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Old 2010-07-16, 12:49   Link #2141
Flinch
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There is no cure for smallpox... the best you can do is make them comfortable while they die
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Old 2010-07-16, 13:11   Link #2142
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Perhaps, but no disease has a 100% mortality rate. Even something like Ebola can be survived with sufficient care and luck. Thus, what about the people who don't even get infected, but who happen to be in the quarantine area?

When it was around, smallpox was commonly not fatal. You're right that it'd likely be worse now, since we lack the immunity, but it still wouldn't kill 100% of cases.
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Old 2010-07-16, 13:17   Link #2143
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you're right, but those few people are very few and spread out, the glitch in the statistic if you will.

As such, a humane way to alleviate their pain would be to jack them up on morpha or kill them.

That said, practical choices are better than idealogical ones built on falacies.
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Old 2010-07-16, 13:23   Link #2144
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Actually, the more lethal version of smallpox only had a mortality rate of 30% or so. And that was (presumably) without modern medicine.

But, really, your idea of a 'practical' choice seems to be "kill everyone who might be a danger", which in the Nasuverse at least is shown time and time again to be a very bad path for a human to follow, regardless of logic (see: Kiritsugu, Archer, MoS Shirou).

Anyway, this is a pointless argument, because what matters, really, is how Shirou would act in that scenario, and to me he's not remotely OOC. He wants to save everyone. And, before you say "but that's idealistic bullshit", Shirou is an idealist. In Fate he gets away with it, mostly, but in HF he sees what it truly means.
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Old 2010-07-16, 13:39   Link #2145
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by breaking the dynamics of the other paths
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Old 2010-07-16, 13:53   Link #2146
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What dynamic?

HF Shirou is merely a logical progression from Shirou in the other two routes. The three routes work well as individual routes, but they also tell as story when put together. The story of Shirou's ideal and how it is fatally flawed.
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Old 2010-07-16, 14:45   Link #2147
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Originally Posted by Flinch View Post
Mitsuzuri, if I'm not spelling that wrong
Yes, that's her!

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Gilgamesh's armor is preferable. I can't imagine the King of mighty Uruk in anything but. Of course, a King is more liable to wear satin than armor.
Right? It's bad enough they gave him a boring hair cut, but no armor? He didn't seem as menacing. Why did they change his design in the other two routes?

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This is Shinji we're talking about.
Yeah, so did he beat her around and rape her and/or take her energy? I don't remember what the resolution was in regards to her.
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Old 2010-07-16, 15:32   Link #2148
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Yeah, so did he beat her around and rape her and/or take her energy? I don't remember what the resolution was in regards to her.
Beat her, rape and take energy, dispose of. I imagine that's how he operates with everyone except Sakura. (For obvious reasons)

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Right? It's bad enough they gave him a boring hair cut, but no armor? He didn't seem as menacing. Why did they change his design in the other two routes?
I liked his hair upswept, when it was down it immediately entered into 'meh' territory. His armor, I liked. His casual clothes? Not so much. (Felt like I was looking at a protagonist's goofball friend or something.)

Oh well.
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Old 2010-07-16, 15:48   Link #2149
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Beat her, rape and take energy, dispose of. I imagine that's how he operates with everyone except Sakura. (For obvious reasons)
I'm pretty sure she survived, actually, in all three routes (she only gets raped in UBW, although she gets attacked in Fate). And, it's kind of implied that Rider was the one doing the raping (and Rider has to drain her of energy). After all, Shinji can't let her see him unless he then kills her, and I think Shinji wanted to humilate her but leave her alive.
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Old 2010-07-16, 16:47   Link #2150
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Why did Gil even HAVE armor? There was no such thing as armor when he was king. Hell, and Enkindu both met when they were naked... and they did wrestle for quite a while over a woman's chastity
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Old 2010-07-16, 16:50   Link #2151
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Did anyone else dislike Gilgamesh's design in UBW & HF? They could have at least given him alternate armor to put on instead of staying in those clothes.
I preferred his hair, anyway! The rest of the outfit was... well... he looked so cheesy I couldn't quite dislike him, but I still preferred the armor.

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Why did Gil even HAVE armor? There was no such thing as armor when he was king. Hell, and Enkindu both met when they were naked... and they did wrestle for quite a while over a woman's chastity
Well, I've never read through the Epic of Gilgamesh, but I'm pretty sure there was no mention of a Reality-breaking Drill Sword either...
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Old 2010-07-16, 16:51   Link #2152
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That's another thing... he was blond, and had ear rings
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Old 2010-07-16, 17:01   Link #2153
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Actually, and I'm not 100% sure on this, but I believe the official explanation for any of Gil's assorted 'oddities'... the armor, the unearthly sword, the weird coloration... is that Ancient Uruk was visited by aliens, and had alien technology.

No, seriously.

EDIT: And just for the record? My absolute favorite of his appearances is that ridiculous furred pimpcoat he wore in Fate. I figure, if you're gonna make a character a giant ham, you might as well go all-out, right?
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Old 2010-07-16, 22:25   Link #2154
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Beat her, rape and take energy, dispose of. I imagine that's how he operates with everyone except Sakura. (For obvious reasons)
He did all of that to Sakura, just not taking the energy. The bastard. If only he died horribly like he did in HF in the other two routes.

