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Old 2013-08-03, 22:13   Link #4661
Xero8420
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Perhaps Gensei has an intention to use Mikoto as a mean to lure Touma (Aleister's real favorite) out. If there's Aleister, there has to be Touma. Don't get me wrong, I'm not being in denial or something. I just don't want to simply assume to Mikoto is Aleister's another favorite just yet, unless he intentionally planned to use her as a leverage.

Spoiler for theory:
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Old 2013-08-03, 23:39   Link #4662
dniv
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Originally Posted by Xero8420 View Post
Perhaps Gensei has an intention to use Mikoto as a mean to lure Touma (Aleister's real favorite) out. If there's Aleister, there has to be Touma. Don't get me wrong, I'm not being in denial or something. I just don't want to simply assume to Mikoto is Aleister's another favorite just yet, unless he intentionally planned to use her as a leverage.

Spoiler for theory:
It seems as if Gensei planned this from the start. It said he was a large proponent of the level 6 shift project though, that was in the manga. I think Shokuhou said that about him in an earlier chapter to Mikoto.

I'm wondering whether Gensei will be defeated this arc and stop being a villain because finally Mikoto (or at least the audience) is starting to find out about the real villain in raildex series and so might be moving on to a "bigger" villain. (not sure why I put bigger in quotes )
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Old 2013-08-04, 00:08   Link #4663
Goldzero
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Originally Posted by hamazura View Post
touma job is only to carry misaka home after misaki do all epic job
i-really-dont-want-falcon-punch-and-lecture-from-touma-to-finish-some-arc-again
i agree with you on some parts(the only problem is our viewpoint on kamijou is different seeing as how hes my fav where hes the opposite of yours) i would prefer to find a different way for touma to help mikoto without him taking all the spotlight where misaki takes the big part seeing as how come i find it somewhat unfair that touma just comes out of nowhere and just ruin the moment(which well piss of quite allot of railgun only fans and those that are fans of both the series).
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Old 2013-08-04, 00:15   Link #4664
pkmntrainer7
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Originally Posted by dniv View Post
It seems as if Gensei planned this from the start. It said he was a large proponent of the level 6 shift project though, that was in the manga. I think Shokuhou said that about him in an earlier chapter to Mikoto.

I'm wondering whether Gensei will be defeated this arc and stop being a villain because finally Mikoto (or at least the audience) is starting to find out about the real villain in raildex series and so might be moving on to a "bigger" villain. (not sure why I put bigger in quotes )
Well if you ignore the Railgun SS novels then in this arc is the first time that magic, the Board of Directors and Aleister were mentioned in Railgun so I can see that happening and possibly moving on to bigger things.
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Old 2013-08-04, 00:24   Link #4665
Flere821
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Originally Posted by Shadrala View Post
Just gonna say... I lol at how so many people just simply refuse to believe Mikoto could be Aleister's favourite...
Because there's been explicit evidence showing otherwise for Touma in Indexverse, eg Vol19 with Girl in Dress, whereas Mikoto has no such events involved. She can't even use the claim of the only Level 5 that has a normal school life as evidence of Aleister's favourite, given what we've seen of Misaki and Gunha.
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Old 2013-08-04, 00:45   Link #4666
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Honestly, I can't see how Mikoto could be his favorite. On the other hand, it does seem to me like he was addressing her and I can't see it being either Touma or Accel or Kakine he is talking about. The first 2 are key players in the plan, Kakine you could argue might be in the shadow, but I doubt he is referring to a character that got a single throw away panel in the manga so far. Though maybe forshadowing the introduction of some one else?

Also, unless I'm mistaken, お気に入り can just mean a favorite / one of his favorites and doesn't necessarily mean higher in his favorites list than people like Touma, Accel, or even Kakine.

Unfortunately, I doubt that line comes back up next chapter...
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Old 2013-08-04, 01:38   Link #4667
dniv
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Originally Posted by SilverTalon View Post
Honestly, I can't see how Mikoto could be his favorite. On the other hand, it does seem to me like he was addressing her and I can't see it being either Touma or Accel or Kakine he is talking about. The first 2 are key players in the plan, Kakine you could argue might be in the shadow, but I doubt he is referring to a character that got a single throw away panel in the manga so far. Though maybe forshadowing the introduction of some one else?

