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View Poll Results: Eden of the East - Episode 8 Rating
Perfect 10 9 15.25%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 16 27.12%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 17 28.81%
7 out of 10 : Good 12 20.34%
6 out of 10 : Average 1 1.69%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 1 1.69%
4 out of 10 : Poor 1 1.69%
3 out of 10 : Bad 1 1.69%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 1 1.69%
1 out of 10 : Painful 0 0%
Voters: 59. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2009-05-29, 22:57   Link #41
miroku2192
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Just watched the episode. Ohsugi really pissed me off with his rather "cocky" attitude.

"i have a little bit of pride you know" -> my ass you do. Did you forget that he spent 1.6 billion yen for you and went through a LOT of trouble to save you? That was a really ironic statement, and it really pissed me off that he would say something like that.

If i were him, i'd be so grateful if a random stranger whom i've never had contact with dish out THAT much money and effort to save ME.
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Old 2009-05-29, 23:14   Link #42
vaden
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Quote:
Originally Posted by miroku2192 View Post
Just watched the episode. Ohsugi really pissed me off with his rather "cocky" attitude.

"i have a little bit of pride you know" -> my ass you do. Did you forget that he spent 1.6 billion yen for you and went through a LOT of trouble to save you? That was a really ironic statement, and it really pissed me off that he would say something like that.

If i were him, i'd be so grateful if a random stranger whom i've never had contact with dish out THAT much money and effort to save ME.
Ohsugi's already rather distrustful of Akira. I could easily see how, in his mind, the whole situation could come off as "the others go on a wild goose chase based on tenuous evidence of a kidnapping, and Takizawa goes off on a bend of misguided heroics to 'save' me and gets himself injured." He's not thinking rationally because he's frustrated with how this whole situation came up while he was pushed out of the loop (and he doesn't know everything we do as viewers, either).
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Old 2009-05-29, 23:25   Link #43
~BC~
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Pride doesn't necessarily equal cocky and even Oosugi seems to realize that he's not a shining example of it. Also why do people think he was suppose to know about the hotel purchase? Going by the discussion they had in the clubroom they clearly don't know the real details about what went down.
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Old 2009-05-29, 23:31   Link #44
miroku2192
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Originally Posted by ~BC~ View Post
Pride doesn't necessarily equal cocky and even Oosugi seems to realize that he's not a shining example of it. Also why do people think he was suppose to know about the hotel purchase? Going by the discussion they had in the clubroom they clearly don't know the real details about what went down.
Oh i don't think he knows either, but im just saying im pissed he doesn't know, i would STILL be AMAZED if someone risked their life for ME. someone i don't know too! he got hurt...

By cocky i mean, he's too full of himself. He thinks he deserves her even though he doesn't really think about what he's lacking, and why she is so attracted to akira.
Oosugi doesn't know crap from what i can tell, he thinks he has pride so thats why he can't get along with akira, but clearly he doesn't if he can't accept the fact that akira risked his life to save him.
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Old 2009-05-29, 23:34   Link #45
Raiga
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Originally Posted by golthin View Post
it is funny how the Japanese added kanji to their writing system to help with all the homophones of their language and after a little while those Kanji words ended having as many synonyms.
Kinda off topic, but didn't kanji come first? Seeing as the kana are all simplified forms of script/cursive kanji, which ultimately all derives from Chinese hanzi. Kanji definitely help with homophones but that's a reason to keep them, not why they were introduced (in fact some language reformists are campaigning to get rid of kanji, make the language completely phonetic). Homophones just arise anyway, even with kanji, considering you've got a syllable-based language with only ~70 such syllables to work with.

And yah, even if his actions come across as kind of annoying/intrusive/whatever, I gotta say I at least sympathize with Oosugi... what's a perfectly normal and flawed human being to do, eh? The guy is somewhat uncomfortably relatable.


Also ~BC~ our avs are disoreintingly similar. XD
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Old 2009-05-29, 23:49   Link #46
~BC~
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Quote:
Originally Posted by miroku2192 View Post
He thinks he deserves her even though he doesn't really think about what he's lacking, and why she is so attracted to akira.
Oosugi doesn't know crap from what i can tell, he thinks he has pride so thats why he can't get along with akira, but clearly he doesn't if he can't accept the fact that akira risked his life to save him.
Hmm, I've never thought of it as him thinking he deserves her but I agree on the not really thinking part. Someone on this forum had a nice quote about how he's selfish in his desire for her.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Raiga
And yah, even if his actions come across as kind of annoying/intrusive/whatever, I gotta say I at least sympathize with Oosugi... what's a perfectly normal and flawed human being to do, eh? The guy is somewhat uncomfortably relatable.
I find both him and Saki to be the most interesting because of their motivations.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Raiga
Also ~BC~ our avs are disoreintingly similar. XD
Mine is cuter.
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Old 2009-05-29, 23:52   Link #47
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Ohsugi is a paranoid over jealous stalking outrageous fiend? He's some what creepy... or maybe just to me. Or maybe he's just an unlikely character for me.

