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Old 2009-03-07, 02:53   Link #1101
ShinMasaki
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Keroko View Post
*shrug* Well, Fate/Stay Night took us several years, if we could wait for that, waiting for this shouldn't be that hard. We know that the translator is putting in effort to get this translated. Of course, a lack of percentages does make one wonder, but at the same time, since we don't know how far he is, he could be farther then we think.
I've gone through all of Fate/Hollow (self translation) and it is a big task...the convenient thing about it is once you complete the game, you can simply select scenes to play/read through but perhaps the hardest thing to do is to make a good flowchart. I'm in the middle of getting a written translation out for the game as well but it's just a daunting task...trying to get this done ASAP so I'm well rested and prepared for Mahou Tsukai no Yoru later in the year. Translating really isn't all the hard or time consuming. The hard part is taking your translation, converting it over to another language and re-editing the existing text/software. Making a reliable flowchart for Fate/Hollow is impossible, I believe.



As far as my little input to the whole above discussion...Here's a quote from the game in the scene you get after getting all the Tiger Stamps. "I said it before, but Fate is Shirou's story. The question of how Shirou should exist is presented in Saber and Rin's routes. One of the answers is Sakura's route, "Heaven's Feel"."

Simply, the game is saying F/SN is about Shirou hinting that the true story to the game is UBW. One answer of how he lives his life, one possible story is Heaven's Feel. A story made so each of the main heroines gets their own story.

I just see Heaven's Feel as a fanfic Nasu wrote to his own story. He can be a fan of his own work, correct? In a fanfic, you are allowed leeway to create events and force things upon the characters that would normally not occur for the sake of convenience.

Events with plot holes are allowed such as True Assassin's birth, Zouken's involvement in the Grail War, the birth of Sakura's 'shadow', the whole Archer's arm's magic circuit dominating Shirou (lol), etc. A fanfic is simply the author's representation of events that could happen. It is not necessary to explain everything so long as it works for your story.
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Old 2009-03-07, 05:34   Link #1102
Keroko
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ShinMasaki View Post
I've gone through all of Fate/Hollow (self translation) and it is a big task...the convenient thing about it is once you complete the game, you can simply select scenes to play/read through but perhaps the hardest thing to do is to make a good flowchart. I'm in the middle of getting a written translation out for the game as well but it's just a daunting task...trying to get this done ASAP so I'm well rested and prepared for Mahou Tsukai no Yoru later in the year. Translating really isn't all the hard or time consuming. The hard part is taking your translation, converting it over to another language and re-editing the existing text/software. Making a reliable flowchart for Fate/Hollow is impossible, I believe.
Yes, I've heard that F/HA is one of those scatter-games where you can go almost anywhere any time. But if you are working on a translation... would you by chance be Amukunau?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ShinMasaki View Post
Events with plot holes are allowed such as True Assassin's birth, Zouken's involvement in the Grail War, the birth of Sakura's 'shadow', the whole Archer's arm's magic circuit dominating Shirou (lol), etc. A fanfic is simply the author's representation of events that could happen. It is not necessary to explain everything so long as it works for your story.
Actually, plotholes in fanfics is sort of a pet-peeve of mine. I don't mind if you put a spin on a story, but at least explain how it happened rather then just be lazy and don't bother to explain it. So even if I view Heavens Feel as a fanfic by the author, that still doesn't really change my views.
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Old 2009-03-07, 13:07   Link #1103
swtrooper42
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Got my game and finally wrapped up the Fate route after 28 hours of playtime, including all the Bad Ends. I gotta say, it was a wild ride.
So I'll just post my thoughts on the route as a whole:

Favorite scenes:
Day 14: Wish - The scene where Shirou, just about slashed in half by Gilgamesh, absolutely refuses to admit defeat and gets up despite Saber's pleas.
Plus him saying he could never give her up to a guy like Gilgamesh.
Day 15: The final battle between Saber and Gilgamesh, especially when she kicks him in the face.
Epilogue: The scene where Shirou talks with Rin about Saber, saying he will always remember he loved her even if his other memories of her fade.
And his muses that if he keeps trying, he'll eventually reach his goal.

Musings:
Rin is very lovely and I look forward to playing through Unlimited Blade Works.
Angry Rin and embarrassed Rin are win.
Ilya is adorable and lightened up gameplay considerably for me.
Lancer is all that is man.
Shirou may be an idealistic idiot, but he certainly has a sort of style to him.
I loved how Saber started to warm to Shirou as the story went on. Her smile just warms me up.
Sex scenes are hilarious. The metaphors make me cringe and the author certainly likes to use the words "meat" and "juice" over and over again.

Overall: Being as this is Saber's route, she just absolutely dominated. Her subtle feelings, devotion to Shirou, and warm smile instantly won me over, plus her jealously when Ilya first moves in. I already got my Saber fix from watching the anime version, which I was watching after playing through certain scenes so I could compare them. The parting was sad since I knew it was coming, but I know it was the only way. So, this route was easily worth the 28 hours of time put in.

