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Old 2012-05-06, 22:57   Link #2301
Ithekro
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Probably, yet that would be the chain of command.

Plus the Yacht club probably has at least some proceedures from their own voyages, and since Marika, Chiaki, and the Princesss are basically outside those procedures (Marika is usually off on being Captain of her own ship...the Princesses are usually tagging along with Marika, and Chiaki is still the transfere student...plus she's sometimes of on her own ship), they should be "fine" without Marika and company for a few minutes. Even in combat.

As I said, there isn't a whole lot Marika can do at that point that isn't being done already, except come up with a plan of action, and that is what she was doing.
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Old 2012-05-06, 23:33   Link #2302
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The battle scens were kinda lousy this time, but great episode and Chiaki was just awesome as always.

Are we ever going to see the Barbalosa in action? I want to see Chiaki's father (a real pirate through my eyes) in action.
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Old 2012-05-07, 01:24   Link #2303
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Originally Posted by Haak View Post
Female empowerment is great and all but do they always have to do it by putting down the other gender? It's just a real killjoy and I thought they were doing pretty well before this episode (Well there were undertones of it in the previous episode but that was nothing compared to this.)
...oh. That explains it. Okada Mari was doing an uncredited writer gig this episode. Yes I'm BSing, just in case some joker negged me thinking I was serious.

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Old 2012-05-07, 01:56   Link #2304
Utsuro no Hako
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Originally Posted by mangamuscle View Post
The path you are pointing is towards micro-management, where every tinsy-bitsy detail of Marika's subordinates should be scrutinized because they MAY fail (due to the pressure, lack of experience, lack of knowledge, etc.). I like more Marika's attitude, she trust her crew for five minutes to think of a new strategy, Chiaki could have been left behind to baby-sit the crew, but she might have had the insight to solve the situation at the 5 minute conference, which one was more important? Of course errors can happen, even on the most quiet night on non enemy ridden waters, look at the Titanic, but micromanagemente is not IMO the solution.
Micromanagement would be Marika ordering Lynn and the helmsman every step of the way. Leaving someone more experienced on the bridge in case the space battle proves more than a bunch of teenagers can handle, not so much.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ithekro View Post
After Marika, due to this being the Yacht Club, technically Lynn (as club president) is next in command. Chaiki is sort of the observer from the other ship (she's a Captain's daughter, but aside from knowledge she has less "experiance" than Marika). Chiaki is a member of the club that is also a transfere student, thus basically not ranked. The Princesss are stowaways and very junior members as they are in middle school. And Jenny is the client.

And Lynn was on the bridge.
Lynn had her hands full hacking the enemy, protecting the Bentenmaru's systems, and configuring the decoys. And the yacht club hierarchy went out the window the moment they stepped onto Marika's ship as its temporary crew. Chiaki's clearly the person with the most experience at piracy and should've been the person to remain on the bridge while Marika had her conference.
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Old 2012-05-07, 02:35   Link #2305
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They should have held the strategy meeting before engaging the Dolittle fleet. They had some time after the FTL jump and before the Jabberwocky caught up on them. With a simple rearranging of the events this episode would have flown much better.

Marika shouldn't leave the bridge under an attack. This is not Starfleet protocol, it's just common sense! What if the Jabberwocky got a clean hit on the Bentenmaru? What if they lost an engine? What if they were surrounded?
In a spaceship the captain must make quick decisions. Sometimes the only choice is to surrender, or to bargain, or to flee with another FTL jump. Marika shouldn't trust these decisions on anyone else, unless incapacitated for some reason.
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Old 2012-05-07, 04:51   Link #2306
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Lynn was busy. She had her hands full running the EW battle against the fleet. It would have been a bit much to ask her to handle tactics as well.
I refer you to another tactical video:



When your down to the last man, you're the captain, tactical officer and the conn. (Epic benchtop leap not necessary.)

I guess multitasking's one of a hacker's talents.
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Old 2012-05-07, 05:22   Link #2307
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Some more random bits from the novel vol 3.

Spoiler:
So yeah, the anime team overblown everything and created things that are not from the novel. I will probably recheck again if I don't have anything better to do
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Last edited by justpassingby; 2012-05-07 at 10:52. Reason: lloyd
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Old 2012-05-07, 06:19   Link #2308
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Originally Posted by Gohan78 View Post
Battle stuff
There seemed to be no time skip after the FTL overdrive. They bantered for a tiny bit before Marika decided a plan was needed. Just as she finished saying that, the Dolittle fleet caught the Bentenmaru.

