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View Poll Results: Potential Pairing - Multiple Choice Option
Alto x VF 171 32 12.31%
Ozma x Bobby 13 5.00%
Ranka x Sheryl 42 16.15%
Sheryl x Alto 199 76.54%
Yasaburo x Alto 5 1.92%
Ranka x Ai-kun 38 14.62%
Alto x Klan 14 5.38%
Ranka x Alto 54 20.77%
Ranka x Brera 37 14.23%
Klan x Michael 101 38.85%
Ozma x Cathy 111 42.69%
Luca x Nanase 41 15.77%
Wilder x Monica 41 15.77%
Alto x VF25 37 14.23%
Yasaburo x Alto's father 10 3.85%
Alto x Brera 18 6.92%
Grace x Ranka 12 4.62%
Nanase x Ranka 21 8.08%
Sheryl x Klan 24 9.23%
Multiple Choice Poll. Voters: 260. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2008-06-13, 23:27   Link #141
ani_d
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Quote:
Originally Posted by justinstrife View Post
I just cannot see Alto picturing Ranka as more than just a sister to protect, and to help. I've watched the first 10 episodes now 4x since last weekend soaking everything in(apparently my hunger for more Macross over the years has spilled over thanks to this series ), and when I look at Alto and Sheryl together, I see two adults slowly lowering their defenses, and opening their hearts, bit by bit. When I see Alto and Ranka together, I see a big brother offering advice and support to his kid sister, and her enthusiasm and innocents pushes him along when he's down.
I'm not going to say you're wrong about his relationships with Sheryl and Ranka. However, I think we all saw that Ranka had made Alto blush once or twice in the story. If she can pull that, then there's definitely a chance that Alto can see her in a different light. Brotherly love to me is when the guy doesn't even get fazed by anything the girl does to him. It's cute, but I think Alto's sitting on the fence here when it comes to his 'brotherly feelings' for Ranka. What the two need is development, and in my opinion, Ranka realizing her own feelings is the start of it. Alto developing feelings for her is absolutely not impossible.

Also, I'm just going to point out that that paragraph I typed was pointing to how Alto and Ranka took the needed boost to get to their own goals in that scene. I didn't say that that they're each other's reasons why they want to be what they want to be.

Is Alto the reason why Ranka wanted to be a singer like Sheryl? No.
Is Ranka the reason why Alto wants to be in SMS? No.

Did they inspire each other to take their respective leap of faith to their goals? Yes. I believe they just did. I don't think this fact is something to be taken for granted.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tak
As for Sheryl and Alto, their interactions are by far the most entertaining in Macross. Alto with Ranka is just... sadly boring. There is no life in that, not enough interaction. But with Sheryl, very energetic, upbeat and dare I say, fun.
That's a matter of opinion

Quote:
Originally Posted by Slick_rick
He was not forced to join the SMS. Ozma wanted him to tell the story of how the other piloted died and then punched him in the face when he first suggested joining. When he heard about Ranka's past it also gave him more motivation to join the SMS. Saving her and hearing what happened in the past influenced his decision though it wasn't the only or even primary reason it still was a reason.
Good one.
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Old 2008-06-13, 23:32   Link #142
Tak
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ani_d View Post

Good one.
Oh no, he was not forced to join the SMS, he was forced to join the military, or suffer the consequences. SMS was a convenient third option he chose and his initial reaction to the SMS surely had very little to do with Ranka. As I said, even if Ranka wasn't there, he would have joined the SMS. Ranka was just a bonus, nothing more.


Quote:
Originally Posted by ani_d View Post



That's a matter of opinion
I've not said anything otherwise.

- Tak (Of course it is a matter of opinion, duh, I mean... everything here is a matter of opinion, what was I gonna do, threaten you with a plastic fork? )

Last edited by Tak; 2008-06-13 at 23:44.
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Old 2008-06-14, 01:16   Link #143
justinstrife
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Originally Posted by ani_d View Post
I'm not going to say you're wrong about his relationships with Sheryl and Ranka. However, I think we all saw that Ranka had made Alto blush once or twice in the story. If she can pull that, then there's definitely a chance that Alto can see her in a different light. Brotherly love to me is when the guy doesn't even get fazed by anything the girl does to him. It's cute, but I think Alto's sitting on the fence here when it comes to his 'brotherly feelings' for Ranka. What the two need is development, and in my opinion, Ranka realizing her own feelings is the start of it. Alto developing feelings for her is absolutely not impossible.
What about when he blushed finding out that Scene 47 had a kissing scene in it? This was before he knew that Ranka would be Mao. He blushed there.