Also, unless I'm mistaken, お気に入り can just mean a favorite / one of his favorites and doesn't necessarily mean higher in his favorites list than people like Touma, Accel, or even Kakine.

Unfortunately, I doubt that line comes back up next chapter...
Well I hope then that it gets cleared eventually what exactly it means. And I'm not sure yet whether I should count Liberal Arts City as canon... It clearly is... but isn't the anime the canon for railgun because even the manga references the anime... I'm not saying that the events of LA city didn't happen, I'm saying what exactly happened in the arc might change up a bit if it were animated. After all, the anime is supposed to organize the story done in the manga and make it more coherent. So I'm not sure Aleister's appearance there counts if we're saying he appeared already in railgun I do hope that Mikoto starts to get clues about what is going on in AC. Every time she finds out more, she just ignores everything/all the implications of what she found out... this is exactly like another certain protagonist They are fit for each other after all....

I guess it's a good thing that the main characters have personalities the way they do, otherwise the series would quickly spiral out of control and it would be impossible to write and keep consistent. But their lack of curiosity is a little irritating , I mean who wouldn't look more into the dark side of AC after finding out about it? I guess there are only 2 people I can think of and it is the reason that they are such easily controllable pawns...
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Old 2013-08-04, 02:01   Link #4668
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お気に入り is closer to "liked", so it isn't necessay THE favorite.

I feel like people are taking a relatively minor thing too seriously, based on inadequate knowledge of the language.
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Old 2013-08-04, 02:02   Link #4669
SilverTalon
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I would say the stuff directly written by Kamachi is what should be thought of as canon (novels, manga) when there are conflicts. He is involved with the animes but I don't think he actually writes the scripts so while anime only stuff like Thelestina is canon, personally, I wouldn't take the anime's word over something the original author wrote.
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Old 2013-08-04, 02:08   Link #4670
dniv
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Originally Posted by SilverTalon View Post
I would say the stuff directly written by Kamachi is what should be thought of as canon (novels, manga) when there are conflicts. He is involved with the animes but I don't think he actually writes the scripts so while anime only stuff like Thelestina is canon, personally, I wouldn't take the anime's word over something the original author wrote.
I only meant that whenever Kamachi refers to events in the anime in order to continue the manga like he referred to Misaka suffering from people watching her and he referred to Terestina later on in the novels, it affirms that those parts of the anime are canon. I only meant that the reduxed version of the arcs that are canon should probably be considered canon, because I am pretty sure that every single thing that happens during those arcs is only allowed with permission by Kamachi... but this may be wrong... Though like with information about how level upper works, I think the diagrams in the anime for example were better. Even the manga points that out in an advertisement for the anime at some point.

Let me clarify: I meant that there is an anime canon and a Railgun manga/SS novel canon that are separate. Depending on which version I like more of a situation, I pick that one to explain what is going on... technically I think that Touma's fight with Mikoto the first time she used iron sand wasn't actually made by Kamachi but instead done by Fuyukawa the railgun manga illustrator who suggested putting that scene in. So even the manga has extra edits to Kamachi's ideas. This is why I'm not sure why the "better" edits of the anime couldn't be canon as well when it's convenient. For example, there were a lot of strange lines Frenda said in the anime which weren't in the manga
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Old 2013-08-04, 02:16   Link #4671
SilverTalon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sumeragi View Post
お気に入り is closer to "liked", so it isn't necessay THE favorite.

I feel like people are taking a relatively minor thing too seriously, based on inadequate knowledge of the language.
Yeah, thats what I was trying to say. The first two kokugo dictionary definitions are 好みに合うこと / 好ましく思うこと which as you said should be closer to "like" as in english if you say something is a "favorite" it implies some kind of hierarchy-esque thing. However, I've checked several japanese english dicitonaries quickly and they all want to translate it as "favorite" which I guess does work, but the implications the word has in english aren't all there.
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Old 2013-08-04, 02:17   Link #4672
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It's similar to how many people translate "daisuki" to "love": the connotations aren't applied quite well.
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Old 2013-08-04, 02:20   Link #4673
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...Eh? Is this business with who's the 'favorite' really that important for it to be going on for so long ? For all we know it's just a taunt from Gensei that wouldn't add up to anything.
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Old 2013-08-04, 02:27   Link #4674
SilverTalon
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Well, but if it was directed as Mikoto, that would mean Al is interested in her for something other than her dna pattern to create the clones or it should have been past tense. You aren't interested in knowing why the upside down man with the secret plan is still interested in her (assuming that he was addressing her and not muttering to himself)?

