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View Poll Results: Eden of the East - Episode 5 Rating
Perfect 10 28 34.15%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 25 30.49%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 16 19.51%
7 out of 10 : Good 8 9.76%
6 out of 10 : Average 4 4.88%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 0 0%
4 out of 10 : Poor 0 0%
3 out of 10 : Bad 0 0%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 0 0%
1 out of 10 : Painful 1 1.22%
Voters: 82. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2009-05-09, 15:18   Link #81
Noe
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Well, that was a waste of a beef bowl. Cute kiss imho.
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Old 2009-05-09, 15:20   Link #82
izmosmolnar
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@Kaoru Chujo. Well ,the only possible way to accomplish the Careless Monday without any casualty, is through Juiz I believe. As I said after episode 2, those areas are far too huge to think there was no one at home!
It's safe to assume #1 can order Juiz to evacuate that area and than launch the missiles we've seen to the evacuated locations (of course I have no idea whether they are capable of doing such a damage).
If that's the case it would also explain how does the media know that some kindof "Selecao" is behind the whole Careless Monday. Maybe he didn't used Juiz to erase the evidence after the launch, and he did everything on his own, but left something behind by accident. I haven't got the slightest clue what are the requirements to launch such missiles (phisically, command-structurally financially etc), but I don't find it impossible to do alone.
I doubt Akira gathered the NEETs for some reason related to the Careless Monday though.

I apologize, if I came across like I'd want to crush Saki's character or something, it was not my intention, but she definitely doesn't click with me (hence the proverb). I'm not blaming for being in love for his brother in love though, everyone knows (or should know) that "love is blind".
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Old 2009-05-09, 15:36   Link #83
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Originally Posted by Kora View Post
somehow i dont seem to sense much romance between Akira and Saki, even with the kiss and all. she just confessed that she's in love with her brother-in-law!
Did you watch only this episode? Do you think she would have invited him for a tea (ep2), felt dumped after the movie (ep3), been so angsty on her bed while mailing him (ep4), if she wasn't at least attracted to him??

She loves Ryousuke, yes, but that doesn't mean she doesn't have feelings for Akira. It's pretty clear she does.
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Old 2009-05-09, 15:45   Link #84
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Originally Posted by Kazu-kun View Post
Did you watch only this episode? Do you think she would have invited him for a tea (ep2), felt dumped after the movie (ep3), been so angsty on her bed while mailing him (ep4), if she wasn't at least attracted to him??

She loves Ryousuke, yes, but that doesn't mean she doesn't have feelings for Akira. It's pretty clear she does.
I completely agree. There have been signs that she has feelings/feels attracted to Akira. That's for sure. She does refer to him as possibly being her Prince in episode one.

That's something I wonder about. The episode one narration at the start; is that in the future, past the events that happened through the eleven episodes? Leads me to wonder where Akira could be if that's the case. Then again, I may be reading into it too much.

Also, yeah... she does seem to be rather in love with her brother-in-law, but that does happen sometimes with the younger sibling crushing over someone she can't have.

Either way, I haven't posted on AnimeSuki in a bit, but I'm absolutely enjoying this series. I love Saki and Akira's interactions, and I'm loving the characters as well. That new Selecao scares me in the manly zone. =[
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Old 2009-05-09, 16:06   Link #85
Kaoru Chujo
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Yes you can. Because buried in that is the possible fantasy that he's going to leave the sister for her.... She also blamed the job for not being more honest with her when jobs don't do that at interviews.
I don't know why you think the idea that he would leave her sister is "buried in that." I don't think we have any indication that the happiness of the family bothers her. And we have every indication possible that she really loves the child, both from her having said it and from her glance at it when she arrived home. It's just loving her brother in law that bothers her. She enjoys having him around, I guess, as well as being pained by it.

As for moving out, she was going to college, and the choice was probably getting money from her family to live elsewhere or living with them. This was a lot cheaper. I think that as far as she and her sister see things, she is moving out at the earliest opportunity, which is now.