How many times has he blushed involving Sheryl? How many involving Ranka? How many involving just embarrassing things?

I should bring up a couple of other scenes.

A) The first time Sheryl kissed him on the cheek(while Michel and Ranka watched). He was not only in shock, he touched his cheek, then watched her, and had a small smile. He may not have realized he even did it, but that is a sign of attraction. In Episode 10 when Sheryl kisses him, he's again in complete shock. Then he looks directly at her, trying to figure out if it was another antic of hers, or if she was trying to reveal more. When he came to the conclusion she was teasing him again, he blushed, then let his emotions get the better of him and started complaining again. I can't even tell you how many animes I've seen, where this happens between the main couple, before they become a couple. It's almost cliche.

Sheryl's eyes were quivering/shaking when she looked at him, but he was too busy trying to study her with his normally cold face, that she raised shields around her emotions again and with a blush(She couldn't raise the wall all the way up mind you), she hid behind the pillar on the deck to give her some distance as she teased him(i.e. distracted him from the true intent of the kiss).

Unless Sheryl dies, Alto gets brainwashed by Ranka, or he comes out of the closest, if he is going to end up with anyone, it will be Sheryl. I am 99.99999% confident of that outcome. She's too much like Misa Hayase and Ranka is too much like Lynn Minmei in terms of where they are in the story. They aren't identical(and Alto isn't Rick Hunter), as I think these characters are even better(dare I say that over my precious Lisa Hayes???).

The interactions so far have been very keen. Ranka only talks about herself with him. Complaining about her brother, talking about what job she has thanks to her new manager, her lack of confidence in singing, her wish to be like Sheryl, her, her, her. She never asks him what he's doing, what he's thinking, how he's feeling, she doesn't even try and know more about him(not about the kabuki thing but in other things). They haven't even gone anywhere together like Sheryl and Alto have together.

Sheryl talks about Galaxy and Frontier. Finding out Alto doesn't like Frontier. She confides she doesn't like Galaxy either. They share a little bit of information about what they think about their homes. She takes effort(I'm sure little effort as Grace can do everything practically), to find out more about Alto(like about his family heritage and that he played a Princess Sakura). She seeks him out, gets him to show her around the school, teach her how to use the Ex-Gear, take her to different places around Frontier, etc. This isn't just because she wants to go do these things, she wants to do them with him. She wants to open up to him, and for him to open up to her. He's not just being her support, he's also the first person who ever saw her as anything other than sheryl the star. She can be herself with him. It's hard, but she's been doing it.

Ranka's whole mission has been to be like Sheryl. She might be adjusting the path so that she can try and get Alto's attention romantically, but only in the last episode or so. Sheryl's been going after Alto for the past 8 episodes. In her own way.

I'm sorry for the big ramble and everything being mixed up. I got about 3 hours of sleep last night, had a long Friday at work, and never got to grab a couple hours of sleep after work today(and I work Saturday to close out the week!). Hopefully some of my points were coherent and understandable. I usually attempt to make my points flow better, and have them in an easier to understand order.
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Old 2008-06-14, 01:23   Link #144
Tak
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^ Thank you, tis a long paragraph and I was too lazy to write it.

Anyhow, anybody believes that Alto is generally not amused by her (Sheryl's) antics should get a reality check. If anything, Alto is generally not interested by anything coming from Ranka. It is hard to dispute that Ranka's actions so far have been pretty predictable, simply give her a catalyst, and you will know which way she turn.

- Tak
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Old 2008-06-14, 01:27   Link #145
nines
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Hmmm if I recall Alto dosn't like Frontier because its to small and no where to fly / no real sky more of a longing for a planet where he can fly normally I think. And Sheryl dosn't like Galaxy because its loaded with gas plants and shit making it ugly and she likes Frontier because its nice and clear and the oceans are beautiful.

And nice explanation Justinstrife pretty much took whats in my head and made it not sound like utter crap xD
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Old 2008-06-14, 01:29   Link #146
Tak
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Originally Posted by nines View Post
And Sheryl dosn't like Galaxy because its loaded with gas plants and shit making it ugly and she likes Frontier because its nice and clear and the oceans are beautiful.
Sheryl didn't like the galaxy primarily because she felt lonely.