I don't think it being a taunt makes sense because she wouldn't have any idea what he was talking about would she?
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Old 2013-08-04, 02:29   Link #4675
dniv
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Originally Posted by SilverTalon View Post
Yeah, thats what I was trying to say. The first two kokugo dictionary definitions are 好みに合うこと / 好ましく思うこと which as you said should be closer to "like" as in english if you say something is a "favorite" it implies some kind of hierarchy-esque thing. However, I've checked several japanese english dicitonaries quickly and they all want to translate it as "favorite" which I guess does work, but the implications the word has in english aren't all there.
I initially freaked out about the statement, but I actually think what both of you guys are saying makes way more sense. Flere also said the same thing upon translating the Japanese.

Apparently, there's a tendency in people to notice what they want to see when they are processing information I am guessing this is what is going on here which is why I am being careful now in assuming anything from Gensei saying that to Mikoto.

Either way... even though the favorite thing is still up to debate... what isn't up to debate is that another level 6 shift project is starting. That is heck of cool... And that in itself is huge news in terms of the series. After all, I can't think of any other attempt to create a level 6 other than Accel's project (that was canon) and that was planned well in advance...

To me what seems more interesting here is that Gensei planned for level upper to synche with his brainwaves so that he could bypass exterior's registration process. The events of the level upper arc happened a while ago, right?

The fact that Gensei seems to have been planning to do this to Mikoto all along sparks my interest... Also, what is more interesting is that he 1. knows about exterior and 2. seems to be enemies with heaven's canceller in terms of views...

Though what seems clear to me is this... Aleister probably doesn't support Gensei's actions... First off it was hard for Gensei to get access to a sister. Second he had to use Kouzaku to trick Member into going against Aleister's orders... And there are other suspicious facts.

From what I gather, Gensei is acting completely against Aleister's wishes and I feel like anything Gensei says or wants may not at all represent what Aleister actually wants or thinks...
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Old 2013-08-04, 03:42   Link #4676
zaeraal
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Please people stop it already
Because at this rate you will come to conclussion that Aleister has fallen in love with her,
which means that he has all those cameras and security just to stalk her,
he made 20 000 clones just to satisfy his lust, he even made a younger / older version,
he is hidden in that impenetrable building of his just so he can enjoy himself
and the reasons Touma has so much misfortune is because he has stolen his waifu which made him mad.
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Old 2013-08-04, 04:06   Link #4677
Xero8420
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Quote:
Originally Posted by dniv View Post
I initially freaked out about the statement, but I actually think what both of you guys are saying makes way more sense. Flere also said the same thing upon translating the Japanese.

Apparently, there's a tendency in people to notice what they want to see when they are processing information I am guessing this is what is going on here which is why I am being careful now in assuming anything from Gensei saying that to Mikoto.

Either way... even though the favorite thing is still up to debate... what isn't up to debate is that another level 6 shift project is starting. That is heck of cool... And that in itself is huge news in terms of the series. After all, I can't think of any other attempt to create a level 6 other than Accel's project (that was canon) and that was planned well in advance...

To me what seems more interesting here is that Gensei planned for level upper to synche with his brainwaves so that he could bypass exterior's registration process. The events of the level upper arc happened a while ago, right?

The fact that Gensei seems to have been planning to do this to Mikoto all along sparks my interest... Also, what is more interesting is that he 1. knows about exterior and 2. seems to be enemies with heaven's canceller in terms of views...

Though what seems clear to me is this... Aleister probably doesn't support Gensei's actions... First off it was hard for Gensei to get access to a sister. Second he had to use Kouzaku to trick Member into going against Aleister's orders... And there are other suspicious facts.

From what I gather, Gensei is acting completely against Aleister's wishes and I feel like anything Gensei says or wants may not at all represent what Aleister actually wants or thinks...
In other words, Gensei is challenging against Aleister, I presume.

Spoiler for speculation:


PS: LOL! I still don't get that Mikoto is really one of Aleister's favorite too? His waifu? Guys, I think it could be a confusion/misunderstanding just because Gensei did mentioned "Aleister's favorite" but we actually have no clue who was he referring to other than Touma.
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Old 2013-08-04, 06:19   Link #4678
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As a reminder, Aleister is aware of everything that happens in Academy City through the Underline nanodevice network. There is no reason to think that Gensei is operating outside Aleister's expectations, or else Mr. Upside Down would have just killed him.

