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Old 2009-01-18, 17:40   Link #301
kk2extreme
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nana mizuki's shin ai, enjoy

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=l76BJOXB9cg
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Old 2009-01-18, 20:39   Link #302
Peanutbutter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mentar View Post
Oh wow... this episode was NOT easy...

Spoiler:
Please explain to me

Spoiler:
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Old 2009-01-18, 20:55   Link #303
Kaoru Chujo
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1. I have a lot of trouble defining melodrama. I think we use the word when we think the emotion is over the top, or the situation is unrealistically designed simply to produce extreme emotion. I don't see any here, yet. Painful complexity seems to be on the way, but whether that will seem melodramatic or not remains to be seen.

Thanks to musouka for the definition, although all of those terms are pretty subjective: what is "exaggerated" emotion? What constitutes a "stereotypical" character, when there is pretty much nothing new under the sun? And perhaps the quote has more to it, since the idea that "interpersonal conflicts" is a sign of melodrama, as opposed to any drama, seems extreme.

I do agree with musouka that we are being held at arm's length from the characters so far. But that is making them more interesting for me, up to this point. I was happy to feel I had a little better handle on Yuuki and Touya from ep3. However, everybody, especially Rina, is getting more and more complex and moving in more than one direction all the time. I'm not totally committed to any character yet.

2. Thanks for the comments on the voices. I just find that Aya gives me a character's feelings, no matter which voice she uses. I don't see her Haruhi voice and her Layla voice as the same, but I guess they are in the same register, whereas Konata and the recent high voices are not.

This recent high voice -- in Akasaka, Hyakko, and here -- is my least favorite, but she is clearly committed to making it work. It is fairly unnatural, and much thinner than any voice she has used before, but when it clicks emotionally it really clicks. It creates a personality that could easily shatter.

I agree with what musume_no_hoshi said about Aya's voice sticking out. I've said before that she's best when she herself makes the running, rather than having to fit in with others. Much as I'm a fan, I don't think she's in the top rank of seiyuus. She must certainly not be the easiest to work into a show. Except that when she does hit something, she hits it out of the park, for me. Like Layla, or Konata, or Mei. Not Haruhi, although I loved the suppressed emotion there.

That quote from houkoholic about Aya seeming intentional in her approach also has always made sense to me. But I don't care, as long as she makes the effects she's striving for.

I've previously found Nana-chan's voice-acting boring. A standard pro, as musume_no_hoshi says. I like her work here more than I ever have before.

3. As for singing, I think skill is much overrated. Musicality is what counts. I like garage bands, or the garage-band sound. And I actually find Aya's harsher songs, the punkier ones she has been doing over the past year or so, to be very enjoyable. Whereas I find a lot of the highly skilled stuff Nana-chan does not to my taste. Theatrical and overblown. But I do love Nana-chan's songs in this show. Maybe it's just a matter of learning to like the musical idiom.

For musicality, my favorites are Onitsuka Chihiro, and now the new young seiyuu-singer Hayami Saori, who just seems to understand the flow of a song, and has such a sweet and expressive voice. She has both skill and musicality, at least recorded as opposed to live. I haven't heard her live.
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Old 2009-01-18, 21:20   Link #304
apr
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaoru Chujo View Post
Whereas I find a lot of the highly skilled stuff Nana-chan does not to my taste. Theatrical and overblown. But I do love Nana-chan's songs in this show. Maybe it's just a matter of learning to like the musical idiom.

For musicality, my favorites are Onitsuka Chihiro, and now the new young seiyuu-singer Hayami Saori, who just seems to understand the flow of a song, and has such a sweet and expressive voice. She has both skill and musicality, at least recorded as opposed to live. I haven't heard her live.
Nana suffers from pretty much the same thing as Hirano, I think. As much as I like Innocent Starter, her songs all kind of blend together, making for extremely dull albums. She needs someone to write her better, more varied music.

