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View Poll Results: Clannad - Episode 22 Rating
Perfect 10 211 60.81%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 49 14.12%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 23 6.63%
7 out of 10 : Good 20 5.76%
6 out of 10 : Average 19 5.48%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 3 0.86%
4 out of 10 : Poor 3 0.86%
3 out of 10 : Bad 2 0.58%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 3 0.86%
1 out of 10 : Painful 14 4.03%
Voters: 347. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2009-03-13, 14:48   Link #241
Kaioshin Sama
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sheba View Post
Jun Maeda is deeply sorry you have kept your disbelief on.
I'm deeply sorry he expected me to believe in miracles in order to get the maximum enjoyment out of his stories ending and that I found his other ending a lot less problematic.


Quote:
Just like how Gundam is a joke when it comes to portray war, its grit, blood, guts and horror when compared to Platoon, Taegukgi or series like Band of Brothers.
Basically. Yes.

Quote:
I did not demand a 10/10. But when you see people being irked at you, ask yourself if it is not a fair deal when you get offended when others bash your shows. Whatever the reasons are.
I'm giving Clannad a much lighter/fairer deal then any so called basher would ever give one of my other favourite shows (as I've pointed out) so I don't see how this idea works.

Quote:
Originally Posted by dgreater1 View Post

FACT: Anything can go wrong in a seemingly flawless happy life.
I remember when Code Geass left off on the same note. It got heavily scrutinized for it just the same. Also if you must know I didn't like the BAD END any better either as to me it felt like just another reason to make people feel extreme emotion and not much else. My main issue with Clannad as I think I mentioned is that it seems to sink or float by the viewer based on it's ability to make said viewer feel extreme emotion in much the same way Code Geass sank or float on it's ability to get people into the cliffhanger/plot twist nature of it's story. In fact I found it just as problematic albeit for different reasons that are related to why I hope something doesn't happen in the show I'm going to watch on Saturday.
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Old 2009-03-13, 14:49   Link #242
Joachim
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaioshin Sama View Post

I'll never understand what makes this ending so okay and so amazingly perfect in so many other people's eyes compared to other thematically convoluted endings. I'm going to just have to chalk it up to it being KeyAni again and the usual insta-praise and cries of "masterpiece" that go with this reality, because if this were any other story by any other companies I could not forsee this kind of ending escaping without at least some scorn.
there you go.. troll bait

You never understand? expect people to never understand you either for bashing, accept it.
LOL your "keyani" hate still there i see

whats wrong with people actually do enjoy key stories or kyoani adaptation anyway? what i saw in your post is just "i can't stand people loving and defending keyani anime which in my opinion "sucks" or average"

yes you wont accept this opinion of mine, but whatever seriously

and no i won't understand any of your comments either, capiche?
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Old 2009-03-13, 14:51   Link #243
Jimmy C
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaisos Erranon View Post
I wouldn't be surprised if they WERE gay. Sugisaka DID give out those vibes back in the first season...
Although it'll never be confirmed either way, there's the ED. Sugisaka and Rie are the only pair holding hands. Not even the three married couples, the Furukawas, the Yoshinos and the Okazakis, are. Why them?
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Old 2009-03-13, 15:00   Link #244
Kaioshin Sama
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joachim View Post
there you go.. troll bait

You never understand? expect people to never understand you either for bashing, accept it.
LOL your "keyani" hate still there i see
Okay, first of all if I were bashing it probably would have resulted in my number ticker up there being something more like a 2 and you would definitely without a doubt know it, I'm merely expressing disappointment in a story that I actually did have some higher hopes for after episode 18. Now it's just going to have to settle for the "good" label. And seriously you can't even begin to comprehend what real bashing looks like if you think that I'm bashing.

Quote:
whats wrong with people actually do enjoy key stories or kyoani adaptation anyway? what i saw in your post is just "i can't stand people loving and defending keyani anime which in my opinion "sucks" or average"
It's kind of funny how my "can't understand" became "can't stand" in your sentence, but if you must know I was referring to how I can't understand how people can defend this as a flawless ending, not that I can't understand how people can enjoy it, it is after all the very defintion of a feel good ending. If it was above average for most people I could just chalk it up to a difference in review scales between me and the others, but perfect, no I'm sorry I can't understand that.
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Old 2009-03-13, 15:09   Link #245
alu546
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiberium Wolf View Post
I can't believe it Fuuko ninja'd 1/3 of the ep.