- Tak
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Old 2008-06-14, 01:41   Link #147
ickem
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Here are the next 6 of Sheryl's blog entries. Again it's a mixture of some summary and some translation. There's a tidbit about what kind of guys she prefers, which alludes to her comment to Michel about not being interested in guys who are frivolous.

2008-05-19
February 2, 2059

Title: [How can I get better at singing?]

She talks about how she gets asked this quite often. She says that everyone is reborn when they sing since people aren't born with the ability to express themselves in any way other than crying. People should just sing without thinking about trifling things.


2008-05-20
April 1, 2059

Title: Signature

A ten year old boy asked her for an autograph and she gave it to him even though she almost never gives them out. She only does a limited number of autographs using a type of prism ink that's created specifically for this purpose on Galaxy. She also asks if autographs are really that desirable. She gave it to him because he was looking at her so earnestly. "Frivilous men are burdens, but sincere men are treasures." The kid wanted her autograph so bad because his newborn sister is named Sheryl. She's never talked about people's names very much so didn't know, but it seems there are quite a few Sheryl's out there. "Chibi-Sheryl." She feels that these parents place a really cruel fate upon their daughters since there's a "huge barrier? sempai? in front of them." "Today's autograph was special. It is like a protection charm for Chibi-Sheryl. This type of service doesn't come often. Next time I am asked, I won't do it."


2008-05-23
??? 9, 2059

Title: Concert


I'm shivering throughout my body!

It feels as if all of my pores are open!

Concerts are like the poison of the Labyrinth!!
No matter how many I perform I always feel so good.
They are all like this.

No matter what type of magic you use you cannot replicate the same concert.

To everyone in the galaxy,
I'll place the words "I love you" in a melody and throw it to you!!

For those who have yet to attend one of my performances, you're only living 4/5 of a life, how unfortunate.


2008-05-24
December 24, 2058

Title: Do you know what I'm talking about?

Pale Cream.

Amontiriard.

Pedro Hinemez. (Please don't ask me about these, deciphering words from katakana has never been my strong point...)

Simply by decorating a room with gold (again this is from katakana, not kanji, so I'm not too sure about it being "gold") that seems to draw you in can blow all your unwanted feelings away.

Galaxy did not have any pure natural things, but do they exist somewhere in the galaxy?

That's right, the one I received as a present long ago was a cheap imitation.

Hehehe. (It's not actually this, but more of a mature feminine, under the breath laughter)

Do you know what I am talking about?

"Girls definitely want one Venetian Doll" is my favorite saying.

It is such a wonderful analogy, don't you think? Partners just have have this type of relationship.

(Ok she's got me, I have absolutely now idea what she's talking about...)


2008-05-26
May 9, 2059

Title: Ex-Gear

...I sort of used one.

All the muscles in my body are sore...especially the inner parts of both of my thighs.

For me, this is so shameful. On Galaxy I used to spend an hour and a half of everyday at a private sports gym doing a full course of weight lifting, aerobic exercises, and even muscle training, but when I came to Frontier I centered my routine around stretching and [steam yoga].

So I am basically reaping what I sowed. But even with that, the workout that I had today was not ordinary. It seems I unknowing used muscles that I don't use very often. Well, I did safely recover the thing that I was trying to recover.

And I did get to see Frontier's beautiful sunset from the perfect vantage point and I also did get to prepare for my future schedule so I have no regrets.

Now I will get into my "Blackbus" and get a thorough massage and then go to sleep.

Good night, the continuation of this will be in dreams.


2008-05-28
April 11, 2059

Title: An incredibly skilled...

She's found an incredibly skilled beautician. She can't just wait until she gets back to Galaxy before having skilled workers so she's looking to hire a new one. She was lucky enough to meet a genius beautician who goes by the name of "Miya" (I think this is the name). The beautician has wonderfully smooth scissor work and is somewhat peculiar, but there is nothing wrong with their sense. She's heard that for people in a certain country, "Miya" is the name of the craftsman that makes the tools and the places that God uses. With this she's ready for any number of interviews or photo shoots.
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Old 2008-06-14, 01:54   Link #148
nines
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Ara? what are these blog things is it like really part of the series or just made by the producers for fans to fight about the characters?
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Old 2008-06-14, 02:09   Link #149
lone_wolf
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ickem View Post
Here are the next 6 of Sheryl's blog entries. Again it's a mixture of some summary and some translation. There's a tidbit about what kind of guys she prefers, which alludes to her comment to Michel about not being interested in guys who are frivolous.
Thanks, ickem!

