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Old 2009-04-11, 06:48   Link #1
Anh_Minh
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Sarkozy, the French president

I hear a lot of things about him from my colleagues, about how unpopular he is abroad (I know he is domestically, that's not the problem...), but it contradicts some of the papers I read, and it makes me wonder how much of that is wishful thinking on their part.

So I decided to go the completely unscientific route and ask you: how do you and your entourage feel about him? (And where are you...) Do you even care?
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Old 2009-04-11, 07:07   Link #2
Kusa-San
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Oh great idea this thread Well i wonder too what foreign people think of him. But as a french, i can tell that many many many french don't like him at all. You have even this : http://jeunesmodem45.com/wp-content/...udou-sarko.jpg
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Old 2009-04-11, 19:11   Link #3
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Well, he definitely earned some retard points for his Anglo-Saxon comment the other week on the financial crisis.
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Old 2009-04-11, 19:13   Link #4
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Originally Posted by Reckoner View Post
Well, he definitely earned some retard points for his Anglo-Saxon comment the other week on the financial crisis.
I believe that was the president of Brazil, unless Sarkozy said the something and I missed it.
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Old 2009-04-11, 23:08   Link #5
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I don't follow French politics, but Sarkozy seems like a mega socialist from an American perspective. I can't even begin to imagine what a French president from the actual Socialist party would be like.

Sarkozy seems to have some good ideas on fixing education and liberalizing the economy, but it's unlikely that he'll be able to reform anything with the far-left in its current militant state and, more importantly, public opinion against him.
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Old 2009-04-11, 23:51   Link #6
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Originally Posted by Terrestrial Dream View Post
I believe that was the president of Brazil, unless Sarkozy said the something and I missed it.
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/new...cle6005810.ece

"Mr Sarkozy, who blames the “Anglo-Saxons” for causing the economic crisis, told his ministers last week that he would leave Mr Brown’s summit “if it does not work out. "

He basically is saying that France isn't part of the Anglo-Saxon culture...

The Brazilian President said he blamed the blond man with the blue eyes...
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Old 2009-04-12, 01:11   Link #7
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Sarkozy is of Hungarian descent, among others. Curiously, he has aristocratic ancestry. (See more at his wiki page.)

Personally, I am neutral towards him. In other states, perhaps he might be a more effective leader. But, he's in France, home of the Revolution, and other movements which never fail to stir up deep emotions. He is unlikely to become a towering figure like De Gaulle or Monnet.
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Old 2009-04-12, 01:14   Link #8
Kusa-San
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Autumn Demon View Post
I don't follow French politics, but Sarkozy seems like a mega socialist from an American perspective. I can't even begin to imagine what a French president from the actual Socialist party would be like.
You're serious

Quote:
Sarkozy seems to have some good ideas on fixing education and liberalizing the economy .
Uh no it's not good ideas especially for the education. I don't know what do you know of the reform about education but, as a french, i can tell you that it's not good at all. This reform has been taken without any consultation from the main protagonist of education sector (researcher, teacher, student....). It's just a big joke (like the reform about internet...). Just to precise that these protagonist are not against a reform but not a stupid one like our dear president did.
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Old 2009-04-12, 01:22   Link #9
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i don't think he is better or worst then any of the other guys in power right now. However I think he has a tendency to want to be in the spotlight and unfounately this has made say some really stupid things. The only politician world leader worst at putting his foot in his mouth is the ltaly PM. He reminds me a lot of the current mayor of San Francisco, which is another attentation hogging, celebratie politician.
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Old 2009-04-12, 04:24   Link #10
Anh_Minh
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Reckoner View Post
http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/new...cle6005810.ece

"Mr Sarkozy, who blames the “Anglo-Saxons” for causing the economic crisis, told his ministers last week that he would leave Mr Brown’s summit “if it does not work out. "

He basically is saying that France isn't part of the Anglo-Saxon culture...
And we're not. Anglo-Saxon, in our parlance, means "UK+USA", or at least "English speaking countries". Where did you get that we should be "Anglo-Saxons" anyway? We're not descended from those Germanic tribes. Our language is descended from Latin. So, what gives?