But as I said, I don't believe in judging works of fiction on moral grounds. Sure, she might have done things better. But this is a lot more interesting, and more human.

As for blaming the people at that company for not being honest, that is 100% justified, in my opinion. They invited her to lunch and then stood her up and dumped gyuudon on her. That is doing a lot more than just not being totally honest. That is being nasty just to derive pleasure from putting someone weaker than you down. Yuck. Maybe Akira will now take that as motivation to destroy the company system. By the way, I thought her answer was interesting enough. The only reason it seemed cliched to us was that we had heard her give it before, to Akira.

Kora's point about the romance being a little tepid seems right to me, however. Saki has the beginnings of love, but even she at first was dubious that this was her prince. Akira was willing to run away, then came back. He forgot all about her for a day, then made huge efforts to find her. Later, something she said clicked with him, giving him a big clue as to how he should go forward. He likes her, is grateful for that, and probably feels her as a bit of a lifeline in his strange situation. Still not sure if the kiss was more than just comforting her. I hope so.

But Ryousuke is meaningless in this context. She knows her love for him is impossible and is eager to find someone else. It is possible to love more than one person at the same time, especially when one of them is off limits.
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Old 2009-05-09, 17:06   Link #86
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Quote:
She also blamed the job for not being more honest with her when jobs don't do that at interviews.
So you think it's a good idea not to be honest with someone?

Perhaps that's why it's called social critique.

Quote:
As for blaming the people at that company for not being honest, that is 100% justified, in my opinion. They invited her to lunch and then stood her up and dumped gyuudon on her. That is doing a lot more than just not being totally honest. That is being nasty just to derive pleasure from putting someone weaker than you down. Yuck.
The example they chose looks like an extreme one (though I've heard so many things about humiliation in Japan that I don't dare dismiss it as fantasy at all. There's a pretty poignant scene in episode 3 of Kurenai on this), but the general point about the shitty attitude of companies in this capitalist world and the complex reality of young people trying to get a job remains, which is what I find the most important. The gyuudon is just an exaggeration to put a point through.

I sincerely hope they follow this line and later tackle the illusion of "life employment" in Japanese firms.
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Old 2009-05-09, 17:29   Link #87
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Originally Posted by WanderingKnight View Post
So you think it's a good idea not to be honest with someone?

Perhaps that's why it's called social critique.
People who switch jobs do it loads of times with their current job. Expecting full honesty at an interview is usually unrealistic. The beef bowl was a bit extreme but she wasn't getting the point after waiting an hour for people to show up for lunch. The interviewer's exit comments should have been a huge hint which is more than what most jobs will do. Obviously, she wasn't worth them spending time and getting a free lunch for. That is the sad commentary about how pissed they were with her.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kaoru Chujo View Post
I don't know why you think the idea that he would leave her sister is "buried in that." I don't think we have any indication that the happiness of the family bothers her. And we have every indication possible that she really loves the child, both from her having said it and from her glance at it when she arrived home. It's just loving her brother in law that bothers her. She enjoys having him around, I guess, as well as being pained by it.
Because this is the female fantasy that some women who date married men go thru, "If I stick around, he'll recognize that he loves me more and dump her for me." When it doesn't happen, the poor schmuck is left emo and going thru a "Do I leave or do I hang in there?" crossroads. It's a very common scenario to be trapped in. I'm sure she loves that family but on a level this is in the background. She's crying in a park saying that she loves the guy like she's realising that she has to end a relationship and move on. Most adult females don't cry over crushes.
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Old 2009-05-09, 17:42   Link #88
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with regards to saki, yes she acts irrationally but that`s just part of being a woman that is emotional. There are plenty of girls in real life that act just like saki even in North America. You cant really blame her for being the way she is more than a moth that flies toward a flame
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Old 2009-05-09, 17:55   Link #89
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with regards to saki, yes she acts irrationally but that`s just part of being a woman that is emotional. There are plenty of girls in real life that act just like saki even in North America. You cant really blame her for being he way she is more than a moth that flies toward a flame
In North America, they are called lots of very unnice things and stepped on without mercy. This is what girls here are taught not to do.

