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Old 2010-03-22, 00:54   Link #761
Hage-bai
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rajura View Post
How dare someone give me negative rep and question my integrity and accuse me of not looking out for a patient who trusts me with their best interest!


But but Rajura, you wrote this:

Quote:
Well, I will be doing the best for my patients based on my professional, educated opinion regardless of what happens and anything Congress may mandate down the line!
This is not what the Pelosi butt buddy wants to hear from you you..evil medical practitioner.

I sure hope Madam Speaker has better reading comprehension.
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Old 2010-03-22, 01:02   Link #762
cors8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marina View Post
Not really surprised at the outcome, but I wince at what's to come given that a good number of my family are in the medical field. I can't say too much without seeing first how everything pans out over the coming years, but I already have a strong urge to change citizenship.
I'm curious as to which country you'd change citizenship to that has a similar quality of life as the USA?

Personally, I think the hysteria is so overblown. It's like "Obama's gonna take away our guns!", which never happened.
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Old 2010-03-22, 01:03   Link #763
Sugetsu
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Whatever the doomsayers want to say, common sense still stands. The bill although flawed due to intense lobbying by insure companies and republicans, will be fixed gradually. The reform is huge and historic for a country where corporations control the government and much of the US.

This bill will save millions of lives over time...


Now onto immigration reform.... LOL... I can't wait to see what kind of stunts Glenn Beck and his tea party will pull off to demonize immigrants. The funny thing is, most of them associate the word illegal immigrant with a person from Mexico... Yet there are millions of people from eastern Europe, the middle east, Africa and Asia that are illegals as well.

Racism ftw.

Edit: It is hilarious that in a country where the conservatives are a dwindling a minority and where Obama won the elections by a huge margin over McCain, to see how the small GOP, fox news and its tea party movement keep trying to manipulate the perception of the nation by constantly repeating how the majority of Americans are against the bill. Now they are proclaiming that it is the end of the world as we know it because Health care will never again be the lucrative business it used to be. My prediction is that the republicans will be utterly crushed come November elections. Their track record over the last 10 years... specially the last 14th months has been nothing short of appalling.

PS. I am not a US citizen, or a Resident of this country... I just come here often for business, but I still love to follow American politics.

Last edited by Sugetsu; 2010-03-22 at 03:32.
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Old 2010-03-22, 01:06   Link #764
Rajura
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Hage-bai View Post
But but Rajura, you wrote this:



This is not what the Pelosi butt buddy wants to hear from you you..evil medical practitioner.

I sure hope Madam Speaker has better reading comprehension.

Try not to provoke the people with opposing views to wrath.

However, I can appreciate the humor in how you referred to me there, and it does make me feel a bit better, thanks. I'm just not used to such unkind accusations from people.

I just needed to vent my frustatration at the *************. (deleted for content we are not supposed to discuss... sorry).
Venting is a great cathartic after all! (and I never use these smilie things so... consider it an honor)
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Last edited by Rajura; 2010-03-22 at 18:18. Reason: Accidently posted about things not supposed to be posted about
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Old 2010-03-22, 02:25   Link #765
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The problem with the modern media is that there is too much unnecessary information that makes a clear picture near impossible.

I'm just saying this from personal experience. The more visible aspects of the two sides on this issue seem to be having a more of shouting match than anything else.

The current health care system does need an overhaul but with people shouting at the top of my lungs even the things I am clear about can get confusing if I don't pay close attention to my pereceptions and understanding from getting cloudy.

Some of the News sites are saying this could prevent Obama from getting re-elected later. If that happens then it is because not enough people who actually honestly care about what's going on and how it affects them and the US are out voting.

Sure, a lot of the people seen on TV and etc do care in their own perspective but regardless of how many people agree or disagree really go out to vote? Vote not just for the presidential election but other state and local elections or local props and etc in a organized fashion that reflects people's interests and reacting to the various actions taken by the politicians?

Not enough.

Yes, it's hard to keep up with everything but though many people got caught up in the moment during the last presidental election that had a African American man become the president of the United States keep up and followed through afterwards with more action?

I know I am rambling but just look at the voting levels seen in the U.S. Voting is key. How and when you vote for everything does make a difference but since the U.S. is relatively peaceful and well off despite the troubles over the last several years not enough people are voting.

