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Old 2009-05-01, 19:55   Link #61
kakakka
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Why don't you get mad with other people?
A lot of people had made rants before at other subjects -_-
Since you take this one too personally (About Hitsugaya), I find it funny to response. There's your answer. Oh well, might have feed something here...
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Old 2009-05-01, 19:59   Link #62
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Chill lol, wait til the conclusion of the battle or the release of the chapter, before getting mad, who knows maybe Soi Fon will be dead at the end =)
You made me feel so much better -_-

Anyway it's not like I have dropped Bleach already or something.
Just saying my thoughts.

I know that situation might change but I really doubt that things will go positively for Espada(especially Halibel) and negatively towards Hitsugaya


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Originally Posted by kakakka View Post
Since you take this one too personally (About Hitsugaya), I find it funny to response. There's your answer. Oh well, might have feed something here...
It is the only character in the whole shows history that I really hate.
I don't even hate bad guys who kill off my fave characters -_-
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Old 2009-05-01, 20:45   Link #63
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Kubo killing Hitsuguya will never happen because of one simple fact
He is the most popular character and although this sounds dumb when everytime Manga author kills a favorite character in Manga or anime there is an uproar and Hitsuguya has a steady base of japanes girl's support and guess what? they buy more stuff compared to man.
and look at what happened when Gundam killed shaa ha one girl killed her self for that and the animator had to say he was MIA not dead.
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Old 2009-05-01, 20:45   Link #64
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Originally Posted by junte86 View Post
Kubo killing Hitsuguya will never happen because of one simple fact
He is the most popular character and although this sounds dumb when everytime Manga author kills a favorite character in Manga or anime there is an uproar and Hitsuguya has a steady base of japanes girl's support and guess what? they buy more stuff compared to man.
and look at what happened when Gundam killed shaa ha one girl killed her self for that and the animator had to say he was MIA not dead.
that is seriously fucked up.
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Old 2009-05-01, 20:50   Link #65
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Well beleave me there are some crazy fans in Japan and I dont want to talk about what they do well good example is look at hitman reborn their fan base... on offense but just think that that is the kind of support our Hitsuguya gets and belieave me... this is a strong protection against anything Kubo well might kill him but ha in my opinion not gonna happen

just look at Naruto where some people claim Kishimoto kills many characters well but not the popular one and I am suprised with the recent development but well its not confirmed yet and the father meeting son stuff kind of made me think well he migth return.., and anyway there is sasuke..
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Old 2009-05-01, 20:52   Link #66
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Originally Posted by junte86 View Post
Kubo killing Hitsuguya will never happen because of one simple fact
He is the most popular character and although this sounds dumb when everytime Manga author kills a favorite character in Manga or anime there is an uproar and Hitsuguya has a steady base of japanes girl's support and guess what? they buy more stuff compared to man.
and look at what happened when Gundam killed shaa ha one girl killed her self for that and the animator had to say he was MIA not dead.
I didn't expect him to die but stand there without a scratch?

It's not authors problem that those people are idiots. You can't please veryone. He could have killed someone else, and that character's fan would also kill himself/herself.

People like this should be kept far away from TV,books and internet, there is nothing else to say to it expect go to hospital and have some check up or something
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Old 2009-05-01, 20:54   Link #67
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Originally Posted by junte86 View Post
just look at Naruto where some people claim Kishimoto kills many characters well but not the popular one and I am suprised with the recent development but well its not confirmed yet and the father meeting son stuff kind of made me think well he migth return.., and anyway there is sasuke..
Itachi was one of the most favourite characters there as well as Kakashi -_-
My fave ones beside -_-

But I don't hate Kishimoto since everything he has done looks very believable and realistic.
I won't even get mad if he will kill Temari or Gaara who are my fave too!
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Old 2009-05-01, 20:56   Link #68
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Like hell I'm gonna tolerate a 5 years old fairy tale and such disrespect for cool characters like Soi Fon and Halibel -_-
I'll better see Urahara/Yoruichi together than this!

