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Old 2010-08-15, 12:02   Link #2441
Cherry_Lover
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Originally Posted by GDB View Post
Same way Sakura would be. She'd have an unresolved story and has many fans.
Well, perhaps, but the same applies to her as to Sakura, only more so (Nasu isn't going to want to base the entire story around "lol, we have to find Ilya a new body"), and in any case she's only around in one route.
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Old 2010-08-15, 12:06   Link #2442
GDB
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Of course. I was mostly saying that if you include Sakura as a hook for a sequel, you gotta include Ilya too. But either way, I do agree that there isn't enough to make a true sequel of.

That being said, more routes please~ That was one of the best parts about the game: being able to make the most minor of decision changes and having the outcome be so radically altered. Ilya route! Oh, more Tiger Dojo too (surprised they haven't done a Tiger Dojo mini anime like they did with Haruhi-chan).
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Old 2010-08-15, 12:44   Link #2443
Cherry_Lover
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Originally Posted by GDB View Post
Of course. I was mostly saying that if you include Sakura as a hook for a sequel, you gotta include Ilya too.
Fair enough, although I'd say that Sakura fits it a little better, not least because with her it's a potential hook for two routes (including UBW, which was the one suggested...).

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But either way, I do agree that there isn't enough to make a true sequel of.
Well, with Sakura I'd say that there was, because saving her from Zouken is not going to be easy, but it's not something I can see Nasu wanting to do. With Ilya, it's not really enough for a sequel at all, because it just consists of finding some way to keep her alive.

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That being said, more routes please~ That was one of the best parts about the game: being able to make the most minor of decision changes and having the outcome be so radically altered.
Well, this is another reason why the 'sequel' idea wouldn't work. Shirou post-UBW or post-HF is too set in his ways for any real radical changes to happen, he has a girlfriend and his life has a well-defined meaning. Whilst you could have some minor divergances, there's no way you could get three routes that are so radically different in the way that you do in FSN.
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Old 2010-08-15, 13:51   Link #2444
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Originally Posted by Cherry_Lover View Post
Well, this is another reason why the 'sequel' idea wouldn't work. Shirou post-UBW or post-HF is too set in his ways for any real radical changes to happen, he has a girlfriend and his life has a well-defined meaning. Whilst you could have some minor divergances, there's no way you could get three routes that are so radically different in the way that you do in FSN.
I disagree. In UBW, especially true end (Far superior lmao), Shiro is still unsure of his path and isn't quite sure what the fight between him and Archer meant to him. All he affirmed was that he wouldn't give up, but the actual quest of not becoming like Archer was never even started.
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Old 2010-08-15, 14:33   Link #2445
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Well...I just finished getting all of the tiger stamps and watched the final, final Dojo. They actually talk about a lot of stuff. And one thing that I found most important was that they described HF's true end as the grande finale of the game. Just something to think about.
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Old 2010-08-15, 14:36   Link #2446
Cherry_Lover
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Originally Posted by Reckoner View Post
I disagree. In UBW, especially true end (Far superior lmao), Shiro is still unsure of his path and isn't quite sure what the fight between him and Archer meant to him. All he affirmed was that he wouldn't give up, but the actual quest of not becoming like Archer was never even started.
Not really, at least not to the extent that he is before the game. For a start, you can't have three different love interests any more, because he's with Rin, and that is a big part of the divergence between the routes. Plus, there's no big event where his life could diverge so spectacularly. In the end, he's going to be much the same person at the end of any routes in the sequel, because his personality can't develop all that much, at least not without things going badly wrong and it ending up something like Mind of Steel.

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Originally Posted by DragoZERO View Post
Well...I just finished getting all of the tiger stamps and watched the final, final Dojo. They actually talk about a lot of stuff. And one thing that I found most important was that they described HF's true end as the grande finale of the game. Just something to think about.
I'm pretty sure that is a literal statement (as in, "it's the end of the game") rather than a statement claiming HF True is the canon ending, as much as I'd like to think otherwise.
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Old 2010-08-15, 19:16   Link #2447
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Originally Posted by Cherry_Lover View Post
Not really, at least not to the extent that he is before the game. For a start, you can't have three different love interests any more, because he's with Rin, and that is a big part of the divergence between the routes. Plus, there's no big event where his life could diverge so spectacularly. In the end, he's going to be much the same person at the end of any routes in the sequel, because his personality can't develop all that much, at least not without things going badly wrong and it ending up something like Mind of Steel.
Since when does a visual novel need to have different love interests or drastically different diverging routes? I was just saying it would be cool to have extra storylines after UBW, good end or true end. Shiro is still exploring the world of magi after all.

