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Old 2010-04-10, 10:34   Link #841
Hypernova
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Originally Posted by RedWing View Post
The thing is it isn't exactly very hard to rebel. There are no restrictions put on your freedom or any oppression of some sort. There are no punishments or anyone being made an example of.

You just have to not do what you're told.

I don't think that is something that people usually have any problem doing.

Also, although I admit I am reaching somewhat, what are the limits to their creation process? I said a nuke because theoretically the process behind a nuclear reaction is not all that complicated. A Scientist can tell you exactly how a carbon nanotube works/look like, could he build a cable made of them?
If they can make any raw material out of dirt a nuke is child's play.

Without regard to yield efficiency:

-synth 5Kg of plutonium, make two blocks of it,
-stick them into both end of a thick tube
-add some C4 to one end of the tube and seal the other end
-Seal the other end plus det cord
-Now when you detonate it the two blocks get smashed together, some of it will reach crit mass and then BOOM.
-Only a very, VERY small part will actually react, but remember, the Hiroshima one used 64KG of uranium and only about 0.6g of it actually reacted. But look what that did.

This is a very basic but easy design, the nuke developed by South Africa during the 80's used the same principle.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gun-type_fission_weapon

IMO they are just limited by real world physics, the cannon didn't work because it was poorly designed. You can see that the barrel is waaaay too thin and indeed the thing exploded from overpressure the moment they tried to use it.

Last edited by Hypernova; 2010-04-10 at 10:49.
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Old 2010-04-10, 10:46   Link #842
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Well, at least Key finally made some progress in making me feel bad for the characters and realizing what type of a situation this is.

BTW, LIA LIA LIA LIA LIA LIA!!! <3 <3 <3 <3

I'm guessing that they're going to have two to three more episodes like this, with a plot contained in a single episode, and then start to delve into a single plotline with cliffhangers each week.
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Old 2010-04-10, 10:48   Link #843
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lol second episode...I like the sacrifice part with her group members
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Old 2010-04-10, 10:49   Link #844
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Well, they are also limited by their experiences. The reason why the Guild is so important (as Yuri says) is because of their memories, which includes something about firearms. They are the only ones who could make gunpowder/ammunition; if it was that easy to make something out of dirt, the group wouldn't needed to stock up in the Guild in the first place. As such, since I highly doubt anyone in the cast has seen what actual plutonium/uranium looks like, they won't be able to build a nuke even if they wanted to.

Which also begs the question, if the cast cannot die and there seems to be no repercussions being caught by Tenshi, why are they so insistent on evacuating the Guild to the old Guild HQ? No answer in this episode, but I'm willing to wait for future episodes for explanations in this regard.
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Old 2010-04-10, 11:04   Link #845
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Originally Posted by DragoonKain3 View Post
Well, they are also limited by their experiences. The reason why the Guild is so important (as Yuri says) is because of their memories, which includes something about firearms. They are the only ones who could make gunpowder/ammunition; if it was that easy to make something out of dirt, the group wouldn't needed to stock up in the Guild in the first place. As such, since I highly doubt anyone in the cast has seen what actual plutonium/uranium looks like, they won't be able to build a nuke even if they wanted to.

Which also begs the question, if the cast cannot die and there seems to be no repercussions being caught by Tenshi, why are they so insistent on evacuating the Guild to the old Guild HQ? No answer in this episode, but I'm willing to wait for future episodes for explanations in this regard.
Well, they use the guild for mass production but if the dirt part is true then it seems they can perform elemental transmutation quite easily (given that you need sulfur for gun powder). They probably don't use nuke because it's just too powerful. A surface 15KT explosion would completely wipe out the school.

Not to mention how the japanese feel about nukes.
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Old 2010-04-10, 11:11   Link #846
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That's exactly it. The Guild can create Sulfur if they like, since they have past memories concerning firearms. Highly doubt anyone in the cast has past memories concerning about plutonium/uranium or whatnot (even in the western world those people are pretty rare), so they can't make a nuke even if they wanted to.
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Old 2010-04-10, 11:20   Link #847
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Originally Posted by DragoonKain3 View Post
That's exactly it. The Guild can create Sulfur if they like, since they have past memories concerning firearms. Highly doubt anyone in the cast has past memories concerning about plutonium/uranium or whatnot (even in the western world those people are pretty rare), so they can't make a nuke even if they wanted to.
Rare? I doubt it, if all you do is "imagine" an element then it's not hard. It's high school chemistry after all, and I read about basic nuke design in elementary level books for children back when I was maybe 9. Plutonium is a silvery metal just like most other. Like showed once you get the Pu-239 turning it into a bomb is VERY easy. If you have enough knowledge level to make guns you have enough to make nukes.