Seriously, I sometimes wonder if the making being able to vote a right and privilege was a mistake and instead it should have been mandatory and a obligation.
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Old 2010-03-22, 03:02   Link #766
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Quote:
Originally Posted by germanturkey View Post
it was 100% democrats who voted for. all the republicans and 34 democrats voted against.
The conduct of the Republicans was nothing short of a disgrace. 99% destruction and obstruction, with zero effort to present a rivalling model. Sorry, but whoever really believes that tort reform is going to fix your broken medical system needs his head examined, and preferably in a country where you can actually afford that. So, not in the US.

They doubled down on bringing down the whole bill, and now they're the ones with the cake in their face. Some of the smarter conservatives (e.g. Frum) lament that the bill could have been much better had the Republicans negotiated in good faith, and I don't doubt that. The fact that this bill was eventually passed with Democratic votes alone is 100% the GOPs responsibility, who placed politics before everything else.

Quote:
giving coverage to an additional (if its even that) 38 million isn't worth a trillion dollars and and a screwed economy for 15 years. there are alternatives out there.
The congressional budget office forecasted that the bill was still a major improvement over the status quo, as in "hundreds of billions of dollars are saved, not a trillion spent extra". This whole "screwed economy for 15 years" is pretty much based on mere GOP propaganda with no real basis in reality. And how giving 38 million people health insurance isn't considered a worthy cause in itself only shows the glorified selfishness which permeats major parts of the American society. Sorry. "It doesn't help me, so I'm against it".

Quote:
@autumn, the senate hasn't passed a bill yet. this is attempt #2 at passing the bill the first one passed the house and died in the senate after Scott Brown got voted in. now the second one cleared the house and is going to get stuck in the senate again unless they can throw out enough money to a republican senator or use reconciliation to pass the bill. if they do the latter, i can't imagine what'll happen.
You're mistaken, the Senate isn't going to be asked anymore. HCR has succeeded and will now be signed into law by Obama. Read the various news outlets if you doubt me.
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Old 2010-03-22, 03:31   Link #767
Sugetsu
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mentar View Post
The conduct of the Republicans was nothing short of a disgrace. 99% destruction and obstruction, with zero effort to present a rivalling model. Sorry, but whoever really believes that tort reform is going to fix your broken medical system needs his head examined, and preferably in a country where you can actually afford that. So, not in the US.

They doubled down on bringing down the whole bill, and now they're the ones with the cake in their face. Some of the smarter conservatives (e.g. Frum) lament that the bill could have been much better had the Republicans negotiated in good faith, and I don't doubt that. The fact that this bill was eventually passed with Democratic votes alone is 100% the GOPs responsibility, who placed politics before everything else.



The congressional budget office forecasted that the bill was still a major improvement over the status quo, as in "hundreds of billions of dollars are saved, not a trillion spent extra". This whole "screwed economy for 15 years" is pretty much based on mere GOP propaganda with no real basis in reality. And how giving 38 million people health insurance isn't considered a worthy cause in itself only shows the glorified selfishness which permeats major parts of the American society. Sorry. "It doesn't help me, so I'm against it".



You're mistaken, the Senate isn't going to be asked anymore. HCR has succeeded and will now be signed into law by Obama. Read the various news outlets if you doubt me.
AMEN! You sir win a 1000 internet points.
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Old 2010-03-22, 03:44   Link #768
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mentar View Post
The conduct of the Republicans was nothing short of a disgrace. 99% destruction and obstruction, with zero effort to present a rivalling model. Sorry, but whoever really believes that tort reform is going to fix your broken medical system needs his head examined, and preferably in a country where you can actually afford that. So, not in the US.

They doubled down on bringing down the whole bill, and now they're the ones with the cake in their face. Some of the smarter conservatives (e.g. Frum) lament that the bill could have been much better had the Republicans negotiated in good faith, and I don't doubt that. The fact that this bill was eventually passed with Democratic votes alone is 100% the GOPs responsibility, who placed politics before everything else.



The congressional budget office forecasted that the bill was still a major improvement over the status quo, as in "hundreds of billions of dollars are saved, not a trillion spent extra". This whole "screwed economy for 15 years" is pretty much based on mere GOP propaganda with no real basis in reality. And how giving 38 million people health insurance isn't considered a worthy cause in itself only shows the glorified selfishness which permeats major parts of the American society. Sorry. "It doesn't help me, so I'm against it".