I'll try to have some more Ranka blog translations sometime tonight or tomorrow morning...LOL, somehow I don't feel so enthused about going to her blog site right now but I guess to be fair, I'll make the effort. ^_^.


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Old 2008-06-14, 02:25   Link #150
stray
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Quote:
Originally Posted by justinstrife View Post
Sheryl talks about Galaxy and Frontier. Finding out Alto doesn't like Frontier. She confides she doesn't like Galaxy either. They share a little bit of information about what they think about their homes. She takes effort(I'm sure little effort as Grace can do everything practically), to find out more about Alto(like about his family heritage and that he played a Princess Sakura). She seeks him out, gets him to show her around the school, teach her how to use the Ex-Gear, take her to different places around Frontier, etc. This isn't just because she wants to go do these things, she wants to do them with him. She wants to open up to him, and for him to open up to her. He's not just being her support, he's also the first person who ever saw her as anything other than sheryl the star. She can be herself with him. It's hard, but she's been doing it.
Not to really compare, or detract from what you said (I agree with alot of it) but in SDFM Misa was kind of the same way with Hikaru, and Hikaru was pretty much oblivious that Misa wanted more/was hurt/etc. until Sammie spilled the beans that Misa was in love with him. I haven't seen Robotech in years and years but I think Lisa spends the whole series basically saying "Oh Rick I can't live without you!!!" (ironically... kind of like Ranka). Either way, no matter how much love and good intention was there, Minmay was a flake. Watching him go for Misa was like watching Tina divorce Ike. (ahh... Proud Mary... sigh)

Of course maybe Alto isn't quite as oblivious, he has Michael basically spelling it out for him... but this triangle it really seems like someone's going to get hurt in the end (so far), and both Sheryl and Ranka are really lovable characters. Can make it easier to justify throwing one of them under the bus by rationalizing it, but there's still 16 more episodes for the powers that be to muck things up.
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Old 2008-06-14, 03:05   Link #151
lone_wolf
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A few more summaries of Ranka's blog. My mind wasn't working clearly for a few of these...sorry ^_^;; (I should be in bed LOL but I'm addicted to this forum at the moment)


5/31
2059年1月29日

So in this entry, Ranka mentions that she is back in school and she's doing okay. But she got lost on her way there and she's worried.

She drew a map of the way to school and her friend laughed at her.

LOL!





6/1
2058年12月4日


Ranka says it's raining this morning. As a result, her hair became unmanageable and if it got worse, she mentions that she wants to tie it.

She mentions (in katakana) Pikopiko which confused me LOL.




6/4 (this entry was worth reading and it shows Ranka's understandable fear of being attacked)
2059年3月5日


Ranka is saying that there were a lot of people who saw the news about an unidentified enemy that attacked Frontier and that was the day she was in town.

She was afraid but relieved afterwards because she didn't die. As she is writing this blog entry, she's still quite shaken up over the event. Lots of damage around the town and people are injured.

Each day was peaceful, she thought. But now she's not certain it will remain this way.



6/5
2059年4月1ξ日

This is more of a report from Ranka.

She reports that a new song has been decided and being worked on. She doesn't know how she will do but she's excited and nervous. (she even does the sound effect WAAI!!)


Apparently it was being announced at the Zentaramoru Forum. She wants everyone to hear it if it's good. She still doesn't know what kind of song it is. Regardless she'll sing it from the heart.

More news...

Ranka states that she might be doing some TV work later. She concludes that since she started this job, everyday has been fun. As soon as she finds out more details, she come back and report it.



6/6 (This one is Christmas/Aquarium themed and weird)
2058年12月19日

Ranka mentions that a large tank came in the store and during Christmas, the store manager will be in. The decorations for the aquarium were red and green (Christmas design)


Apparently it's for the fish called AROWANA

(Link in case no one is aware of what type of fish this is:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Osteoglossidae)



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Old 2008-06-14, 04:01   Link #152
justinstrife
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tak View Post
^ Thank you, tis a long paragraph and I was too lazy to write it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by nines View Post

And nice explanation Justinstrife pretty much took whats in my head and made it not sound like utter crap xD
I'm going to bed now as it's 2am here and I have work in 7 hours(and like I said in my earlier post, I only got about 3-4 hours of sleep the night before), but I've been having so much fun reading the different character threads, I lose track of time.

