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Old 2009-12-09, 22:56   Link #6441
ncrushx
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kuroshinobu View Post
The part about not many knowing the limitations of Lelouch's geass are true. Him and CC are the only people I can remember off the top of my head.
That part make Lelouch's geass losing its promise in using it at all. If, only he could cast infinitely, like Charles.
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Old 2009-12-09, 22:57   Link #6442
Rising Dragon
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If C.C. can hold some sort of connection with those who have a Geass, then V.V. should have the same, guys.
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Old 2009-12-09, 23:02   Link #6443
Kuroshinobu
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Originally Posted by Rising Dragon View Post
If C.C. can hold some sort of connection with those who have a Geass, then V.V. should have the same, guys.
I think they have to be physically within the area, and even then I think it's onyl a sixth sense saying they have a geass. I don't think the details are actually given to the Code-bearer on the geass' limitations and powers.
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Old 2009-12-10, 06:44   Link #6444
Dr. Casey
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Lelouch? More like Ledouche
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Old 2009-12-10, 11:10   Link #6445
Betteroffer
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Originally Posted by eaglei3 View Post
First, how exactly does Charles know that his geass is one time only at that point? Each geass is different in what they are capable of doing.

2nd, as I said, Villetta was placed on that team because she new Lelouch's identity. There would be no point having to convince her to watch this student at Ashford Academy because she knew. Episode five of season two talks about her becoming a baron for uncovering the identity of Zero. No where is it said she was given that spot because she can't be geassed anymore. No one but Lelouch and C.C. new that detail of Lelouch's geass.
Viletta was aware that Lelouch's Geass was light based, required direct eye contact, and was not a sort of psychic signal Lelouch could send out. This is evidenced by:

1. The use of floodlights and Akatsukis during the betrayal.
2. The mention of the goggles being worn during the UFN summit.
3. The sealed chamber in the council room.

Viletta also knew that a Geass symbol will appear in a person's eyes when their Geass is active, which was another reason for having all the cameras in Ashford and the comment about Lelouch having no opportunities to use his Geass.

From here, the one use limit could be proven as follows:

1. Lelouch tells the BK that his Geass can't be shut off and proves it by removing the contacts to demonstrate.
2. Lelouch tells the BK of the one use limit.
3. Lelouch has one BK soldier sent to him so that he may Geass them to do something stupid while the others watch as insurance.
4. With the cameras looking at Lelouch's eyes to make sure he doesn't turn off his Geass as he does so, Lelouch then orders the BK soldier to kill him right there.
5. Rather than comply, the BK stands there.
6. Profit.

As for Viletta, what Lelouch was saying to her when he blackmailed her into serving him was for the audience's benifit in giving us the "official" reason why Viletta was serving as a teacher when she had been made a Baroness.

While it is never outright stated that Viletta was made aware of the one use limit, the fact that she was made into a teacher at all suggests that part of the reason she was put there was due to the knowledge that she could no longer be Geassed. Think out it:
If only Lelouch knew of the one use limit, then why would Charles send Viletta at all?
Why would she be acting as a teacher, rather than sitting in the base all day, (she could still have an alias if she needed to run up top and grab Lelouch)?
Why not send one of the Directorate cultists to fill her spot?
Why not let Viletta run of to live in luxury in the mainland?
Why not thank her for a job well done and then kill her to make sure the secret of Geass remained a secret?
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Old 2009-12-10, 15:45   Link #6446
eaglei3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Betteroffer View Post
Viletta was aware that Lelouch's Geass was light based, required direct eye contact, and was not a sort of psychic signal Lelouch could send out. This is evidenced by:

1. The use of floodlights and Akatsukis during the betrayal.
2. The mention of the goggles being worn during the UFN summit.
3. The sealed chamber in the council room.
1) The floodlights had no effect on Lelouch as he said it was possible to geass Oghi and the others, but the knightmares would be a problem in the situation. As for the floodlights and Akatsuki, the betrayal was going to show Zero's death to the world. You have to remember that Diethard was there recording, and had a script ready to be broadcasted to make it seem that Zero had died in death and not in betrayal.