Oh I got a question thats been bugging me for awhile. In a lot of series when a person is asked what's wrong, what happened, did anything happen? They always seem to say "nothing". Why is this? Isn't this like against common sense not to leave important things. If you do, things just get worse.
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Old 2009-05-29, 23:52   Link #48
vaden
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(more semi-off-topic kanji stuff)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Raiga View Post
Kinda off topic, but didn't kanji come first? Seeing as the kana are all simplified forms of script/cursive kanji, which ultimately all derives from Chinese hanzi.
Kanji do derive from Chinese characters, but the Japanese had a separate spoken language at first. When kanji started gaining traction, there was an odd cross-pollination over time where Chinese characters were matched with semantically-appropriate Japanese readings in some contexts while Chinese pronunciations were kept in others (usually compound terms or idiomatic constructions), leading to the "many-to-many" relationship between kanji and pronunciations.

(At least this is my understanding of the subject.)

Quote:
(in fact some language reformists are campaigning to get rid of kanji, make the language completely phonetic)
I believe this actually happened with Korean.
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Old 2009-05-29, 23:57   Link #49
Raiga
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Yah, there's no more hanja in Korean (except for names I think?), just the phonetic hangul. And I know Japanese had a spoken form before Chinese influence... nonetheless, when a writing system was developed, it would have been kanji first, wouldn't it? So that kanji weren't "added to help with homophones," they just came with the written system to begin with. Or rather, I'm not sure if there was a writing system in Japan before then (I think I heard somewhere there wasn't?), but from what I've read it looks like the modern character set essentially completely derives from Chinese, so it sorta amounts to the same thing in this discussion...

As for alternate pronunciations, I think at least part of it has to do with most kanji having a Chinese reading and a native Japanese reading.
Quote:
Originally Posted by ~BC~ View Post
Mine is cuter.
Uso! D<

Well, Micchon is cute anyway...

Also +100 points geek appeal for being godly with computers. XD
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Old 2009-05-30, 00:04   Link #50
fish eric
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Originally Posted by Raiga View Post
Yah, there's no more hanja in Korean (except for names I think?), just the phonetic hangul. And I know Japanese had a spoken form before Chinese influence... nonetheless, when a writing system was developed, it would have been kanji first, wouldn't it? So that kanji weren't "added to help with homophones," they just came with the written system to begin with. Or rather, I'm not sure if there was a writing system in Japan before then (I think I heard somewhere there wasn't?), but from what I've read it looks like the modern character set essentially completely derives from Chinese, so it sorta amounts to the same thing in this discussion...

As for alternate pronunciations, I think at least part of it has to do with most kanji having a Chinese reading and a native Japanese reading.


Uso! D<

Well, Micchon is cute anyway...

Also +100 points geek appeal for being godly with computers. XD

There is nothing sexier than a cute girl who is a programmer.


I think Hiragana must have come first. You can write a complete sentance or even a whole book using just hiragana. I mean shonen Jump spells out any Kanji in Hiragana.

But you can't write a sentence using just Kanji. Instead of thinking of kanas as simplified Kanji wouldn't it make more sense to say that a Kanji is multiple kanas put together to form a single character?



This episode was great. This whole series is great. The story line is just so immersive.

I wonder what Oushugi saw at the mall...
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Old 2009-05-30, 00:23   Link #51
Raiga
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Originally Posted by fish eric View Post
I think Hiragana must have come first. You can write a complete sentance or even a whole book using just hiragana. I mean shonen Jump spells out any Kanji in Hiragana.

But you can't write a sentence using just Kanji. Instead of thinking of kanas as simplified Kanji wouldn't it make more sense to say that a Kanji is multiple kanas put together to form a single character?
Nope, since kanji comes straight from Chinese hanzi (most kanji are identical to traditional Chinese characters) and isn't built out of simpler native Japanese characters (more complicated kanji can actually be seen to be built from other simpler kanji, but not hiragana). And if you go to this page you can see how both forms of kana were derived from kanji.
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Old 2009-05-30, 01:10   Link #52
fish eric
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Nope, since kanji comes straight from Chinese hanzi (most kanji are identical to traditional Chinese characters) and isn't built out of simpler native Japanese characters (more complicated kanji can actually be seen to be built from other simpler kanji, but not hiragana). And if you go to this page you can see how both forms of kana were derived from kanji.
interesting. I still don't see how they could have written with just Kanji. Maybe when they developed the written language they did both at the same time?



