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Old 2011-09-09, 01:50   Link #3961
Westlo
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We need that "My Kumagawa can't be this Moe" spinoff.
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Old 2011-09-09, 05:08   Link #3962
Tactics
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It's unique, that it's always the most negative person is the most famous character in a shounen manga.
Kumagawa sure had his own charm, aiming for harem end ?
Too bad the person with that "reason to kill" ( I forgot his name ), is not making appearance anymore.
If I recall correctly, he's still in Top 10 Favorite Character, isn't he ?

Quote:
Originally Posted by Last Carpet View Post
I seriously wish Nisio would stop beating around the bush with this.

Zenkichi's feelings have been obvious since Chapter 1. But Medaka says she refuses to live her life for one person. She even said "I love you" to her most hated enemy, but not to her best friend?

This is one of the reasons I want Zen to pursue someone else, preferably Mukae. Not just to see if it will get a rise out of Medaka, but for Zen to get some love an affection which Medaka doesn't give him.

I don't think she's in denial, so much as she is refusing to change her worldview. Something really big has to happen to change an aspect of the way Medaka has been for 15 years. Zenkichi dying isn't going to work, so I can only hope he turns evil in the future, leaving Medaka without her (so-called) best friend and emotion crutch for the first time.

Until she gets over this and admits to herself that she can hold one person higher on a personal level than everyone else on earth

MedakaXZenkichi will more than likely never happen.
Just because Medaka casually use "I love you" to the others,
It still didn't nullify her personal feelings to Zenkichi.
Her personal feelings for Zenkichi that is enough to stop her from going rampage when she is fighting Unzen.

Just like you said, Medaka is too dense.
To inspired by Zenkichi words from her childhood until she turned into something like that

Luckily, Zenkichi is not that kind of lovesick person.
His loyalty to Medaka is his form of affection towards her.
Following her until the senior high school is not an easy task.
Thanks to Zenkichi also, everyone saved from Medaka kiss during their childhood.
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Old 2011-09-09, 07:16   Link #3963
Soji
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Westlo@I see where you coming from ...but is not a good idea assume that the author prefers to write more about Kumagawa that Zen ... I repeat that, I understand why you say it, but if the author himself dont says his preference is better not to say things like that. (they can be truth like they can not ).
Tactics@I agree with you is admirable how he managed to stand alongside Medaka
so far. But it is also why Iwish he got a little more ... even though I know he does not expect anything.
That is, after all the sacrifices that does is that it is committed to keep pace with Medaka and the others he deserve just a little something more .
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Old 2011-09-09, 07:26   Link #3964
Last Carpet
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tactics View Post

Just because Medaka casually use "I love you" to the others,
It still didn't nullify her personal feelings to Zenkichi.
Her personal feelings for Zenkichi that is enough to stop her from going rampage when she is fighting Unzen.

Just like you said, Medaka is too dense.
To inspired by Zenkichi words from her childhood until she turned into something like that

Luckily, Zenkichi is not that kind of lovesick person.
His loyalty to Medaka is his form of affection towards her.
Following her until the senior high school is not an easy task.
Thanks to Zenkichi also, everyone saved from Medaka kiss during their childhood.
I know most of that, I'm just waiting for something to happen to get through that thick skull of hers to make her realize that she loves Zenkichi more than she loves the entire world.

She says she loves the whole world, but it's obvious she loves Zenkichi more. You don't see her crying for everyone, just him. She's so dense that I don't think she even realizes that she values him over everyone else.

This is why I want Zen to switch sides. Him nearly getting killed by Kei made Medaka cry, him getting killed by Misogi drove her crazy and made her cry.

I honestly think that having him turn against her, so she'll be without her (so-called) best friend, is what will force her to admit to herself and the rest of the manga world that she loves him above everyone else.
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Old 2011-09-09, 09:52   Link #3965
Tactics
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Last Carpet View Post
I know most of that, I'm just waiting for something to happen to get through that thick skull of hers to make her realize that she loves Zenkichi more than she loves the entire world.

She says she loves the whole world, but it's obvious she loves Zenkichi more. You don't see her crying for everyone, just him. She's so dense that I don't think she even realizes that she values him over everyone else.

This is why I want Zen to switch sides. Him nearly getting killed by Kei made Medaka cry, him getting killed by Misogi drove her crazy and made her cry.

I honestly think that having him turn against her, so she'll be without her (so-called) best friend, is what will force her to admit to herself and the rest of the manga world that she loves him above everyone else.
Actually, what I'm trying to say is ....