It's too easy to become a "victim" here.
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Old 2009-05-09, 18:00   Link #90
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And yet, they still do, don't they?
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Old 2009-05-09, 18:04   Link #91
orion
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The ones who are smart and with family support don't.

The ones that become victims. Yeah, they are screwed. Bad outcomes (unintentional pregnancy, rape, death, prostitution, drug abuse, low socioeconomic status). It's not like they are going to live a happy life unless by some miracle they pull themselves out.

But you know, it's prob like that in most countries, right?
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Old 2009-05-09, 18:11   Link #92
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You have a very harsh view on women, apparently. Really, girls that go through unintentional pregnancies are victims? Of what?

I know some kids who did go through the cracks a bit (and were neither stupid nor alone in the world), but most did not fare too badly. Mostly, it's a case by case thing - generalization, and one so broad as you try to make, is more often than not, a very bad thing.

And I think people do learn from every single one of their experiences, even the unfortunate ones. It just takes some people more time, is all - like our Saki, here. It's not all that easy to let go of an unrequited love story. It's hard work.
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Old 2009-05-09, 18:16   Link #93
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Quote:
People who switch jobs do it loads of times with their current job. Expecting full honesty at an interview is usually unrealistic.
And that's why it's called a social critique. You should drop your conformist view and be a little more critic about what is right and wrong with society. The fact that things happen doesn't make them either right or impossible to change.
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Old 2009-05-09, 18:23   Link #94
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I dont think saki is a slut by any means. Girls cant help but feel attracted to who they are attracted to. Oosugi is just not attractive of a guy to get any girl. As mentioned before he has no game. Guys that have social intuition (game) do not call a girl they like numerous times to get their attention. This demonstrates low value or desperation. Girls intuitively know when a person is low value and they dont become attracted to them. Oosugi showed too much desire for saki and it turned her off. Very early on in their `relationship`saki already slotted Oosugi in the friends zone, after that he already had no chance with her but Oosugi still thought he had a good chance.

Now contrast this with akira that quickly managed to spark attraction in saki. Right off the bat, akira is not showing any desire for saki. He was being a challenge to her right from the start. Only high value men are challenging. This is because high value men get lots of women all the time and they have to screen out the less desirable women. Women emotionally react to this kind of stuff powerfully as their brains are evolutionarily geared to select high value males. There were also other things like his akira`s confidence, he`s naked but he`s not shameful, he leads saki to different places, he continually takes a leadership position over saki. Saki sees akira as a high value person because his confidence and challenging nature. She also sees that akira is independently wealthy when she sees his crib.

finally saki is attracted to her sister`s lover because he`s preselected. When a girl sees a guy that is desirable to other women she become attracted to him. This is commonly seen in the animal kingdom.
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Old 2009-05-09, 18:44   Link #95
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Not like I want to protect Oosugi, or argue with any of you folks, but I think it's worth to mention, that Saki at the White House said something like ~"Oh if Oosugi would have a phone right now, he would call me". It's possible she thought about him as a friend only back then already, but it somehow implies she might be willing to consider him more. Maybe it's just me though, I don't know...
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Old 2009-05-09, 19:00   Link #96
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once a girl sees you as a friend it is rare that she will see you as a love interest later.
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Old 2009-05-09, 19:17   Link #97
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Originally Posted by orion View Post
People who switch jobs do it loads of times with their current job. Expecting full honesty at an interview is usually unrealistic. The beef bowl was a bit extreme but she wasn't getting the point after waiting an hour for people to show up for lunch. The interviewer's exit comments should have been a huge hint which is more than what most jobs will do. Obviously, she wasn't worth them spending time and getting a free lunch for. That is the sad commentary about how pissed they were with her.
So she shouldn't be mad at them for choosing to purposely dump food on her lap to get her to leave instead of just telling her to leave. So it's her fault they had to dump food on her lap because she couldn't take the extremely rude hint before he invited her to lunch leading her on... How in the hell did you convince yourself of this?

