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Old 2012-03-26, 02:10   Link #17861
Kirito
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leukrota View Post
Actually it attached, or rather grew again all by itself. Touma is apparently the IB's preferred host, at least for now. All Ollerus did was watch over him.

EDIT: Reviewing the passage, it re-attached this time... it still did it on it's own.
So it's possible that Imagine Breaker can leave Touma and choose another host if it wanted.

Considering what's happened up until now I wouldn't be surprised if that happened.
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Old 2012-03-26, 02:25   Link #17862
shmaster
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But that's the problem, how?
According to Fiamma, Imagine Breaker has pretty much chosen Touma as the bearer of this generation.
But here is the question, is Touma's right hand special because of Imagine Breaker? Or is it because Touma's right hand is special in the first place that Imagine Breaker choose Touma?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Phibrizzo View Post
Yes but the ritual was done, the point here was the rejection of Imagen breaker, the altar can be changed (and for what Aliester state it must be changed).
I highly doubt that. As the the churches start to break down the Star of Bethlehem, the Holy Right was losing power along with it. The Holy Right still needs a Temple.
He might not need a Star of Bethlehem, but he still need a Temple to access Holy Right's full power. Without a Temple, he has no container to host all the super natural energy he needs to fuel the Holy Right.
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Old 2012-03-26, 02:30   Link #17863
tsunade666
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It's also debatable on how special is Touma's right hand is. Because Fiamma wants Touma's RIGHT HAND and NOT the Imagine Breaker. Fiamma originally planned to remove it but since with the imagine breaker acting it powers up the holy right so he leaves it behind. But what he really wants is the RIGHT HAND. The perfect vessel that allows the holy right to be perfect and be able to materialize completely.
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Old 2012-03-26, 02:41   Link #17864
Chaos2Frozen
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Since we're back on the topic discussing the Holy Right, I want to address something- The explanation for its power is to defeat anything without needing an effect. But if thats the case why are there some things that require Fiamma to 'power up'? Doesnt that imply some form of power level?
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Old 2012-03-26, 03:03   Link #17865
tsunade666
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maybe it's a seal. The power to absolute conquer the enemy. But since it has a seal or a limit. A certain ritual is needed to remove the seal or power it up. Like the Star of Bethlehem as the ritual site. Then the knowledge of Index to fill in the gaps of his knowledge about Holy right and the alignment of angels and also a perfect vessel for power. Then lastly a place where it's needed. Lots of requirement to fully unleash its real power. Well since it's over hax to begin with.
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Old 2012-03-26, 03:05   Link #17866
shmaster
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A power of right hand has to be refined in a Temple to achieve the level of power that can cause an Aeonic shift. Fiamma himself also needs a output terminal for himself to fully use the power of Holy Right.

It is more about the requirement of things rather than actual power.
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Old 2012-03-26, 06:50   Link #17867
Chaos2Frozen
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Okay so is it something like this-

By default, Holy Right can protect Fiamma from almost all forms of attacks and can defeat any enemy in one hit. There is also a limited number of uses.

Stage Two, Holy Right can defeat any concept such as distance and negative emotions. There is an unlimited number of uses and Fiamma can use any magic associated with the Right Hand.

True Form, Holy Right is now a Star Destroyer... Kinda fitting since it did destroy the 'Morning Star' once.
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Old 2012-03-26, 06:52   Link #17868
whitecloud
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Basically if fiamma want to fight othinus in this state he will need to recreate a temple...not necessarily have to be star of Bethlehem, and a lot of negative emotion which is pretty easy get
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Old 2012-03-26, 06:53   Link #17869
Chaos2Frozen
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He would also need Index again.
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Old 2012-03-26, 07:16   Link #17870
whitecloud
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Stage two doesn't need index I think...he isn't fighting othinus alone after all he have ollerus as well
It will be much better if we coul bring back our crazy alchemist back
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Old 2012-03-26, 07:37   Link #17871
ellifeedn
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Is there more to the Imagine Breaker than just the right hand? Could the power cover the entire body?
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Old 2012-03-26, 07:41   Link #17872
Chaos2Frozen
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Quote:
Originally Posted by whitecloud View Post
Stage two doesn't need index I think...he isn't fighting othinus alone after all he have ollerus as well
I'm almost certain stage two requires Index, it's only after getting the knowledge of the Grimoires was Fiamma's Holy Right elevated from overpowered to haxx, recall the events of vol 20.
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Old 2012-03-26, 08:03   Link #17873
Cosmic Eagle
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tsunade666 View Post
It's also debatable on how special is Touma's right hand is. Because Fiamma wants Touma's RIGHT HAND and NOT the Imagine Breaker. Fiamma originally planned to remove it but since with the imagine breaker acting it powers up the holy right so he leaves it behind. But what he really wants is the RIGHT HAND. The perfect vessel that allows the holy right to be perfect and be able to materialize completely.
But how much does Fiamma know about Touma? He saw what was inside him but that didn't seem to be something he anticipated...It may not be the Touma's hand itself but the thing inside that's significant.