2 & 3) These occur after Schneizel has talked to the BK, as well as after Kallen is back with them after the betrayel. Between Schneizel's research and Kallen who was close to Lelouch, it is very possible the information came from them. If Villetta knew before the betrayal, she obviously didn't say anything or was wrong on what she knew.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Betteroffer View Post
Viletta also knew that a Geass symbol will appear in a person's eyes when their Geass is active, which was another reason for having all the cameras in Ashford and the comment about Lelouch having no opportunities to use his Geass.
I'm going to claim no on this one. Not one other person in the series other than those who had geass or a code ever mentioned once about seeing the symbol in someone's eyes. Way too much speculation on this. And the cameras in Ashford just meant that there would be no opportunity for him to get away or into a spot on the school where he wouldn't be seen interacting with someone to possibly use the geass.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Betteroffer View Post
From here, the one use limit could be proven as follows:

1. Lelouch tells the BK that his Geass can't be shut off and proves it by removing the contacts to demonstrate.
2. Lelouch tells the BK of the one use limit.
3. Lelouch has one BK soldier sent to him so that he may Geass them to do something stupid while the others watch as insurance.
4. With the cameras looking at Lelouch's eyes to make sure he doesn't turn off his Geass as he does so, Lelouch then orders the BK soldier to kill him right there.
5. Rather than comply, the BK stands there.
6. Profit.
Once again as with Blade, nice test, still proves nothing. Tell me how Lelouch proves this test isn't a fabrication he came up with to 'restore' trust with the BK? I could tell you right now if I were a BK and saw this test, my first thoughts would be "He is possibly making this up, we have no idea if he can really turn his geass on or off, and we have no idea if he really used it again on the soldier when given the order to kill him..."

Quote:
Originally Posted by Betteroffer View Post
As for Viletta, what Lelouch was saying to her when he blackmailed her into serving him was for the audience's benifit in giving us the "official" reason why Viletta was serving as a teacher when she had been made a Baroness.

While it is never outright stated that Viletta was made aware of the one use limit, the fact that she was made into a teacher at all suggests that part of the reason she was put there was due to the knowledge that she could no longer be Geassed. Think out it:
If only Lelouch knew of the one use limit, then why would Charles send Viletta at all?
Why would she be acting as a teacher, rather than sitting in the base all day, (she could still have an alias if she needed to run up top and grab Lelouch)?
Why not send one of the Directorate cultists to fill her spot?
Why not let Viletta run of to live in luxury in the mainland?
Why not thank her for a job well done and then kill her to make sure the secret of Geass remained a secret?


So you don't like the "official" explanation from Lelouch and substitute your own in that has no backing? The "official" statement makes sense because 1) As I said earlier, Villetta discovered Zero's identity in season 1, and knew the most out of the entire Britannia army. It makes sense for her to take this job as she still feels the need to gain honor amongst the ranks in Britannia. 2) The teaching aspect gets her closer to Lelouch to observe him. It also gives her an excuse to be able to freely travel around the campus and participate in events where Lelouch might be. 3) Villetta had an inspiration to try teaching after her encounter with Oghi in which he talks about teaching before the war... and turn 25.01 still shows her teaching at Ashford.
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Old 2009-12-10, 16:04   Link #6447
bladeofdarkness
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Lelouch sees Mao's geass active
the geass symbol seems to be a visible thing

and again, Lelouch can prove he cant switch it off by showing that he has contact lenses to cover it up
and can show that he can give orders to someone without them reacting to it (if they were geassed before)

if you keep trying to nitpick there would NEVER be a perfect way ever
but the fact that the test suggested would WORK and is very possible, means that Lelouch has a very good way of proving he didnt use his geass on them