EDIT: The interviewers behavior was disgusting, rude and unjustified. How they acted goes beyond just not being completely honest.
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Old 2009-05-09, 19:18   Link #98
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Originally Posted by BetoJR View Post
And I think people do learn from every single one of their experiences, even the unfortunate ones. It just takes some people more time, is all - like our Saki, here. It's not all that easy to let go of an unrequited love story. It's hard work.
Damn straight
I see Ryousuke more than a mere "crush" to her. Sure it's silly to see a grown woman cry and weep over something silly but not over someone you "love". That's a different story. Saki isn't a little school-girl who blushes and giggles all the time and gossips about it. Love works in mysterious ways.

Luckily Saki has Akira
Oosugi has...his friends? :'D ( I don't wanna count the ding-dong killer woman xD )

@ izmosmolnar: If she was willing to consider him more, she wouldn't act so indifferent towards him. She hardly even looks his way when he talks and seems kinda...lifeless. I think she was saying that as a teaseful thing.

If she was willing, she failed at it for sure
That and Akira got in the way...not that I mind.
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Old 2009-05-09, 19:41   Link #99
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Originally Posted by Kaoru Chujo View Post
Different strokes, lol. She's my favorite character. But I always like weakness in a character. Perfection and strength are boring.
Well, I think most people prefer their characters to have some imperfections and flaws. That's not the issue though. The problem with Saki is how weak (character-wise) she is compared to Akira. The male protagonist may have some faults, but they are really nothing more than personality quirks (inappropriately goofy, etc.). In fact, they pale in comparison to his strengths: reliable, assertive, confident, quick-witted, charming, great emotional fortitude, etc.

Contrast that with Saki. Other than being a cute, adorable good girl type, it doesn't seem like she will demonstrate any strengths similar to Akira. There is no balance between the two protagonists; it's too one-sided. As someone else mentioned, right now her role is similar to the super passive characters who gets rescued by her prince.

Quote:
Originally Posted by hamstar View Post
finally saki is attracted to her sister`s lover because he`s preselected. When a girl sees a guy that is desirable to other women she become attracted to him. This is commonly seen in the animal kingdom.
Or it could be that she has genuine romantic feelings for him but understands that it will never happen since he's happily married to her sister, hence the pain she's going through while living with them. While I agree that Saki's character is heavily modeled after the typical 'damsel in distress', her affection for her brother-in-law doesn't appear to be beholden to such gender stereotypes (thankfully).

On another note, I hope nothing bad does happen to Oosugi next episode, because then Saki will most likely feel it's all her fault and then that will confirm with absolute assurance that he is nothing more than a pity character: pitied by the audience and the other characters as well. What a a poor, pitiful, loser...

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Old 2009-05-09, 19:47   Link #100
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Fantastic episode, I really liked it, one of my favorites without doubt! There are so many things that have been shown to us.

We have definitive proof that Akira didn't kill the NEET, he he... I always knew that it didn't match with the food and the containers. Now we know they have been sent to Dubai. I wonder how exactly that helped them. I somehow can imagine what's the thought behind that. I remember NHK where basically it is shown that the perfect cure for a Hikikomori is to makehim starve, then he'll be forced to get out from his room. Now I guess the the concept is similar, get the NEETs and throw them out of their fancy easy lifestyle and they'll be forced to grow up and be more responsible.
Personally I think this is a naive perspective, expecially considering the high rate of suicides in Japan. Time will say if this really apply to Higashi no Eden.

