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Old 2009-02-06, 20:48   Link #101
james0246
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^Well, it is unknown where the various Shichibukai are stationed (well, not stationed, but where their stomping ground is, so to say), so it is not that surprising that Jinbei and Hancock have not met before (I doubt Hancock would have had a chance to meet Moria, and Blackbeard has only recently been appointed). (What I would be surpised about is if Jinbei had never heard of Hancock before.) Hell, this is a group where even two members attending an official meeting is considered a success. That being said, Hancock's main base of operations is outside of the regular travel lanes, so I guess it is true that it is potentially harder to contact Hancock compared to others.
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Old 2009-02-06, 20:58   Link #102
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Originally Posted by The Small One View Post
I don't really see the confusion over the powers.
Wasn't the distinction always pretty clear? A Paramecia just consists of the relevant stuff, while a Logia not only consists of something, but can also control and create more of it (endlessly). And that's exactly the situation we have here: He creates a dragon of poison, outside of his body.
Lets see:

Waxman: creates endless amounts of wax - Paramecia.
Darknessman: creates darkness, can't change its form, but still Logia.
Shadowman: have absolute control over shadows, control shadow shapes and still Paramecia.

Conclusion: we cannot decide until Magellan says so.

Hancock maintaining her composure and controlling the atmosphere just shows the strength of her Haki.
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Old 2009-02-06, 20:59   Link #103
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They are shichibukai, so they don't really go and steal by themselves anymore. What they did the past decade:

Crocodile: we all know.
Mihawk: wandering around.
Moria: hide in his ark and gather power.
Kuma: don't know, but not the type to go around fighting out of unnecessary.
Boa: robbing here and there.
Jimbei: A pirate who detests pirate. What do you expect?
Doflamingo: i guess this is the most notorious one. But he does not exactly dirty with his own hands either.

As I said, the past decade was a peaceful one. So the WG other than some stupid meeting never really had any reason to gather all of them, knowing ho "obedient" they are. That's also why i said Hancock has little experience in fighting the top. In fact Croc case might be the first time a Shichibukai lost to a newcomer like that.

Quote:
It was very interesting to note how Magellan simply purged his lust for Hancock when those prisoners were disrespecting him. He managed to free himself of her charms very easily, which tells us that anger is another way of not falling for her. Jimbei having never met Hancock was also a nice surprise. I wonder which other warlords have never met her before, considering how she despises men.
I need to stress this. It wasn't a REAL anger either.
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Old 2009-02-06, 21:48   Link #104
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Originally Posted by Slayerx View Post
doesn't matter if the dragon is outside his body as both logia's and parmecias could do such a thing... Kizaru for instance created a light sword, and croc made blades of sand
It may depend on the level of control the person has over the powers. But, in any case, creating such a thing outside of his body, and controlling it that well, even if it may just be paramecia, its level should be quite high. And, what Magellan created is closer to Enel's level of creation (more dynamic) compared to Mr. 3's (more static).
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Old 2009-02-06, 23:20   Link #105
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Quote:
Originally Posted by C.A. View Post
Lets see:

Waxman: creates endless amounts of wax - Paramecia.
Darknessman: creates darkness, can't change its form, but still Logia.
Shadowman: have absolute control over shadows, control shadow shapes and still Paramecia.

Conclusion: we cannot decide until Magellan says so.
Darknessman can't be used as an example because it is a special exception amognst logia's... Bleackbeard can use his powers to become 100% darkness just like any other elemental... however because of the nature of his power he can't use it like others; he is essentially a blackhole and as such can only attract things and must let them make contact with him

that's the difference between an elemental parmecia and a logia... Parmecia's can create and control an element, while logia can actually become the element... in the warden's case, it's hard to tell if he is covering himself in poison or actually turning into poison

Quote:
Originally Posted by Fipskuul View Post
It may depend on the level of control the person has over the powers. But, in any case, creating such a thing outside of his body, and controlling it that well, even if it may just be paramecia, its level should be quite high. And, what Magellan created is closer to Enel's level of creation (more dynamic) compared to Mr. 3's (more static).
Mr.3 is a poor example... the staticness of his power is due the nature of the power; the wax he creates his hot and thus melted but after it parts from him it quickly harders... in a place like lv 3 where all of his wax can't harden he actually could possible create something more dynamic if he tried... though grant it, if you remember mr.3's robot max thing, that was a wax form that did indeed move around.