Quote:
True Form, Holy Right is now a Star Destroyer... Kinda fitting since it did destroy the 'Morning Star' once.
I would say that's unknown since the true Holy Right was never achieved. It was being used in the wrong Aeonic format after all.
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Old 2012-03-26, 10:00   Link #17874
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OK, after reading 20 pages of post i finally caught up and now the main topic now is touma right hand, some say it a dragon inside, a hidden power, or some unknown power in him.

I dont have much time to write because class start in a hour, but let me say this

"When we see Touma Unleash HIS power 100% or Loses it IN A RAGE MODE, Touma will be a total BEAST WHEN HE (if ever) Uses his new power or BEAT THE living DAYlight for whoever he fighting."

Agree?
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Old 2012-03-26, 10:00   Link #17875
desrtsku
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Cosmic Eagle View Post
I would say that's unknown since the true Holy Right was never achieved. It was being used in the wrong Aeonic format after all.
But for now, we're not even sure whether the Aeon shift boosts the scale of the power or its special effects or both

EDIT :

Quote:
Originally Posted by mark1246 View Post
OK, after reading 20 pages of post i finally caught up and now the main topic now is touma right hand, some say it a dragon inside, a hidden power, or some unknown power in him.

I dont have much time to write because class start in a hour, but let me say this

"When we see Touma Unleash HIS power 100% or Loses it IN A RAGE MODE, Touma will be a total BEAST WHEN HE (if ever) Uses his new power or BEAT THE living DAYlight for whoever he fighting."

Agree?
Dunno, he earns our respect by throwing his punches here and there without any real notable super power (and being at the same time on the other side of the tier list), so it isn't sure if he'd look as badass being overpowered. But Aqua and Accel did it, so I guess it might be ok ^^
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Last edited by desrtsku; 2012-03-26 at 10:10. Reason: to mark
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Old 2012-03-26, 10:55   Link #17876
Kirito
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ellifeedn View Post
Is there more to the Imagine Breaker than just the right hand? Could the power cover the entire body?
Terra of the Left mentioned that Imagine Breaker when it's at full power it can go past the right hand and beyond, and could block attacks from any range if it wanted. They also made theories that at full power Touma could destroy the planet by negating the Ley Lines and killing a human being by destroying their life force via handshake. Terra died before he could give Touma the answers he needed and Gremlin knows about it and have counter measures against it. The ending of Nt4 is the definitely proof of that.

Aleister is monitoring Touma's Imagine Breaker potential/limit and it's at least 2% away from completion and it hinted that he's about to "awaken" soon.
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Old 2012-03-26, 11:01   Link #17877
judasmartel
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So is it possible that the Invisible Thing is a living embodiment of Death?
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Old 2012-03-26, 11:03   Link #17878
Acer
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When it is mentioned that Touma can "awaken"?
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Old 2012-03-26, 11:05   Link #17879
Sumeragi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Deikan View Post
hinted that he's about to "awaken" soon.
Could we stop throwing the term "awaken" around like it's just something anyone can do?
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Old 2012-03-26, 12:17   Link #17880
tsunade666
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Quote:
Originally Posted by mark1246 View Post
OK, after reading 20 pages of post i finally caught up and now the main topic now is touma right hand, some say it a dragon inside, a hidden power, or some unknown power in him.

I dont have much time to write because class start in a hour, but let me say this

"When we see Touma Unleash HIS power 100% or Loses it IN A RAGE MODE, Touma will be a total BEAST WHEN HE (if ever) Uses his new power or BEAT THE living DAYlight for whoever he fighting."

Agree?
I can't agree. I like Touma the way he is. I don't like super power MC that goes against hax enemies. I found Touma unique because he is he and he only uses his right hand to fight enemies that could literally turned the planet into wasteland. If he become overpowered. Some of his original charms would be gone.

Accelerator got a power up from a stuck up undamaged goods. To damaged goods that manage to crawl up by using any means of method to defeat his enemy. To a carnage of wrath until he reach nirvana or rather freedom of heart. Being stuck with his dark past and twisted reasoning. He become free and start doing what he REALLY wants without even a care.

while Aqua gets a decrease in Strength. From double saint to single saint to a normal person who can't even use magic but still fight with a sword.

Few people can only awaken. And that's Accelerator and Fridge-kun and also Touma. Aleister did said that it's about to be complete or awaken.

Quote:
But for now, we're not even sure whether the Aeon shift boosts the scale of the power or its special effects or both
Aleister said that Fiamma was doing it wrong. If he use the Aeon of Horus then he might had even surpassed him but alas he stuck in Aeon of Osiris. But by meeting Ollerus. He might start to understand and shift his believes from Osiris to Horus. Thus we still didn't see the full wrath the holy right can unleash.
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