As soon as Hitsugaya will kill Halibel and Soi Fon will lose to Barragan, I'll drop Bleach
Hitsugaya will lose, and Soi Fon will lose, everyones gonna lose, or else there would be no reason for the Vizard to come and help.
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Old 2009-05-01, 20:58   Link #69
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Hitsugaya will lose, and Soi Fon will lose, everyones gonna lose, or else there would be no reason for the Vizard to come and help.
I really hope that you are right. I really won't mind if they both lose.

Well they could come to kick Aizen or we will get some minus espadas or as some people suggested vizards will become new masterminds
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Old 2009-05-01, 20:58   Link #70
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Itachi appearance and all made him go towadrd his death and at the end he had his moment, so that is acceptable and Kishimoto created that character to be killed by Sasuke now if Kishimoto can kill Sasuke I wll call that something impressive (All the stuff about cursed seal eating your body and forbiden spells or expermients Sasuke was using to get his power ups and the only thing he gets is that eye problem which will probably be fixed because of his brothers eye..
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Old 2009-05-01, 20:59   Link #71
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I just don't get so emotionally attached to characters I guess.
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Old 2009-05-01, 21:03   Link #72
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Ikkaku being third seat....didnt have a limiter placed on him. When he went bankai it was a full power after it charged.

Just tossing that out there...
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Old 2009-05-01, 21:07   Link #73
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Originally Posted by junte86 View Post
Itachi appearance and all made him go towadrd his death and at the end he had his moment, so that is acceptable and Kishimoto created that character to be killed by Sasuke now if Kishimoto can kill Sasuke I wll call that something impressive (All the stuff about cursed seal eating your body and forbiden spells or expermients Sasuke was using to get his power ups and the only thing he gets is that eye problem which will probably be fixed because of his brothers eye..
And Kakashi?

A lot of people promised to drop Naruto,but they are still here.


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I just don't get so emotionally attached to characters I guess.
Yeh... getting sad and angry about them is one thing... but killing yourself for something that doesn't exist?
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Old 2009-05-01, 21:07   Link #74
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haa thats good you are not that attached to manga chracter in Japan there is one guy who is trying to make a law which will make you able to marry an anime girl I think the girl
he wants to marry is one of the girls from Haruhi. bizzare -_-



not all the people who say they will drop the series will stop reading it but even if jjust 1% gets angry and not read it
it hurts.. and Kishi doesnt really have to worry about money but still he is obliged to follow Jump's instruction although
his influence now shold make him do his way easier

but the only two person in Jump who can do whatever they want are Togashi and the author of Jaguer


oh and getting attached to manga character... I remember this year or last year some Japanese fan got so angry
when It was revealed one female character was not a virgin some guy burned all the Manga volumes

ha Although I kind of felt stupid about that I mean there are millions of doujinshi that has sexual contexts and yet they dig on to those thing
and get angry about such -_-
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Old 2009-05-01, 21:10   Link #75
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Originally Posted by Waking_Dreamer View Post
Ikkaku being third seat....didnt have a limiter placed on him. When he went bankai it was a full power after it charged.

Just tossing that out there...
That's what I was saying. Hitsugaya's 20% should be enough to win, but he got almost killed.

Besides in my opinion Renji was fighting the strongest arrancar. Even Ururu's kicks didn't help much.
But Renji defeated him the same way as Hitsugaya and in comparison to him he was in much better shape what puts Hitsugaya at the same level as Renji who sadly is weak(yep,my fave character is weak).
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Old 2009-05-01, 21:13   Link #76
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Originally Posted by junte86 View Post
haa thats good you are not that attached to manga chracter in Japan there is one guy who is trying to make a law which will make you able to marry an anime girl I think the girl
he wants to marry is one of the girls from Haruhi. bizzare -_-
Are you seriouse?!
When the hell did he visit the doctor last time?!


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Originally Posted by junte86 View Post
not all the people who say they will drop the series will stop reading it but even if jjust 1% gets angry and not read it
it hurts.. and Kishi doesnt really have to worry about money but still he is obliged to follow Jump's instruction although
his influence now shold make him do his way easier

but the only two person in Jump who can do whatever they want are Togashi and the author of Jaguer
Still he does kill characters and at the same time makes things look believable and you don't get angry that much.
If it was Kishimoto who would kill Soi Fon, I think my anger wouldn't be that big.