Questions:
What is with the imagery of Shirou's body made of swords or whatever? It comes into play when he falls to his death at the school and again when he gets slashed by Gilgamesh. Did that have to deal with Avalon implanted in his body? Because that's what I was thinking.

What happened to Assassin? Since he was summoned by another Servant does that mean he only has finite mana and he just faded away when it ran out or did Caster dispel/kill him to free up mana for Saber?

How does Caster instantly order Saber to kill Shirou? I thought that Rule Breaker only dispelled magical contracts. Was the contract transferred to Caster and she used a command spell? Or did she use a normal spell to get Saber to obey? But then wouldn't Saber's A magic resistance shrug it off or at least allow her to resist?
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Old 2009-03-07, 13:35   Link #1104
ShinMasaki
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Answer time!

Quote:
Originally Posted by swtrooper42 View Post
Questions:
What is with the imagery of Shirou's body made of swords or whatever? It comes into play when he falls to his death at the school and again when he gets slashed by Gilgamesh. Did that have to deal with Avalon implanted in his body? Because that's what I was thinking.
If anything, it would be Shirou awakening his magical powers and unconsciously using his own magical ability. So not to spoil things too much because this is a big thing about Shirou, play through UBW (the next story arc after Fate). It explains a lot. If my understanding of Avalon is correct, it would not have anything to do with Avalon since Avalon only heals and restores wounds already inflicted and does nothing to prevent said wound from occurring.

Quote:
Originally Posted by swtrooper42 View Post
What happened to Assassin? Since he was summoned by another Servant does that mean he only has finite mana and he just faded away when it ran out or did Caster dispel/kill him to free up mana for Saber?
It is assumed that Assassin was given X mana by Caster at his summoning. Assassin was summoned by Caster but actually linked to the hill itself and not Caster. Due to this, Assassin is not able to leave the hill as he has to stay with his Master, albeit the Master is a hill. As the hill is his Master, Assassin isn't receiving mana from his Master and has so many days to exist before his mana supply initially given by Caster runs out. As you know, running through the Fate story, when a Servant's mana runs out, they are done.

Quote:
Originally Posted by swtrooper42 View Post
How does Caster instantly order Saber to kill Shirou? I thought that Rule Breaker only dispelled magical contracts. Was the contract transferred to Caster and she used a command spell? Or did she use a normal spell to get Saber to obey? But then wouldn't Saber's A magic resistance shrug it off or at least allow her to resist?
Rule Breaker dispelled Shirou's contract with Saber and Caster immediately picked Saber up as her own Servant. Remember that a Servant without a Master will disappear after a while, but during that time if said Servant finds (or gets found) by an available person eligible to be a Master a new contract can be made. So it's not that she used a spell to get Saber to obey, it's that she used a Command Seal to force Saber to obey. More is explained on this during the Heaven's Feel route.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Keroko View Post
Yes, I've heard that F/HA is one of those scatter-games where you can go almost anywhere any time. But if you are working on a translation... would you by chance be Amukunau?
I am not. There are actually a number of people actually working on their own translations to Fate/Hollow. It's just that some like Amukunau are more known due to posts and status updates on other boards like on nrvnqsr.com (Beast's Lair boards) and some of the other people from the boards on mirrormoon.org. Just think of me as one of those unknown people working on a translation that will suddenly be complete and nobody will know they were doing anything at all.

If you want an update about my status on F/HA, I have just about nothing physically translated, it's just a matter of transferring what I did translate into a physical form then editing all the stuff. Aside from the intro to F/HA though, I have nearly the entire game translated (just not written down). Just need to do that which shouldn't take all too long and then find an editor who wants to do the next step. From what I hear, the actual editing takes forever.

Last edited by ShinMasaki; 2009-03-07 at 13:46.
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Old 2009-03-07, 18:58   Link #1105
BusterSword
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so what was saber's sword called? Caliburn or Excalibur? I thought it was caliburn but then excalibur is a sword too but then saber's hougu is called excalibur so im guessing that wasnt the name of her sword she was using or was it?
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Old 2009-03-07, 19:17   Link #1106
Keroko
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Caliburn is the sword she usually fights with, it's only when she releases the wind and activates her Noble Phantasm that she summons Excalibur
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Old 2009-03-07, 19:42   Link #1107
rastilin
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This question comes up a lot

Caliburn is the sword in the stone
-- but she lost that one ---
Excalibur is the replacement which she uses during the grail war
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Old 2009-03-07, 20:54   Link #1108
BusterSword
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so just to make it clear saber has been using excalibur ever since she was summoned right?
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Old 2009-03-07, 21:14   Link #1109
rastilin
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"so just to make it clear saber has been using excalibur ever since she was summoned right? "

Yes
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Old 2009-03-07, 23:42   Link #1110
ShinMasaki
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In addition, the sword that Shirou projects is Caliburn. Saber is surprised about this since it is the sword that she lost. She also favors Caliburn over Excalibur.

She probably traded Caliburn for a good meal claiming she 'lost' it.