Random firing is indeed strange. The Dolittle fleet was unable to get a precise fix (and firing lock) on Bentenmaru due to Lynn's electronic warfare. Robert then decides to use his advantage in numbers to surround the approximate location of Bentenmaru, and a precise fix is obtained. The second in command(?) then calls for fires to concentrate on the engines to stop the Bentenmaru, and prepare for docking.
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Old 2012-05-07, 06:34   Link #2309
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Mouretsu Uchuu Kaizoku Akiman Design Works (Temporary title) [amazon]
On sale July 4th.
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Old 2012-05-07, 07:40   Link #2310
encia
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Utsuro no Hako View Post
Spoiler:
Hardware alone doesn't make a ship. There's very little need to micro-manage evasive type maneuvers with active EW i.e. let the pilot do her job.

On engineering side, Yayoi has practical exprience with her family's criuser twin reactors and with similar stability issues.

We are not dealing normal teenagers i.e. all members of this yacht club has thier own non-standard backgrounds.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kyuu View Post
Not to roll around on Star Trek too much -- where it is protocol for the Captain to announce leaving the bridge, and the highest ranking officer left on the bridge assumes command.

This ain't Star Trek.

Nevertheless. In a situation like that, someone definitely had to be left in command to deal with the rapidly changing situation. If anything, Marika didn't need to be part of that strategy conference at all. Chiaki coulda handled it on her own just fine (or vice-versa as commented already).
Well, Bentenmaru has protective energy shields i.e. extra insurance for actual hits.

Last edited by encia; 2012-05-07 at 07:55.
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Old 2012-05-07, 10:24   Link #2311
Ithekro
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Quote:
Originally Posted by justpassingby View Post
Some more random bits from the novel vol 3.

Spoiler:
So yeah, the anime team overblown everything and created things that are not from the novel. I will probably recheck again if I don't have anything better to do
Aren't there recent civil ordnances so that they couldn't realistically get away with showing things like that in their anime? Well and keep the tone of the previous episodes I mean.
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Old 2012-05-07, 10:33   Link #2312
mangamuscle
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Originally Posted by Ithekro View Post
Aren't there recent civil ordnances so that they couldn't realistically get away with showing things like that in their anime? Well and keep the tone of the previous episodes I mean.
It is a known fact that even before the new anti-anime tokyo law it was forbiden to show teenagers drunk on anime (If I remember correctly on the Haruhi LN they got drunk when visiting mistery island but that was changed on the anime). Which is kind of harsh since american movies show drunk teenagers quite often.
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Old 2012-05-07, 10:43   Link #2313
Utsuro no Hako
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Originally Posted by encia View Post
Hardware alone doesn't make a ship. There's very little need to micro-manage evasive type maneuvers with active EW i.e. let the pilot do her job.
Again, you're assuming the situation remains constant and the enemy doesn't do something that requires more than evasive maneuvers. Battles are dynamic and things could change in a second. Marika's just lucky Roger waited until she returned to the bridge before he altered his tactics.

Quote:
On engineering side, Yayoi has practical exprience with her family's criuser twin reactors and with similar stability issues.

We are not dealing normal teenagers i.e. all members of this yacht club has thier own non-standard backgrounds.
Yes, we're dealing with scions of wealthy families who've had previous experience with yachts. That's not the same as being battle-hardened sailors.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ithekro View Post
Aren't there recent civil ordnances so that they couldn't realistically get away with showing things like that in their anime? Well and keep the tone of the previous episodes I mean.
It's not even that recent. The first season of Haruhi Suzumiya had to cut a scene where the SOS Brigade got drunk on a trip.
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Old 2012-05-07, 11:01   Link #2314
mangamuscle
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Originally Posted by Utsuro no Hako View Post
Again, you're assuming the situation remains constant and the enemy doesn't do something that requires more than evasive maneuvers.
You are assuming that having Marika on the bridge is some kind of magical safety device against anything that might happen and that incompetence is rampant.

Quote:
Yes, we're dealing with scions of wealthy families who've had previous experience with yachts. That's not the same as being battle-hardened sailors.
If you can't suck it up for five minutes then you never were prepared for sailing >_<
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Old 2012-05-07, 11:11   Link #2315
Ithekro
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I meant aside from the drinking. The orgy in particular.

If you can't show those thing, then you must come up with something else. And if you want to make Marika and the others look cool...and guess breaking up revolutionaries, and rooting out criminal activity works.