Personally I think Sakamoto Maaya (Escaflowne) and Makino Yui (ARIA songs) have the nicest singing voices, but then I'd rather not call them voice actors, and I haven't really heard them live. Except for this one TV show a few years back where Makino's live performance was really poor. Hayami's range might be wider, though.

Vocal performances also seem to be closely related to the show's direction. I don't exactly have any experience here, but my assumption after watching shows like Darker than Black is that some directors just squeeze that extra bit of talent out of the actors. Someone's doing a good job handling them for White Album, while even an experienced pro like Nakahara Mai sounds hopelessly flimsy in this season's Chrome Shelled Regios. Maybe I'm overestimating the director's influence, though.

As for "sticking out", it reminded me of when I watched Genshiken. It's a great series, with many good actors, but whenever Yukino Satsuki's character spoke, it was like her voice punched me straight through the TV screen. She's just so lively and vibrant that the remarkable "3D-ness" of her performance detached itself from the 2D animation. Still haven't been able to settle on whether that's good or bad.
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Old 2009-01-19, 11:55   Link #305
musume_no_hoshi
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Hirano Aya is always hit or miss for me. The best role she did in my opinion is definately Reira from NANA, she hitted the emotional scenes perfectly. Somehow, I get a feeling from Hirano Aya that she wants to try alot of of things, such as writing a blog in a style similar to Shokotan, tried to do different character voices, tried to do a vibrato (I think thats how it's spelt), but she seems to give a 'half-ass' (excuse me for the word, I don't know what other word to use) effort each time or she just isn't naturally talented in what she is experimenting with, which makes it look...fairly bad. Anyone heard her b-side on unknown world? My god the engrish there, when I heard the song, I didn't even know it was english, I thought it was it was japanese, apparently she wrote the lyrics to it too...oh god the grammar. Hirano Aya is still on her early stages of her career, so some experimenting would be good, but I hope she won't taint her name too much. I would have liked Hirano Aya using her Reira voice with White Album, so the emotional scenes would still be good, but not too high pitch...which doesn't suit her voice.

Nana Mizuki debuted when she was 14 with an Enka single. Although it was a recording, it was still amazing for a 14 year old. I agreed with the above, Nana Mizuki's songs never varies too much, at first when I heard Shin Ai...I just went 'typical Nana-chan'. When I heard her Lydia voice from Earl and Fairy, it was typical Nana Mizuki. But this is the style I love, so it's almost garenteed that I would Nana-chan new singles. I heard Nana Mizuki trying to sing hip hop for one of her album, oh god that was awful, doesn't fit with her voice. I could say Nana-chan is a great singer for a seiyuu, but also she's a great seiyuu for a singer. She's very professional, but never experiment with new things, both for seiyuu work or singing.

In a way, we will know what to expect from Nana Mizuki, but we would never know what would Hirano Aya give us. Hirano Aya sometimes really surprises how great she could be, Nana-chan always has her Nana-chan quality.

Actually let the two seiyuus switch roles, Nana Mizuki can do a soft spoken girl with no problem and Hirano Aya then can use her lower voice. I can dream right?
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Old 2009-01-19, 12:19   Link #306
animekritik
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I think Aya's voice for Konata in Lucky Star was very good too.
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Old 2009-01-19, 14:43   Link #307
relentlessflame
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by apr View Post
Vocal performances also seem to be closely related to the show's direction. I don't exactly have any experience here, but my assumption after watching shows like Darker than Black is that some directors just squeeze that extra bit of talent out of the actors. Someone's doing a good job handling them for White Album, while even an experienced pro like Nakahara Mai sounds hopelessly flimsy in this season's Chrome Shelled Regios. Maybe I'm overestimating the director's influence, though.
No, if anything, I was going to say that people shouldn't under-estimate this aspect. It's not as if these voice actors really have much say in the sorts of voices you hear beyond what they're basically capable of. It's all determined by the voice directors for the show. So the voice director says "I want you to try something higher-pitched", or whatever, and after hearing the VA try it, they decide if it's what they want for the character or not. Likewise with the music the VAs sing, or whatever -- typically it's all assigned to them, and it's like "sing this". They really don't have very much control over "their sound" beyond just what they're capable of doing naturally. So when people say they like or didn't like when Aya tried to do this or that, it's probably more accurate to say "when she was told to do this or that". I highly doubt the producers and directors asked for her opinion.