And yes, the financial crisis originated from, guess what, the US. And the risky banking practices of "the City". While our own banks aren't innocent (hey, they did buy American and English financial products, if nothing else), we as a country have tried for more regulation.

edit: I don't like that article. It implies that France stood alone against the USA, UK, and Germany. In fact, both France and Germany wanted more regulation and made efforts to present a united front.

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Originally Posted by Kusa-San View Post
You're serious



Uh no it's not good ideas especially for the education. I don't know what do you know of the reform about education but, as a french, i can tell you that it's not good at all. This reform has been taken without any consultation from the main protagonist of education sector (researcher, teacher, student....). It's just a big joke (like the reform about internet...). Just to precise that these protagonist are not against a reform but not a stupid one like our dear president did.
And as a French, I think the ideas weren't so bad. Two problems, though:
- he tried to compromise too much. So many problems for so little change. It is, as we say, "an elephant that gave birth to a mouse".
- any reform was doomed. Oh, people in France say they want change. But just try giving it to them. And the unions in the Education system are very powerful.
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Old 2009-04-12, 04:34   Link #11
Kusa-San
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Originally Posted by Anh_Minh View Post
And as a French, I think the ideas weren't so bad. Two problems, though:
- he tried to compromise too much. So many problems for so little change. It is, as we say, "an elephant that gave birth to a mouse".
- any reform was doomed. Oh, people in France say they want change. But just try giving it to them. And the unions in the Education system are very powerful.
Reforming the education is not a bad idea in itself as i said in my previous post but it's how the reform is. The main problem is that our government don't know their subject at all and made some reform without consulting the main protagonist. Do you think it's normal to do such reform without even asking for reseacher, teacher opinion ? And do you know how dangerous the LRU is for University ? Do you think it's normal to give so much power to the president of our University ?

Quote:
I don't like that article. It implies that France stood alone against the USA, UK, and Germany. In fact, both France and Germany wanted more regulation and made efforts to present a united front.
Just see that too. It's scandalous to write such lie O_o France and Germany are together for this cause. I'm very angry now because it's what we call " misinformation" . Scandalous !
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Old 2009-04-12, 05:34   Link #12
Anh_Minh
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Originally Posted by Kusa-San View Post
Reforming the education is not a bad idea in itself as i said in my previous post but it's how the reform is. The main problem is that our government don't know their subject at all and made some reform without consulting the main protagonist. Do you think it's normal to do such reform without even asking for reseacher, teacher opinion ? And do you know how dangerous the LRU is for University ? Do you think it's normal to give so much power to the president of our University ?
I don't want to get too deep into a Franco-French debate in this thread, but I'll say I'm pretty neutral on those issues. I'm mostly interested in closer ties between universities and the guys who will supposedly hire their students after graduation. The disconnect between colleges and employers is a serious problem.
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Old 2009-04-12, 08:48   Link #13
Slice of Life
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Originally Posted by Kusa-San View Post
Just see that too. It's scandalous to write such lie O_o France and Germany are together for this cause.
Yes. Actually, this was even pretty much the agreed EU position and not even Brown spoke up against it anymore. But for somebody who has been following BBC news for years it's a familiar pattern of British media.

As for Sarkozy (who's anything but a "socialist") from my very limited understanding of both politicians stances I consider him a step don't from Chirac, not up.
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Old 2009-04-12, 09:00   Link #14
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I'm glad that he isn't part of our country but I lolled when he banned TV adds from state TV
I think the French are sometimes quite silly to begin with like the atheists making posters on buses about God not existing and then Catholics then declaring war by producing the same posters but with saying that God is real

The again in my country when atheists decided to make a road sign that you should enjoy life rather than being bound to rules of the church Catholics decided to make one that looks the same but that states that God is real -_-;
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Old 2009-04-12, 09:13   Link #15
Jinto
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So what do I think of Sarkozy... he has some good ideas in topics that he does understand. But he should rely more on expert knowledge regarding all the other topics where he just seems to have a misguided lobbyist understing of things. He seems sometimes unaware of the fact that he is the president of the whole of France not just its elite.