As for the battle. Anime logic. I've seen instances were a ship's crew basically stops fighting, or even paying attention to what is going on around them for these sorts of talks. Happened in Space Battleship Yamato all the time. Even to the point that the Acting Captain had to leave the bridge to get advice from the wounded Captain...while the ship is under constant attack from all sides. Or more or less everyone has a little pow-pow in the bridge, not really minding their stations, while under attack, to discuss how to defeat the enemy. And you can tell they are still under attack as you can hear explosions going on, and sometimes the ship rattles. They even all left the bridge one time to plot out how to destroy the enemy fleet...while hidden behind and asteroid, while under fire from a big fleet...that had destroyed a previous asteroid they had been hidding behind. These scenes are usually about as long as Marika's planning scene. And the enemy's aim just about the same as those that tend to fire on Yamato.

Sort of happens in Star Trek from time to time. Those instances where is seems like the battle happens to gets a lull while the crew discuss what to do about the major problem they are having, or to talk to the Admiral or whatever over subspace. Yet they really didn't move the ship out of the battlefield. Sometimes you can tell they are still under fire. Usually they don't leave the bridge in Star Trek...unless they have someone unfriendly onboard that the Captain thinks only he can deal with (Kirk era thing).
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Old 2012-05-07, 11:37   Link #2316
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The Glorious Coolph....was there a more ridiculous ship name. And am I seeing correctly that he's 28?
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Old 2012-05-07, 12:01   Link #2317
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Look, at the end of the day, there wasn't much that Marika could have done on the bridge.

Pilot the ship? With the amount of bracketing fire they were getting, I doubt she could have done better than Ai.

Organise EW? Yeah, Lynn has that handled.

Engines? She doesn't know jack shit about engines.

The captain's job is not to be an expert in all things; the captain's job is to lead, manage the crew, and above all else, plan. The captain will have a single specialist track (usually tactical, like Marika, though a friend of my family became an ASW frigate skipper from the Communications track) and relies on the department heads to provide specialist advice, before making the big picture decision.

In this case, no matter whether she stayed on the bridge or not, the tactical situation would not have changed in the near future, and Marika needs to come up with a course of action now. So she makes the call to pull her command team off the bridge to plan, after leaving instructions to her crew.

It's a gamble, and frankly it's one she would have preffered not to make, but sometimes you gotta try and pick the choice which is the least worse and try your best.
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Old 2012-05-07, 12:38   Link #2318
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Originally Posted by Wild Goose View Post
The captain's job is not to be an expert in all things; the captain's job is to lead, manage the crew, and above all else, plan. The captain will have a single specialist track (usually tactical, like Marika, though a friend of my family became an ASW frigate skipper from the Communications track) and relies on the department heads to provide specialist advice, before making the big picture decision.

In this case, no matter whether she stayed on the bridge or not, the tactical situation would not have changed in the near future, and Marika needs to come up with a course of action now. So she makes the call to pull her command team off the bridge to plan, after leaving instructions to her crew.
Then the alternative would be for Chiaki to take command of the ship while Marika does the critical planning stages.



Quote:
Originally Posted by encia
Well, Bentenmaru has protective energy shields i.e. extra insurance for actual hits.
Um. When they were flying through that dust-filled nebula in the Serenity Arc -- those shields weren't activated. The Bentenmaru was being pummeled by nebula material.

So, I don't see much evidence of energy shield usage in this sci-fi series. Unless, I have to go back and take a look at the military vessels. But right now, I don't remember any command ordering the activation of shields.
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Old 2012-05-07, 12:51   Link #2319
mangamuscle
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Then the alternative would be for Chiaki to take command of the ship while Marika does the critical planning stages.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Ithekro View Post
After Marika, due to this being the Yacht Club, technically Lynn (as club president) is next in command. Chaiki is sort of the observer from the other ship (she's a Captain's daughter, but aside from knowledge she has less "experiance" than Marika). Chiaki is a member of the club that is also a transfere student, thus basically not ranked. The Princesss are stowaways and very junior members as they are in middle school. And Jenny is the client.

And Lynn was on the bridge.
Quote:
Um. When they were flying through that dust-filled nebula in the Serenity Arc -- those shields weren't activated. The Bentenmaru was being pummeled by nebula material.

So, I don't see much evidence of energy shield usage in this sci-fi series. Unless, I have to go back and take a look at the military vessels. But right now, I don't remember any command ordering the activation of shields.
I see clear evidence of energy deflecting shield on the opening sequence :-p Maybe it was not activated while inside the nebula because the constant hits would have drained their fuel reserves rapidly and those "hits" did not represented a clear and present danger to the hull integrity.
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Old 2012-05-07, 12:52   Link #2320
Wild Goose
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Then the alternative would be for Chiaki to take command of the ship while Marika does the critical planning stages.

Under normal circumstances i'd agree, though it does seem as though she wanted Chiaki's input, being the closest thing to an expert specialist.
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