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I liked his hair upswept, when it was down it immediately entered into 'meh' territory. His armor, I liked. His casual clothes? Not so much. (Felt like I was looking at a protagonist's goofball friend or something.)
I was surprised by that. Does anyone have any idea why they changed his design? Just for the hell of it?

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I'm pretty sure she survived, actually, in all three routes (she only gets raped in UBW, although she gets attacked in Fate). And, it's kind of implied that Rider was the one doing the raping (and Rider has to drain her of energy). After all, Shinji can't let her see him unless he then kills her, and I think Shinji wanted to humilate her but leave her alive.
When did they tell us she got raped? I really don't remember anything except them finding her alive.

And didn't Rider dream rape Shirou in the beginning? In his sex dream with Rin in HF, she had Rider's eyes at the end.
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Old 2010-07-16, 22:33   Link #2155
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When did they tell us she got raped? I really don't remember anything except them finding her alive.

And didn't Rider dream rape Shirou in the beginning? In his sex dream with Rin in HF, she had Rider's eyes at the end.
I don't think they ever said Mitsuzuri was raped, but I recall it being implied. It's been awhile since I've read UBW, though, so I'm not certain.

And yeah, Rider totally dream-raped Shirou.
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Old 2010-07-16, 23:45   Link #2156
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He did all of that to Sakura, just not taking the energy. The bastard.
I think the bit that they were claiming Shinji didn't do to Sakura was the "dispose of her" bit, actually....

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If only he died horribly like he did in HF in the other two routes.
Really, his HF death wasn't nearly horrible enough. He probably suffered more in Fate, and he definitely suffered more in UBW (although he didn't die, of course).

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When did they tell us she got raped? I really don't remember anything except them finding her alive.
I think it's implied rather than outright stated.

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And didn't Rider dream rape Shirou in the beginning? In his sex dream with Rin in HF, she had Rider's eyes at the end.
Yeah, that's Rider. Sakura was short on prana, so Rider raped him to help aleviate her (note that the day after they're talking about how Sakura gave Shirou her 'cold'). There's a bit of a difference between giving Shirou a rather pleasant sex dream and beating and raping Ayako, though, even if they're technically both rape.
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Old 2010-07-17, 08:02   Link #2157
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I think the bit that they were claiming Shinji didn't do to Sakura was the "dispose of her" bit, actually....
Ah, my bad.


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Really, his HF death wasn't nearly horrible enough. He probably suffered more in Fate, and he definitely suffered more in UBW (although he didn't die, of course).
I'll agree to that. He deserved a more slow death, however he was also a victim of circumstance to some degree.

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I think it's implied rather than outright stated.
I must have missed that I suppose.

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Yeah, that's Rider. Sakura was short on prana, so Rider raped him to help aleviate her (note that the day after they're talking about how Sakura gave Shirou her 'cold'). There's a bit of a difference between giving Shirou a rather pleasant sex dream and beating and raping Ayako, though, even if they're technically both rape.
So a servant has to use sex to absorb energy unless they use a boundary field or a spell of some sort?
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Old 2010-07-17, 09:11   Link #2158
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I don't think they ever said Mitsuzuri was raped, but I recall it being implied. It's been awhile since I've read UBW, though, so I'm not certain.
It was pretty strongly implied by Shinji that Ayako had been raped, but I'm not certain if it was actually true or if he was just spreading it as a rumor to ruin her reputation. But yeah, it was very heavily implied that she had been raped.


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So a servant has to use sex to absorb energy unless they use a boundary field or a spell of some sort?
I've only played through Fate and UBW, but yes, Servants can use sex to get energy. Saber did it during the Fate route with Shirou, and in UBW Caster had sex with Kuzuki to regain the energy she had lost and make him her Master.
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Old 2010-07-17, 09:45   Link #2159
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It was pretty strongly implied by Shinji that Ayako had been raped, but I'm not certain if it was actually true or if he was just spreading it as a rumor to ruin her reputation. But yeah, it was very heavily implied that she had been raped.
Ah, yes! Now I remember that scene. I thought he was only spreading a rumor, didn't think he actually did it. But then again, we didn't learn that he raped until HF, so I see how I didn't think he did it.


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I've only played through Fate and UBW, but yes, Servants can use sex to get energy. Saber did it during the Fate route with Shirou, and in UBW Caster had sex with Kuzuki to regain the energy she had lost and make him her Master.
Yeah, but sex is not the only way, right? It's just the easiest. I think Rin explained it in Fate before she kissed Shirou.
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Old 2010-07-17, 09:53   Link #2160
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Yeah, but sex is not the only way, right? It's just the easiest. I think Rin explained it in Fate before she kissed Shirou.
It's definitely the easiest way as far as I know, or at least, it was in Fate since they had no other way of saving Saber. But I think overall it's the easiest way in general to get mana from the Master, since it takes less time and care, assuming that they aren't already getting mana from the connection they share with their Master.
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