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Old 2009-01-01, 04:48   Link #101
Westlo
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Join Date: May 2007
The reason manga fans are annoyed Kaioshin is... well to provide an example.. we expected a Lelouch but we ended up with Kira Yamato. I exaggerate a tad but it's annoying they had to remove every part of Keita that made him standout and just make him a generic lead. I liked manga Keita because he was a prick who developed. Oh and Akane is now a dumb cow! Yay?

And if manga fans continue to get annoyed please don't turn this into "Oh great more Sunrise hate" because it doesn't matter who did it, we would still bitch about sub par adaptions.

Last edited by Westlo; 2009-01-01 at 10:24.
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Old 2009-01-01, 06:59   Link #102
Same_Shark
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I'm sorry, but I'd have to say that Kuro's fight scene was the perfect fight to end the year! That was an ass whooping that I'll never forget!
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Old 2009-01-01, 07:19   Link #103
raidou
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Ehh… it is not too bad once I watched the raw. They are leaving the concepts of manga intact with just different pace, storyline and new characters. The fight scenes and overall animation are enjoyable enough for me (what’s with kuro’s hair going shana-ish anyway)

True, the manga’s Keita might be a more original dude but the anime version doesn’t seem too generic either (at least for now)…..The much angst-ing probably just to give early explanation of his background. Sadly, this also means less/no Kuro's abuses which are source of humour in the manga (sometimes)

Spoiler for ep1 complaints...:


Overall..not too bad for my 1st anime in a year..

Oh yeah the subs by KyouNoSUBS is out btw, if anyone is waiting (am I even allowed to say this since it is ?licensed?)

Would anyone be kind enough to make any Puni-puni avatar ?
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Old 2009-01-01, 10:12   Link #104
Tiamat's Disciple
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First ep blowed.

I wasn't expecting a total manga conversion, but already to much has been chnged for it to really be called Black God.

The emo side of Keita in the manga works, because of his age, it actually adds to his personality. In the anime version it's a huge turn off, cause he's just overly emo. I don't like them changing it to his dad being alive as well, to much has changed for me to enjoy it, especially since i love the manga.

Did a more indepth thoughts post on my blog
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Old 2009-01-01, 12:20   Link #105
Westlo
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Read your blog post and pretty much agree, I'm quite annoyed at the total downgrade of Akane in the anime since she was also one of my favorite characters in the manga. I really liked the interaction between Keita and Akane as well as Keita and Kuro but it looks like none of that will come over thanks to the new version of Keita. Shame about the changes since the VA's fit nicely and the animation is nicely done.

At least it hasn't been treated as bad as Rosario + Vampire... but we're only 1 episode in...

Last edited by Westlo; 2009-01-01 at 12:32.
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Old 2009-01-01, 12:44   Link #106
Tiamat's Disciple
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R+V was bad, but atleast it was funny and entertaining to an extent. BG lacks all that, since it was a story and interaction based series. Since that's been watered down to the point of it being just water, there's nothing left to taste.

It's stupid to take a seinen manga and try and reduce it to a shonen, they could have made this a kick ass seinen series that could have lead the season.
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Old 2009-01-01, 12:44   Link #107
tzia_n
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damn, after reading through some of your reactions to the anime I'm getting afraid of watching it since I really liked the manga
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Old 2009-01-01, 15:21   Link #108
Kaioshin Sama
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However angsty and emo the main character is I'm seeing a pretty angsty and emo thread over these manga changes so people might want to consider the proverb about the pot calling the kettle black. And what else would you prefer I say Westlo when people are indeed going after a series for superficial reasons. For example, if people have established in their own eyes that the anime is so different from the manga to be called Black God, then why still treat it as if it's restrained by the manga's version of the story instead of considering it an alternate retelling? Also, as an adaptation or an anime in general it's no earth shattering original masterpiece (and if you ask me the manga is no original milestone either) I won't dispute that, but when people can't even get their facts straight about the production and histories of a company and I've twice seen people make mistakes about a company such as giving them a copyright they don't own and mistaking the order of another adaptation then I don't see why I should be muzzled from saying something. I'm really tired of you going after me like this so consider yourself ignored like I had warned.

I mean do people even consider that the main character might actually....gasp.....evolve out of his emo phase at some point or that they might be able to make something fresh of this adaptation the way it's all being done in the anime? No, they just freak out immediately over changes from the manga and go looking for somebody to blame. I still don't understand why some people have such a huge issue with changes being made from an original source such that it's all they seem concerned about when watching an adaptation either. As long as we can still have a functioning anime I'm satisfied but I don't see how one episode is enough to judge if we have a working series or a "bastardization" as Tiamat's Disciple puts it. Maybe it will even end up being better at the manga at some points, who knows. People will never know if they make up their minds after one episode though.

