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Old 2004-02-03, 19:37   Link #21
brood-faun
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Join Date: Dec 2003
Quote:
Originally Posted by kanazuchi
It was obviously cut, I cant stand people who think its alright to tear apart somebody elses work like that... Does anybody know if there is an uncut DL for the second ep of canvas?
There is uncut version of canvas available.
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Old 2004-02-03, 20:20   Link #22
Diedrupo
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I think it's funny that the whole thing about "stuff" in Canvas has made the bit torrent DL for Canvas + Canary incredibly uh, popular. o_O Otherwise I'd be curious as to why so many people are DLing it.
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Old 2004-02-03, 21:21   Link #23
Aquillion
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kanazuchi
It was obviously cut, I cant stand people who think its alright to tear apart somebody elses work like that... Does anybody know if there is an uncut DL for the second ep of canvas?
I don't care about ero anime and things like that one way or the other, but I don't think that Animesuki should list censored or edited versions of anything. They don't list parody subs, even if only a small portion of the sub is a parody; censored subs should be excluded on the same principal.

If they have to list censored subs, then should be clearly marked as such. One of the reasons why people watch fansubs is specifically to get away from that kind of BS, and nobody wants to download and watch a (perhaps hamhandedly) censored version of a show without knowing that they're getting the butchered version beforehand.

(Of course I know that Animesuki can't possibly scan everything beforehand, but people in the forum would probably be more then happy to help point censored things out after they've been posted, if for some reason the fansub group didn't announce it.)
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Old 2004-02-04, 00:13   Link #24
kanazuchi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aquillion
I don't care about ero anime and things like that one way or the other, but I don't think that Animesuki should list censored or edited versions of anything. They don't list parody subs, even if only a small portion of the sub is a parody; censored subs should be excluded on the same principal.

If they have to list censored subs, then should be clearly marked as such. One of the reasons why people watch fansubs is specifically to get away from that kind of BS, and nobody wants to download and watch a (perhaps hamhandedly) censored version of a show without knowing that they're getting the butchered version beforehand.

(Of course I know that Animesuki can't possibly scan everything beforehand, but people in the forum would probably be more then happy to help point censored things out after they've been posted, if for some reason the fansub group didn't announce it.)
Exactly why I was pissed. I cant stand censored material, leaves you with a feeling of incompletelyness after you finish watching...
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Old 2004-02-04, 01:24   Link #25
kestrel
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I have to agree that censoring by fansubbers is pretty lame. While I certainly appreciate the time and effort it takes to do a sub, I think they should clearly mark it as censored in the listing and perhaps point to a non-edited version. It still would be better not to censor anything at all. Not everyone who watches these shows is 13 years old and I really just didn't appreciate a jarring cut right before the episode ended.

Now I gotta go find the unedited sub that was mentioned....
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Old 2004-02-04, 01:41   Link #26
babbito2k
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The fansubbers thought enough of the story to create this R-rated version and make it a bit more widely available. If this wasn't on bt here I would have missed it, so I give the editing idea a thumbs-up. I also think that if this kind of edited work is offered in a torrent in future that it should be accepted and listed by AnimeSuki.

After all, any kind of subbing or translation is an interpretation of the writer's thoughts. And AMVs are taking someone else's footage and someone else's song and putting them together.

I see that the story is not much of a topic but I will weigh in anyway and say that as far as these game-based shows go this was middle-tier work. Story and characters were workmanlike. Art style in the two seemed different (don't know production dates). Cheap music (no surprise) but not actually bad.

I had seen the first segment and was interested enough to watch the second. I for one am not gonna beat my brains out hunting down the 3 minutes of creepy slishy noises.
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Old 2004-02-04, 02:08   Link #27
Greenish Growth
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I thought Canary was only a one episode OVA. Were there really two?

I see Suki has Canary listed as being two episodes long.
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Old 2004-02-04, 02:17   Link #28
Keitaro
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Greenish Growth
I thought Canary was only a one episode OVA. Were there really two?

