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View Poll Results: Toradora! - Episode 17 Rating
Perfect 10 35 27.34%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 45 35.16%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 27 21.09%
7 out of 10 : Good 13 10.16%
6 out of 10 : Average 7 5.47%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 1 0.78%
4 out of 10 : Poor 0 0%
3 out of 10 : Bad 0 0%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 0 0%
1 out of 10 : Painful 0 0%
Voters: 128. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2009-01-31, 17:40   Link #161
RogerOsk
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I think Guns and Roses is probably just a synonym for "troublesome or risky situation" which Ryuuji has now found himself in. Also a play on the Gansu words Yacchaan was going on about earlier.
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Old 2009-01-31, 18:11   Link #162
Eisdrache
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaisos Erranon View Post
-The side characters are actually getting some attention (well, everyone except poor Nanako) which you don't see too often... you get the feeling that they're actual people with their own dreams and identities, even if the focus isn't on them.

-That damn bird needs to be put down. Even if it is hilarious.
QFT

What this show needs is not more Ami but more Nanako <33

*runs away before he gets slapped by Master Chibi*

Someone mentioned how Aihara is an "odd factor thrown in the mix." I think thats probably the most accurate description for her at the moment. I wonder how her impact on the other characters, obviously Ryuuji/Taiga/Minorin/Kitamura, will be.
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Old 2009-01-31, 18:16   Link #163
Clarste
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Originally Posted by LeaD36 View Post
Kihara is no new girl by any means, she sticks around Ami almost all the time, and we´ve also seen her in the basketball incident in the early chapters/episdoes, and she gave off that "Kitamura <3" vibes all the time too. . ., she won´t have too much of an impact on the story either way
Yup, it's kinda weird how many people are taling about her like she's a new character or will suddenly become important after this (although I guess she might, I wouldn't know). Ever since episode 2, it's always been sort of clear that A) she exists and B) she's interested in 'Maruo.' Storytelling-wise, her primary purpose before now has been to both prove that Kitamura is pretty popular despite or perhaps because of his weirdness and to be a "generic female student" for reaction shots (especially for Ami for whom a significant portion of her character depends on reaction shots).

Anyway, Kihara's purpose in this episode was simply to make Ryuuji confront his own feelings. Nothing more and nothing less.
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Old 2009-01-31, 18:25   Link #164
Tri-ring
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There is no meaning to the reference of Gun and roses, it was just thrown in to make it rhyme.
Nothing more nothing less.
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Old 2009-01-31, 18:35   Link #165
Kaisos Erranon
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Originally Posted by Tri-ring View Post
There is no meaning to the reference of Gun and roses, it was just thrown in to make it rhyme.
Nothing more nothing less.
Uh. I think it has to be some kind of reference.

Otherwise that's just totally nuts.

But that's not surprising either.
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Old 2009-01-31, 18:38   Link #166
miroku2192
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaisos Erranon View Post
The fact that the phrase is in English makes me think it is indeed a reference to the band...



Maybe they're Big in Japan. Heh.

Seriously though, we'd probably need a Japanese person to actually answer that question.
roomate is japanese...apparently it's not famous.

Anyway, it's really painful to see so many people give a "bad rating" for this episode. It's like deja vu, like that episode where kitamura dyed his hair blonde and everyone got pissed and said the episode sucked...but by episode 16 everyone was like 0h damn that was GOOOOOOOD son! Yeah, come on, please refrain from b!tching about not seeing your favorite character long enough. This episode is probably going to set up a lot of g00d things, and by the end of this arc, everyone's gonna be all "oh damn that was really good".

i thought the episode was pretty good. Quite hectic for ryuuji
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Old 2009-01-31, 18:58   Link #167
Kaisos Erranon
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Originally Posted by miroku2192 View Post
This episode is probably going to set up a lot of g00d things, and by the end of this arc, everyone's gonna be all "oh damn that was really good".
This is what I keep saying.

The arc endings in Toradora are all really really strong.
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Old 2009-01-31, 19:14   Link #168
Vexx
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Originally Posted by vaberella View Post
You know what...I don't like either the song of the vid.
Spoiler for OP/ED:


I get the feeling that the last 9 eps including 17 may not hold the same fun the other eps did. Or that's the impression the new OP and ED have given me. ~sigh~
That's because Toradora is not a "comedy".... most romances in anime have their comedic moments, their dramatic moments, and sometimes tragic moments. ... you know, like *life* does....

Typically, comedy is used to get you attached to the characters... then the drama/tragedy ... and last if you're lucky there's a light at the end of some kind (though often bittersweet).

I rated this well ... lots of good drama and the kettle is starting to boil.
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Old 2009-01-31, 19:29   Link #169
HashiriyaR32
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Speaking of Guns N' Roses, I think it's just a conincidence that their "Chinese Democracy" album came out only a month before the setting of ep 17.
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Old 2009-01-31, 19:53   Link #170
typhonsentra
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I was going to make a joke about that actually.