Sadly I don't know those authors =/
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Old 2009-05-01, 21:50   Link #77
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Because it is hell irritating to hear the same thing all over again!
Like if everyone were reading and watching Bleach with closed eyes and ears -_-
I'm sorry but, seems a little hypocritical. You get tired of hearing the same thing over and over again, yet in this thread alone, you've said "HITSUGAYA IS CLEARLY THE WEAKEST CAPTAIN" how many times now? C'mon.

And your logic on these characters seems completely flawed. For instance, you keep saying things like "Well since Ikkaku won his fight, and Renji won his fight, and Hitsugaya barely won his fight when his limiter was removed, then they are all the same level of power". That is the dumbest thing I've ever heard.

First off, if you want do some comparisons on how characters might be in the same "power level" do it correctly. For instance, Ikkaku probably has the power to become a captain, because he's a good fighter, and seems to have a decent mastery over his bankai. Therefore, you could say he might be equal to Hitsugaya in that since, even though he's a third seat. (In the same way that you could say Kisuke was probably stronger than Soi Fon even though he was just a third seat as well. Just nobody really knew this except for Yoruichi because she actually KNEW him, as everybody else just judged him on the outside). It's not like it's shocking for a third seat to be strong.

Now as for Renji, yes, he beat his arrancar, but does that make him on the same level as Hitsugaya? I doubt it. He has the least experience with his bankai (up there with Ichigo, time frame wise) and has proven that he's not exactly that outstanding of a fighter. Maybe it's just a stroke of bad luck. But still. That being said Hitsugaya isn't a captain just because he is strong. He is a captain because of his mind. He's intelligent, and WAY beyond what someone his age should be. They wouldn't call him a prodigy for no reason. He still has plenty of room to grow. Hell, it hasn't even be clearly explained what the pedals on his Bankai symbolize. There is probably something there we don't know about yet.

As for him demonstrating a new technique, is it all that shocking? Christ, I mean it's only happened how many other times with OTHER CAPTAINS even? Kenpachi using Kendo could be called a "power up" or new technique, in the same way as Byakuya using Yoruichi's technique is new. So why is it shocking that Hitsgaya would have something up his sleave too?

Yes. He said he "barely" beat the 11th arrancar. But during that time he's had time to train, PLUS he's learned more about his enemy as a whole. And don't give some lame argument saying "IT HASN'T BEEN THAT MUCH TIME SO IT WOULDN'T MATTER" as clearly, other characters have gotten stronger in that amount of time as well.

Now, would I like it if some good guys actually fell? Yes. It would shake things up. But do I hate Hitsugaya for not dying? No, it's just the way it's written.

I mean christ, your arguments are so blatantly fabricated, it's almost annoying. I mean no offense, but you keep getting so worked up at other people or about some character you hate, but have no basis for so many things you say. There is NO PROOF he is the weakest captain. What's to say Komamura isn't the weakest? We haven't exactly seen TOO much from him. Yeah, he's gaurding some Vices, but still. What's to say your precious Soi Fon isn't the weakest? I mean she called some technique using her Shikai her "Best Technique". Or did she just forget all about her Bankai and Shunko? What's to say Ukitake isn't the weakest? Sure he's an old captain who probably has a lot of experience and reiatsu, but with his illness that can come up at any point, it makes him seem pretty weak, as it just kind of shits all over anything he was doing prior to this. Hell, he was too weak to protect his own vice captain of a HOLLOW!

Point is ... we don't know who is the weakest or if there even IS one, so, stop making outlandish complaints claiming people are the weakest and what not. Discussing it in a calm manner and stating decent reasons for why you think so is fine, but complaining all the time just saying "HE JUST IS. HERE ARE SOME FACTS I HAVE WRONG TO PROVE IT" isn't really helping the general discussion and kind of takes away from the mood of everything.


... Yeah that's all.
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Old 2009-05-01, 22:15   Link #78
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I'm sorry but, seems a little hypocritical. You get tired of hearing the same thing over and over again, yet in this thread alone, you've said "HITSUGAYA IS CLEARLY THE WEAKEST CAPTAIN" how many times now? C'mon.