Anyway I don't like most politicians in general. I have hopes for Obama though.

Last edited by Jinto; 2009-04-12 at 10:17.
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Old 2009-04-12, 09:17   Link #16
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Originally Posted by Terrestrial Dream View Post
I believe that was the president of Brazil, unless Sarkozy said the something and I missed it.
I believe every leader/person has complained about the anglo-saxon model except for the Anglo-saxons themselves.

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Originally Posted by Anh_Minh View Post
And we're not. Anglo-Saxon, in our parlance, means "UK+USA", or at least "English speaking countries". Where did you get that we should be "Anglo-Saxons" anyway? We're not descended from those Germanic tribes.
Yes you are, where do you think the Franks come from... France? Everyone in Europe except for those with a Celtic origin (and even the Celtic tribes originally came from Germany) were "invaded" by the Germanic tribes during the "Barbarian invasions". The Angles and Saxons settled in England hence Anglo-saxons, while the Franks settled in France, Visigoths settled in Iberian peninsular etc. and the modern west European people are born.

Anyway as for Sarkozy, he's amusing on the international world stage but when it comes to Europe I find him annoying I know he wants to proclaim himself as leader of Europe but frankly I don't want to see him in that role (I was quite glad when his presidency was over) nor does his protectionist stance (I admit he isn't the only one doing this but still) will help Europe and the single market in these tough times.

Anyway I can't really judge him on domestic issues, I'll leave that to those who live in France.

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Originally Posted by -KarumA- View Post
I think the French are sometimes quite silly to begin with like the atheists making posters on buses about God not existing and then Catholics then declaring war by producing the same posters but with saying that God is real
That was in London, the French are really obsessed with their secularism.
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Old 2009-04-12, 09:47   Link #17
-KarumA-
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Originally Posted by Blaat View Post

That was in London, the French are really obsessed with their secularism.
Was that in London o.o; my bad then still that as well made me lol
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Old 2009-04-12, 10:32   Link #18
Anh_Minh
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Originally Posted by Blaat View Post
I believe every leader/person has complained about the anglo-saxon model except for the Anglo-saxons themselves.

Yes you are, where do you think the Franks come from... France? Everyone in Europe except for those with a Celtic origin (and even the Celtic tribes originally came from Germany) were "invaded" by the Germanic tribes during the "Barbarian invasions". The Angles and Saxons settled in England hence Anglo-saxons, while the Franks settled in France, Visigoths settled in Iberian peninsular etc. and the modern west European people are born.
I said "those" tribes, meaning the Angles, the Saxons, and, I guess, the Jutes who somehow didn't make it into the name "Anglo-Saxons". The Franks were another tribe.
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Old 2009-04-12, 10:55   Link #19
Blaat
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Originally Posted by Anh_Minh View Post
I said "those" tribes, meaning the Angles, the Saxons, and, I guess, the Jutes who somehow didn't make it into the name "Anglo-Saxons". The Franks were another tribe.
Ahh my bad, I interpreted as "those Germanic tribes" as in all Germanic tribes especially with the comment "Our language is descended from Latin." considering none of the Germanic tribes originally spoke Latin.
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Old 2009-04-12, 21:00   Link #20
Reckoner
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Originally Posted by Anh_Minh View Post
I said "those" tribes, meaning the Angles, the Saxons, and, I guess, the Jutes who somehow didn't make it into the name "Anglo-Saxons". The Franks were another tribe.
All right, the point isn't that I'm trying to say that the French people are Anglo-Saxons. Yes, technically they are not. I'm just laughing at his attempt to distinguish his country from the US and UK. I'm not going to get into a such a debate why his comments are just plain stupid, but I'll apologize for creating the misunderstanding.
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