I've been out of school for a few years, and I don't read books as often as I use to, but just as in a verbal discussion, I try and keep my posts/summaries/chats, as orderly, and as to the point as possible. I get very irritated with myself, if I believe I said something that was confusing to other people. You don't have to agree with me, but I'd like for you to not be confused about what I say.

I admit to being a very big Sheryl supporter for Alto, but I also love Ranka's character and VA too. She would make the perfect little sister to protect, and to watch grow up and stand on her own feet. Sheryl however, pulls more at my adult feelings, and I like how she is drawn better(since she's an adult or at that age). Putting myself in Alto's shoes, he needs someone who will pull him out of his shell. I don't see Ranka doing that. Playing big brother might be fun, but it's not what he needs in the long-term. Both he, and Sheryl, have buried pasts that they try and avoid, and put up a cold front, that others don't see through. He's shown no interest in girls until now(if you remember the locker scene in episode 5 the one girl mentioned how he showed no interest in a Freshman that confessed to him), yet, several of the teases/advances that Sheryl has done with him, makes him look at her quite differently from everyone else(including Ranka).

Usually when he's looking at Ranka, it's more of a brotherly fondness. She's naive and innocent, and I think he admires that trait about her. He does care for her, but I don't see it in a romantic way. He wants to protect her, but because he sees her as someone who's defenseless and needs to be cuddled in a way. When he looks at Sheryl, he sees someone who confuses him. At first he thinks she's a self-centered bitch/queen diva, but immediately sees, that she is not a quitter. She is successful, not because of other people, but because of her own hard work. At the same time, she also has a playful, teasing side. She is a woman, and some of the things she does, can't help but effect him as a man. The locker scene, his charm in her shirt, the comment getting in the car on episode 2(or was it 3?) about how he could use the memory of her topless (), the kiss on his cheek, the french kiss in episode 10, etc.

Another thing I noticed, watching the episode where he gives her the earing back(before she gives it back to him to protect him), both of their voices get really low, and almost shy and unsure. Very unlike their usual interactions. I don't see those kind of changes in tones, with him and Ranka. When he and Sheryl are standing on the deck near the end of episode 10, they're like two adults watching over a child who is growing up. They seemed like they were from a different world than Ranka.

Oh my. I've been typing this up for the past 10 minutes when I should already be sleeping.

Someone made a comment about Misa and Hikaru, quoting me and getting into detail about their interactions from SDF:M, but I'll have to get to that tomorrow at work on my lunch break if I have the time.

Until my next, long-winded speech.
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Old 2008-06-14, 06:02   Link #153
ani_d
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Quote:
Originally Posted by justinstrife View Post
What about when he blushed finding out that Scene 47 had a kissing scene in it? This was before he knew that Ranka would be Mao. He blushed there.

How many times has he blushed involving Sheryl? How many involving Ranka? How many involving just embarrassing things?
Alto blushed tremendously when he found out he was going to kiss Ranka. There's also another instance in episode 3 when Ranka got closer to him and he blushed. Anyway, I'm not trying to count how many times Sheryl and Ranka made Alto blush lol I'm just saying that if Ranka can illicit this kind of reaction from Alto, then there's a chance he'd see her from a romantic perspective given the proper development. That's all. =)

Quote:
I should bring up a couple of other scenes.

A) The first time Sheryl kissed him on the cheek(while Michel and Ranka watched). He was not only in shock, he touched his cheek, then watched her, and had a small smile. He may not have realized he even did it, but that is a sign of attraction. In Episode 10 when Sheryl kisses him, he's again in complete shock. Then he looks directly at her, trying to figure out if it was another antic of hers, or if she was trying to reveal more. When he came to the conclusion she was teasing him again, he blushed, then let his emotions get the better of him and started complaining again. I can't even tell you how many animes I've seen, where this happens between the main couple, before they become a couple. It's almost cliche.
Though Alto did show attraction to Sheryl here, the guy also showed attraction to Ranka in the first episode. It balances it out. Plus, the fact that Ranka and Mikhail were there kind of ruins the Innocent Green moment, imo.

