Macross Frontier - Episode 11 Discussion / Poll

[Lanis]

I wasn't too sure with the LQ raw I watched but holy crap its him!! Wonder who else from the original series will make an appearance. hmmmmm

[herbert]

Worst episode so far, I gave it a 3. I should mark it higher for Alto's backstory and some Sheryl's cute scenes, but some potential negative-ness on Sheryl and too much screen-time for Ranka-is-simply-the-same-childish-Ranka basically kill my high hope from last episode and the all my positive opinions from this episode (I guess that two-week-long wait added some fuel in it).

One thing puts a smile on my mouth is that "bitch" comments are back (Long time no see, my old friends). I agree with what Westlo said in ep10 thread those comments only make me feel glad that I'm a Sheryl fan. I haven't had time to check other places like those blogs some Ranka fans have mentioned, maybe I will go see them later.

OK, drop these unrelated stuff, little more I'd consider I'm attacking Ranka fans on personal basis. So move to some my random opinions to this episode.

As for Alto, the backstory actually doesn't add much to what we have already known. It confirms that Alto is not a runaway, but also disowned. However, there is a comment from his step-brother got my interest. I can't explicitly recite that line, but it sounds like "Are dreams dreams only because they are not achievable? Do people pursue their dreams recklessly only because they can't really reach to them?" This make me start to wonder how much Alto's want of flying is from his instinct and how much is from unsatification. If flying is more a symbol of freedom which he doesn't feel he has ever since he is still a child.

As for Sheryl, I was a little puzzled why she has done sth in this episode. It took me a lot time to make some sense of her doings in this episode. Click the spoiler tag to see my interpretation of Sheryl's actions if you are a Sheryl fan or neutral, but for Ranka fans, please move on, this is a nonsense so don't waste your time on it.

Spoiler:

The biggest question came to me as I finished the episode is if Sheryl intentionally kicks Ranka out of way. I believed it wasn't but as director has done many times before, the whole situation is told form Ranka's perspective so it's much easier to just sympathize Ranka than to understand Sheryl.

To begin with, it's mostly Sheryl's fault. But it's not that kind of fault Ranka fans have declared to be. Sheryl's fault is not take care of her own health carefully. If we look back in middle of the show when Sheryl talks to Ranka, she immediately understands that Ranka wants to invite Alto to her first concert. However, before she can talk with Ranka little more, Sheryl collapses. As a result, Sheryl doesn't know about Ranka wants to use this to buy some quality time under sunset with Alto. As we know, Sheryl is not kind of person to dig into details of most things. Her attitude towards Ranka is to encourage but not to provide physical help. So my conclusion is that Sheryl doesn't know about Ranka's plan, she neither takes much consideration of it, her brain may not function well due to fever, and her recklessness gets better of her as she sets a goal to give Alto the best birthday present.

As a sidenote, if Sheryl is aware Ranka's plan, I'd call it negative character development but it's because I think she is a much better person than Ranka is and putting her near to Ranka's level is a negaitve character development. Here is my take of Ranka out of Ranka's perspective. In fact, Ranka knows Sheryl has sth for Alto and Sheryl must want to be with Alto but she still wants to get Alto herself at Alto's birthday night. Ranka only wants Alto without any others around. She fails so we feel sorry for her, but what if she succeed? Does she thinks of Sheryl? or other friends of Alto's? What if there is a birthday party for Alto? From the message she delievers to Alto, I gathered that Ranka is still the Ranka, she only thinks of what she wants and not consider what her doings may affect others. So I don't sympathize Ranka this time again. She has made a selfish plan and fail, she deserves this failure because she hasn't planned it well.

[RPNS]

With so many old faces coming back I wonder if they will let us see what happen to other characters in the macross universe or at least show us what they look like now.

Would really like to see the Macross 7 crew and what they look like especially Max and Millia, they are what 70 now?

[Xellos-_^]

Anyone else saw the similarity between Alto riding escort for Sherryl's shuttle and Hikaur riding escort for Misa when she went back to earth? I think they even had the same type of seats.

[justinstrife]

Originally Posted by herbert

Worst episode so far, I gave it a 3. I should mark it higher for Alto's backstory and some Sheryl's cute scenes, but some potential negative-ness on Sheryl and too much screen-time for Ranka-is-simply-the-same-childish-Ranka basically kill my high hope from last episode and the all my positive opinions from this episode (I guess that two-week-long wait added some fuel in it).