Last edited by Kaioshin Sama; 2009-01-01 at 15:56.
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Old 2009-01-01, 16:38   Link #109
Shiroth
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tzia_n View Post
damn, after reading through some of your reactions to the anime I'm getting afraid of watching it since I really liked the manga
I've never read the manga, so i went into and came out of the first episode with no problems at all. I was thinking of starting the manga, though it's something i believe would be better to do once the series has finished.

I guess most of this thread will feature people not happy with the main character, and people going against that saying "you'd act the same if you were in his place".
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Old 2009-01-01, 16:52   Link #110
Zippicus
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The first episode was pretty good but it was a bit confusing at times due to some jarring scene changes. I think I was mostly able to keep up though. The action was great, it kind of surprised me how brutal it was, I'm guessing it's going to get worse from here on out.

Thankfully I haven't read the manga so I should be able to enjoy this apparently
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Old 2009-01-01, 16:54   Link #111
Fnights
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiamat's Disciple View Post
It's stupid to take a seinen manga and try and reduce it to a shonen, they could have made this a kick ass seinen series that could have lead the season.
Sunrise ruin for the same reason Code Geass R2, they decrease the target for gain more audience and make more money. Is a shame. I think i drop this serie as i drop Princess Resurrection (one of the worst conversion ever seen).
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Last edited by Fnights; 2009-01-01 at 17:08.
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Old 2009-01-01, 17:05   Link #112
Tiamat's Disciple
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Why bother making an anime of a manga if you're going to change everything?

If all you interested in is the concept, then take that and make a new anime. When you make a big buzz about how you're making an adaptation of a manga then you end up with fans of the manga having a lot of preconceptions about how the anime will play out.

Certain chages will always happen, since there's never enough time in an anime to do everything in a manga. No one really disputes that (i would think), but when you start changing things left right and center, especially core elements, then it's only natural people would get upset.

Whats really frustrating in this instance is they've taken a great seinen series, one of my favorites, and turned it into a crappy high school shonen series. There was a lot more potential for it as a true seinen conversion than dumbing it down to a shonen. It's like buying a copy of Lord of the Rings, getting home and finding it Baby of the Dummy instead.

Can the series be good? Of course it can, hell i know people who have never read the manga and loved the first episode. and i know people who like me loved the manga and are devestated by the hatchet job.
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Old 2009-01-01, 19:31   Link #113
Kaioshin Sama
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Wow you people are all such experts that you can forsee the course of the whole show right from the very first episode and whether it's going to be good or not. I guess I can't argue with psychics since they can see the future and all.

Why else would anybody ever jump to all these conclusions that are being made at the end of the first episode. Certainly they have to know what they are talking about.

@Shiroth: No it's going to feature the usual hate on and trolling with lots of lines like, "Oh they changed it because they're only interested in making money and oh they're so evil that $unrise, they butcher everything they do!". I mean I'd be fine if people were just upset at manga changes, called it a loss and left disappointed with a post saying as such, but then they always have to go spouting of about something they know nothing about like production processes and why the changes were made, instead of knowing when they've made their point. Of course according to Westlo I'm not allowed to talk about this and need to just sit around and listen to people give their uninformed opinions so maybe I should draw the line here.
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Old 2009-01-01, 19:40   Link #114
PNGO
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Dam they really changed everything, I don't get it the manga story was perfect. I guess i'll still watch it but I was really excited about this one
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Old 2009-01-01, 20:07   Link #115
Tiamat's Disciple
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@Kaioshin Granted i havent read the entire thread (can't be bothered, only read this page), i haven't seen anyone trolling yet. Though im sure it'll get there eventually.

As for the rest, why else would you change a series from Seinen to Shonen, and reduce the lead from a mid 20's to a teenager? The only reason i can think of is to make it appeal to a wider audience base thus bringing in more $$$. The other thought i had was they intend the series to be only 12/13 episodes long (i noticed ANN lists it as 11 at the moment). So they would have to change a lot if they wanted to compress into 12 episodes.

And yes, you can tell a lot about a series by it's first episode, so far almost all the shows i've not liked the first episode of i've not liked at at all (Druga and Code Gease to name 2). Does that mean im going to hate this series, not really, there have been a few that i've ended up loving despite hating the first episode (Corda and Akagi for example).