I find episode 5 and 8 more like a ramp to kill two birds in one stone--one is to establish Sheryl's place in the LT and to develop Ranka's character. With episode 10, it all seems like it hit a home run.

Quote:
Sheryl's eyes were quivering/shaking when she looked at him, but he was too busy trying to study her with his normally cold face, that she raised shields around her emotions again and with a blush(She couldn't raise the wall all the way up mind you), she hid behind the pillar on the deck to give her some distance as she teased him(i.e. distracted him from the true intent of the kiss).
I really don't mean this as an offense, but I still feel like this scene was used merely as a catalyst for Ranka to face her and Mao's feelings. I'm not discrediting anything from it. I just find it as a one of the puzzle pieces used to create a big picture. =__=


Quote:
Unless Sheryl dies, Alto gets brainwashed by Ranka, or he comes out of the closest, if he is going to end up with anyone, it will be Sheryl. I am 99.99999% confident of that outcome. She's too much like Misa Hayase and Ranka is too much like Lynn Minmei in terms of where they are in the story. They aren't identical(and Alto isn't Rick Hunter), as I think these characters are even better(dare I say that over my precious Lisa Hayes???).
I'm not a long time Macross fan, but I don't think Kawamori's going to do the same thing twice here.

Quote:
The interactions so far have been very keen. Ranka only talks about herself with him. Complaining about her brother, talking about what job she has thanks to her new manager, her lack of confidence in singing, her wish to be like Sheryl, her, her, her. She never asks him what he's doing, what he's thinking, how he's feeling, she doesn't even try and know more about him(not about the kabuki thing but in other things). They haven't even gone anywhere together like Sheryl and Alto have together.
That's because we're still in episode 10. Didn't Ranka get upset when she realized how little she knew of Alto? She became aware of it, and that's more than enough. If Kawamori is trying to emphasize Sheryl and Alto's growing understanding of each other, then why did he make Sheryl look like one of the "leave-Alto-be" crowd that know of his past?

Quote:
Sheryl talks about Galaxy and Frontier. Finding out Alto doesn't like Frontier. She confides she doesn't like Galaxy either. They share a little bit of information about what they think about their homes. She takes effort(I'm sure little effort as Grace can do everything practically), to find out more about Alto(like about his family heritage and that he played a Princess Sakura). She seeks him out, gets him to show her around the school, teach her how to use the Ex-Gear, take her to different places around Frontier, etc. This isn't just because she wants to go do these things, she wants to do them with him. She wants to open up to him, and for him to open up to her. He's not just being her support, he's also the first person who ever saw her as anything other than sheryl the star. She can be herself with him. It's hard, but she's been doing it.
Why didn't they reveal this side of Sheryl in the earlier episodes? There's no doubt that Sheryl was shown to be not such a bad character later on. She does look like she'll be a good partner for Alto. Like I've been saying here over and over, if Sheryl started out like this instead of Ranka then I probably would've grown to like her more because I usually find strong characters like her appealing. When Kawamori decided to bastardize Sheryl's character in the first episode, Ranka kinda won me completely lol I'm merely stuck on first impressions and I believe first impressions are a big part of storytelling That's why while Sheryl is shown to have all these good things you mentioned, I'm pretty sure Ranka will not be left in the dust. We're bound to see some 'giving' from her side too in the future. For sure.

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Ranka's whole mission has been to be like Sheryl. She might be adjusting the path so that she can try and get Alto's attention romantically, but only in the last episode or so. Sheryl's been going after Alto for the past 8 episodes. In her own way.
Hmm...I don't know about just last episode, Ranka's feelings for Alto has been growing consistently for the past 10 episodes too. Little by little. ^_^

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I'm sorry for the big ramble and everything being mixed up. I got about 3 hours of sleep last night, had a long Friday at work, and never got to grab a couple hours of sleep after work today(and I work Saturday to close out the week!). Hopefully some of my points were coherent and understandable. I usually attempt to make my points flow better, and have them in an easier to understand order.
Wow that's tough. I'm on summer vacation so I pretty much have it easier. Sorry my post kept you up. ^^ I'm toning down now. And I do think you brought up some good points about Sheryl up there.
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Old 2008-06-14, 08:07   Link #154
Slick_rick
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Originally Posted by Tak View Post
Actually, Alto had no choice. It would seem piloting the VF-25 would be his best chance of survival. After all, his wings were clipped, and if the VF-25 did not show up just in time, Alto might have died. Again, Ranka or no Ranka, Alto would have hopped into that plane, even if he was to buy himself time.
Whether or not her would have entered the VF if Ranka wasn't there is debatable. He best chance of survival would be escape in that situation. If you look at the scene again you will see him backing up away from the Vajra until he notices that Ranka was in danger. So your belief is quite a bit suspect.