P.S
2&3 being after the betrayal is irrelevent, sicne the test is proposed to take place AFTER lelouch takes over britannia
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Old 2009-12-10, 16:19   Link #6448
eaglei3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bladeofdarkness View Post
Lelouch sees Mao's geass active
the geass symbol seems to be a visible thing

and again, Lelouch can prove he cant switch it off by showing that he has contact lenses to cover it up
and can show that he can give orders to someone without them reacting to it (if they were geassed before)

if you keep trying to nitpick there would NEVER be a perfect way ever
but the fact that the test suggested would WORK and is very possible, means that Lelouch has a very good way of proving he didnt use his geass on them

P.S
2&3 being after the betrayal is irrelevent, sicne the test is proposed to take place AFTER lelouch takes over britannia
Number 2 & 3 were about Villetta being the one to come up with it. But as expected from you at this point, you just come in to the topic and type whatever rolls off your mind even if they aren't related to the subject at hand.



As for the seeing Geass part, I lost the part when copying the quotes around where I wanted to say that only those with Geass or Codes have ever been shown to see other people's geass. No normal person has ever been shown noticing a geass in an eye.

As for nitpicking? Maybe that was the point to show how too easily you guys make it sound in that he could convince them. Basically from what you guys say, I could take a gun, fill it with blanks, and tell everyone "Hey look, this guns doesn't hurt people when I shoot it." I try it out for them, and later, I put real bullets in it. That is how Lelouch's geass is. The BK don't know what powers geass (bullets), they just know it is fired (like out of the barrel of the gun.) However, you can't dissect Lelouch's head and show that he is telling the truth about the limitations, just like if you don't get your hands on the gun I demonstrated, you can't get it open to see if it is properly put together or if the bullets were blank or not.

P.S.: I'm sorry nitpicking means going against your over simplistic 'peace' ideas.
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Old 2009-12-10, 16:29   Link #6449
bladeofdarkness
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eaglei3 View Post
Number 2 & 3 were about Villetta being the one to come up with it. But as expected from you at this point, you just come in to the topic and type whatever rolls off your mind even if they aren't related to the subject at hand.
ouch
untrue and uncalled for

Quote:
As for the seeing Geass part, I lost the part when copying the quotes around where I wanted to say that only those with Geass or Codes have ever been shown to see other people's geass. No normal person has ever been shown noticing a geass in an eye.

As for nitpicking? Maybe that was the point to show how too easily you guys make it sound in that he could convince them. Basically from what you guys say, I could take a gun, fill it with blanks, and tell everyone "Hey look, this guns doesn't hurt people when I shoot it." I try it out for them, and later, I put real bullets in it. That is how Lelouch's geass is. The BK don't know what powers geass (bullets), they just know it is fired (like out of the barrel of the gun.) However, you can't dissect Lelouch's head and show that he is telling the truth about the limitations, just like if you don't get your hands on the gun I demonstrated, you can't get it open to see if it is properly put together or if the bullets were blank or not.

P.S.: I'm sorry nitpicking means going against your over simplistic 'peace' ideas.
Except Lelouch can prove that the gun only fires once by SHOWING how it works
they know that direct eye contact is the key, and they know what geass looks like (at least villeta does, since she was put in charge of searching for it)

and you dont have to be sorry about nitpicking ruining my simple peace idea because it doesn't really do that (at best, it proves that trust building would require more then just a geass test)
you DO have to be sorry about the fact that the conclusion of zero-requiem with zero coming in and saving everyone requires even MORE trust on the black knights part then my proposal does
since it requires the black knights, cornellia and villeta to just accept another person coming in wearing the mask and saying "i'm zero" without demanding to know who he is
"fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice, shame on me"
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Old 2009-12-10, 16:51   Link #6450
ncrushx
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True, but if Lelouch uses Geass on somebody; they are pretty much dead and a zombie forced to do their master's work at that point.

Then, he can Geass anybody else in the way to ensure his safety.