I see Suki has Canary listed as being two episodes long.
Canary has 1 OVA, thats prolly a typo because on the series page its listed as having only 1 episode. http://animesuki.com/series.php/339.html
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Old 2004-02-04, 12:25   Link #29
warnold
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Keitaro
Canary has 1 OVA, thats prolly a typo because on the series page its listed as having only 1 episode. http://animesuki.com/series.php/339.html
You are correct. I got which had 1 episode, and which had 2 backwards. I've corrected our listing.

--
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Old 2004-02-04, 12:44   Link #30
sothis
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you know, i skimmed the first episode (don't have the second yet) and i'm really not seeing how this could be labeled as NOT hentai.

it's one thing to insinuate that the girl is jacking off, thinking about the guy. it's another thing to show her groping her breast over and over for like, 2 minutes. if it was just supposed to be "R rated" they would have shown it briefly to get the point across.. but they kept showing it over and over. this says hentai to me.
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Old 2004-02-04, 14:04   Link #31
ky_khor
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i doubt that if animesuki list it as

canvas ~motif of sepia (and canary)

then seed 10 dl 100

but now animesuki list it as

canvas ~motif of sepia (and canary) warning R-rated

OMG seed 300 dl 1000


funny.....
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Old 2004-02-04, 14:43   Link #32
RobotCarnival
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Lovely.

Does anyone know the real story behind it supposedly being edited? It's too easy to look at something and say "yeah, that was definitely cut", as it's just as easy to come back with "oh, there's an unedited version". If I'm not mistaken, not getting to see the 'squishy bits' would be expected, considering it's doubtful that the Japanese would have either. Otherwise we still wouldn't have gotten to see them for a huge ugly mosaic pattern in the way, ne?

As for the "unedited version" that's floating out there, somehow I have to take that with a grain of salt. Where did you see it? Do you have it uncut? Did you watch the original Japanese version? If you have any information, could you provide it in your post? It wouldn't even have to be a link, a few chosen bits of hearsay would suffice.

It's very silly to state something without the slightest shred of proof or indication of how you know this, and even sillier for people to blindly believe it. Don't misunderstand what I'm saying here -- if it was animated fully explicit and then edited before being published, that's still a bad thing, but it's also a differant issue having to do with Japanese social repression and censorship laws.

If what we get is what the Japanese got, then there's no complaint. Let's keep in mind that in some ways we've gotten to see much, much more than the Japanese ever have as for as hentai goes.

The real question is has anyone gotten word on this issue from the group who did the subbing? It seems to me that they are going to be the only ones who can give any real information here, but their site is down at the time of this post and I can't get to their IRC channel.
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Old 2004-02-04, 14:55   Link #33
babbito2k
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There's a scene chopped in half at the end of the second episode; the music jumps. Both episodes have a note at the beginning saying they were edited by someone.
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Old 2004-02-04, 17:47   Link #34
Diedrupo
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Quote:
it's one thing to insinuate that the girl is jacking off, thinking about the guy. it's another thing to show her groping her breast over and over for like, 2 minutes. if it was just supposed to be "R rated" they would have shown it briefly to get the point across.. but they kept showing it over and over. this says hentai to me.
The problem you have with your assertion is that you're using a conservative view on sexuality where anything involving nudity is pornographic. If you ask me, there is nothing erotic or stimulating about seeing the girl masturbate, especially when it lasts for only a few seconds, with other scenes that cut in between it, and so forth. Believe me, I've seen a lot of porn and ero anime, and the scene in Canvas does not indicate it was meant to be an ero anime.

Besides, didn't Shinji whack off in Eva?

Canvas the game exists in both X and PG rated versions in Japan, there was even a japanese company that offered an english PG rated version of the game over here at conventions. This tells me that Canvas is not meant to be an ero story, it just happens to have sex scenes in it. And like others have pointed out, plenty of R-rated movies have almost explicit sex scenes. The fact that only ONE person is involved here, and plus the scene in ep 2 is edited, indicates that this is clearly R rated content.
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Old 2004-02-04, 17:50   Link #35
RobotCarnival
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Quote:
Originally Posted by babbito2k
There's a scene chopped in half at the end of the second episode; the music jumps. Both episodes have a note at the beginning saying they were edited by someone.
Terse or not, that's what I like to hear -- a good, useful, informative response.