One thing puts a smile on my mouth is that "bitch" comments are back (Long time no see, my old friends). I agree with what Westlo said in ep10 thread those comments only make me feel glad that I'm a Sheryl fan. I haven't had time to check other places like those blogs some Ranka fans have mentioned, maybe I will go see them later.

OK, drop these unrelated stuff, little more I'd consider I'm attacking Ranka fans on personal basis. So move to some my random opinions to this episode.

As for Alto, the backstory actually doesn't add much to what we have already known. It confirms that Alto is not a runaway, but also disowned. However, there is a comment from his step-brother got my interest. I can't explicitly recite that line, but it sounds like "Are dreams dreams only because they are not achievable? Do people pursue their dreams recklessly only because they can't really reach to them?" This make me start to wonder how much Alto's want of flying is from his instinct and how much is from unsatification. If flying is more a symbol of freedom which he doesn't feel he has ever since he is still a child.

As for Sheryl, I was a little puzzled why she has done sth in this episode. It took me a lot time to make some sense of her doings in this episode. Click the spoiler tag to see my interpretation of Sheryl's actions if you are a Sheryl fan or neutral, but for Ranka fans, please move on, this is a nonsense so don't waste your time on it.

Spoiler:

The biggest question came to me as I finished the episode is if Sheryl intentionally kicks Ranka out of way. I believed it wasn't but as director has done many times before, the whole situation is told form Ranka's perspective so it's much easier to just sympathize Ranka than to understand Sheryl.

To begin with, it's mostly Sheryl's fault. But it's not that kind of fault Ranka fans have declared to be. Sheryl's fault is not take care of her own health carefully. If we look back in middle of the show when Sheryl talks to Ranka, she immediately understands that Ranka wants to invite Alto to her first concert. However, before she can talk with Ranka little more, Sheryl collapses. As a result, Sheryl doesn't know about Ranka wants to use this to buy some quality time under sunset with Alto. As we know, Sheryl is not kind of person to dig into details of most things. Her attitude towards Ranka is to encourage but not to provide physical help. So my conclusion is that Sheryl doesn't know about Ranka's plan, she neither takes much consideration of it, her brain may not function well due to fever, and her recklessness gets better of her as she sets a goal to give Alto the best birthday present.

As a sidenote, if Sheryl is aware Ranka's plan, I'd call it negative character development but it's because I think she is a much better person than Ranka is and putting her near to Ranka's level is a negaitve character development. Here is my take of Ranka out of Ranka's perspective. In fact, Ranka knows Sheryl has sth for Alto and Sheryl must want to be with Alto but she still wants to get Alto herself at Alto's birthday night. Ranka only wants Alto without any others around. She fails so we feel sorry for her, but what if she succeed? Does she thinks of Sheryl? or other friends of Alto's? What if there is a birthday party for Alto? From the message she delievers to Alto, I gathered that Ranka is still the Ranka, she only thinks of what she wants and not consider what her doings may affect others. So I don't sympathize Ranka this time again. She has made a selfish plan and fail, she deserves this failure because she hasn't planned it well.

I can't get the only subbed version of this anime to play correctly, so I was stuck watching the RAW this morning. My Japanese is still very, very rough, so I missed out on a lot of the conversations. However, I do think this was the worst episode so far in this series, and was very disappointed. I'll be holding off on voting, until I can get a sub that works, but in the mean time, this was not worth wasting 2 weeks for.

[Tabris]

They'd look exactly the same

[justinstrife]

Originally Posted by Xellos-_^

Anyone else saw the similarity between Alto riding escort for Sherryl's shuttle and Hikaur riding escort for Misa when she went back to earth? I think they even had the same type of seats.

For some reason that thought crossed my mind then fell out of one of my ears and I didn't give it another thought.

Good eye Xellos.

[herbert]

Read Xellos-_^'s title. Wow, it's already the time? I followed Saimoe last year but didn't cast a single vote because voting is too troublesome. I guess I'll vote exclusively Sheryl this time(maybe Fate from Nanoha and Addillisia from Rental Magica as well if I can get used to the voting procedure), but as it holds on 2ch, no high hope for Sheryl because she is not real a moe type by general standard.

[RPNS]

Originally Posted by Tabris

They'd look exactly the same

What was it again aging is not for Jenius right

[aldw]

I thought it was a decent episode, nothing that I didn't expect. Just don't understand why people are panning it so...