You're mistaken, the Senate isn't going to be asked anymore. HCR has succeeded and will now be signed into law by Obama. Read the various news outlets if you doubt me.
The Republican Party is pretty much a joke of a political institution at this point and a even less than a shadow of the former GOP that featured such members as Abraham Lincoln, Dwight D. Eisenhower and Teddy Roosevelt among many other honourable men. Joe Biden wasn't just taking a shot at the party when he said it was full of nothing but hardliners, he was telling the truth and to be honest I think that in it's current state it is too dangerous to world security to ever be elected again. Based on the following quote from Eisenhower I think he would be absolutely disgusted with what his party has become to day and sadly I have to imagine him turning in his grave whenever I think about it:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dwight D. Eisenhower

Should any political party attempt to abolish social security, unemployment insurance, and eliminate labor laws and farm programs, you would not hear of that party again in our political history. There is a tiny splinter group, of course, that believes you can do these things. Among them are H. L. Hunt (you possibly know his background), a few other Texas oil millionaires, and an occasional politician or business man from other areas. Their number is negligible and they are stupid.
Anyway the bill managed to pass despite the Republicans and Big Drug Business doing everything they could to stop it. Looks like Bill Clinton was right that they were going to get it in some form this time. Now we have to see how they put it into practice. You can bet that Glenn Beck and the folks and Fox News will be pulling overtime looking for stories of people who are unsatisfied with the new system in the coming years.
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Old 2010-03-22, 04:26   Link #769
Reckoner
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My favorite moment from sunday. What a clown, this orange man is. Cheers.

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Old 2010-03-22, 04:42   Link #770
Tri-ring
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He sounded more like a preacher then a politician, I was expecting him to shout "Hallelujah" during the end of his speech.
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Old 2010-03-22, 04:55   Link #771
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That's what makes it hard for me to get with some of these representatives. Too populist in tone, to me it's just condecending sometimes. I know they are not like in that in Japan (it seems like the other side of the extreme completely robotic and alientating) How are they in Europe?
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Old 2010-03-22, 07:19   Link #772
Mentar
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Oh, because some guy neg-repped me for this earlier article of mine, with this quote:

"You'd believe anything that fits your vitriolic world view wouldn't you?"

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mentar View Post
And what else are you dreaming of?

The teabagger coverages I have seen have consistently shown masses of lunatics frothing at their mouth. Calling out other fellow teabaggers for the n- and f-words? They're even going after parkinson victims peacefully sitting down and holding up pro-HCR signs. A vicious bunch.
Have a look for yourself. This video was confirmed by multiple sources and also made it into big media. This is very representative for what happens on Tea Party demonstrations:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EXsRH73Cnw8

Am I saying that every Teabagger is like this? No. But I am saying that this frothing scorn is indeed very typical for them. And it's nutcases like Beck/Limbaugh/Bachmann who whip them into this spiteful frenzy.
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Old 2010-03-22, 07:26   Link #773
solomon
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I'm disregarding such bullshite.

After reading the sinthesis of the bill, I am generally for it.

Admittedly, I haven't heard any real GOP counter ideas but then again to be fair, the media hasn't really reported on any. Whether it's bias or due to them not really saying anything I am not sure.

Still, I do think it generally moves toward a more just health care system. I think it's essential. There is too much confabulation of Health Care with some sort of commercial commodity in this country, I don't like that. It's a service and a right.

Plus, it's not like we initated a NIS over here. I honestly don't understand why the GOP is so deathly afraid of it in some sort of dumbass socialist context.

Still a legitamte worry is what this will do to the national deficit. This is about the only thing I agree with GOP and Tea Party peeps on. We are in a precarious situation vis a vis finances in this country, while it drastically increase national debt? I haven't seen many mainstream news outlets tackle that yet.