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I hope you did not miss what I said. I stated quite correctly that he was about to become a military pilot or suffer the consequences. He negotiated his way out by choosing Ozma and the SMS as his third and best option.

When he finally reached the Macross quarter, he volunteered to pilot the VF-25 not because of Ranka, as he has yet to hear anything about Ranka's past. He simply wanted to fly, and he knew he could do it. That is all.
I didn't miss it. You were just plain dead wrong about what happened in the scene. Alto did not negotiate anything. He was saved by Ozma. Ozma told Cathy that the VF-25 was SMS property so it was none of the military business and they would handle it. After that Ozma tried to push him away from joining not force him into it.

Another scene where your reasoning is lacking. Before he volunteered there was a moment when he was staring at the dead pilots helmet. To say that the only reason he volunteered was so he could fly is cheapening Alto's emotions. He had many more reasons. Mainly the pilot, Ranka and wanting to save others if something like that happened again.



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Actually, he has been quite 'amused' by most of her antics. And I did not say in my post that he will eventually choose Sheryl, although that is what I am leaning towards. I simply stated that his interaction with Sheryl was a lot more entertaining than anything he has done with Ranka.

- Tak
I'm starting to wonder if we watch the same show. Alto doesn't usually get bullied or forced into 90 percent of the things he does with Sheryl on your show I guess. Sheryl and Ranka are both great characters. Each has their good points. Sheryl scenes are usually funny and unpredictable while Ranka are cute and endearing.
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Old 2008-06-14, 08:40   Link #155
Westlo
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Originally Posted by justinstrife View Post
The interactions so far have been very keen. Ranka only talks about herself with him. Complaining about her brother, talking about what job she has thanks to her new manager, her lack of confidence in singing, her wish to be like Sheryl, her, her, her. She never asks him what he's doing, what he's thinking, how he's feeling, she doesn't even try and know more about him(not about the kabuki thing but in other things). They haven't even gone anywhere together like Sheryl and Alto have together.
I briefly touched upon this in the Ranka Lee thread, I don't know if they are trying to get some sympathy for Ranka being the only one in Alto's circle who keeps finding out things everyone else knows but it's not going to work on me. Especially considering it's all Ranka, Ranka, Ranka, Ranka, Ranka in their conversations and next to no Alto at all. I'm trying to remember their conversation before the OP in 8 and it was pretty much Ranka's work and Ranka going back to school for most of it and than oh yeah 5 seconds on Alto being in hospital.

Sheryl actually makes an effort to find out about Alto and "get" him, she gives him an easy task to do (fly me around for a bit) so she can forgive him for her lost earring instead of just forgiving him which Alto wouldn't have liked. She understands his motivation to fly, knows about his work, she's pretty perceptive when it comes to Alto. She's also asked why he joined SMS and their interactions are more even and back and forth compared to the one way traffic of Ranka.

You compare these two things and yet the character who's been accused of being self-centered by some watchers is the one who's actually trying to understand Alto instead of using him like an advice column and a sounding board

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Originally Posted by ani_d View Post
Spoiler for Out of topic:
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Last edited by Westlo; 2008-06-14 at 09:08.
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Old 2008-06-14, 08:56   Link #156
ReddyRedWolf
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Join Date: Jun 2006
Yeah well if indeed both Sheryl and Ranka are Mao's grandkids it is somewhat a role reversal.

In Macross Zero it was Mao that was pursuing Shin while Sara watches at the background.

It was Sara that went jealous when she felt through the birdman head Mao and Shin's kiss.

Seems to me Sheryl and Ranka got some of their characteristics from grandma Mao.
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Old 2008-06-14, 09:39   Link #157
Tak
DIN = DAS IST NORM!
 
