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Old 2008-10-31, 14:37   Link #101
Sordes Pilosus
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Well Renee would return to the Organisation, quite shaken up. She would not take what the Ghosts would tell her "Seriusly", while being unable to forget about it. And likly be used by the author to show Organisation point of view in the comming conflict between Ghosts and The Org. She will likly be extremly confused and from there might hesitate in what she will do, what to report and those kind of things.
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Old 2008-10-31, 18:54   Link #102
revan5
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Originally Posted by Sordes Pilosus View Post
Well Renee would return to the Organisation, quite shaken up. She would not take what the Ghosts would tell her "Seriusly", while being unable to forget about it. And likly be used by the author to show Organisation point of view in the comming conflict between Ghosts and The Org. She will likly be extremly confused and from there might hesitate in what she will do, what to report and those kind of things.
I think ultimately this sort of moral confusion will be what does in the Organization. That and the fact that the current generation seem a bit "rushed". They aren't particularly amazing and, at least to my amateur eyes, struggling where the Ghosts were not as much just seven years ago.

Excepting Nos 1 & 2, this is a very shorthanded Organization right now. They'll be at the "suicidal" phase in no time if the Ghosts & Abyssals keep capturing or gaining single-digit warriors of theirs. They've already got Nos 4 & 6 and will probably add No 8, and maybe 7 or 9 the way things are going. This is the definition of a panic if you're the Organization right now. Not only are there unknown warriors poking about all over you can't detect, but Riful is now attempting to awaken an Abyssal-level fighter.
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Old 2008-11-01, 08:49   Link #103
irvinethearcher
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"So it begins, the great battle of our time..." (L.o.t.R.)

If those new found claymores in chapter 85 really are half-awakened they will probably join forces with the others in rabona.
It will be only reasonable that many of the other claymores will join the ghost. At the end the org will have only alicia and a few fanatics and psychos like ophelia who help them.
But alicia alone is incredible powerful. In the end probably only clare or another AO/Pricsiclla/Raciella will be able to beat her like it was in pieta against rigardo.
This isn't good - i fear that many claymores will have to die in the last battle. It will be harder than pieta. All will probably happen like miria said.
And somehow i have the feeling that perhaps galatea and lune will gave clare some kind of soul link backup to fight alicia.
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Old 2008-11-01, 14:43   Link #104
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Originally Posted by irvinethearcher View Post
"So it begins, the great battle of our time..." (L.o.t.R.)

If those new found claymores in chapter 85 really are half-awakened they will probably join forces with the others in rabona.
It will be only reasonable that many of the other claymores will join the ghost. At the end the org will have only alicia and a few fanatics and psychos like ophelia who help them.
But alicia alone is incredible powerful. In the end probably only clare or another AO/Pricsiclla/Raciella will be able to beat her like it was in pieta against rigardo.
This isn't good - i fear that many claymores will have to die in the last battle. It will be harder than pieta. All will probably happen like miria said.
And somehow i have the feeling that perhaps galatea and lune will gave clare some kind of soul link backup to fight alicia.
Somehow, having read the translations provided, I can't see No 8 joining at the moment. Helen & Deneve seem to want to talk to her only and then leave on their own. That's not to say No 8 doesn't seem intriguingly strong for her number. She outclasses No 9 by a margin that really shouldn't be there. So while she may have been sent on a suicide mission, I get the feeling Helen & Deneve aren't about to chance trying to turn her against the organization just yet.

Maybe that will happen once the Ghosts & Organization are fully aware of what the other is doing and getting mixed up into large fights. When that time comes I predict that a number of single-digits and others they have met will either (like No 14) be pissed at them or conflicted (probably No 8).
End of Chapter-
Dietrich: Even if polluted by evil, both you and I are/were both warriors. This one is out of respect among comrades. (sounds like she knows the three of them are not NORMAL)

Something BIG just occurred to me. Rubel mentions Claire saving Rafaela & Renee early in chapter 85. Just what would happen if Claire and the gang intervened? I can imagine one scenario might be if Rafaela did awaken in which they would essentially save Renee only while fleeing the upcoming monster fight. Still that wouldn't be as cool as the possibility that Claire and Co show up just as the awakening is occurring. Imagine, the two bodies merge BUT Claire/Cynthia stop it from fully awakening! Could you imagine if they were able to gain someone/something as powerful as an ally as a combined Rafaela/Luciella? Of course this might be extremely hard to accomplish...but I have confidence in Claire's reckless nature & Cynthia's enabling of it.