Another important thing is that the NEET knew that Akira was going to erase his memory. It looks like that there was some sort of relationship between them and Akira. I think Akira must have talked with them a lot. That NEET was indeed angry at him, but it gave me the vibe that it was like a reunion of friends. He was angry the way usually friends are, which means he wasn't really angry. This can also explain the Johnny scene in episode 4.

We finally see number I face. Let me say it as if i was "L": Now i'm 90% sure number I is the supporter.
There are so many hints that point that way. Certainly he is the same guy that is shown on episode1 talking to Juiz. Number XI expects number I to react against another seleçao that messed up. The reason i don't say 100% is because there is that 10% chance that number I believes to be the supporter but in fact he is not.
However he definitely acts as a "supporter" whether he's the real one or a fake.

We now know that missiles were launched by SDF. As I thought this is the work of a seleçao and this also supports the idea that Juiz's power is limited to Japan. No foreign army is involved. It's debatable if the missile attack was done by Akira, however I think I know the reason behind it. The guy that ordered those attacks believes that Japan is too laid down and it should be better prepared on a militaristic level. By throwing missiles on Tokyo he hopes Japanese will realize they can't just rely that much on peace. Peace won't last forever.
This guy however is not a psycho, he made it so to cause no victims. Certainly the power of Juiz is behind this, otherwise this wouldn't be possible. It's hard to determine why the last attack caused victims. Maybe it was an accident, or maybe this guy enraged by the feeble response decided to act more seriously.

The seleçao name has leaked. This is realistic. To carry all those orders Juiz has probably used an enormous amount of people from different places. Many of these people are probably aware of the seleçao, while not clearly knowing what they are exactly.

It looks like Akira keeps at heart the problems related to NEETs. Even with his memory erased it looks like he still see this as one of the major problems with Japan, the only difference is that now he seem tho think the problem relies on the system itself. I'm looking forward to what Akira is going to do. He's an incredibly resourceful guy. Surprise me, Akira!

About Osugi, man he's so helpless! I can't help but sympathize with him, but certainly he's diggin his own grave. Am I the only one that noticed that "Saki-chan"? He treats her as if she was his childhood's friend, and as someone already pointed out:

Quote:
Originally Posted by hamstar View Post
once a girl sees you as a friend it is rare that she will see you as a love interest later.
I just hope nothing bad will happen to him, he is stupid but he doesn't deserve to die by blood loss from "johnny" deprivation.

I'd like to voice my opinion about Saki but first:

Quote:
Originally Posted by orion View Post
Because this is the female fantasy that some women who date married men go thru, "If I stick around, he'll recognize that he loves me more and dump her for me." When it doesn't happen, the poor schmuck is left emo and going thru a "Do I leave or do I hang in there?" crossroads. It's a very common scenario to be trapped in. I'm sure she loves that family but on a level this is in the background. She's crying in a park saying that she loves the guy like she's realising that she has to end a relationship and move on. Most adult females don't cry over crushes.
I personally have a completely different view. I think it was evident that Saki wants to leave that house no matter what, the problem is she can't. My idea is that she had to endure many years in that situation while hoping to graduate faster and get a job. I think she knows she has to move on, but do you really think you can move on when you have to live in the same house with the man you love? It's nearly impossible. Ryusuke is being completely clueless, but something tells me that the sister knows.

If there's something i think Saki should be criticized about it that she is a bit self-centered. She is having a very hard time and a lot of confusion in her head, however because of that she's not paying attention to her surrounding. She doesn't seem to be aware that other people around her might also have a hard time. This is why she is completely clueless about Ohsugi's feelings. She was supposed to have lunch with him, but she completely forgot that. Well if you ask me... that's what your average young woman do. I don't really know many girls that realize that people around them might have a harder time than them.

I'm completely disgusted by how Saki was treated at that company interview. Not telling a person straightaway that she didn't pass, this is not courtesy this is called being coward. And when someone doesn't get a clue, you don't spill food on them. That was something very immature. I wonder if this is based on actual facts.
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