Anyway if ppl wanted realism then don't go watch anime. You know the laws of anime so you know the drill.
You don't like the ending and don't like Maeda writing. Oh well... Lot of ppl like it and the story is sellable so it's considered good. What can't not be sold will always be forgotten.

BTW, can anyone tell the song name they used at mid ep before Fuuko appearance?
No, no , you got it wrong, we werent wanting a realistic ending, we wanted an ending that made sense given the context of the story presented in the anime. I point to the clannad movie as an example that the crap couldve been done.

Based on what is presented in the ANIME, and the amount of jargon that got thrown at us(in comparison to the other times we had it done) then yes, I DO have a problem with how its written. Because its as if the makers decided that they wanted a better, happier ending than the flow of the story wouldve given them , and made a miracle happen so it would occur. If they wanted a happy ending, they shouldve just changed the flow of the story.

Air : lotsa fantasy elements, a good story. The fantasy aspects were presented throughout the series so you werent "............." when something impossible in real life occured. Key knows how to write this stuff too.

But thats not me flaming, thats me voicing a legitimate complaint.
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Old 2009-03-13, 15:09   Link #246
Vegard Aune
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Originally Posted by Sheba View Post
Jun Maeda is deeply sorry you have kept your disbelief on.
Although I loved the ending, I'd like to point out that Jun Maeda apparently didn't want to end the story like this. I heard in another thread here that he apparently finds these kind of "miracle-endings" to be cheap and unrealistic...
...Though the way I interpret that makes me want to ask: Did he seriously WANT to end the story with Ushio dying? Because if you ask me, that would make this entire story feel COMPLETELY pointless.
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Old 2009-03-13, 15:13   Link #247
Jimmy C
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Given how I heard he ended Tomoyo After, I think that's exactly how he would have done it if he had complete creative freedom writing Clannad.
It's not my place to say whether that's a good or bad thing.
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Old 2009-03-13, 15:13   Link #248
Nosauz
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Originally Posted by alu546 View Post
No, no , you got it wrong, we werent wanting a realistic ending, we wanted an ending that made sense given the context of the story presented in the anime. I point to the clannad movie as an example that the crap couldve been done.

Based on what is presented in the ANIME, and the amount of jargon that got thrown at us(in comparison to the other times we had it done) then yes, I DO have a problem with how its written. Because its as if the makers decided that they wanted a better, happier ending than the flow of the story wouldve given them , and made a miracle happen so it would occur.

Air : lotsa fantasy elements, a good story. The fantasy aspects were presented throughout the series so you werent "............." when something impossible in real life occured. Key knows how to write this stuff too.

But thats not me flaming, thats me voicing a legitimate complaint.
your point is valid if you ignore all the fantasy that was in the series and then say the ending came out of left field. Its a 4 cour show, lots of the themes and fantasy were hased in small chuncks but they were clearly visable. That or we just watched two different shows.
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Old 2009-03-13, 15:16   Link #249
Kaioshin Sama
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vegard Aune View Post
Although I loved the ending, I'd like to point out that Jun Maeda apparently didn't want to end the story like this. I heard in another thread here that he apparently finds these kind of "miracle-endings" to be cheap and unrealistic...
...Though the way I interpret that makes me want to ask: Did he seriously WANT to end the story with Ushio dying? Because if you ask me, that would make this entire story feel COMPLETELY pointless.
Does this claim have a source or is it just a rumour?
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Old 2009-03-13, 15:21   Link #250
Sheba
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vegard Aune View Post
Did he seriously WANT to end the story with Ushio dying? Because if you ask me, that would make this entire story feel COMPLETELY pointless.
Yes. There are tragedy and POINTLESS tragedy. Then there are the overall tone of the story. As much the latter parts of Clannad was filled with tragedy. The show was overall rooted in optimistim and idealism.
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Old 2009-03-13, 15:26   Link #251
Vegard Aune
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaioshin Sama View Post
Does this claim have a source or is it just a rumour?
Eh, ask the guy who said it in the first place: http://forums.animesuki.com/showpost...9&postcount=26 (Warning: Discussion contains major spoilers for Tomoyo After)
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Old 2009-03-13, 15:29   Link #252
Kaioshin Sama
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sheba View Post
Yes. There are tragedy and POINTLESS tragedy. Then there are the overall tone of the story. As much the latter parts of Clannad was filled with tragedy. The show was overall rooted in optimistim and idealism.
Clannad was filled with virtuous characters who were brought down by a character flaw that was indistinguishable from that which we admire them for in the first place?
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Old 2009-03-13, 15:31   Link #253
alu546
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nosauz View Post
your point is valid if you ignore all the fantasy that was in the series and then say the ending came out of left field. Its a 4 cour show, lots of the themes and fantasy were hased in small chuncks but they were clearly visable. That or we just watched two different shows.
You said it yourself, the fantasy elements were in small chunks.