So the question has got to be...when/if Riful discovers them...what will they be doing?

1) Saving Rafaela/Luciella remains from Riful along with Renee
2) Saving Renee only since "Raciella" has awakened and is fighting Riful
3) Saving their asses since Riful discovered them early
4) Saving a merged (but not fully awakened) Raciella along with Renee
5) Yuma, Cynthia & Raki attempting to stop Claire from killing Priscilla
6) Talking with Raki & Priscilla (Claire unaware of what Priscilla is)

If the answer is number 4, how does that affect the island war? Heck, how would it affect the island war if it was just Renee?

My answer: If they rescue a merged but not awakened "Raciella" (essentially they would stop complete awakening in this scenario) they will have a genuine chance at killing Riful...not to mention will all of a sudden rival the Southern Abyssals as the most powerful faction on the island. If it's just Renee they'll get a solid fighter but also improved intelligence while the Organization is further hurt.

So what about you guys? Is there a possibility they could rescue a merged but NOT AWAKENED Raciella? And if they did, what would that mean for the Island War in your opinion?
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Last edited by revan5; 2008-11-01 at 16:19. Reason: Rafaela...is she really doomed to awaken along with Luciella's remains?
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Old 2008-11-02, 09:32   Link #105
Sordes Pilosus
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Well there are a few changes to possible scenario's after this chapter. The most noticable thing is the fact more and more of "This Generation Claymore's" get introduced. We have been getting Single Digits of this generation constantly since the timeskip. Nina, Audrey, Ray, Miata, Renee and Diet"linde"(Its either just Diet from me or something like that rest of the series. Dont want to call her by a boyname without atlest a good backstory about why she is named that way.)

Generaly speaking this generation's single digits ends up being saved one after an other. So far we can place 3 in the category: "Saved but stil with the Org", Thats Nina, Audrey and Ray. We have 1 in the "Possible Ally" in Miata. We have now 2 Unknown. Renee thats stil a captive by Riful. And Diet who has just been saved by Helen and Deneve. How these 2 will turn out is stil unknown. Probably both will return to Org i feel.

But anyone else really noticed all the Single Digit Focus so far ? We even have Galatea added again. Its like the Author is now using this period to "Establish" the main character's that will dominate the rest of the series. Sure several will die, thats Claymore. But generaly we have been "Introduced or Reintroduced" to like 7 Single Digits since timeskip. And add Miria its 8. And Clare can be considered one even if she aint one, probably more of the Ghosts aswell. But generaly speaking, its quite alot of focus on Single Digits now.

It can be a preporation for the "1 on 1's" Between the Org and Ghosts. It can be related to some that will assists the ghosts, direct enemies they will be forced to slash down. There is quite a few posibilities. We are like in a "Calm Period" now, just waiting for the storm to hit.
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Old 2008-11-02, 11:08   Link #106
irvinethearcher
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Perhaps we should make a list:

1.Alicia
2.Beth
3.Audrey
4.Miata
5.Ray
6.Lune
7.?
8.Dietlinde
9.Nina

Please feel free to complete...

Quote:
So what about you guys? Is there a possibility they could rescue a merged but NOT AWAKENED Raciella? And if they did, what would that mean for the Island War in your opinion?
There are so many possibilites now for story developement. Rubel mentioned that clare and raffaella could be good comrades if they'll meet.
And Raki asked lune to tell clare about him, when she'll meet her.