If you recall, Ao kiji's ice logia is also a very static kind of element and has so far not been shown to be as dynamic
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Old 2009-02-06, 23:44   Link #106
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Slayerx View Post
Mr.3 is a poor example... the staticness of his power is due the nature of the power; the wax he creates his hot and thus melted but after it parts from him it quickly harders... in a place like lv 3 where all of his wax can't harden he actually could possible create something more dynamic if he tried... though grant it, if you remember mr.3's robot max thing, that was a wax form that did indeed move around.
I gave that example, because it was close to the liquid state of that poison. I think, with more power, the wax could have been used in a similar way. By creating a semi-fluid state that may look static from the outside, but actually being dynamic inside.

It is not like Magellan is creating something that is out of control, but, he was able to control it with his own ability. So, Mr. 3 might have the choice of liquidfying the wax by pumping more to it (what Magellan created is connected to him, so he can make it look alive), and letting go of the hardened ones along the way.

Quote:
If you recall, Ao kiji's ice logia is also a very static kind of element and has so far not been shown to be as dynamic
Aokiji has never been in a situation to use his ability like that. The nature of his elemental ability may make it harder to achieve that, but, by putting some of his self into that ice, he may be able to create an ice-dragon or something like that, that he can use as a medium to transfer his powers.
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Old 2009-02-07, 00:43   Link #107
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Chapter was wack.
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Old 2009-02-07, 04:52   Link #108
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Small One View Post
Mr. 3 is Paramecia??? That absolutely doesn't make sense.
And about Blackbeards power: He fits to my description, since he can create and control darkness outside of his body.


Actually I always thought, that THIS is the difference between a Paramecia and a Logia.
Luffy as Paramecia-Rubber-man just consists of it, but can neither control nor create it. If he met a Logia-Rubber-man, this person should be able to turn other things to rubber or create new one.

But if Mr.3 is indeed Paramecia, then the author messed up in his categorization IMHO.
not at all...
A logia is someone who can become the element itself and back to normal at will.
Mr.3 can not become wax, he can only create it and manipulate it.
If he were a logia, he would be able to turn himself into wax and use it to escape
This also applys to Califa... she was able to create and manpulate soap, but she could not turn into soap itself
The key difference between a Logia and a Parmecia is that a logia-user can actually turn into the element itself; both can create the element and manipulate it, but logia's are the only ones that can willingly turn their body into the element... and that's what gives logia the infamous "phasign" ability that makes them such tough opponents.

This is why Ace found it strange he was able to hurt Blackbeard; the trade mark ability of the logia is being able to break yourself down into elemental form and avoid all damage... Blackbeard however is the exception to this trademark. Like a Logia, he can become the element itself, but because of the nature of the darkness element, he is unable to let things pass through his body as nothing can pass through a blackhole

And their likely would not be anything like a rubber logia... Just as Zoan fruits are exclusive to different types of animals, Logia's are exclusive only to elements (by which i mean fit Oda's definition of elements) and i doubt rubber would be considered an element.

Parmecia's are a kind of "every thing else" catagory of devil fruits... if you can turn yourself into elemental form, it's a logia... if you can turn yourself into an animal, it's a Zoan... if what you have doesn't fall into either of those, then you are a Parmecia.
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Old 2009-02-07, 07:00   Link #109
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Back when we saw Kizaru fighting with Hawkins, he said: I don't know what ability you possess, but... you're "solid", huh... so you're probably not a "Logia".

Against a logia user, conventional weapons are mostly useless, unless you can figure out their weak point.

Regarding Hancock's petrification ability, some here seem to be concluding that unless the targets are going ga-ga over her, it won't work. However, that doesn't seem to be the case - in the first usage, Momonga was clearly not going ga-ga over her, but still "had" to stab himself to avoid it. This is something Hancock has seen before it seems, since she's not surprised.

Hancock has other abilities (we haven't even seen her use the snake), but the petrification one is pretty damn useful. It can even work on animals. However, it's utility depends on the situation - in a more serious situation (like a big battle) it would be less likely to be useful.
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Old 2009-02-07, 07:48   Link #110
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Perona can craete multiple negative ghost, and even make them look like herself - change sized while doing it.
Like Slayerx said Logia can become the element and become untochable (Ace is fire, Aokiji is Ice, Kizaru is light and Croc is sand).
Paramecia can have modified body - Luffy (made of rubber), Buggy (can separate his body), Alvida (is very smooth), Ablosm (can be invisable) and Mr.5 (his body can explode - even breath and booger)
- or they can create something outside of their bodies - Mr.3 (wax), Califa (soap - if she's wet), Perona (negative ghosts), Foxy (slowing beam).
Zoan can turn into animal form and betwen animal and human form (or weapon-animal). Chopper is the only one that has four more transformation - it's like 5 betwen forms.