And your logic on these characters seems completely flawed. For instance, you keep saying things like "Well since Ikkaku won his fight, and Renji won his fight, and Hitsugaya barely won his fight when his limiter was removed, then they are all the same level of power". That is the dumbest thing I've ever heard.

First off, if you want do some comparisons on how characters might be in the same "power level" do it correctly. For instance, Ikkaku probably has the power to become a captain, because he's a good fighter, and seems to have a decent mastery over his bankai. Therefore, you could say he might be equal to Hitsugaya in that since, even though he's a third seat. (In the same way that you could say Kisuke was probably stronger than Soi Fon even though he was just a third seat as well. Just nobody really knew this except for Yoruichi because she actually KNEW him, as everybody else just judged him on the outside). It's not like it's shocking for a third seat to be strong.

Now as for Renji, yes, he beat his arrancar, but does that make him on the same level as Hitsugaya? I doubt it. He has the least experience with his bankai (up there with Ichigo, time frame wise) and has proven that he's not exactly that outstanding of a fighter. Maybe it's just a stroke of bad luck. But still. That being said Hitsugaya isn't a captain just because he is strong. He is a captain because of his mind. He's intelligent, and WAY beyond what someone his age should be. They wouldn't call him a prodigy for no reason. He still has plenty of room to grow. Hell, it hasn't even be clearly explained what the pedals on his Bankai symbolize. There is probably something there we don't know about yet.

As for him demonstrating a new technique, is it all that shocking? Christ, I mean it's only happened how many other times with OTHER CAPTAINS even? Kenpachi using Kendo could be called a "power up" or new technique, in the same way as Byakuya using Yoruichi's technique is new. So why is it shocking that Hitsgaya would have something up his sleave too?

Yes. He said he "barely" beat the 11th arrancar. But during that time he's had time to train, PLUS he's learned more about his enemy as a whole. And don't give some lame argument saying "IT HASN'T BEEN THAT MUCH TIME SO IT WOULDN'T MATTER" as clearly, other characters have gotten stronger in that amount of time as well.

Now, would I like it if some good guys actually fell? Yes. It would shake things up. But do I hate Hitsugaya for not dying? No, it's just the way it's written.

I mean christ, your arguments are so blatantly fabricated, it's almost annoying. I mean no offense, but you keep getting so worked up at other people or about some character you hate, but have no basis for so many things you say. There is NO PROOF he is the weakest captain. What's to say Komamura isn't the weakest? We haven't exactly seen TOO much from him. Yeah, he's gaurding some Vices, but still. What's to say your precious Soi Fon isn't the weakest? I mean she called some technique using her Shikai her "Best Technique". Or did she just forget all about her Bankai and Shunko? What's to say Ukitake isn't the weakest? Sure he's an old captain who probably has a lot of experience and reiatsu, but with his illness that can come up at any point, it makes him seem pretty weak, as it just kind of shits all over anything he was doing prior to this. Hell, he was too weak to protect his own vice captain of a HOLLOW!

Point is ... we don't know who is the weakest or if there even IS one, so, stop making outlandish complaints claiming people are the weakest and what not. Discussing it in a calm manner and stating decent reasons for why you think so is fine, but complaining all the time just saying "HE JUST IS. HERE ARE SOME FACTS I HAVE WRONG TO PROVE IT" isn't really helping the general discussion and kind of takes away from the mood of everything.


... Yeah that's all.
tl;dr Cliffs please?
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Old 2009-05-01, 22:21   Link #79
kitten320
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I'm sorry but, seems a little hypocritical. You get tired of hearing the same thing over and over again, yet in this thread alone, you've said "HITSUGAYA IS CLEARLY THE WEAKEST CAPTAIN" how many times now? C'mon.
I think you didn't get what I was saying... I'm not arguing with the facts like everyone does about bankai!