IMO lune will meet clare soon and tell her about priscilla and raki. Therefore clare will try to prevent raciella from awakening. That's how far i can forsee the story developement.
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Old 2008-11-02, 11:20   Link #107
Sordes Pilosus
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Number 6 Renee.(Lune, or Rune also used to describe her)
Number 1 and 2 is stil "Unconfirmed but belived to be Alicia and Beth"
Since for all we know they could have been "Taken out of the ranks"
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Old 2008-11-02, 12:32   Link #108
revan5
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Quote:
Originally Posted by irvinethearcher View Post
Perhaps we should make a list:

1.Alicia
2.Beth
3.Audrey
4.Miata
5.Ray
6.Lune
7.?
8.Dietlinde
9.Nina

Please feel free to complete...


There are so many possibilites now for story developement. Rubel mentioned that clare and raffaella could be good comrades if they'll meet.
And Raki asked lune to tell clare about him, when she'll meet her.

IMO lune will meet clare soon and tell her about priscilla and raki. Therefore clare will try to prevent raciella from awakening. That's how far i can forsee the story developement.
Well what I just thought of when you mentioned that is a possible pairing of Raciella (partially awakened) with Claire & Co against Riful. If that is the case (imagine if you will, the raw combat capabilities of someone who results from the merging of Two Abyssal level fighters), there is a real possibility that this adventure may either end in Riful's death struggle or be the event that forces her to ally with Isley.

Still, considering this individual would not have a sword, they'd have to get one eventually. I figure this would be the event (whether it is with only Raciella or Renee or both) that leads to the party going north (possibly with Raki) and discovering the last of the unknown single-digits, No 7.

Somehow I get the wild feeling that Riful is going to be unpleasantly surprised by something soon...and it could be Claire keeping her new creation from totally awakening.
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Old 2008-11-03, 18:50   Link #109
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Well there is something that I have always thought about. Do we really know anything about Alicia & Beth at all? I mean if you consider that for the 7 years the ghosts were training, Alicia and Beth were being gauged and perfected and trained the entire time, no telling how strong they are. Yagi might even throw in something crazy enough as a "perfected subconscious soul-link", where they could both fight while Alicia was awakened. They have just been in the back of my mind as being ridiculously strong when introduced, seeing as in 85 chapters they have been in maybe 2, and still have not been introduced. I think it is a building up. Also, would Galatea post-timeskip not be considered pretty damn #1 level, I mean wow. And considering that the Ghosts technically have 4 claymores of #1 strength.
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Old 2008-11-03, 20:55   Link #110
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The ghosts have 2 members that are around n1 level and Miata who could be a number 1 who may help them if push comes to shove but shes very young maybe to young to be much use, Galatea I don't belive is n1 material to me she's never really seemed to be a front liner she's more a support class than anything.

There's also the issue of will Galatea,Maitia and Clarice even fight with the ghosts against the org because I'am not sure they will.
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Old 2008-11-04, 14:35   Link #111
revan5
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Originally Posted by xeratal View Post
Well there is something that I have always thought about. Do we really know anything about Alicia & Beth at all? I mean if you consider that for the 7 years the ghosts were training, Alicia and Beth were being gauged and perfected and trained the entire time, no telling how strong they are. Yagi might even throw in something crazy enough as a "perfected subconscious soul-link", where they could both fight while Alicia was awakened. They have just been in the back of my mind as being ridiculously strong when introduced, seeing as in 85 chapters they have been in maybe 2, and still have not been introduced. I think it is a building up. Also, would Galatea post-timeskip not be considered pretty damn #1 level, I mean wow. And considering that the Ghosts technically have 4 claymores of #1 strength.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Newhope View Post
The ghosts have 2 members that are around n1 level and Miata who could be a number 1 who may help them if push comes to shove but shes very young maybe to young to be much use, Galatea I don't belive is n1 material to me she's never really seemed to be a front liner she's more a support class than anything.

There's also the issue of will Galatea,Maitia and Clarice even fight with the ghosts against the org because I'am not sure they will.
Well it is possible that Alicia will be even more mind-blowing than when we saw her last. But the thing is they also mentioned that Alicia was "too unstable" (http://www.onemanga.com/Claymore/72/13/) by Audrey to go after Galatea. Perhaps they've cured that problem...but somehow I doubt it. After all, why haven't we seen her running out and about? Why is she an "inactive member"?