End of discussion.
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Old 2009-12-10, 16:52   Link #6451
bladeofdarkness
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read the proposed test
Quote:
Originally Posted by bladeofdarkness View Post
his geass only works once on any given person
thats the reason why villeta was selected to watch over him

he can prove it by individually using his geass on any one of them under circumstances where others could see that he isnt abusing his power, but nevertheless using it on them

for example
gather all the people who claimed he used geass on them
have them all wear goggles over their eyes to protect them
and then have each one in turn removes his goggles and Lelouch geasses them to do some small unimportent thing (count till 10) while the others watch (and possibly, kill him if he tries anything bad)

the person who does the counting does not remember for themselves, but the others can confirm that
1)lelouch used his geass on him (which means he couldnt have used it before)
2)Lelouch didnt use his geass to do anything wrong to them
3)Lelouch cant use his geass on them ever again

its simple, and effective, and proves definitively that Lelouch had not used his geass on any of them
it may mean that he wastes his ability to geass them in the future, but he proves to them that he didnt use it on them before, and that they have no reason to fear him using it against them again
the whole point is to prove to the OOBK that he DIDNT geass them before
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Old 2009-12-10, 16:55   Link #6452
ncrushx
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Why would he tell Schneizel about his DAMN Geass anymore info?

That's suicide beyond death, and he was pretty much dead when he was in there.
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Old 2009-12-10, 17:00   Link #6453
bladeofdarkness
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we're talking AFTER he became emperor
he isnt telling shnizel anything
he is telling the black knights that he didnt use geass on them in order to try and rebuild their trust in him
teh whole point is to create a scenario in which lelouch, as emperor, can bring about world peace WITHOUT having to do zero-requiem (that is, no conquering the world and becoming a mass murderer)

shnizel would have to be dealt with, but attacking the UFN is something lelouch does needlessly and foolishly
instead of forming an alliance against shnizel, he end up having to fight both the UFN forces AND shnize at the same time
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Old 2009-12-10, 17:01   Link #6454
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That's more info, and Lelouch knows Schneizel knows about Geass but not how much.\

It's not worth the risk to find out, how can you expect to prove without unveiling his weaknesses.

Even then, that doens't mean they will let him go. That does not mean anybody will let him go.
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Old 2009-12-10, 17:06   Link #6455
bladeofdarkness
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again
we are NOT talking ep 19 here
we are talking ep 22
as in AFTER lelouch is emperor
and he does not tell shnizel anything, he is telling the black knights about his geass weakness in order to regain their trust
how does shnizel even factor into this in your mind
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Old 2009-12-10, 17:08   Link #6456
ncrushx
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It's not worth the risk to find out.

Even then, that doens't mean they will let him go. That does not mean anybody will let him go.

What would they do if they knew more info? Tell to the entire world, that would make things worse. Wouldn't this be Rebellion 4 counting the BK as R3?

There, is that good enough.
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Old 2009-12-10, 17:11   Link #6457
bladeofdarkness
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let him go where ?
what are you talking about
lelouch isnt the black knights prisoner

lelouch is emperor of britannia
he calls the UFN up and says "i want to make peace"
the people of the UFN agree, with the only group of people who suspect lelouch being the black knights leadership
this is a way for him to get the black knights leadership on HIS side again
the rest of the world needs not know anything about geass

i dont get what you are saying
are you suggesting the black knights are working the shnizel ?
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Old 2009-12-10, 17:12   Link #6458
ncrushx
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Schneizel still would have to be dealt with. Lelouch has to get rid of all the evidence.

The first answer is for R2 Episode 19. The second answer is for R2 Episode 22.
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Old 2009-12-10, 17:13   Link #6459
bladeofdarkness
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what evidence ???
dealing wiht shnizel has nothing to do with evidence
we're talking ONLY about ep 22
ep 19 is past
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Old 2009-12-10, 17:14   Link #6460
ncrushx
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Are you an idiot?

Schneizel can still get rid of Lelouch by political ways (Electric Chair, Rebellion within Britannia, etc...) thanks to Villeta, Suzaku, etc...

, and it's not just Schneizel.

Schneizel will ruin Lelouch's life as much as possible.


Imagine the entire world against Lelouch at that point.
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