I suppose it's possible that Aleister didn't know Gensei intended to power-up Mikoto, but he had to know about Exterior/Gensei's assault and hijacking of the network. That he didn't stop this is a little odd. Maybe he wanted this experiment to happen...

Are we sure there are no other references to this arc anywhere? I doubt there are, but I'm just curious.
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Old 2013-08-04, 06:45   Link #4679
desrtsku
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Quote:
Originally Posted by zaeraal View Post
Because at this rate you will come to conclussion that Aleister has fallen in love with her,
which means that he has all those cameras and security just to stalk her,
he made 20 000 clones just to satisfy his lust, he even made a younger / older version,
he is hidden in that impenetrable building of his just so he can enjoy himself
and the reasons Touma has so much misfortune is because he has stolen his waifu which made him mad.
It makes sense.

The fact that his plans were destroyed when Hamazura beat Mugino is also related to her. I think that relation is the "parameter list". Mikoto actually only had the potential to become a level 3 or level 4 at best. But he liked her so much he spent half of AC's human and financial resource to turn her into a level 5. This is also why it's so difficult to create level 5 clones of hers ... because the original herself could hardly become a level 5 to begin with.
When Aleister discovered Hamazura's link with Takitsubou, he anticipated that he'd learn about Takitsubou being a potential level 5 sooner or later. Thus also knowing about the parameter list, and leading to him eventually learning about his secret concerning Mikoto.

His real plan is actually to use a spell similar to Angel Fall to transform all beings on earth into Mikoto clones. But such simple plan can easily be countered by killing the original. So he needed to protect her at all cost.
So naturally, all of his actions during the first part of Index were to minimise Mikoto's connection with the dark side and the magic side as much as possible (hence why her lack of screentime), he even went as far as using his broken powers to make her oblivious to magic. However, since Hamazura discovered the existence of the parameter list (and would probably share the info to the other members of the Kamijou faction, especially birdway & co), the risk of anyone finding out about Mikoto being given super special treatment and protection (as well as his entire plan) increases. Thus why he isn't doing anything anymore in NT, which leads to Mikoto being more involved and less oblivious to magic.

Papa Mikasa's connexion with Aleister becomes even more clear, now. Aleister asked him for her hand, but Papa eventually refused. Nevertheless, Aleister gave him his number in case he'd change his mind.

Aleister, you sick bastard.
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Old 2013-08-04, 06:48   Link #4680
Shadrala
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Quote:
Originally Posted by desrtsku View Post
It makes sense.

The fact that his plans were destroyed when Hamazura beat Mugino is also related to her. I think that relation is the "parameter list". Mikoto actually only had the potential to become a level 3 or level 4 at best. But he liked her so much he spent half of AC's human and financial resource to make her into a level 5. This is also why it's so difficult to create level 5 clones of hers ... because the original herself could hardly become a level 5 to begin with.
When Aleister discovered Hamazura's link with Takitsubou, he anticipated that he'd learn about Takitsubou being a potential level 5 sooner or later. Thus also knowing about the parameter list, and leading to him eventually learning about his secret concerning Mikoto.

His real plan is actually to use a spell similar to Angel Fall to transform all beings on earth into Mikoto clones. But such simple plan can easily be countered by killing the original. So he needed to protect her at all cost.
So naturally, all of his actions during the first part of Index were to minimise Mikoto's connection with the dark side and the magic side as much as possible (hence why her lack of screentime), he even went as far as using his broken powers to make her oblivious to magic. However, since Hamazura discovered the existence of the parameter list (and would probably share the info to the other members of the Kamijou faction, especially birdway & co), the risk of anyone finding out about Mikoto being given super special treatment and protection increases. Thus, why he isn't doing anything anymore in NT, which leads to Mikoto being more involved and less oblivious to magic.

Papa Mikasa's connexion with Aleister, becomes even more clear, now. Aleister asked him for her hand, but Papa eventually refused. Nevertheless, Aleister gave him his number in case he'd change his mind.

Aleister, you sick bastard.

Lol... I... can't... breathe...! XDD That was brilliant.
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