I wouldn't have minded something closer to NIS or what Canada has if more people have comprehensive care and the level of care wasn't terribly comprimised but given how large and dysfunctinal my country is, it'd be largely untenable.
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Old 2010-03-22, 08:42   Link #774
Nosauz
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Quote:
Originally Posted by germanturkey View Post
rep system is particularly bad when you get into political discussions. they don't even give a better reason for disagreeing other than "so you'll deny people healthcare." grow a pair. people our age (upperclass college/graduated/grad school) who are for this don't get that we'll be paying for it out of our paychecks for basically a generation.

also, what Pelosi said about people can be artists or photographers for a living if this bill passes cracks me up. you can do that already if you're good enough at your job. her vision is allowing people to suckle from the successful even if they're second rate.
demonizing pelosi isn't going to change the fact that in the current system I pay for those who are uninsured anyway, the uninsured still get medical care but the cost is still shifted on to paying insurance policy holders. The notion that the rich live and the poor die, just assualts all senses of what America is about, if your afraid of death panels etc, then you should be afraid of the insurance industry because their number one concern isn't your life it's their share holders. All I hear is this self righteous me first, or as long as i get mine I don't give a shit, well you guys have listened way too much to Glenn Beck and his anti social justice rally call.

Quote:
Well, I will be doing the best for my patients based on my professional, educated opinion regardless of what happens and anything Congress may mandate down the line!
Yet you still are controlled by the insurance companies to turf patients who don't have the means to pay. Sounds like you'll just be serving another master.

@kaoshin sama
didn't you know it's uncouth to speak of Teddy Roosevelt as a Republican because he was a "progressive" not only being one of the most bad ass presidents we had but apparently he was too liberal with the environment and too willing to bust trusts that the GOP now demonizes him at every turn. The Good Old Party has long died, I believe after Eisenhower the last great Republican president a new GOP has risen in it's place.
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Old 2010-03-22, 08:42   Link #775
cors8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by solomon View Post
I'm disregarding such bullshite.

After reading the sinthesis of the bill, I am generally for it.

Admittedly, I haven't heard any real GOP counter ideas but then again to be fair, the media hasn't really reported on any. Whether it's bias or due to them not really saying anything I am not sure.

Still, I do think it generally moves toward a more just health care system. I think it's essential. There is too much confabulation of Health Care with some sort of commercial commodity in this country, I don't like that. It's a service and a right.

Plus, it's not like we initated a NIS over here. I honestly don't understand why the GOP is so deathly afraid of it in some sort of dumbass socialist context.

Still a legitamte worry is what this will do to the national deficit. This is about the only thing I agree with GOP and Tea Party peeps on. We are in a precarious situation vis a vis finances in this country, while it drastically increase national debt? I haven't seen many mainstream news outlets tackle that yet.

I wouldn't have minded something closer to NIS or what Canada has if more people have comprehensive care and the level of care wasn't terribly comprimised but given how large and dysfunctinal my country is, it'd be largely untenable.
When GOP leadership offered their alternative plan, it was like 13 pages with no numbers. Rep. Paul Ryan of Wisconsin offered a more detailed plan that would reduce the deficit. However, it involved getting rid of Medicare/Medicaid or SS (I think) over the next few years to do it.

Of course, the GOP leadership definitely wouldn't go for that.
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Old 2010-03-22, 09:41   Link #776
solomon
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Naturally NO ONE will dare touch Medicare like they wouldn't touch the farm subsidies.

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/03/22/bu...health.html?hp

This provides an interesting assesment of the effect on big Pharma and hospitals

http://www.cnn.com/2010/OPINION/03/2...ex.html?hpt=C1

THis is a variety of opinion from thinkers and people on the ground about the legislation.

http://money.cnn.com/2010/03/21/news...ion=2010032122

This is commentary from anaylists on the effect on the deficit. As I said, this a concern rightys that is legitamite.


Looking back the democrats did a BAD job of selling this bill. Good perks like kids staying insured till their mid 20s and such and highlighting the end to discriminatory practices should have been put out MUCH eariler and MUCH more clearly by local legislators. Obama did his MLK stchik and the individual dems seemed to hem and haw dependent on what kind of district they represented. It was a big jumbled mess by the democrats.

The GOP is winning because they have a more unified well oiled voice, even though I hardly agree with it. They did too much damage in the the PR war. The dems HAVE to get a much better PR machine lined up because it's still a ways to go. My state Attorney General (VA) is ready to fight it because we have a state lay that says no citizen should be forced to buy coverage.....(WTF)

THen again we Americans seem to like our political debates in a very very very folksy populist sort of vein, which really harms discourse. The media sure don't help either, unfortunetly, I don't see this changing much.
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Old 2010-03-22, 09:47   Link #777
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Attorney Generals from 12 states say they will challenge the health care bill in court. The twelve states are Florida, South Carolina, Virginia, Alabama, Nebraska, Texas, Oklahoma, Pennsylvania, Washington, Utah, North Dakota, and South Dakota.