Saber - Servant of the sword eating.
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Old 2009-03-07, 23:51   Link #1111
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ever since shirou made caliburn we were able to see saber use her sword so did she ditch excalibur for shirou's caliburn? lol
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Old 2009-03-08, 08:36   Link #1112
rastilin
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I think the wind barrier is one-shot. If you drop it, it's gone. Although I could be wrong.
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Old 2009-03-08, 09:12   Link #1113
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Saber prefer Calliburn to Excallibur.
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Old 2009-03-08, 11:39   Link #1114
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how do you know saber prefers caliburn over excalibur? lol I must of forgotten if it said she did in the anime o_o
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Old 2009-03-08, 11:42   Link #1115
Keroko
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I find it ironic though that the game lists Caliburn as the weaker of the two, despite Caliburn being the key to victory against Berserker (hence my initial confusion that Saber uses Caliburn throughout the game, I just fuigured she was using Caliburn and 'upgraded' it whenever she fired Excalibur).
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Old 2009-03-08, 12:09   Link #1116
ShinMasaki
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BusterSword View Post
how do you know saber prefers caliburn over excalibur? lol I must of forgotten if it said she did in the anime o_o
If you play the game F/SN (the PC vicual novel) it says so in the weapon descriptions.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fate/Stay Night weapon description
Golden Sword of Assured Victory
Caliburn

A holy sword that symbolizes England's king of knights, King Arthur.

It is the symbol of a king, pulled out from a chosen stone under the guidance of magus Merlin. It is a different sword from the one granted by the fairy of the lake, and its characteristics as a Noble Phantasm differ.

But, it seems Saber is more attached to this holy sword.

Since a sword is a symbol of power, a sword carried by a king usually ends up being degraded to the status of an ornament covered by decorations.

This is the biggest difference between Excalibur and Caliburn. In exchange for being a beautiful sword, its effectiveness as a weapon does not match that of Excalibur.

In the legend, it is said that it broke when King Arthur fought in a battle going against the principles of chivalry.
Quote:
Originally Posted by rastilin View Post
I think the wind barrier is one-shot. If you drop it, it's gone. Although I could be wrong.
To answer this, again the answer is in the info in the F/SN game under the status of the Servants.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fate/Stay Night Saber reference guide
Noble Phantasm - Invisible Air - Boundary Field of the Wind King

Other than the advantage of making the blade invisible, it is possible to release the compressed wind, making it a single-use projectile weapon.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Keroko View Post
I find it ironic though that the game lists Caliburn as the weaker of the two, despite Caliburn being the key to victory against Berserker (hence my initial confusion that Saber uses Caliburn throughout the game, I just fuigured she was using Caliburn and 'upgraded' it whenever she fired Excalibur).
Silly plot hole. Yeah, Saber has always been using Excalibur, just concealed. Shirou projects Caliburn and beats Berserker with it although it is weaker than Excalibur. Also, Saber's Excalibur is the true sword Excalibur as it is made into a Noble Phantasm. The projections that Shirou makes are always of a weaker grade than that of the original, so it's like this.

Excalibur > Caliburn > Shirou's Caliburn = destroys Berserker? lol
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Old 2009-03-08, 14:27   Link #1117
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I think it's because, although Shirou's Caliburn is weaker, it's still enough to destroy Berserker.

Saber couldn't actually use Excalibur in that battle, right? Simply because she didn't have enough magical energy/prana... so when Shirou creates her old sword and she's able to wield it, she can destroy Berserker with it.
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Old 2009-03-08, 14:39   Link #1118
Keroko
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The plothole is that, even though it's shrouded in wind, she is already using Excalibur. A sword more powerful then Caliburn. Even if she can't 'Fire da lazor' her sword should have been more then enough to kill berserker.

Oh well.
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Old 2009-03-08, 16:57   Link #1119
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Keroko View Post
The plothole is that, even though it's shrouded in wind, she is already using Excalibur. A sword more powerful then Caliburn. Even if she can't 'Fire da lazor' her sword should have been more then enough to kill berserker.

Oh well.
Where's the plothole in that? It's precisely because Saber can't "Fire da lazor" that Exaclibur can't kill Berserker--and neither can Caliburn. Both, on their own, could only take one potential life from Berserker. However, the actual activation of the Noble Phantasm is a different story entirely. A full-powered, direct Excalibur could likely take all 12 of Berserker's lives, but Saber didn't have the mana to use it. The activated Caliburn was strong enough to take only 7 lives, but the cost to use it is significantly lower (i.e. not 800 units of Saber's approximate 1200 mana (of which she was severely lacking at the time)).

Basically, Caliburn is capable of dealing a stronger, anti-unit attack like the version of Excaliblast that Saber uses against Gil. in the final fight and was useful solely because she didn't have to mana to use an Excaliblast.
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Old 2009-03-08, 17:09   Link #1120
Keroko
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The problem lies in that that Caliburn is not one of Saber's Noble Phantasm's. If berserker can only be defeated by Excalibur in 'Noble Phantasm form', so to say, how come Caliburn, which is not a Noble Phantasm, defeat Berserker?
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