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Old 2008-08-12, 00:06   Link #101
killer3000ad
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Russians advancing further into Georgia

The Russians appear to be following my sig and paying it back two for an eye. Not content with driving the Georgians out of well..... the Georgian territory of South Ossetia, their ground forces have pushed beyond South Ossetia and Abkhazia right into Georgia itself.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/7554507.stm
http://edition.cnn.com/2008/WORLD/eu...sia/index.html
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Old 2008-08-12, 00:21   Link #102
WanderingKnight
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Quote:
No one in the U.S. is afraid of Russia, or at least im not.
Sweet father of mercy, would you please open his eyes?

Go fight in the fucking front if you're not so afraid of them. When there are wars, it's people the ones who fight them, with many dying in the attempt. And probably while you're comfortably rotting on your couch.

Seriously, grow up. Your attitude is beyond deplorable.
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Old 2008-08-12, 00:32   Link #103
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zoned87 View Post
I'm all for supporting Georgia I don't care if we have to face Russia.

No one in the U.S. is afraid of Russia, or at least im not.
I lived through the Cold War, and that was scary as hell (at times). Having said that, I never want to face the prospect of an actual war with Russia. Just reading your post sent shivers down my spine. A war with Russia would probably be worse than the previous two World War's combined. Never, ever, say that the U.S. does not fear a war with Russia.

That being said, they are equally as afraid of going to war with us as we are of going to war with them. So, as always, we have a distinct standoff that will never truly be resolved until both countries change drastically.
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Old 2008-08-12, 00:41   Link #104
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WanderingKnight View Post
Sweet father of mercy, would you please open his eyes?

Go fight in the fucking front if you're not so afraid of them. When there are wars, it's people the ones who fight them, with many dying in the attempt. And probably while you're comfortably rotting on your couch.

Seriously, grow up. Your attitude is beyond deplorable.
Agreed. This fellow clearly has never read a single page of history in his life.
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Old 2008-08-12, 00:49   Link #105
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I know Russia used to be a powerful nation, but is no longer really a threat since its economic collapse and the USSR being dissolved in 1991.

Germany was once a powerful nation, but no one fears them now. So was Rome, Spain and even England at one time.
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Old 2008-08-12, 00:53   Link #106
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No longer a threat?

I'm so holding back remarks that would get me banned from the forum.
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Old 2008-08-12, 01:12   Link #107
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Originally Posted by Zoned87 View Post
I know Russia used to be a powerful nation, but is no longer really a threat since its economic collapse and the USSR being dissolved in 1991.

Germany was once a powerful nation, but no one fears them now. So was Rome, Spain and even England at one time.
*facepalms*

Let's see: Germany was taken down by the unholy alliance of the USSR and the USA in a war which lasted years, and devastated large areas in Europe.

The decline of Rome and Spain was something else altogether, while England declined because of the two World Wars.

Now, Russia is putting its house in order. Putin is clearly no drunk (Bless Boris, RIP). Now rich with oil money, it wants its place in the sun.
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Old 2008-08-12, 01:12   Link #108
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If they blew up the world they would die to, it would be stupidity.
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Old 2008-08-12, 01:19   Link #109
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Originally Posted by Zoned87 View Post
If they blew up the world they would die to, it would be stupidity.
Russia is not threatening nuclear war. They want to send a signal to the US and Western Europe to stop poking their noses in Russia's backyard. NATO's expansion eastwards has made Russia very uncomfortable, and Georgia is one fellow which they had been wanting to hammer for a long time.
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Old 2008-08-12, 01:24   Link #110
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zoned87 View Post
I know Russia used to be a powerful nation, but is no longer really a threat since its economic collapse and the USSR being dissolved in 1991.

Germany was once a powerful nation, but no one fears them now. So was Rome, Spain and even England at one time.
No longer a threat? You are dreaming man. Please study history, because Russia's shear size, it oscillates between a major power and a power. Someone from Northern Europe need to speak out and educate these kids.

Look at how much trouble US is having with afgan and iraq. These are not even power nations. Do you know how much we have crippled ourselves so far on these 2 fronts?

US's only leverage is to put other concession on the table in exchange of Georgia's existence.
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Old 2008-08-12, 01:25   Link #111
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zoned87 View Post
If they blew up the world they would die to, it would be stupidity.
please, stop talking. you're becoming as bad as Excalibur with your nonsense

while I'm not going to add anything to this discussion, you have clearly shown you do not have an ounce of knowledge that is true pertaining to the situation.

and anything I could say has already been said, so please, just STOP
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Old 2008-08-12, 01:37   Link #112
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lol silly ruskies
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Old 2008-08-12, 02:02   Link #113
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Here you go. It's yesterday's news but maybe someone haven't read yet:
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...nt-890563.html
The most unbiassed opinion. More or less it is true.

And for those who don't want to read:
Spoiler for True:


Quote:
Germany was taken down by the unholy alliance of the USSR and the USA in a war which lasted years, and devastated large areas in Europe.
Actually it was mostly USSR. USA shown up at the wery end. But half of the world think that USA is the only heroes.
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Old 2008-08-12, 02:13   Link #114
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Originally Posted by Ellaya_dw View Post
Here you go. It's yesterday's news but maybe someone haven't read yet:
http://www.independent.co.uk/news/wo...nt-890563.html
The most unbiassed opinion. More or less it is true.