It's so hard looking for such romantic cliche in this kind of manga.
Zenkichi loyalty and Medaka reaction for him is enough for me,
Since this kind of manga always keep romantic issue in minimal level just like what happened to Akune - Wanizuka, or maybe Kumagawa - Mukae.

Having Zenkichi switching side to aim romantic cliche is quite--- hard.

What is his true value ? A normal human ? Zenkichi loyalty is also strong.
Medaka also have The End which will allow her to exceed everything.
She's main character just like what Ajimu said.

The only possible scenario ....
Ajimu managed to have Zenkichi brainwashed, and then she said,
"If you want him back, give me your The End skill !"

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Old 2011-09-09, 10:50   Link #3966
noobita
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I never understand about this. Why people loves Zen so much? I can't see any good point about this character at all. Plus, his design don't really great at all, especially when you compare him to Misogi.
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Old 2011-09-09, 11:21   Link #3967
Soji
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Quote:
Originally Posted by noobita View Post
I never understand about this. Why people loves Zen so much? I can't see any good point about this character at all. Plus, his design don't really great at all, especially when you compare him to Misogi.
If you think about it other people might ask you the same exact thing in regard to Misogi.
The fact of like a character or not and the style of that character is subjective as well as the merits or defects on that character.
For you, maybe Zen merit are defect, while for others the qualities that you see on Misogi are defects.
So I think that sometimes it is better not to ask questions like this for the simple fact that it is subjective and it depends from person to person.

Edit:
Quote:
The only possible scenario ....
Ajimu managed to have Zenkichi brainwashed, and then she said,
"If you want him back, give me your The End skill !"
I can see this happen , although I think there is more to their hystory .
But if this scenario ever happens why I fear that Medaka would prefer to keep the end instead of take back Zen?
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Old 2011-09-09, 12:49   Link #3968
Kusa-San
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I would like it more if Zen end up with Ajimu and fight against Medaka.

Now, about Zen ranking, he's still third when it comes to guy which is not that bad. What I don't like lately about how he's protrayed is it seems that he don't understand Medaka anymore when he's supposed to know her the best (as said in one of the chapter). It seems to me that Nisio don't know how to write him well because he's not anormal like the other which means that Nisio is not that great and don't know how to make normal people interesting.
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Old 2011-09-09, 14:10   Link #3969
Xacual
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My top 5 is more like Kumagawa, Naze, Ajimu, Medaka, Zen. I'm happy that Kumagawa crushed the competition though, great color page.

On the Zen front, I kind of like the fact that Zen was pretty much forced into taking an abnormality which he didn't want. It would be interesting if at some point soon, Ajimu retakes the abnormality and he loses his sight since according to Kumagawa back then he should have been stuck blinded..
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Old 2011-09-09, 14:46   Link #3970
Soji
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xacual View Post
My top 5 is more like Kumagawa, Naze, Ajimu, Medaka, Zen. I'm happy that Kumagawa crushed the competition though, great color page.

On the Zen front, I kind of like the fact that Zen was pretty much forced into taking an abnormality which he didn't want. It would be interesting if at some point soon, Ajimu retakes the abnormality and he loses his sight since according to Kumagawa back then he should have been stuck blinded..
You know you made me come up with something.
I wonder if Najime are waiting for Zen to learn appreciate/love parasite eyes and then suddenly take them away from him and (as you said yourself) loses his sight as well.
and then see how he react to the lack of parasite Eyes + (of course) its sight and propose a deal.
Like ll give them back to you but .....Enter proposal that usually do the final boss
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Old 2011-09-09, 21:53   Link #3971
Westlo
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If any male character switches sides it will be Kumagawa, he can have his "Majin Vegeta" moment since he is the Vegeta to Medaka's Goku.. and I guess Zen is ChiChi lol...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kusa-San View Post
It seems to me that Nisio don't know how to write him well because he's not anormal like the other which means that Nisio is not that great and don't know how to make normal people interesting.
Zen's easily the most plain male lead that Nisio has wrote imo, I agree that Nisio can't make normal people interesting.. even the Zaregoto lead who "seems" normal said some stuff that made you think "WTF" and from what I've been told I haven't seen the anything just yet.. and I never will unless it gets an anime.
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Old 2011-09-10, 00:51   Link #3972
Soji
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Westlo View Post
If any male character switches sides it will be Kumagawa, he can have his "Majin Vegeta" moment since he is the Vegeta to Medaka's Goku.. and I guess Zen is ChiChi lol...
Never say never, anything is possible in this manga, you should have understood by now.
And compared Zen to Chichi is a no ... Chichi is a lot worse (if we go to your reasoning) I do really think she is like as you describe Zen.