"Maybe he's trying to say it's like Guns N' Roses in that this situation will take way too long to resolve and end unsatisfyingly."

Oh snap!
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Old 2009-01-31, 19:54   Link #171
Kaisos Erranon
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Bahahaha.

That's pretty funny.
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Old 2009-01-31, 20:53   Link #172
BetoJR
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Originally Posted by Sinestra View Post
A little of Ami this episode but not enough for my taste. With the couples only Christmas party approaching i was hoping she would be more aggressive toward Ryu making some sweet sweet drama. But if things keep going the way they are with Ryu and Minorin not talking this would be a good oppertunity for AMi to make her presence known even more
Oh, I'd think this episode made it quite clear she'll be making her presence known as regards Ryuji and Minorin, no? C'mon, people, she's obviously trying (in her own way) to set them up. How that conflicts with her own feelings, however, is another story completely.
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Old 2009-01-31, 21:04   Link #173
HayashiTakara
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I think Ami should stop fronting and go for Ryuji already... She's obviously bothered by Minori's sudden change in attitude
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Old 2009-01-31, 21:36   Link #174
DragoZERO
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Originally Posted by typhonsentra View Post
It's really annoying they'd throw out a nonsense phrase like that at the end of the episode. They act like it's something we should be able to understand, is Guns N' Roses even that popular in Japan? Are they known for something in particular over there?
Keep in mind how the fansubber's might have interpreted or just decided how to translate it in a way.

Quote:
Originally Posted by HayashiTakara View Post
I think Ami should stop fronting and go for Ryuji already... She's obviously bothered by Minori's sudden change in attitude
Ryuji x Ami FTW!
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Old 2009-01-31, 22:21   Link #175
Kaisos Erranon
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Originally Posted by DragoZERO View Post
Keep in mind how the fansubber's might have interpreted or just decided how to translate it in a way.
Again, "Guns N' Roses" is in clear English, so...
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Old 2009-01-31, 22:40   Link #176
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Originally Posted by Kaisos Erranon View Post
Again, "Guns N' Roses" is in clear English, so...
This implies that apart from his "OMG I LOVE CLEANING + HOUSEWORK!" complex, he loves music as well, although we get little about that other hobby of his. I think we all do remember him listening to music CDs while doing his homework in the first episode.
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Old 2009-01-31, 23:13   Link #177
apr
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Originally Posted by DragoZERO View Post
Keep in mind how the fansubber's might have interpreted or just decided how to translate it in a way.
This Guns N' Roses thing is actually getting pretty goddamn funny.

I think it goes like this:

1] Nerd idol Shoko-tan gets famous and her "Shoko-tan Lingo" spreads across the otaku world, with words like "giza" and "giganto".

2] Toradora's author decides it's a funny reflection of modern female speech and uses it in her fiction.

3] Yacchan is worried about her increasing age and the possibility of losing her job as a club hostess, so she talks to the younger girls and tries to adopt their way of speaking. The result is a mess of random hip words thrown into her sentences, particularly "giza" (very) and "gansu" (dialectal gozaimasu (desu)).

4] Her son Ryuuji twists the concept farther in an internal monologue where he's expressing his confusion at the current situation, with the line 「ギガント混乱するンガンゼンローゼス。」 (giganto konran suru'n ganzen-roozesu) meaning roughly "It's so massively confusing" where, in the fashion of his mother, "gansu" ("It's") has evolved into Guns N' Roses, or at least something sounding very similar.

5] An anime is made, based on the novels, and Ryuuji speaks the line on television.

6] Shoko-tan watches the show and expresses her surprise on her blog. She starts using the expression "giganto ganzen-roozesu" in her daily life, because it's amusing.

7] Eventually someone in her staff hears her say the phrase and asks "Oh, you like American bands?" and in response to Shoko-tan's confused look, this person kindly informs her that Guns N' Roses is an American rock band.

The circle is, I suppose, complete.
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Old 2009-02-01, 01:49   Link #178
physics223
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That's the most satisfying explanation if I ever saw one, apr.
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Old 2009-02-01, 03:13   Link #179
CaptGloval
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Yup, truly satisfying. Especially point no. 4. If the Japanese quote 「ギガント混乱するンガンゼンローゼス。」is in the novel or the script, then that settles it.
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Old 2009-02-01, 03:39   Link #180
nor4d
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I didn't expect to ANYONE go with the opininion that far. LOL! Especially with the Yacchan feelings and that Guns n Roses part, but still... it's very interesting to me too. Actually the ending of this ep saved that one.

I expected a lot after 16 and what happened? The change with Minorin is way to strange hehe What will she do now? What is her feelings?

And last... What Ryuuji will do NOW? I guess when i saw the first ep i was sure he will be with Taiga one day, and now... Hmmm
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