The writer just doesn't want to go there.
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Old 2010-04-10, 11:55   Link #848
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When people say that Yuri is similar to Haruhi, it doesn't mean that her characterization is a carbon copy. What Yuri's problem is is that her mannerisms are practically a copy of Haruhi's, from the way she stands, to the way she gestures, even the way she expresses annoyance.
I think I have to agree with this statement.
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Old 2010-04-10, 12:09   Link #849
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Supposedly they can only create things they remember. They can imagine up guns because some of them have had experiences with them, so I doubt they can do the same with the tools that can make guns for example, let alone a nuke... Though they did imagine up all of those ginormous stuff in the Guild... Apparently not a silly cannon though... I'm gonna stop analyzing this for rationality now...

Spoiler for Prequel Ooyama:
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Old 2010-04-10, 12:18   Link #850
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Originally Posted by Free View Post
Supposedly they can only create things they remember. They can imagine up guns because some of them have had experiences with them, so I doubt they can do the same with the tools that can make guns for example, let alone a nuke... Though they did imagine up all of those ginormous stuff in the Guild... Apparently not a silly cannon though... I'm gonna stop analyzing this for rationality now...

Spoiler for Prequel Ooyama:
It's just one of those fridge logic kind of thing , it would make very little sense if they can only make what they remember given that we've seen stuff in the guild that doesn't exist in real life already. Plus it would imply they can't learn or think of new things.

Either way, if I ever end up there, Tenshi's got her work cut out for her
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Old 2010-04-10, 12:39   Link #851
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Originally Posted by Hypernova View Post
It's just one of those fridge logic kind of thing , it would make very little sense if they can only make what they remember given that we've seen stuff in the guild that doesn't exist in real life already. Plus it would imply they can't learn or think of new things.

Either way, if I ever end up there, Tenshi's got her work cut out for her
There's still something called innovation at work there: simply imagine up something, then manually create something out of the parts. Seems to be how they made their grand cannon anyway (which is one of the more spectacular superweapon failures I've seen in recent anime, and I love it )

Also, people need to realize that as far as the precise mechanics go, a nuke may be simple in theory, but it took one of the largest industrial undertakings in history (The Manhattan Project) with some of the brightest minds in science to turn the atomic bomb into reality. Firearms are infinitely easier both in theory and in practice to manufacture and operate than nuclear weapons.

And another question? Why would they want to build nukes anyway? They're out to survive, not destroy the new "world" they're in

--------------

I never really had any interest in this anime until I actually the first couple of episodes this week. It's strange... it doesn't have the same HOTBLOODED MANLY PIERCE THE HEAVENS WITH YOUR DRILL power as Gurren Lagann, but somehow it has the same awesome energy in the episodes for some reason, at least in my opinion. And that they manage to tell a relatively simplistic premise into such a fast-pace without being an utterly confusing mass of metaphysics and such is a nice thing. Also, the way they know they can't die but still dread the pain associated with it anyway is a refreshing change of pace from other shows where even the smallest death flags are used as an excuse for "grimdark" settings and whatnot.

And Yuri... IMHO she's the best parts of Haruhi's hyperactive energy and spirit without the annoying arrogance, denseness or tsun tendencies, which I like. And that she can bust some awesome moves against Tenshi is
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Old 2010-04-10, 12:56   Link #852
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man i think this ending sequence is very nice and touching with great ending music to suit it.. one of my favs..

and i think the animation quality in this series looks very very well done.. soo crisp and clean..
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Old 2010-04-10, 13:27   Link #853
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Great episode. The comedy scenes were just too much. Especially when Otonashi was climbing up Yuri. XD

So apparently those that commit suicide don't end up here. That's rather interesting.
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Old 2010-04-10, 13:29   Link #854
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Great episode. The comedy scenes were just too much. Especially when Otonishi was climbing up Yuri. XD

So apparently those that commit suicide don't end up here. That's rather interesting.
those who suicide end up in a different purgatory, Old Homes.
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Old 2010-04-10, 13:30   Link #855
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So they build a big ass cannon & loaded a barrel of shell but explode before the shell hitting on Tenshi...WTF!!!!
And then they destroy that freakin huge guild in less of 3 minutes,what are those guild members thinking?!.It's not like Tenshi can have difficulties to escape from the destruction.I wonder how long that guild been exists...

