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Old 2008-05-15, 08:58   Link #101
squaresphere
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Hmmm... you know I'm wondering who has the most control/power in the colony fleets. In M7 it seemed like the Captain of the main Macross Ship (Battle 7) was most likely the head of the NUNS and it seemed like he shared equal power with the mayor/president of City 7.

Though this could be in part that they were married.

Frontier it looks like the President has the most power, though we have yet to see the head of the NUNS fleet. I highly doubt Leon is highest ranking NUNS officer in the fleet.

-- edit in--

just a small thing but why isn't there an "admiral" ranking officer in the fleets? It would make sense for them to have that be highest rank.
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Old 2008-05-15, 09:04   Link #102
Burner of Anime
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Anh_Minh View Post
Depends which alien, I guess. The slimy tentacled things? Ew. Meltrandy? Interesting.

BTW, do Abh count as "alien"?
Imagine the line that will que up for them. There'll be a big banner with the words "Welcome, Alien Companions". Allow us to show you the best of Human Culture . Can't say much for our women side, I suppose that the older set of Zentradi can be considered attractive. I mean, for the Zentradi to "discover" that there is more to the opposite sex is reason enough for universal peace and brotherhood

Spoiler:


Nope, Abh are not aliens. They're just a genetically modified sub-species of man made for colonising deep space.
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Old 2008-05-15, 10:29   Link #103
ReddyRedWolf
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Quote:
Originally Posted by squaresphere View Post
Hmmm... you know I'm wondering who has the most control/power in the colony fleets. In M7 it seemed like the Captain of the main Macross Ship (Battle 7) was most likely the head of the NUNS and it seemed like he shared equal power with the mayor/president of City 7.

Though this could be in part that they were married.

Frontier it looks like the President has the most power, though we have yet to see the head of the NUNS fleet. I highly doubt Leon is highest ranking NUNS officer in the fleet.

-- edit in--

just a small thing but why isn't there an "admiral" ranking officer in the fleets? It would make sense for them to have that be highest rank.
Maximillan Jenius was captain in rank but was leader of the UN Spacy taskforce of Macross 7.

We saw Battle Frontier's captain in episode one.

When you think about it these are small escort fleets compared to the Zentradi war machine that make up most of UN Spacy.

I'm beggining to think there is greater civilian oversight over the military than 14 years earlier.

Maybe that's why UN Spacy calls itself NUNS nowadays.

What did those stuffy admirals say when Macross 7 were facing an unknown enemy?

Your on your own.

What did they say when Macross 7 encountered a fleet of giant girls?

They're hopeless blow them up.

Heck those stuffy shirts were considering making pilots obsolete with a AI fighter.

If that does not require a revamp of the human side of the organization I don't know what does.
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Old 2008-05-15, 11:02   Link #104
Wesley84
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Originally Posted by ReddyRedWolf View Post
Heck those stuffy shirts were considering making pilots obsolete with a AI fighter.
That's just good sense, assuming you can make an AI that can beat a human.
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Old 2008-05-15, 11:12   Link #105
Anh_Minh
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It's genre blindness. Such things never work.

Either the AI are beaten by the powers of the human heart, or they try (sometimes succesfully) to take over, or both.
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Old 2008-05-15, 12:20   Link #106
squaresphere
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Well M+ showed us that the tech was there to build a highly advance AI fighter that could compete with high level pilots using cutting edge fighters.

MF the decultured ep1 showed they do deployed unmanned fighters.

Something must have happened to create this man/unmanned combine arms approach. IE meeting aliens/cultures that could produce tons of EM jamming.
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Old 2008-05-15, 12:38   Link #107
ReddyRedWolf
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*Looks at lost sheep*

I think your post should be on thread below
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Old 2008-05-15, 15:05   Link #108
Wesley84
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Originally Posted by squaresphere View Post
Well M+ showed us that the tech was there to build a highly advance AI fighter that could compete with high level pilots using cutting edge fighters.

MF the decultured ep1 showed they do deployed unmanned fighters.

Something must have happened to create this man/unmanned combine arms approach. IE meeting aliens/cultures that could produce tons of EM jamming.
I don't think they seriously consider drones as front-line units. More like armed probes that can give an idea of what they're dealing with, while not risking pilots. We'll hopefully find out soon if they've really considered automated fighters.
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Old 2008-05-15, 15:19   Link #109
Tak
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Originally Posted by Wesley84 View Post
I don't think they seriously consider drones as front-line units. More like armed probes that can give an idea of what they're dealing with, while not risking pilots. We'll hopefully find out soon if they've really considered automated fighters.
Well, its more like this.

The Drones serve as skirmishers, and as you said, they test enemy defenses without risking lives. Although at the same time, based on what we learned in Macross Plus, I think they did seriously consider for drones to serve as front-line material, even if their intelligence isn't on par with the best pilots, it has to be up there somewhere.

Unfortunately, they fail at electronic warfare.

- Tak
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Old 2008-05-15, 15:24   Link #110
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Why would an AI be more vunerable to EW than the shielded systems on the Valkryies?
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Old 2008-05-15, 16:02   Link #111
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Originally Posted by Wesley84 View Post
Why would an AI be more vunerable to EW than the shielded systems on the Valkryies?