Basically, it's up to the directors to take the raw talent they have at their disposal and make something of it. But I suppose this can sometimes be more challenging than others, as they have varying degrees of say into which actors get assigned to the project in the first place. All the key cast need to be vetted by the production committee, and that brings a lot of commercial interest into the equation. But, regardless, the VAs themselves generally have the least say of all in the whole process, especially when we're talking about "managed talent". Of course, this show itself gives us some insight into that, in a way.
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Old 2009-01-20, 06:41   Link #308
Julius Firefocht
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Quote:
Originally Posted by apr View Post
Nana suffers from pretty much the same thing as Hirano, I think. As much as I like Innocent Starter, her songs all kind of blend together, making for extremely dull albums. She needs someone to write her better, more varied music.
I feel the need to correct this statement, because it is plainly wrong and misleading.

Anyone who has listened to more of Nana's songs apart from the ones that she sang for anime will know that her range and style is way larger than what was described by apr.

Take Independent Love Song and Discotheque for example. How do they "blend together?" They do not, not anymore than how Shin Ai would "blend" with Pray.

@apr: I would suggest that you listen to more of Nana's songs before making such a comment. Go through all 250+ songs, and tell me how the songs "all kind of blend together".
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Old 2009-01-20, 06:41   Link #309
dodgethis_sg
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Quote:
Originally Posted by apr View Post
Nana suffers from pretty much the same thing as Hirano, I think. As much as I like Innocent Starter, her songs all kind of blend together, making for extremely dull albums. She needs someone to write her better, more varied music.
Because Hime Murasaki and Ano ne ~Mamimume☆Mogacho~ sound alike, right?




When you have Hironobu Kageyama calling you Mizuki aneeki in front of the crowd at Animelo, it means you have no talent, whatsoever, right?
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Old 2009-01-20, 07:50   Link #310
apr
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Originally Posted by dodgethis_sg View Post
Because Hime Murasaki and Ano ne ~Mamimume☆Mogacho~ sound alike, right?

When you have Hironobu Kageyama calling you Mizuki aneeki in front of the crowd at Animelo, it means you have no talent, whatsoever, right?
What's Mizuki's talent got to do with anything? It's usually someone else writing the tunes. I wasn't really complaining about the lyrics.

I've listened to three albums, which I figured was enough to make sweeping statements, and that three hour "blue side" live fighter concert video a few days ago: more than three Nana songs in a row just puts me to sleep, no matter how cute she is. Nothing ever remains in my head distinctively, and it becomes this large mass of bland goo in my memory. Picking out the extremes isn't really going to change my mind.

Spoiler for White Album 03:
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Old 2009-01-20, 08:31   Link #311
Julius Firefocht
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Originally Posted by apr View Post
What's Mizuki's talent got to do with anything? It's usually someone else writing the tunes. I wasn't really complaining about the lyrics.

I've listened to three albums, which I figured was enough to make sweeping statements, and that three hour "blue side" live fighter concert video a few days ago: more than three Nana songs in a row just puts me to sleep, no matter how cute she is. Nothing ever remains in my head distinctively, and it becomes this large mass of bland goo in my memory. Picking out the extremes isn't really going to change my mind.
Three albums amount to 36 songs at the most, while Blue Side has a grand total of 24 songs. That is 60 songs, out of a huge library of 250+ songs, and you say that is enough to let you make a sweeping statement?

I fail to see the logic in that, apr. But you may be right from your own perspective, since you said "Nothing ever remains in my head distinctively, and it becomes this large mass of bland goo in my memory." In which case that is a personal problem of yours, and Nana or any other artistes that you might listen to should not be blamed for that.