 
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Originally Posted by Slick_rick View Post
Whether or not her would have entered the VF if Ranka wasn't there is debatable. He best chance of survival would be escape in that situation. If you look at the scene again you will see him backing up away from the Vajra until he notices that Ranka was in danger. So your belief is quite a bit suspect.
Uh, no. His best chance of survival, if Ranka wasn't there, was to grab that VF-25 and fight the Vajra as he was right beside the VF-25. If Ranka was not there, the Vajra's attention would have been turned to him, and he was awfully close. At that range, I doubt you can escape anything fired at sub-light speed!

You said Alto backed away, I said he was scared shitless and stunned (yeah, he took half a step backward, that doesn't exactly count as 'trying to get away').

And your claim on him piloting the VF-25 due to Ranka is far more debatable. For all we know he was using her as bait! After all, she bought time for Alto to make further decisions. Had it been for anyone else taking Ranka's place, Alto would have done the same thing. Ranka's existence in that situation was not special, she was an added bonus! Forcefully associate Ranka to every major decision made by Alto when it was clear to me he would have done most of what he did with or without her is not a convincing argument.

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Originally Posted by Slick_rick View Post
I didn't miss it. You were just plain dead wrong about what happened in the scene. Alto did not negotiate anything. He was saved by Ozma. Ozma told Cathy that the VF-25 was SMS property so it was none of the military business and they would handle it. After that Ozma tried to push him away from joining not force him into it.
Alto chose to go with Ozma who obviously offered to save him. Alto didn't have to, but was it not his best third choice? Between being arrested and joining the military? And I didn't say he was forced by Ozma to join the SMS, I said he chose Ozma and the SMS as his best third option. Nonetheless, he was most definitely forced by the military to be in that situation. Then he volunteered to pilot despite Ozma's protest, not because of Ranka, but because he thought he could do it and perhaps, for the pilot who died saving him.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Slick_rick View Post
Another scene where your reasoning is lacking. Before he volunteered there was a moment when he was staring at the dead pilots helmet. To say that the only reason he volunteered was so he could fly is cheapening Alto's emotions. He had many more reasons. Mainly the pilot, Ranka and wanting to save others if something like that happened again.
Yeah, my miss, but his decision at the time still had nothing to do with Ranka either way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Slick_rick View Post
I'm starting to wonder if we watch the same show. Alto doesn't usually get bullied or forced into 90 percent of the things he does with Sheryl on your show I guess. Sheryl and Ranka are both great characters. Each has their good points. Sheryl scenes are usually funny and unpredictable while Ranka are cute and endearing.
I don't know what you are watching, but I sure as heck am watching the same show as everyone else.

You said Alto was not amused by most of Sheryl's antics, which is a bit different than what you are saying now. Now you are saying something like 'Alto was not voluntary in most of Sheryl's bullies'.

Not only was Alto amused, he was friggin entertained. During 'Star Date', there were many situation where Alto could just ditch Sheryl and run, but he didn't and even took her to Folmo. I can see that he obviously enjoyed being with Sheryl. Its so obvious Alto secretly likes how Sheryl mind-phuck him. If Alto is not amused or entertained, why is he digging this 'hole' deeper? Why? Because he likes eeeeet!!!

And I will stand by what I said earlier. Alto gets a lot more out with Sheryl. There is a lot of frantic energy involved, a lot of chemistry and a lot of fun! With Ranka, its almost always one-sided. Ranka knows next to NOTHING about Alto, although that may change by episode 11, but thus far, their whole interaction had been... boring.

- Tak (Yeah, and this is a matter of opinion too, if you think otherwise, thats too bad. Like I am gonna get shovel and hammer my opinions down your throat, that'd be a waste of my valuable time)
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Old 2008-06-14, 09:43   Link #158
Tsuchiro
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Join Date: May 2008
lol.. you forgot about the charm... but alto probably forgot about it just like how Sheryl forgot about the earring until alto mentioned it
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Old 2008-06-14, 09:48   Link #159
Tak
DIN = DAS IST NORM!
 
 
Join Date: Jul 2006
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I always thought Alto had contacted Sheryl beforehand about the earring, but Sheryl forgot that he (not the earring) was coming. I doubt Sheryl would have forgotten about the earring though.

- Tak
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Old 2008-06-14, 09:52   Link #160
Tsuchiro
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Originally Posted by Tak View Post
I always thought Alto had contacted Sheryl beforehand about the earring, but Sheryl forgot that he (not the earring) was coming. I doubt Sheryl would have forgotten about the earring though.

- Tak
I'm talking about right after star date and before getting the kiss.
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