You have to ask yourself, is your PC more durable then the smart mobile phone?

They both have a CPU, except one can be use to run complex programs, while the other has to make do with simpler ones.

However i've dropped my phone down the toilet once and left one in the washing machine and amazingly they both survived. They weren't even "tough" mobile phones either.

However if you did that to a pc, i doubt they would survive.

The point being, that a far simpler system requires a far less complex and easier system to shield, and if the EW protection fails to cover it 100% well, it won't do much, there is a far larger tolerance in terms of circuity and programming. its robust.

However it seems that for a full A.I system, you have a far lower tolerance, the EW shielding has to be at a higher standard, if it drops for only a moment, flicker or don't provide the system with 100% protection it's going mess up a while lot of very complex programming, put one little kink and the answer is vastly different.

You have to assume that when you encounter an alien technology for the first time, you cannot assume that your standard of EW protection will be 100%.

EW only works a few times during conflict until the enemy develop an effective countermeasure.

Be assured that if A.I. controlled drones are valued, then no doubt they will be back later on, with effective protection.
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Old 2008-05-15, 16:14   Link #112
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I would think you'd want to give your AI Brains as good as a protection as you could possibly provide, and wasn't the issue that they were hacked?
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Old 2008-05-15, 16:32   Link #113
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Originally Posted by Wesley84 View Post
I would think you'd want to give your AI Brains as good as a protection as you could possibly provide, and wasn't the issue that they were hacked?
It depends on your standard of "Good" protection.

Government set standards for things, from commercial household products to industrial equipments.

As designers we want the best that will conform or exceed these set standards.

But in the end, manufacture, cost, materials, even political influence will strip away at these idealistic goals.

The point being, that eventually for realistic results you will have to make compromises, as long as you reach a set "standard" that allow you to put your product on the market and also have a distinctive advantage over your other competitors then by definition it is "good".

However we are talking about an alien encounter, for all we know, the "compromises" they took in the design of the A.I. fighter was one that by NUNS standards, meet the requirements against known human/zentradi EW technology.

But these alternative and lacking EW protection to certain areas of the design are vulnerable to VAJRA attacks, in parts that are perfectly capable to defeat NUNS EW tech. or perhaps something entire exotic that by pass all known countermeasures.

In short, you won't know until you encounter them.
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Old 2008-05-16, 06:55   Link #114
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Macross Galaxy is different from other Macross fleets that we've seen.

Spoiler for Macross Galaxy:


While Macross fleets like Macross 5, 7, 13 and Frontier have shell dome cities with a New Macross class battleship, Macross Galaxy appears to be a throwback to the old Megaroad class with a single large colony.
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Old 2008-05-16, 10:57   Link #115
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more funky and liberal design, i won't say a "throwback" because it clearly isn't.

But it seems that the 2nd wave of fleets from Eden have a different standard for their colony fleets.

Some would say, the enclosed method is more practical, as in less energy is spent on holographic projectors, forcefield enclosed atmosphere, and the use of a clamshell physical shield that will have to be physical closed in case of emergencies.

But we have to see if it has an attached battle flagship, at the moment the pictures don't show anything.

If it has no Military command Flagship equivalent to the New Macross Class, then we have to assume the military and civilian command are on one ship. Which will then put it on the same philosophy as the earlier fleets that consisted of Megaroad class ships.
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Old 2008-05-16, 12:17   Link #116
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Well Macross Galaxy looks weirdly designed compared to the previous colonization ships.

But this does make me wonder if it is classified as Macross does that mean it's a transforming ship?

Looks suspiciously at port and starboard sides.
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Old 2008-05-16, 13:12   Link #117
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Originally Posted by ReddyRedWolf View Post
Well Macross Galaxy looks weirdly designed compared to the previous colonization ships.

But this does make me wonder if it is classified as Macross does that mean it's a transforming ship?

Looks suspiciously at port and starboard sides.
oh yeah, it is classified as a "macross" fleet.

I guess it must have some sort of military flagship, on par with the New Macross Class.

But with the funky purple design, im not really sure where it's suppose to dock to the colony ship, which i assume is the big purple thing.
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Old 2008-05-17, 05:44   Link #118
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Noticing differences between Galaxy and Frontier such as cybernetics policies I'm beginning to think that Earth and New Eden may reflect these policies. Being point of origins f these fleets.

Frontier left from Earth. Galaxy left from New Eden.
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Old 2008-05-17, 07:11   Link #119
glyph
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Originally Posted by ReddyRedWolf View Post
Noticing differences between Galaxy and Frontier such as cybernetics policies I'm beginning to think that Earth and New Eden may reflect these policies. Being point of origins f these fleets.

Frontier left from Earth. Galaxy left from New Eden.
Indeed. I wonder if this policy might be part of the fallout from the events of Macross Plus.
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Old 2008-05-17, 19:59   Link #120
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You know it kinda makes sense there aren't much Zentradi in Galaxy particularly the giant ones.

Implants don't grow or get shrunk with Zentradi.

Which would also explain why Vrlithwai didn't undergo miclonization.

His eyepiece is cybernetic.

Miclonization has always been a choice for Zentradi but cybernetics limits that choice.
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