Now we have a large chunk based fantasy ending, THAT came out of left field.

That is the core point, so please dont associate me with someone who wanted an extremely realistic ending, but its not as if i wanted to watch mood swings in an anime either.

Oh and to the other poster: I dont see how an episode with Ushio's death wouldve made a large point unless alot to the intended story occured afterwards. But I wish to point out the possibility that Ushio was made to die knowing he'd end up bringing her back, and that he wouldnt have killed her in the first place if he had full authority over the written works.
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Old 2009-03-13, 15:32   Link #254
FireChick
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I have a question. What is the name of the song that played during the scenes with the girl and the little robot?
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Old 2009-03-13, 15:33   Link #255
Sheba
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Originally Posted by Kaioshin Sama View Post
Clannad was filled with virtuous characters who were brought down by a character flaw that was indistinguishable from that which we admire them for in the first place?

You are deliberately baiting, aren't you?
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Old 2009-03-13, 15:34   Link #256
Vegard Aune
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Originally Posted by alu546 View Post
Oh and to the other poster: I dont see how an episode with Ushio's death wouldve made a large point unless alot to the intended story occured afterwards. But I wish to point out the possibility that Ushio was made to die knowing he'd end up bringing her back, and that he wouldnt have killed her in the first place if he had full authority over the written works.
Quite possible. I like to think that, if Jun Maeda had gotten his way, the story would have ended with Tomoya finally coming on terms with Nagisa's death, forgiving his father and finally starting to treat Ushio like his own daughter. (Which would actually be a pretty excellent ending, I'd say.) And if not... then the guy is just evil.

Quote:
Originally Posted by FireChick View Post
I have a question. What is the name of the song that played during the scenes with the girl and the little robot?
It's called "Shoujo no Gensou", or "The Girl's Fantasy".
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Old 2009-03-13, 15:38   Link #257
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Nice story, nice ending. Well done Kyoto Animation!

Spoiler:
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Old 2009-03-13, 15:42   Link #258
SageGaiGar
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vegard Aune View Post
Quite possible. I like to think that, if Jun Maeda had gotten his way, the story would have ended with Tomoya finally coming on terms with Nagisa's death, forgiving his father and finally starting to treat Ushio like his own daughter. (Which would actually be a pretty excellent ending, I'd say.) And if not... then the guy is just evil.


It's called "Shoujo no Gensou", or "The Girl's Fantasy".
Yeah, they all die would've just been over the top "I am going to ruin all your hopes and dreams" kind of misery.
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Old 2009-03-13, 15:43   Link #259
cbatty
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Originally Posted by MeoTwister5 View Post
After my finals end I'm gonna do something I probably shouldn't do.

Watch all episodes of both seasons in succession.
LOL - I am doing that right now with my wife. She is a complete Clannad newbie so it will be interesting if the emotions will be the same for her as they were for me.

Eh - it will be interesting if the emotions will be the same for me as they were when I watched it the first time.
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Old 2009-03-13, 15:45   Link #260
SnackPacs
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Just.. perfect. I can't say anymore.

Absolutely perfect ending.

Both Nagisa and Tomoya look beautiful together and seeing that... Finally seeing them have their family...

Seeing the truth realized in the illusionary world, finally getting answers about that.

It's just... so satisfying.

Thank you, Kyoto Animation, Key, Kadokawa and whatnot... Such a beautiful production, beginning to end. Minor snags on progress, it was an amazing series.

I cried quite a bit though. But it was worth it. The one of maybe 5 times in the past few months I've been fine with having to re-clean my broken glasses.

11 out of 10 from me.

And the last quarter of the episode was fairly pleasant to recover from everything else.

*still watching* OMG, IT'S THE GIRL FROM THE OTHER WORLD?! Wait no, it's Ushio, but... It seems Fuuko can see the other girl.

Whee! Extra episode! Covering pre-beginning of clannad I presume?

Further question, was the last quarter of the episode original Kyo Ani content? Or was it in After Story originally?
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