P.S. I find it funny how so many diverging opinions form on this visual novel depending on which heroine you like best and which route you like best (Though they often coincide).
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Old 2010-08-15, 20:06   Link #2448
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Originally Posted by Reckoner View Post
Since when does a visual novel need to have different love interests or drastically different diverging routes? I was just saying it would be cool to have extra storylines after UBW, good end or true end. Shiro is still exploring the world of magi after all.
Well, I was referring more to GDB's comment about diverging routes....

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P.S. I find it funny how so many diverging opinions form on this visual novel depending on which heroine you like best and which route you like best (Though they often coincide).
Well, it's kind of hard, as a Sakura fan, to like any route other than HF, because the other two shaft her so thoroughly....
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Old 2010-08-15, 20:21   Link #2449
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Since HA follows a route where most everyone is around, I'd follow that route as the 'canon' end for all intents and purposes.
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Old 2010-08-15, 21:42   Link #2450
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Since HA follows a route where most everyone is around, I'd follow that route as the 'canon' end for all intents and purposes.
Except that it's not. Whilst the characters are 'canon', the actual events of the game itself are not.

Spoiler:
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Old 2010-08-16, 10:47   Link #2451
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Originally Posted by Cherry_Lover View Post
I'm pretty sure that is a literal statement (as in, "it's the end of the game") rather than a statement claiming HF True is the canon ending, as much as I'd like to think otherwise.
I also think they meant it as the end with the fewest loose ends. I think if there was going to be a sequel, it would be after HF but because it is lacking important characters, they won't do it.

I think the best sequel would be in name only. Let's have the 7th Grail War or something. Even though much of the mystery would be gone, they could still come up with something to keep us compelled.
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Old 2010-08-16, 11:13   Link #2452
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I also think they meant it as the end with the fewest loose ends.
Well, it's the end with essentially no loose ends. The others have huge unresolved issues, both with regards to Sakura's situation and with regards to what will happen to Shirou. In HF, it's fairly clear how the future will go.

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I think if there was going to be a sequel, it would be after HF but because it is lacking important characters, they won't do it.
I think that that's quite plausible (Battle Moon Wars, which is a doujin game, follows on from HF, with the servants being re-summoned), except that HF has a substantial number of detractors, especially in Japan. So, whilst it'd make the most 'natural' route for a sequel (with the characters being very powerful and without any loose ends to tie up), it wouldn't be popular. However, trying to follow on from any other route would mean having to deal with (or ignore, I suppose, but that would be infuriating) Sakura's situation, and all routes are missing several important characters (Archer and two of Ilya, Rider and Saber, plus many others).

If they were going to do a sequel, it'd be after some hypothetical 'good end' where everyone was alive. But, they've already done that, with HA, so I don't see them doing it again.

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I think the best sequel would be in name only. Let's have the 7th Grail War or something. Even though much of the mystery would be gone, they could still come up with something to keep us compelled.
Well, if they do do a sequel, it's likely that there would be little crossover in characters. Perhaps it'd be post-Fate, with only Shirou around (Rin and Sakura having faded into the distance), showing him going around attempting to be a hero.

A seventh Grail War could perhaps work, but it's a bit non-canonical (since the Grail was dismantled), and without the FSN characters it wouldn't really be a sequel as much as it would be a new VN set in the Nasuverse.
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Old 2010-08-16, 11:21   Link #2453
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Okay, CL, Sakura does not matter in any other path than HF, so please stop trying to say that she does. Saber, Rin, and Ilya all have critical roles in each path, while Sakura has only a role in her own, therefore making her a less important character. Whether you like it or not, that's how it plays out, so please stop trying to make her sound like the most important person in the story, it's been bothering many of us for a while.
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Old 2010-08-16, 11:25   Link #2454
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Hideo.... Hideo... Is he a god?

I prefer anything with Rin in it. It's much funner, oh... having a RinxShirouxIlya rotue would rock.