Now then, on to this issue of ranks. I'd hazard a guess that Nos 1 & 2 are probably, at the moment, somewhat stronger than Claire or Miria, besides Galatea & Miata. That said if they get more experience or do yet another controlled awakening, you can imagine that Miria & Claire will be more than just minor hazards for the No 1, and certainly matches for No 2, Beth.

Miata has a long way to go, while Galatea I imagine will be used as a support in battle, and may battle her replacement, Audrey. If however the Ghosts are able to add Raciella to their ranks, the Organization would be in extreme peril. Renee & Dietrich at that point would be merely nice to have.

As to whether Miata & Galatea will fight...I think they will if Rabona is threatened at the very least. It might take them awhile to get into this war.

Am I the only one who thinks that the Ghosts are endangering themselves needlessly right now? How long does anybody think Helen & Deneve can continue this active intervening before the Organization sends their Nos 3, 5, 9 and maybe 8 after them? I can't see them risking Beth just yet...nor Alicia. I sense a single-digits vs. Helen & Deneve fight coming up within half a year, anyone else do too?
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Old 2008-11-04, 16:11   Link #112
Sordes Pilosus
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Well that would be a very interesting way to spark the fight between the Org and the Ghosts off. But its stil a little to soon, well it depends what happends in the 6 chapter's til then. Since its 6 Chapter's your refering to right ? Well personaly Thats a little to early, if Clare and group ends in a fight now it will last a few chapter's considering who the foes would be. And alot stil depends on how things will be buildt up. Its stil introduction chapter's which is why alot of the new generation low digits are being introduced. But im stil looking forward to when the "Calm Breaks"
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Old 2008-11-04, 18:18   Link #113
xeratal
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Originally Posted by revan5 View Post
while Galatea I imagine will be used as a support in battle, and may battle her replacement, Audrey.
I imagine that battle being terribly sad......for Audrey. Given what we have seen Galatea do against Miata and Agatha, I would say she is quite the champ. IMO she would tear Audrey apart.
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Old 2008-11-05, 10:39   Link #114
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Going back to the wider war implications, I was rereading the series and noticed something.

Remember when Raki got taken by the slave traders, and that was why he was up North in the first place? There was a note on the slave trade that was interesting. It went something like

'Everyone knows that all orphans are gathered up by the slave traders. The boys are sent North, and the girls are sent East, because those are the areas that are always lacking manpower.'

Now we know that the girls sent East can be used by the Organization as Claymore candidates. But what of the boys? What happens with them?

And just why were there so many awakened ones in the North at all, let alone under Isely's command?

Anyone else following me on this?
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Old 2008-11-05, 10:59   Link #115
Awakened
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Dean_the_Young View Post
Going back to the wider war implications, I was rereading the series and noticed something.

Remember when Raki got taken by the slave traders, and that was why he was up North in the first place? There was a note on the slave trade that was interesting. It went something like

'Everyone knows that all orphans are gathered up by the slave traders. The boys are sent North, and the girls are sent East, because those are the areas that are always lacking manpower.'

Now we know that the girls sent East can be used by the Organization as Claymore candidates. But what of the boys? What happens with them?

And just why were there so many awakened ones in the North at all, let alone under Isely's command?

Anyone else following me on this?
I speculated about that here. http://forums.animesuki.com/showthre...=56339&page=96
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Old 2008-11-05, 13:57   Link #116
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I just talked to a couple of friends about various theories about what will happen in order for a "Raciella" to come about.

First, how does it happen?

Theory 1-Renee awakens Raciella
Theory 2-Renee starts awakening of Raciella, but Claire stops it
Theory 3-Claire merges Raciella but stops it from awakening

Of course, the real question is how does Claire get into Riful's lair

Theory I-fights her way in
Theory II-comes willingly knowing she can use Rafaela/Luciella's remains against Riful
Theory III-Claire is captured by Riful

What happens to Rafaela/Luciella's remains?