The only part that I have much interest are all the members death scene.All of them except Yuri & Otonashi have comical yet gruesome death.T.K death are more heroic than others but unfortunately they less appreciate his "sacrifice"
I can't believe Shiina can fell on that trap...yeah she like cute things even it cost her life Yuri past is interesting but it's too shady to know what cause her death.

While most of the SSS guys & Shiina are already involved in death feast,when will be the turn of others girls (Yusa,Yui,Sekine,Iwasawa&Hisako) for killing spree?
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Old 2010-04-10, 13:32   Link #856
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And Yuri... IMHO she's the best parts of Haruhi's hyperactive energy and spirit without the annoying arrogance, denseness or tsun tendencies, which I like.
Exactly what i'm thinking man. Yuri > Haruhi.

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those who suicide end up in a different purgatory, Old Homes.
Ouch. XD
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Old 2010-04-10, 13:38   Link #857
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Originally Posted by RedWing View Post
The thing is it isn't exactly very hard to rebel. There are no restrictions put on your freedom or any oppression of some sort. There are no punishments or anyone being made an example of.

You just have to not do what you're told.

I don't think that is something that people usually have any problem doing.

Also, although I admit I am reaching somewhat, what are the limits to their creation process? I said a nuke because theoretically the process behind a nuclear reaction is not all that complicated. A Scientist can tell you exactly how a carbon nanotube works/look like, could he build a cable made of them?
Well, from what I can tell from the first novel, it's that most of them don't even initially realize that they're dead/in the afterlife. Think the Matrix. The majority of normal humans can't rebel because they don't realize that it's a simulation in the first place.

Quote:
Originally Posted by DragoonKain3 View Post
Well, they are also limited by their experiences. The reason why the Guild is so important (as Yuri says) is because of their memories, which includes something about firearms. They are the only ones who could make gunpowder/ammunition; if it was that easy to make something out of dirt, the group wouldn't needed to stock up in the Guild in the first place. As such, since I highly doubt anyone in the cast has seen what actual plutonium/uranium looks like, they won't be able to build a nuke even if they wanted to.

Which also begs the question, if the cast cannot die and there seems to be no repercussions being caught by Tenshi, why are they so insistent on evacuating the Guild to the old Guild HQ? No answer in this episode, but I'm willing to wait for future episodes for explanations in this regard.
Didn't Yuri mention something about losing their memories if they get caught by Tenshi?
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Old 2010-04-10, 14:26   Link #858
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okay since you can't die in this world unless you do nothing, and that yuri showed us that melee combat seems to be better than using guns and rockets. so shouldn't the groups start adapting to using more swords and less guns? this way they wouldn't really need a massive underground factory that should be producing tanks and planes, but instead produce just guns and ammos.

also i'm not getting why they're fighting/rebelling despite that neither them or Tenshi can be killed. i'm hoping this problem will be solved/revealed soon, otherwise this is no different from a video game where everyone just respawn and go pwn each other over and over again

anyways i liked episode 2. some light comedy and some background story on yuri.
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Old 2010-04-10, 14:32   Link #859
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Episode 2 is so much better than the first one in my opinion.
Yurippe past story is sad and interesting .
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Old 2010-04-10, 14:35   Link #860
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Fishfood1 View Post
okay since you can't die in this world unless you do nothing, and that yuri showed us that melee combat seems to be better than using guns and rockets. so shouldn't the groups start adapting to using more swords and less guns? this way they wouldn't really need a massive underground factory that should be producing tanks and planes, but instead produce just guns and ammos.
It isn't like melee combat is "that better" than weaponry. The thing is that Tenshi is basically a walking tank as soon as she pulls out GS Distortion. But even so, she is not really able to go panzer while keeping Disortion active it seems.
As far as it went for Episode 1, using weaponry is much more effective to stall her to a certain degree, especially if you mix it up with bladed weapon (as seen when she had to deflect a kunai). In fact, Distortion seems to be a frontal type of space distortion, or a plain thick barrier, not really a fullfledged spheric shield.

Considering the use of weaponry doesn't seem that taxing in that setup (unlike the happy-fun recoil you have IRL), it doesn't seem that all good to have several people specialized in melee combat (extremely hazardous as Tenshi seems to excel in close quarter combat, and having several people on the same team against such dodge machine would be way too detrimental regarding a proper confrontation).
In a practical way, I can't say that they have much choice.
I personaly see Yuri's decision as a last resort option to stall her, as they aren't equipped enough to repell her (being only two against her isn't really optimist). Meanwhile, having a stalemate in close combat was the only "good" option in that context, but I can't say it would in general.
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