Of course, since I'm bias to red eyes and lolis... I may choose Ilya in the end. >_>
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Old 2010-08-16, 11:34   Link #2455
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With eyes enhanced by magic, there's no real reason to have melanin in them, same with the rest of the body. That's why all of the Einzberns have white hair and red eyes, it's a complete lack of melanin (albinism).
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Old 2010-08-16, 11:45   Link #2456
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Originally Posted by Flinch View Post
Okay, CL, Sakura does not matter in any other path than HF, so please stop trying to say that she does. Saber, Rin, and Ilya all have critical roles in each path, while Sakura has only a role in her own, therefore making her a less important character. Whether you like it or not, that's how it plays out, so please stop trying to make her sound like the most important person in the story, it's been bothering many of us for a while.
She may not have a direct role but isn't she part of the reason Rin knows a little about Shirou?

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Hideo.... Hideo... Is he a god?

I prefer anything with Rin in it. It's much funner, oh... having a RinxShirouxIlya rotue would rock.

Of course, since I'm bias to red eyes and lolis... I may choose Ilya in the end. >_>
Rin is hilarious, without a doubt. I love tsunderes who poke fun at the protagonist, like Hitagi from Bakemonogatari.

And I liked UBW's good end the best because you had Rin x Shirou x Saber.
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Old 2010-08-16, 11:48   Link #2457
Cherry_Lover
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Okay, CL, Sakura does not matter in any other path than HF, so please stop trying to say that she does.
Yes, she does. She may not play a direct role in the story, but she's still an important character, and her fate matters. It matters to Rin, it matters to Shirou and it sure as hell matters to her fans. If Nasu is going to make a sequel, he needs to make everyone happy, not just Rin fans or Saber fans. Plus, any UBW follow-up would screw over Ilya too, so....

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Saber, Rin, and Ilya all have critical roles in each path, while Sakura has only a role in her own, therefore making her a less important character.
No, they don't. Saber has little role in HF, other than as a plot device, and Ilya's only importance in UBW is as a heart to stuff into Shinji. Sakura has just as much importance in the story as they do, you just don't realise it until you play through HF.

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Whether you like it or not, that's how it plays out, so please stop trying to make her sound like the most important person in the story, it's been bothering many of us for a while.
To be quite frank, fuck you.

I don't care if you think Ilya is a more important character than Sakura, even though she's not (Ilya is barely mentioned in UBW, except as a plot device, and even in Fate she's just an enemy to be defeated and then a little kid for Shirou to look after), that's just your opinion.

Last edited by Cherry_Lover; 2010-08-16 at 14:31.
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Old 2010-08-16, 11:51   Link #2458
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I'm just trying to say its as if you're trying to stuff your belief down our throats, and that's not something I can approve.
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Old 2010-08-16, 12:23   Link #2459
Cherry_Lover
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And you're trying to stuff your beliefs down my throat. Whilst you're perhaps right that, overall, Sakura has less involvement than Saber or Rin, she certainly has more than Ilya.

Anyway, that's beside the point, because her situation is not resolved in the other two routes, and even if you don't care about her, it matters to Rin and Shirou. Plus, if you don't deal with it, then she is left out of the sequel, and that would mean alienating her fans. And, if you actually bothered to read what I said, I quite expressly stated that they wouldn't do a sequel based on any of the routes (including HF) because it would mean missing out at least 3 of the six most popular characters (Archer and at least two of Ilya, Rider and Saber, plus Sakura unless they deal with her issues) and that would alienate a lot of people.

As for my post, I'd like you to point out to me where I was saying that Sakura was the "most important person in the story". I merely agreed that HF is the only route without any loose ends (it was someone else's statement, not mine), which is true, and stated that any other route would require either dealing with or ignoring Sakura's situation (which is also true), and that them ignoring it is something that I would find infuriating. All of those things are entirely factually true statements, and have no specific Sakura bias. I even quite clearly stated that any route would leave out important characters. And, you can't deny that Sakura is an important character in the game as a whole, even if she's not the most important.

Last edited by Cherry_Lover; 2010-08-16 at 14:35.
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Old 2010-08-16, 12:36   Link #2460
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SO...while getting my stamps I was wondering what the deal was with the worm rape with Rin in the 40th bad end. I expected there to be a lot more detail from what everyone was talking about regarding it.

There really is a lot of added info in the dojos. They surely are not to be overlooked. The only thing I didn't like was how Saber, Rin & Sakura were drawn, but that's just my taste after all.
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