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Now as for Renji, yes, he beat his arrancar, but does that make him on the same level as Hitsugaya? I doubt it. He has the least experience with his bankai (up there with Ichigo, time frame wise) and has proven that he's not exactly that outstanding of a fighter. Maybe it's just a stroke of bad luck. But still. That being said Hitsugaya isn't a captain just because he is strong. He is a captain because of his mind. He's intelligent, and WAY beyond what someone his age should be. They wouldn't call him a prodigy for no reason. He still has plenty of room to grow. Hell, it hasn't even be clearly explained what the pedals on his Bankai symbolize. There is probably something there we don't know about yet.
Yes Renji is weak but his power was enough to defeat arrancar without blood splashing from him while Hitsugaya fell down after the same fight. So who is stronger? Both fought similar opponents under similar conditions and somehow one of the weakest characters is standing while captains falls down.
Hitsugaya had to win arrancar without any releases or at least make him feel uncomfortable.

I don't see anything intelligent about him. Every other captain has the same level.
And if to talk about smartest... Gin is much better!

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As for him demonstrating a new technique, is it all that shocking? Christ, I mean it's only happened how many other times with OTHER CAPTAINS even? Kenpachi using Kendo could be called a "power up" or new technique, in the same way as Byakuya using Yoruichi's technique is new. So why is it shocking that Hitsgaya would have something up his sleave too?
How about the fact that Lupi(fake 6) had kicked his ass big time. And if he wasn't so concentrated with Matsumoto and others, Hitsugaya would be dead?


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Originally Posted by SimplyAJ View Post
Yes. He said he "barely" beat the 11th arrancar. But during that time he's had time to train, PLUS he's learned more about his enemy as a whole. And don't give some lame argument saying "IT HASN'T BEEN THAT MUCH TIME SO IT WOULDN'T MATTER" as clearly, other characters have gotten stronger in that amount of time as well.
I don't see any improvements in any character.
Byakuya was fast, he still is.
Kenpachi was srong, he still is.
Mayuri was clever, he still is.
Soi fon was fast, she still is.
Hitsugaya was weak, and now he is Super Hitsugaya?!
Just come on! Little improvement but not like this!

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Originally Posted by SimplyAJ View Post
I mean christ, your arguments are so blatantly fabricated, it's almost annoying. I mean no offense, but you keep getting so worked up at other people or about some character you hate, but have no basis for so many things you say. There is NO PROOF he is the weakest captain. What's to say Komamura isn't the weakest? We haven't exactly seen TOO much from him. Yeah, he's gaurding some Vices, but still. What's to say your precious Soi Fon isn't the weakest? I mean she called some technique using her Shikai her "Best Technique". Or did she just forget all about her Bankai and Shunko? What's to say Ukitake isn't the weakest? Sure he's an old captain who probably has a lot of experience and reiatsu, but with his illness that can come up at any point, it makes him seem pretty weak, as it just kind of shits all over anything he was doing prior to this. Hell, he was too weak to protect his own vice captain of a HOLLOW!
Do I really need to tell you every time Hitsugaya got his ass handed to him and every time enemy had escaped from his ice attacks?
I may agree about Komamura being weaker than Hitsugaya.

I think you didn't get the point. What she meant was her best move in shikai form. Not shunko and bankai. You seem to miss a lot of things yourself so before correcting me try to pay attention more too.

Illness it the only thing that stops him. He didn't fail to protect Kaien, Kaien himself asked not to interfer. Ukitake was protecting his honor.
And Ukitake didn't have any screen time to show anything since all screen time was given to Hitsugaya.
Besides Ukitake was fast enough to come out of nowhere and stop Byakuya from killing Rukia and Ganju



All captains are good in the right time and place, but they have different levels of strengh and Hitsugaya's strengh is weak since he can't freeze anyone, strong, to death
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Old 2009-05-01, 22:52   Link #80
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I think you didn't get what I was saying... I'm not arguing with the facts like everyone does about bankai!



Yes Renji is weak but his power was enough to defeat arrancar without blood splashing from him while Hitsugaya fell down after the same fight. So who is stronger? Both fought similar opponents under similar conditions and somehow one of the weakest characters is standing while captains falls down.
Hitsugaya had to win arrancar without any releases or at least make him feel uncomfortable.

I don't see anything intelligent about him. Every other captain has the same level.
And if to talk about smartest... Gin is much better!
Yes. That's why he was the only captain to see Gin for what he really was. Way before the other captains. But, you must not see anything intelligent about that, right? Hell, I'll even go along with you saying all other captains are the same level. If that's the case, what does it have to say if ALL captains of the SAME LEVEL of intelligence as someone so young? Either he is very intelligent or they are all incredibly stupid.