[Westlo]

Originally Posted by herbert

As a sidenote, if Sheryl is aware Ranka's plan

Nah I don't think Sheryl did this on purpose, as you said Ranka never got the chance to finish her conversation with Sheryl since Sheryl's sickness took hold. She was talking about her relief concert with Grace (gotta love how Grace manipulated her to go there) and probably remembered she had no escort at the time and than recalled this conversation from episode 6…

Sheryl - Hey Alto, do you like this ship?
Alto - I hate it I don’t like city ships.
Sheryl - Why?
Alto - There’s no sky here.

You can tell by her voice she knew she hit a home run with this offer, gotta love how Alto's attitude was like "I’m not going to care what she gives me because she’ll probably be fucking with me like usual" and when he heard what the present was his tough exterior cracked. He was very enthusiastic at the end of the episode as well.

Originally Posted by Xellos-_^

Anyone else saw the similarity between Alto riding escort for Sherryl's shuttle and Hikaur riding escort for Misa when she went back to earth? I think they even had the same type of seats.

First thing I thought of when someone posted the preview pics a few days ago. I was hoping for Alto to flash her a message but he's actually going with her which is even better.

[ickem]

Originally Posted by Xellos-_^

Anyone else saw the similarity between Alto riding escort for Sherryl's shuttle and Hikaur riding escort for Misa when she went back to earth? I think they even had the same type of seats.

Yeah, that was exactly what I thought about when I saw the scene. The next episode would be a pretty good place to relive the rescue from Alaska aftermath where they're in the cockpit together flying around.

[KoroshiyaX]

I do not think Grace is the one speaking to Leon at the end. She is probably just spying on Leon's convo with someone else. The voice Leon speaks to matches with the person that hands him the purple crystal from 11:00 to 12:00 in episode 10... (the tomboy with the short hair and glasses.)

[Westlo]

Considering the advanced technology we have seen throughout Frontier and how Galaxy is suppose to be much more advanced it's not outside the realms of possibility that Grace was speaking through a proxy or even controlling that person who met Leon. Why would she go herself when Leon would instantly recognize her as the manager of Sheryl Nome? The voice fits Inoue Kikuko as well.

[Mecha_Trueno]

Originally Posted by Xellos-_^

Anyone else saw the similarity between Alto riding escort for Sherryl's shuttle and Hikaur riding escort for Misa when she went back to earth? I think they even had the same type of seats.

so thats where it came from. when i was watching it, i was like "hey, i swear i saw this scene somewhere else before"
good eyes!

on a side note, if theyre gonna be following traditional macross ways, then ozma is definitely gonna die. (the taichou always dies)... lesson from macross: dont become a captain

[ani_d]

Originally Posted by Westlo

Going by all their conversations so far in this series it's quite fitting that Ranka's present is a ticket to her concert since she never asks Alto anything and just talks about herself all the time. Sheryl otoh gives Alto a chance to fly in a real sky something she knows he would love because in their conversations she actually asks him questions about himself (gasp the audacity!) instead of telling Alto all about herself.

Ranka's present is the (good ol') homemade airplane shaped cookies. That required more effort. Let's not blame Ranka's inability to know more about Alto from the previous episodes. She loves the guy with all her heart. That's what counts. Even Sheryl is aware of it.

Originally Posted by Westlo

The chances of Sheryl just being a normal person seem to be getting slimmer and slimmer but Grace could be with her since Sheryl provides very easy access to numerous fleets and planets. Considering she's her manager I assume she makes the bookings of where to go.

Well, Grace has always been pushing Sheryl to sing--discreetly. And now, she just tricked Sheryl into going to Galia 4. She's been playing her like a puppet. Looks like Galia 4 is going to be where the action is, even Leon is going to join in. It would be ironic if amidst all of these foreshadowing about Ranka's lost past, it ended up as Sheryl being the one with the most threat. Just a thought.

Spoiler for escaflowne:

It's not a matter of how obvious who will Hitomi choose, but the fact that they didn't stay together and Allen scored and Van never did. =/ Kawamori made a very conventional pairing have a not too conventional ending and still managed to stay consistent with the story. It's one of the charms of HitomixVan. Like I said, he likes to torture his lead characters to bring flavor to the story.

I have to admit, I appreciated RankaxAlto more after Alto got closer to Sheryl. With Sheryl always stealing Alto, Ranka's moments with Alto become more appreciable. The boring RxA development spicens up with Sheryl around---like having Masako from Ghost Hunt.