For me at least it's a question of trust. When a company bills something as an adaptation it should be an adaptation, not a alternative telling. I have nothing against alternative tellings, spin-offs, or inspired by series. Hell i'm a huge Tenchi Fan, and all of those are spin off's in one for or another.

While i don't really like Sunrise, it's purely a question of taste. I liked Gundan Seed, Hated Destiny, Hated Mai-Hime, loved Mai-Otome.

TBH i don't particularly care who makes what anime, i base my likes and dislikes based on the series. However when a large portion of what i dislike comes from one particular company, then is there any reason for me not to say i don't like that company?

I don't comment on how anime is made, cause frankly i don't know enough on the subject, and even more importantly i don't care. All i care about is if i like the series or not. I don't spend hours dissecting an episode an saying it sucks cause a finger was missing a finger nail or something, or cause a bit of animation wasn't totally smooth. I'll say it sucks based on how i feel about it as a whole.

Also, i guess i must be missing something, cause in the posts by Westlo on this page, there's nothing here saying you couldn't comment. Aren't you being just as emo about it as everyone else

If you've a comment say it, simple as that. If you like the episode good for you, if you have high expectations of the series, good for you. Not everyone will be the same though. It's not exactly fair to say they're emo just because they disagree with you and give the reasons why. So far all the reasons given that ive read (on this page) are solid reasons, and mostly come from fans of the manga
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Old 2009-01-01, 21:28   Link #116
Sai Feng
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Spoiler for Thoughts on Ep. 01:
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Old 2009-01-01, 21:33   Link #117
Jhono1
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Woha, read this thread and got my hopes down, but this bad, I'd never would have imagined... They messed this one up big time! High school student? Akane as a sort of older sister? Wtf, seriously, wtf?

The whole episode was a total rewrite from the manga, why? As Tiamat's Disciple above me says (and I agree completely with him), an adaptation doesn't equal a total remake... If they wanted they could just take some parts of the plot and made an original anime instead. What the hell are Sunrise up to here, what was so bad about the manga that they had to change it into this crap? Way to f#cking ruin down an series I've been looking forward for ages too. Im Dal Youngs first anime adaptation deserves way better than this high school shounen crap.

Here I was hoping that we for once would get an anime about 20's something. Guess I was wrong once more. There have been some extremly bad manga adaptations during 2008, if the plot works in the manga and makes it successful, why change it and totally remake it?

Well, the background was nice, I give them that. The rest of this crap can burn for all I care.

Edit! Well I watched it again, and the art is really nice and so was the fighting scene, well done there really. Still does not change the fact that the direction they are taking this sucks imo.

Last edited by Jhono1; 2009-01-01 at 21:54.
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Old 2009-01-01, 22:47   Link #118
Duo Maxwell
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiamat's Disciple View Post
As for the rest, why else would you change a series from Seinen to Shonen, and reduce the lead from a mid 20's to a teenager? The only reason i can think of is to make it appeal to a wider audience base thus bringing in more $$$. The other thought i had was they intend the series to be only 12/13 episodes long (i noticed ANN lists it as 11 at the moment). So they would have to change a lot if they wanted to compress into 12 episodes.
Because at the first 2 volumes, it's not different from your usual shonen manga? It doesn't get interesting until volume 3rd onward.
I don't like the change, but I'm going to hold my mouth until I see how it will affect the plot later on (when thing is getting more interesting than the shonen feeling it give me at first 2 volumes).

I'm glad that I was born with optimism personality.
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Old 2009-01-01, 22:53   Link #119
Westlo
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Only 1 Episode? We're foreseeing the future? Why be so naive Kaioshin? The ending scene of the episode was completely changed around and came from volume 3. They have completely changed Keita and Akane's personality and dynamic which will change a lot of scenes, especially ones with Kuro as well. The introduction of some support characters will be completely changed now thanks to the ending scene being moved forward.

But yeah let's pretend it's only one episode, lets be naive and ignore obvious changes that are coming.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiamat's Disciple View Post
Also, i guess i must be missing something, cause in the posts by Westlo on this page, there's nothing here saying you couldn't comment. Aren't you being just as emo about it as everyone else
All I did was say "please don't turn this into a "people hate Sunrise thread" and somehow he equates that with "You better not dare comment!" lmao. Ah gotta love Kaioshin and his overreactions and precious defense of anything Sunrise related.
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Old 2009-01-01, 23:22   Link #120
orion
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But we knew before it aired that Keita was going to be a hi schooler. That should have been a big signal that changes were being made to sell to a specific demographics.

Just pretend that the anime is an alternate universe title.
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