I prefer to think that Chief is a paramencia user, because it would be easier to deafet him - what is the weak point of posion? Luffy would have to cover his hands in anitidote?
Besides in last movie where Franky were boarded before Chopper, there was a guy that used poison fruit and he was just shooting posion balls, and fast deafeted very fast.
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Old 2009-02-07, 14:46   Link #111
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Originally Posted by JINBEI View Post
Chapter was wack.
Most truthful post in the thread and best avatar!

Nothing really happened in this chap. Luffy didn't even move on...
Maybe next week guys.
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Old 2009-02-07, 14:56   Link #112
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Originally Posted by Wolcik View Post
Perona can craete multiple negative ghost, and even make them look like herself - change sized while doing it.
Like Slayerx said Logia can become the element and become untochable (Ace is fire, Aokiji is Ice, Kizaru is light and Croc is sand).
Paramecia can have modified body - Luffy (made of rubber), Buggy (can separate his body), Alvida (is very smooth), Ablosm (can be invisable) and Mr.5 (his body can explode - even breath and booger)
- or they can create something outside of their bodies - Mr.3 (wax), Califa (soap - if she's wet), Perona (negative ghosts), Foxy (slowing beam).
Zoan can turn into animal form and betwen animal and human form (or weapon-animal). Chopper is the only one that has four more transformation - it's like 5 betwen forms.

I prefer to think that Chief is a paramencia user, because it would be easier to deafet him - what is the weak point of posion? Luffy would have to cover his hands in anitidote?
Besides in last movie where Franky were boarded before Chopper, there was a guy that used poison fruit and he was just shooting posion balls, and fast deafeted very fast.
Both the chief (Magellan) and the other guy (Mushuul) have fruits that both specialize in poison and both fruits are paramecia. The difference is this:

Magellan- Doku Doku no Mi (Doku- japanese for poison)
Mushuul- Noko Noko no Mi (Noko- japanese for mushroom; in this case the poisonous type of mushroom)
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Old 2009-02-07, 15:31   Link #113
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Well it seems that Jinbei is really sticking to the government in this protest of his, I wonder if the WG will just get tired of his insubordination and just replace him already *cough*Captain Kidd*cough**
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Old 2009-02-07, 16:49   Link #114
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Originally Posted by The Phenomenol View Post
Most truthful post in the thread and best avatar!

Nothing really happened in this chap. Luffy didn't even move on...
Maybe next week guys.
Nah. The giant Koala made it good. :]

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Well it seems that Jinbei is really sticking to the government in this protest of his, I wonder if the WG will just get tired of his insubordination and just replace him already *cough*Captain Kidd*cough**
Uhh rofl? Kidd is like a nobody still.
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Old 2009-02-07, 16:59   Link #115
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Well a bunch of interesting things in this chapter for me were Magellan,BonClay's return and surprisingly...the den den mushi surveillance camera

Quote:
It was very interesting to note how Magellan simply purged his lust for Hancock when those prisoners were disrespecting him. He managed to free himself of her charms very easily, which tells us that anger is another way of not falling for her.
This.I also enjoyed how he suddenly changed mood from goofy warden towards scary monster guy in a second.if you ask me he is goofing around just because Hancock is on his side and no sign of trouble yet, he would instantly get out of her charm if he realizes that Hancock is playing double.
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Old 2009-02-07, 17:32   Link #116
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Originally Posted by Freya View Post
Nah. The giant Koala made it good. :].
Hahahaha, The Koala was good.
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Old 2009-02-07, 18:06   Link #117
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Uhh rofl? Kidd is like a nobody still.
Blackbeard was a nobody and yet he got into the shichibukai. And Kidd is definitely not a nobody. The guy has a 315 million bounty for crying out loud, which tells us that he certainly got the World Government's attention. He has quite the fearsome reputation indeed after killing all of those innocent people and those that laughed at his dreams. In short, he has the prerequisites needed to become a warlord.
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Old 2009-02-07, 19:12   Link #118
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[B]Blackbeard was a nobody and yet he got into the shichibukai.
when Black monstered Fire fist Ace he became more then a somebody, and thats what paid the way into the Shichibukai.
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Old 2009-02-07, 19:32   Link #119
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Actually, I believe that ANY of the Supernovas (with the exception ofLuffy and Zoro,) have the potential to become a Shichibukai. They're all certainly infamous enough, plus they've got some unique abilities. The only disadvantage that they have is the fact that they're still rookies.... the current Shichibukai are all pirates who have many years' worth of experience.



Still, seeing how Jinbei's position is currently teetering on the edge, we may see a Supernova taking his place in the near future.....
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Old 2009-02-07, 20:17   Link #120
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^It would definetly be a sure fire way of giving the fans their desired Kidd vs. Luffy match (or which ever Supernove the fans wish to fight Luffy ).
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