The most info I could find was on a forum here: http://crossfade.proboards26.com/ind...num=1075743546

It seems the encoder has a weak stomach for adult content (prolly a kid anyway), and cut the parts that made him squeamish. The thing that threw me was the comment about an edited version being available, which I have to take means an even more sanitized version. This all leaves me to wonder what the point is. I mean, are we going to see stuff edited till it's suitable for the Teletubbies set? Maybe it's me, but unless it's just the best anime in the world - that everyone simply must watch, from grandma on down - it just seems pointless.

I mean, how do you end up encoding a hentai in the first place if you shouldn't have even be watching the original? I mean, do you really, really love Fist of The Northstar but wish it weren't so violent? Some people's priorities just leave my head hurting.


EDIT: This all reminds me of this site: http://www.cleanfilms.com/

I have mixed feelings about that site. I can, to a point, understand why Mormons would do that given their religious convictions; even though I would never choose to watch an edited movie myself, if I was going to sit down with the kids on family movie night to watch The Bone Collector or Willard, I'd sure want to make sure it was 'safe' for the little tykes.

However, somehow I just don't see a Mormon saying "hey, this hentai is good let's edit it down so it'll be family friendly". Like I said before, maybe it's me -- but for personal viewing I simply cannot fathom watching an anime that's been edited, and conversely, assuming there was a particular anime that had content so objectionable I couldn't bear to watch it, well then, I wouldn't.
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Old 2004-02-04, 17:57   Link #36
babbito2k
annoying white bat
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by RobotCarnival
...
I mean, how do you end up encoding a hentai in the first place if you shouldn't have even be watching the original? Some people's priorities just leave my head hurting...
As I mentioned earlier, I think the priority here was to make a fairly good title available through venues which otherwise wouldn't have touched it. If the thing hadn't been edited and fansubbed we wouldn't be discussing it here at all.

What makes my head hurt is seeing how crazy everyone has gotten over the editing as opposed to what was left; it's like a discussion of donut holes.
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Old 2004-02-05, 00:46   Link #37
kestrel
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You can think of it more as someone else is choosing how much you get to see. Half the reason I am watching fansubs is because those shows won't come over here because someone chose not to show them here. Now I have to deal with whether things were removed by fansubbers as well.

I have no problem with an edited version to draw interest. I do have a problem not being able to get an unedited version. As far as the adult content thing goes, there is a lot more stuff on the internet than this movie is going to show.

I have to agree, if you feel squeamish about this kind of stuff, then maybe you shouldn't be doing it. I think the way they handled it was very poor and it seems like I should really avoid this group as much as I can.

I could care less about the nudity in the show, I just despise the lack of continuity at the end which makes it jarring and annoys me enough to ruin the end for me.
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Old 2004-02-05, 20:56   Link #38
Seiryuu
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Note: They DO have an unedited vers, which I got straight from the IRC channel. It says at the beginning that there is some "adult" content that is not VITAL to the plot, and therefore that those who wished could go to animeforce and nab the edited version. They did it because there are fans who would delete this excellent show the moment they saw a girl in bed, moaning, with one hand on her chest and the other exploring uncharted territories. I was a little disturbed myself. On a side note, can someone help me link to the torrent, I think the site is down or my university blocked it. But I can't get to animeforce to make the connection, and i REALLY want to see this Canary show.
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Old 2004-02-06, 12:00   Link #39
Doddler
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I guess the point is that people don't like censorship without any alternatives, even if they don't agree with the origional content. If there's an unedited version (thats made readily available), then I don't think its too big of a deal. I havn't looked into it much though... how readily available is the un-cut version?
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Old 2004-02-06, 14:01   Link #40
monir
cho~ kakkoii
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The general sentiment toward this silly censoring is perfectly understandable. Since all the viable points has been discussed toward why the censorship of animation should not be ecouraged by any fansubbers, I will just quote Mr Yonkers for I am in complete agreement with these following words.
Quote:
I hope this "modifying" isn't going to become a trend, even if it is just one scene that has nothing to do with the story. If somebody was worried about this in the first place, it just should have never been done.
By the way, is this the first censorship of any animation by any fansubber? And I am not talking about hentai.
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