Quote:
Zen's easily the most plain male lead that Nisio has wrote imo, I agree that Nisio can't make normal people interesting.. even the Zaregoto lead who "seems" normal said some stuff that made you think "WTF" and from what I've been told I haven't seen the anything just yet.. and I never will unless it gets an anime.
Again give a Zen some slack I know what you think about him ...but it's seems you really like shot him down is like your hobby
For being so plain he sure make you do comment like thatXD
So much for being so plain if he can get you to react so
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Old 2011-09-10, 06:29   Link #3973
Sol Falling
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Westlo View Post
Zen's easily the most plain male lead that Nisio has wrote imo, I agree that Nisio can't make normal people interesting.. even the Zaregoto lead who "seems" normal said some stuff that made you think "WTF" and from what I've been told I haven't seen the anything just yet.. and I never will unless it gets an anime.
Haha, Ii-chan seemed normal? I don't think he remotely ever approached that categorization for me. Maybe that's 'cause I started with the second novel first, though. God, I'm seriously waiting hard for more Zaregoto to come out. Everything in that series manages to be pretty fucking twisted, even the "normal" people.

Anyway, by this point I'm having a hard time even conceiving Zenkichi as a 'lead'. Amongst the members of the Student Council, he's a worthy contributor, sure. But that's honestly the side-stories, the pawns, the buildup, really. In terms of overarching conflicts, and the world at Medaka's level--Medaka's intentions, Medaka's outcomes--Zen has always been pretty much only a 'perspective' character.

A perspective character becomes a main when his viewpoint takes you places you could never go. I don't think Zenkichi's "perspective" has become remotely unique anymore for receiving insight into the world and universe of Medaka Box's characters.

However, in light of Zenkichi being a 'perspective' character, it's actually really ironic and funny that his abnormality is "parasite seeing", lol.
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Old 2011-09-10, 14:24   Link #3974
Doc Astaroth
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Spoiler for popularity poll results:
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Old 2011-09-10, 14:31   Link #3975
Shadow5YA
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Zenkichi was supposed to be the foil to Medaka as the normal to her abnormality. He used to be like Kyon, which is why people used to like him, but people jumped ship because Kumagawa is just a fun character.
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Old 2011-09-10, 16:01   Link #3976
LeaD36
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i rlly dun get how the top 2 of anyone reading this manga can be anything else but kumagawa / akune. the rest of the characters just don't have that much of an imapct
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Old 2011-09-10, 16:31   Link #3977
Kleeyook
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Everyone realizes that the reason that Zen looks so plain compared to most casts is obviously because the author want to, right? I feel bad for all of us who has hope that Zen's role will become important or he'll become more badass while worrying about the fact that the author might just want to piss us off by simply make Zen forgotten from the series. After all, the series' name is "Medaka's Box", not "Zenkichi's Pitiful Devotion of Love Towards Medaka".
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Old 2011-09-10, 17:00   Link #3978
K. Shiruto
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kleeyook View Post
Everyone realizes that the reason that Zen looks so plain compared to most casts is obviously because the author want to, right? I feel bad for all of us who has hope that Zen's role will become important or he'll become more badass while worrying about the fact that the author might just want to piss us off by simply make Zen forgotten from the series. After all, the series' name is "Medaka's Box", not "Zenkichi's Pitiful Devotion of Love Towards Medaka".
Looks like someone will have to eat his/her words...

Yeah, the series name is "Medaka Box", so what? Do I need to write you here some series which have the name of some character as title and yet that so called character isn't the main? The main character of this series is and has always been Zenkichi, and Medaka his reason for everything that has happened till now.
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Old 2011-09-10, 17:44   Link #3979
LeaD36
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^It's inofficially Kumagawa Box as of latest events.
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Old 2011-09-10, 18:04   Link #3980
Kleeyook
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Adan View Post
Looks like someone will have to eat his/her words...

Yeah, the series name is "Medaka Box", so what? Do I need to write you here some series which have the name of some character as title and yet that so called character isn't the main? The main character of this series is and has always been Zenkichi, and Medaka his reason for everything that has happened till now.

Yeah, just like how "To Aru Majutsu no Index" is almost all about Imagine Breaker and "Hidan no Aria" is almost all about Kinji's histeria mode. The author makes the MC looks like a loser who get lucky and that makes the readers feel like they could do better than him. If Zenkichi never improves himself and gets forgotten or less has less important role later is because he sucks, not because the author wants him to...

I really hope that Zen's role will become more important again. I'd be mad if not. But i don't think anyone else would give a damn and just forget his existence later anyway...
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