Originally Posted by aldw

I thought it was a decent episode, nothing that I didn't expect. Just don't understand why people are panning it so...

Because it's Ranka-centric I bet if the majority of the future episodes become like this, MF will lose some fans here in AS and some outside the forums. I guess I don't have to worry about the Sheryl-centric episodes because I doubt Sheryl will receive this much focus for the later half of the show lol

Originally Posted by herbert

As a sidenote, if Sheryl is aware Ranka's plan, I'd call it negative character development but it's because I think she is a much better person than Ranka is and putting her near to Ranka's level is a negaitve character development.

Sheryl knows Ranka has a ticket to give to Alto for her live concert. She's also aware that Ranka has a thing for Alto, yet she still invited Alto to go to planet Galia 4. Ranka's first live would've been over once Alto comes back. I dunno maybe she forgot about Ranka's plans and has to think of her own interests lol I just can't help but notice Sheryl congratulating Ranka as the number Two idol. Confidence.

Originally Posted by KoroshiyaX

I do not think Grace is the one speaking to Leon at the end. She is probably just spying on Leon's convo with someone else.

It's Grace. They spoonfed it to us.

Btw. I just watched the subs and Cathy and Leon's talk in the beginning caught my attention.

Leon--> "Once the clock strikes 12, the magic disappears"

I knew it.

[Sotobrastos]

I loved the end of this episode--Ranka munching on the cookie she baked after wishing Alto a happy birthday, then saying, 'it's bitter!' So sad.

[Kaoru Chujo]

Originally Posted by KoroshiyaX

I do not think Grace is the one speaking to Leon at the end. She is probably just spying on Leon's convo with someone else. The voice Leon speaks to matches with the person that hands him the purple crystal from 11:00 to 12:00 in episode 10... (the tomboy with the short hair and glasses.)

Yes, I believe the voice does match the "guy" in the scene in the restaurant in ep10. Just to add fantasy to this, the words also seemed to be matched a bit to Sheryl's lip movements.... But Grace seemed to be aware of the conversation -- hearing it, or participating in it, or controlling it.

On the other hand, the voice reminded me of Toyoguchi Megumi (Kuran Klan), too. Zentradi?

I think we're getting indications that Alto, while he did go with Sheryl, went for the chance to fly in open atmosphere, not for Sheryl. When Sheryl thanked him for coming, his head was totally somewhere else, and it disappointed her.

But I'm not sure she is anything but playing with him. Maybe I'm wrong, but to me she seems proud and basically uncaring about others. That scene when she arrived on Frontier and was so mad about fans getting backstage seemed to me like laying the baseline of her character. Just as her proud "Because I'm Sheryl" does. She wants to be Ranka's patron, in a way, but she also wants to take her man. An enjoyable person, but maybe not a nice person. My view of her character makes it possible for me to think that she is the voice, although I doubt that can be true. I can't easily imagine that is Endou Aya's voice, so deep.

But I don't dislike her. Her laugh at around 4:35 was strong and endearing at the same time. Both deep and fun.

[Aquifina]

Originally Posted by ani_d

Ranka's present is the (good ol') homemade airplane shaped cookies. That required more effort. Let's not blame Ranka's inability to know more about Alto from the previous episodes. She loves the guy with all her heart. That's what counts. Even Sheryl is aware of it.

I have to admit, I appreciated RankaxAlto more after Alto got closer to Sheryl. With Sheryl always stealing Alto, Ranka's moments with Alto become more appreciable. The boring RxA development spicens up with Sheryl around---like having Masako from Ghost Hunt.

Poor Ranka. Anyhow, hopefully this will lead her to being much more assertive than she's been, because otherwise she's definitely toast in the triangle. I'm sure she'll be able to make a countermove, although presumably after the fight that's going to at least start the next ep. A theme of the series seems to be Ranka's growth as a character, and needing to deal with the formidable Sheryl is a pretty good stimulus for character development. That shot at the end of her trying to bake those cookies was really quite poignant, considering how the ep. worked out.

[cerrian]

My initial reaction to this episode is that it was really well done. I like this episode a lot because it fleshed out a lot of the minor characters a bit more and answered some of the plot mysteries. The music seemed to have done a good job and setting the tones for most of the scenes.

As for the comments that there was too much Ranka screen time, I would have to disagree and say that this episode was actually more Alto-oriented. Truthfully, the time spent on Ranka's character development was dwarfed by Alto's development and the plot movements.