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How about the fact that Lupi(fake 6) had kicked his ass big time. And if he wasn't so concentrated with Matsumoto and others, Hitsugaya would be dead?
How does the Lupi fight prove that he wouldn't have ANYTHING ELSE up his sleave? Again, as I said before characters are shown to use new techniques later on. But you know what? Just to humor you, let's use you logic here. Well, Kenpachi lost to Ichigo even after he took off his eyepatch. So we could compare Ichigo to Lupi and Kenpachi to Hitsugaya. Eyepatch = The Ice Move Hitsugaya used on Luppi. Well, that must mean Kenpachi has nothing else up his sleave right? Oh wait, he used Kendo! Look at that, something new! Why didn't he use it against Ichigo? For the same reason Hitsugaya didn't use whatever he did against Halibel.

Another example. Byakuya lost to Ichigo too. Let's say, again, Ichigo = Luppi and Byakuya = Hitsugaya. Byakuya uses his bankai and still pretty much loses. But he must not have anything else up his sleave right? Why didn't he use Yoruichi's move against Ichigo? (These are metaphors, if you didn't get that)



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I don't see any improvements in any character.
Byakuya was fast, he still is.
Kenpachi was srong, he still is.
Mayuri was clever, he still is.
Soi fon was fast, she still is.
Hitsugaya was weak, and now he is Super Hitsugaya?!
Just come on! Little improvement but not like this!
YES. Obviously. He is so obviously "SUPER" now, because he's not dead. Not that he isn't showing any signs of fatigue or anything. If anything, we can say Hitsugaya was crafty and intelligent, and still is. Seeing as he manages to scrap his way through things. Ever think of it that way? Maybe he's SUPPOSED to be viewed as the underdog "that can do it?"


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Do I really need to tell you every time Hitsugaya got his ass handed to him and every time enemy had escaped from his ice attacks?
I may agree about Komamura being weaker than Hitsugaya.
Not that Rukia's were all that great. Sure, she killed D-Roy with ice. But he was obviously a joke. Period. But when she did it to Grimmjaw, he busted it like it was nothing. She also froze Rudobone's arm when he was going after Ichigo, but he got out too. (Yes, she did better against him later on, but he still got out). Sure, she killed Espada number 9, but, I'm pretty sure that if any character made their sword materialize in another character's head they are going to die. And, sure, while it might be retarded and predictable, but, now that we know what Halibel's release is, sure enough, things are probably stacked in Hitsugaya's favor. Because yes, ice does freeze water.


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I think you didn't get the point. What she meant was her best move in shikai form. Not shunko and bankai. You seem to miss a lot of things yourself so before correcting me try to pay attention more too.
Really? Because, I'm pretty sure she just said "Keep your mouth shut. It's my best move." Not "HEY THIS IS MY BEST SHIKAI MOVE, OKAY? JUST MY SHIKAI. Make that CLEAR! SHIKAI ONLY!", so, there you go, assuming things again.

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Originally Posted by kitten320 View Post
Illness it the only thing that stops him. He didn't fail to protect Kaien, Kaien himself asked not to interfer. Ukitake was protecting his honor.
And Ukitake didn't have any screen time to show anything since all screen time was given to Hitsugaya.
Besides Ukitake was fast enough to come out of nowhere and stop Byakuya from killing Rukia and Ganju
Yes, but you missed the point. He may be strong, but that illness can MAKE him weak, so therefore, essentially he could be the weakest captain as he could have an attack at any point. If you're going to rate and judge them, you have to put them on the scales with all of their positives and negatives. And that is a BIG negative on his end. My point still stands.

Quote:
Originally Posted by kitten320 View Post
All captains are good in the right time and place, but they have different levels of strengh and Hitsugaya's strengh is weak since he can't freeze anyone, strong, to death
You said it yourself. Good at the right time and place. And right now he's fighting someone who is water based. Seems like the right time and place, wouldn't you say? Even if he is outmatched in pure power, his advantages still might make up for it. We don't know if he can't freeze anyone strong to death. We still don't know enough ABOUT him, what he can and can't do.
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