And for those who don't want to read:
Spoiler for True:



Actually it was mostly USSR. USA shown up at the wery end. But half of the world think that USA is the only heroes.
Well, the Soviets did tie down the Germans at the Eastern Front. But, if you want to harp on the issue, then Stalin is the USSR's worst enemy, since his policies left the country open to attack. His purges left the military command weak at the top, which was the prime reason why the initial German assault was a spectacular success.

The US was crucial on the Western Front. In fact, Stalin was breathing down Roosevelt's neck when D-Day was delayed all the way till July '44.
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Old 2008-08-12, 02:44   Link #115
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zoned87 View Post
I know Russia used to be a powerful nation, but is no longer really a threat since its economic collapse and the USSR being dissolved in 1991.
Even when they were down after the collapse, because of its army and nuclear power, it was supported by the western countries. And, right now, with many crucial decisions are being made after taking into account Russia's position. They have regained a lot of what they lost after the collapse. Thanks to their natural resources, and good use of capitalism, they are once again in power.

And, they are using the favorable position here, by doing nothing while US was encouraging Georgia to show its teeth to Russia. And, now the Georgia is paying the price, because they are the ones who invited Russia there, by attacking first (assuming they will get supported by US, an assumption coming from a naive leader). US is in no position to throw out threats when they had done the same thing in Iraq. And, no one would have any right to say anything, even if Georgia gets divided by Russia, since Iraq was divided into three by US and others not so long ago. The same thing happened in Yugoslavia. Russia's weakness was used against him. In all those times, when Russia became the opposing side, I don't remember US or others taking into account what Russia said.

Maybe people hating Bush should be grateful seeing that happening. Reminding people the importance of not making a mistake, so that others wouldn't repeat it willingfully, for their profit.
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Old 2008-08-12, 02:49   Link #116
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Quote:
Originally Posted by yezhanquan View Post
Well, the Soviets did tie down the Germans at the Eastern Front. But, if you want to harp on the issue, then Stalin is the USSR's worst enemy, since his policies left the country open to attack. His purges left the military command weak at the top, which was the prime reason why the initial German assault was a spectacular success.

The US was crucial on the Western Front. In fact, Stalin was breathing down Roosevelt's neck when D-Day was delayed all the way till July '44.
Indeed, Stalin has a lot of innocent blood on his hands. That's because of him so many has died. But nazi army could not occupy USSR even after this. USSR was the first who gave them a big kick to their greedy @$$.
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Old 2008-08-12, 02:53   Link #117
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The issue of who really "won" World War II in Europe is controversial, but it is true that the USSR held down a far larger contingent of the Wehrmacht than the Allies. Whether they could've won without the Allied invasion is difficult to assess - some might argue that had Hitler been able to commit the entirety of the Wehrmacht he would've overrun Stalingrad, taken the Caucasus, and devastated Stalin's military capability, while others say that it was only a matter of time before the Siberian winter grinded the German forces down to a halt and then a full retreat.

The US was a far more decisive player on the Pacific front against Japan - there the USSR did not contribute as much (though they still won some significant victories).

Whatever the case, though, World War II was such a horrific war in terms of its scale and apathy to human suffering that you all had better pray we never get into such a conflict again (against Russia or whoever). Seriously, the wounds of that conflict have yet to even heal; we should not so casually stride into the next world war.
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Old 2008-08-12, 02:58   Link #118
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Russia has enough warheads to vaporize the world a hundred times over. And that was all the way back in the Cold War.

The fact that they, AND America has a LOT more Nukes now should make one more afraid of the current crisis, not less.
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Old 2008-08-12, 03:09   Link #119
james0246
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Originally Posted by Ronin Aquila View Post
Russia has enough warheads to vaporize the world a hundred times over. And that was all the way back in the Cold War.

The fact that they, AND America has a LOT more Nukes now should make one more afraid of the current crisis, not less.
This is actually backwards. Just 20 years ago, there were close to 60,000 nuclear weapons spread throughtout the world (with Russia having the most, and America having the best). Currently there are only around 15,00-20,000 nuclear weapons. Sure, we can probably still kill ourselves, but it is possible that the Earth will at least survive our suicide now...

But this is not an issue of Nuclear armaments. America will do nothing, Europe will do nothing, Georgia will (probably) get a new leader, and Russia will sit back knowing that no other border country will attempt anything in the near future...still pretty bleak, but at least there is no escalation that would result in an even greater conflict.
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Old 2008-08-12, 05:03   Link #120
yezhanquan
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I think the Georgians may be joining the long list of peoples "betrayed" by the US. Rightly or wrongly, the US has created "hope" for many groups of people around the world, only to leave them in the lurch later. From the forgotten war in Laos, to the Kurds after the First Iraq War, many peoples have been played by the US for fools.

I forsee that Russia will get the chance to exert their influence once again. The once-sick bear is roaring again.
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