In fact, with your memory lapse, I suppose Tamura Yukari sounds like JAM Project to you?
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Rightousness is our Shield, Faith our armour and Hatred our weapon.
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Old 2009-01-20, 08:41   Link #312
dodgethis_sg
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By admitting that Hime Murasaki and Mamimume are extremities, you have contradicted yourself on the point that all her songs blend together.

You claim that the concert put you to sleep, in short, wanting nothing more than for the concert to end, how can you come up with a fair and unbiased conclusion? And since everything becomes a 'mass of bland goo', you're just making a generalisation about the whole thing, rather than a proper conclusion.
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Old 2009-01-21, 02:19   Link #313
relentlessflame
 
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So, some interesting news on the merchandise front. Solicitations for White Album are out. 13 episodes, as we all knew, but the interesting thing is that it's going to be on Blu-Ray as well as DVD. Unless I'm mistaken, I think this is the first time that King Records/Starchild has published an anime on Blu-Ray (someone correct me if I missed something). And it's actually priced at a lower price point that I might have expected -- only 4 volumes in all, with the first 3 at 7000 Yen + tax each (3 eps./BD), and the last for 8000 Yen + tax (4 eps.). 1000 Yen less each for the DVD versions of each of the respective volumes. That basically puts it about on par with the pricing for most of the 24-26-episode shows being put out on Blu-Ray at the moment (and a bit cheaper than what Geneon is doing with its 12-episode shows). For a show paced the way this one is, the smaller disc count may be a good idea on their part (though this isn't the only time they've done this either, by any means).

Anyway, as a fan of anime on Blu-Ray, I think this is good news. I wonder if other Starchild shows will be arriving on Blu-Ray soon (hopefully not solicited right after their respective DVD runs finish...) Unfortunately, of course, it's still missing the "killer feature" from our perspectives... English subtitles...
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Old 2009-01-21, 20:28   Link #314
Kaoru Chujo
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I think the sound director on a show can be extremely important, as relentlessflame and apr suggest. My understanding is that the sound director often is the one directing the seiyuus, and the director himself sometimes doesn't even show up at the recording sessions.

The sound director on this show is Shioya Yoku, who is more of a seiyuu than a sound director. He has been working as a seiyuu since the early 1970s, but has only sound-directed nine shows, including Yoshimune and Welcome to the NHK. I can actually remember thinking that the sound in NHK was substandard. And I'm not convinced here yet, either.

The news about Blu-Ray releases and costs is interesting. With HDTV and Blu-Ray, I think ordinary DVDs, with their lower resolution, are no longer very interesting.
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Old 2009-01-22, 00:47   Link #315
Traece
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Because the episode only showed up on the list in the last couple of hours I'm going to spoiler tag my thoughts and absolute confusion about Episode 3.
Spoiler for White Album - Episode 3:
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Old 2009-01-22, 01:30   Link #316
Sylphic
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Rina is amazing, easily winning out over the other girls at this point in the show, which worries me. Usually in these types of shows.. the one with the strongest starting position ends up losing.

That said..

Spoiler:
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Old 2009-01-22, 01:57   Link #317
meh
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Why doesn't Touya talk? Watching this anime is like playing RPGs with the "silent protaganist", where everyone just talks around you and mysteriously know what you're thinking.
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Old 2009-01-22, 03:34   Link #318
gonzo562
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after watching episode

Spoiler for thoughts:
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Old 2009-01-22, 07:34   Link #319
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erm, ep3 was not bad.

Spoiler for ep3:
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Old 2009-01-22, 08:50   Link #320
SuperKnuckles
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I find it interesting that Rin is basically putting herself in a corner by being the guardian angel over Yuki and Touya. Like others have said, that's not good news when she plays it so perfectly as a professional with personal reasons.

I wonder what Haruka will do too, since she just feels so... utilitarian and she is literally a girl next door. lol
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