I wonder what the deal is with this show and the word "Johnny" Oushugi says Im gonna grab Takizawa by his Johnny (gay)

At the very begining of the episode, During Akira's dream he sees Diana flying, but he was alseep and doesn't remember it so how did he dream of it? And we once again see the Johnny creature from earlier in the show.
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Old 2009-05-30, 01:20   Link #53
vaden
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Originally Posted by ThoHell View Post
Oh I got a question thats been bugging me for awhile. In a lot of series when a person is asked what's wrong, what happened, did anything happen? They always seem to say "nothing". Why is this? Isn't this like against common sense not to leave important things. If you do, things just get worse.
Most likely they don't want to burden friends with the issue (this "typical" response is partially a cultural thing too).


Quote:
Originally Posted by fish eric View Post
interesting. I still don't see how they could have written with just Kanji. Maybe when they developed the written language they did both at the same time?
The kana developed out of man'yougana, which were kanji used to represent phonetic sounds much like kana are today, so at some point kanji were used as a syllabary to supplement more semantic uses.
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Old 2009-05-30, 01:43   Link #54
Nobodyman9
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Okay, is it just me or did like nothing happen in this episode? Maybe it's because this is the first episode without knowing I've got one to follow up on immediately, but to me this episode seemed very slow. It seems that the focus was on this Itazu character, and then there was that bit with Ohsugi and some more details on the Eden of the East club, but a lot of it seemed unnecessary. Well, hopefully next week will be better.
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Old 2009-05-30, 03:34   Link #55
zero1328
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I'm very surprised no one has said anything about Pantsu's comment about there only being 11 Selecao. The possibility of Akira being Mr. OUTSIDE just skyrocketed.
That kinda sounds like a ridiculous theory, to me. It would make more sense if you remember that the Supporter also has one of the 12 Selecao phones, and we know next to nothing about his actual identity and purpose.
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Old 2009-05-30, 03:59   Link #56
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You can easily write a sentence in kanji only---while Japanese is technically completely variable due to particles, it's predictably SOV enough in practice where reading classical Chinese on an academic basis is a matter of special symbols to mark order. Not to mention, just as French and Latin wele the language of the educated class in England, and were legally valid for court proceedings until the 18th century, China was enough of a cultural influence where the earliest "Japanese" writing was an attempt to represent Japanese in documents that must be considered Chinese-language, whether produced by Chinese envoys and monks who had learned some Japanese or by the educated class of Japanese who had learned Chinese.

Were there no Roman letters, and writing was unknown until contact was made with Japan which presumably would have been in the running of colonial powers were Western civilization to not exist, certainly much of the beauty of English would be lost on paper, and phonetic detail would be utterly removed in text. But a mishmash such as 彼1我4球3投2 or later 彼スルーザ球アット我 would, when given force of habit and a childhood of academic reinforcement, easily be recognized as "he threw the ball at me", and with contextual distinction ruling out "he through the ball at me" in the later, nativized/phoneticized version.
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Old 2009-05-30, 04:05   Link #57
Haak
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I'm very surprised no one has said anything about Pantsu's comment about there only being 11 Selecao. The possibility of Akira being Mr. OUTSIDE just skyrocketed.
#12 is the only badge that #1 doesn't connect to in the opening.

Overall, I really loved this episode. Lot's of suspense.

I don't know why loads of people are hating on Oosugi. He's not perfect but no one is. Even Akira (too naive and doesn't think things through fully). Everyone has their bad moments in life. He's not really doing anything that I can't empathise with. Someone previously metnioned that he's imposing his will on others. He is doing that to an extent but to be fair I don't think it's part of personality. He's just being like that because of his jelousy and suspicion over Akira. And doesn't seme to me like he was planning on actually doing anything until he found out that Akira had multiple identities. And finding out that Akira has multiple identities will make him far more suspicious.
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Old 2009-05-30, 04:49   Link #58
GundamMeisterLockon
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i got a feeling Oosugi is trying to catch akira out so he can score points with saki
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Old 2009-05-30, 05:43   Link #59
golthin
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i got a feeling Oosugi is trying to catch akira out so he can score points with saki
nah, he just wanted to find who the guy was and he walked into something bigger and sinester.
My only problem with Akira is that he doesn't mind involving other people in something as dangerous as this.
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Old 2009-05-30, 05:47   Link #60
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...He's just being like that because of his jelousy and suspicion over Akira. And doesn't seme to me like he was planning on actually doing anything until he found out that Akira had multiple identities. And finding out that Akira has multiple identities will make him far more suspicious.
I have to agree. The green-eyed monster rears its head and when jealousy consumes a person, every action appears justified, no matter how irrational to everyone else. I'm not a huge fan of Ohsugi's character either, but meh, if it advances the plot, then I'll just have to bear with him while the rest of the story plays out.

Ohsugi certainly got more than he bargained for when he digs to find out more about Akira - naturally, one action leads to another. He can't stop now, not when there's too many questions and holes in this Akira guy. I mean, I want to know!!

More and more questions, and so few of them answered in this episode. Another long wait before the next episode!
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