Theory A-They merge and awaken
Theory B-They merge but don't awaken
Theory C-They don't merge and are destroyed

Currently the only plausible scenario to me is this: Claire is detected by Riful, reveals that she knows what Riful is up to and offers to help (with the purpose of using Rafaela/Luciella's merging against Riful), she then merges the two but stops them short of awakening, and then afterwards, Riful, furious, attacks the two of them.

Shortly thereafter she is wounded in a severe fight with the two of them while Renee, Cynthia & Yuma high-tail it out of there. Riful then either dies (along with Dauf) or leaves to ally herself with Isley. Well anyways, that's my theory, but I'm sure I'll be proved wrong somehow.

Then of course a friend of mine brought up the ultimate weird theory: a triple-merger & partial awakening. What he was referring to was a bit bizarre. He thinks that Claire will attempt to merge the two but be accidentally drawn into their merger, and will come out as the top consciousness with the memories of the other two fused into her own. It's bizarre, amazing, and might be a bit too cool, as it'd make Claire positively "god-like". What this would mean for her relationship with Raki & the Ghosts is hard to say, though it would be both amazing & perhaps the weirdest thing to happen in Claymore yet.

There is a saying; the truth is stranger than fiction (in this case the truth of the fiction). So what do you guys see happening? Which of these (or your own theory), do you see happening and what implications will it have for the Island War?
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Old 2008-11-06, 05:30   Link #117
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I think Raciella will awaken but Rafeala will have more control over her behaviour.
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Old 2008-11-06, 23:48   Link #118
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I actually hope Raciella doesn't awaken it would be really interesting to see the personality that emerges if it merges and doesn't awaken will it be Rafaela or Luciela or a blend of the two or even an AB and claymore sharing one body, it'll also be interesting to see how it will effect there power N1 + N1= uber claymore?
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Old 2008-11-07, 13:53   Link #119
revan5
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I actually hope Raciella doesn't awaken it would be really interesting to see the personality that emerges if it merges and doesn't awaken will it be Rafaela or Luciela or a blend of the two or even an AB and claymore sharing one body, it'll also be interesting to see how it will effect there power N1 + N1= uber claymore?
I get the feeling that since you are merging an non-awakened claymore's remains with that of an awakened being's we will see the emergence of a partially awakened claymore of immense strength.

The personality & memory of the new individual would be very interesting, considering it would be an individual resulting from a merger of two sisters.
But I think the most important question would be if this happened, does the new person, this partially awakened "Raciella", ally herself with the Ghosts? My guess is she would but it's impossible to say for sure.
What would happen in the Island War should that happen? Do Riful and Dauf die? Or do they instead ally themselves with Isley against the Ghosts and Organization? What does the Organization do against a partially awakened Claymore that is the result of the merging of two beings, both of Abyssal One strength?

I think that if the Ghosts do indeed pick up Raciella as an ally they will be able to threaten everyone else like never before. Who knows, perhaps it'll bring about a previously impossible alliance between the Abyssal Ones and the Organization against them.
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Old 2008-11-07, 16:56   Link #120
irvinethearcher
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Quote:
Originally Posted by xeratal View Post
Well there is something that I have always thought about. Do we really know anything about Alicia & Beth at all? I mean if you consider that for the 7 years the ghosts were training, Alicia and Beth were being gauged and perfected and trained the entire time, no telling how strong they are. Yagi might even throw in something crazy enough as a "perfected subconscious soul-link", where they could both fight while Alicia was awakened. They have just been in the back of my mind as being ridiculously strong when introduced, seeing as in 85 chapters they have been in maybe 2, and still have not been introduced. I think it is a building up. Also, would Galatea post-timeskip not be considered pretty damn #1 level, I mean wow. And considering that the Ghosts technically have 4 claymores of #1 strength.
Good point i think we didn't have seen all their powers. They will be perhaps even stronger than riful or isley by now with some new crazy abilities they're the main enemy of the ghost's now.
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