Lelouch's ass all day than post this at the Lelouch thread since you're not making any valid reasons to redeem Lelouc for his past sins.
In Episode 4 Lelouch asked Guilford what he would do if there wasn't an evil that could not be beaten with justice, would he beat that evil with evil or would he accept that his justice succumbs to evil.

Lelouch said that he would become evil to defeat an even greater evil. Lelouch has been consistent with his actions so far.

On the other hand Suzaku seems to be the latter, one who accepts the fact that his justice succumbs to evil.


OT: people who use larger fonts with color and other decorations when posting in a forum really amuse me, like the students whose project reports I had to mark where they used font size 15, bold and colorful fonts with flowers and twisting twirling shapes in the business course I use to teach for summer. Of course that alone cost them 50% of the grade for unprofessionalism.
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Old 2008-06-25, 14:51   Link #2230
Orga777
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Quote:
Originally Posted by m1thril View Post
he made up his mind to give the order to kill them all right before that girl tried to shoot them. then he had that euphie/nunally vision thingy and that's when he changed his mind.
But did he really make up his mind? He was still conflicted before he remembered the massacre which made up his mind real fast.
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Old 2008-06-25, 14:51   Link #2231
Silver Soul
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Originally Posted by m1thril View Post
he made up his mind to give the order to kill them all right before that girl tried to shoot them. then he had that euphie/nunally vision thingy and that's when he changed his mind.

Rewatch the episode because that's not what happened! He was conflicted and couldn't make the decision she was doing whatever so he stopped her.
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Old 2008-06-25, 14:52   Link #2232
m1thril
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Originally Posted by Orga777 View Post
But did he really make up his mind? He was still conflicted before he remembered the massacre which made up his mind real fast.
yeah he did he was thinking 'ill give the order to shoot zero'
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Old 2008-06-25, 14:53   Link #2233
Orga777
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dynastya View Post
Lelouch said that he would become evil to defeat an even greater evil. Lelouch has been consistent with his actions so far.
Last time I checked, two wrongs don't make a right.

Quote:
On the other hand Suzaku seems to be the latter, one who accepts the fact that his justice succumbs to evil.
No. Suzaku's view is to change from within. Which fits his personality. He is trying to change himself just as he is trying to change the world essentially.
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Old 2008-06-25, 14:53   Link #2234
Silver Soul
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dynastya View Post
In Episode 4 Lelouch asked Guilford what he would do if there wasn't an evil that could not be beaten with justice, would he beat that evil with evil or would he accept that his justice succumbs to evil.

Lelouch said that he would become evil to defeat an even greater evil. Lelouch has been consistent with his actions so far.

On the other hand Suzaku seems to be the latter, one who accepts the fact that his justice succumbs to evil.
Well that's a better explanation on his chracter as a whole but what makes that redeemable compare to Suzaku?
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Old 2008-06-25, 14:53   Link #2235
Eliarine
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Originally Posted by Silver Soul View Post

I smell TROLL
Pssst: no, this is the odor of sarcasm triggered by the obvious Lelouch fanboyism around
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Old 2008-06-25, 14:54   Link #2236
Orga777
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Originally Posted by m1thril View Post
yeah he did he was thinking 'ill give the order to shoot zero'
But was he dead set on it? I don't think he was.
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Old 2008-06-25, 14:55   Link #2237
Silver Soul
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Originally Posted by Eliarine View Post
Pssst: no, this is the odor of sarcasm triggered by the obvious Lelouch fanboyism around
smells like a TROLL to me!
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Old 2008-06-25, 14:55   Link #2238
Rising Dragon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by m1thril View Post
yeah he did he was thinking 'ill give the order to shoot zero'
Um, no. He was thinking that he SHOULD give the order to shoot, but he couldn't because it clashed with his principles. He wasn't going to start another massacre.
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Old 2008-06-25, 14:56   Link #2239
Dynastya
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Orga777 View Post
Last time I checked, two wrongs don't make a right.
Only in an ideal world does two wrongs not make a right. The world isn't ideal.

It's not ok to kill either, but police officers have to use deadly force on occasions. It's not ok to lie but sometimes people have to lie to protect themselves or others.
And these wrongs always keep making rights.
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Old 2008-06-25, 14:58   Link #2240
demon_god04
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Orga777 View Post
But was he dead set on it? I don't think he was.
Suzaku's duty as the Knight of Seven demanded he should not let Zero get away, yet he did could not make the decision. He thought that the right thing in that situation was to order the army to open fire, he may not be dead set on it but it was certainly what he thought he should do.
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