Quote:
Virginia Attorney General Ken Cuccinelli announced that he will file a lawsuit on behalf of his state challenging what he called the “unconstitutional overreach” of the healthcare law.

“Virginia is in a unique situation that allows it the standing to file such a suit since Virginia is the only state so far to pass a law protecting its citizens from a government-imposed mandate to buy health insurance,” he said. “The health care reform bill, with its insurance mandate, creates a conflict of laws between the federal government and Virginia,” Attorney General Cuccinelli said.

“Normally, such conflicts are decided in favor of the federal government, but because we believe the federal law is unconstitutional, Virginia’s law should prevail.”
http://www.csmonitor.com/USA/Justice...ealthcare-bill

I doubt any lawsuit will even make it to the Supreme Court. No way the four liberal justices would vote against the bill, and I don't see Kennedy voting against it either.
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Old 2010-03-22, 10:30   Link #778
Netto Azure
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ZOMG IT'Z TEH END OF TEH WORLDAS WE KNOW IT. /o/

*insert Apocalypse now picture here*

Bring out the Overreaction and Hyperbole. >___>

Joking aside, I am a bit happy that this bill passed. I know, it's watered down to the point of cynicism for us who has checked this issue out for a while, but still it's a first step. Omnibus bills can always be doled out, but we need a baseline for it.

Democrats hail landmark US healthcare bill


President Barack Obama: 'It's a victory for the American people'

Quote:
Democrats have hailed the approval of legislation extending healthcare to an additional 32 million Americans as a historic advance in social justice.
The speaker of the House of Representatives, Nancy Pelosi said it was comparable to the establishment of Medicare and Social Security.

The bill was passed in the House on Sunday evening by just seven votes.
Republicans have vowed to continue to challenge it, saying it is too expensive and promotes big government.
Senator John McCain, the defeated presidential candidate, warned that outside the capital "the American people are very angry".
"They don't like it, and we're going to repeal this," he told ABC News.
President Barack Obama is expected to sign the bill as early as Tuesday, after which it will go to the Senate where Democrats hope it will be passed by a simple majority under budget reconciliation.

'New day in America'
The BBC's Adam Brookes in Washington says Mr Obama's long, stubborn effort to reform healthcare came to fruition after a dramatic late night in Congress.

The House approved the bill passed by the Senate on Christmas Eve by 219 votes to 212, with 34 Democrats joining Republicans in voting against it.
Victory was assured only hours before voting started, when the president agreed to a deal with conservative Democrats to reiterate in an executive order that money provided by the bill could not be used for abortions.
Democrats were jubilant after the vote, with House Majority Whip Representative James Clyburn describing it as "Civil Rights Act of the 21st Century".
Rep Marcy Kaptur of Ohio said the bill heralded "a new day in America", while Rep Doris Matsui of California said it would "improve the quality of life for millions of American families."

The president said that after nearly 100 years of debate and frustration, Americans finally had the assurance of universal health cover.
"We pushed back on the undue influence of special interests," he said in a statement. "We didn't give in to mistrust or to cynicism or to fear. Instead, we proved that we are still a people capable of doing big things."
"This legislation will not fix everything that ails our healthcare system, but it moves us decisively in the right direction," he added.
Under the plans, health insurance will be extended to nearly all Americans, new taxes will be imposed on the wealthy, and restrictive insurance practices such as refusing to cover people with pre-existing medical conditions will be outlawed.

Our correspondent says many Americans do seem bemused by the size and complexity of the bill and have been angered by the long, bitter process of its passage.
The New York Times, which has supported the reforms, called the vote an accomplishment of historic proportions, but the Wall Street Journal said the bill would mean much higher taxes, slower economic growth and worse medical care.
Democrats hope that once the voters see the new law taking effect they will learn to like it before they go to the polls in mid-term elections in November, our correspondent adds.

'Fixes'
The bill's final approval represented a stunning turnaround from January, when it was considered dead after Democrats lost their 60-seat majority in the Senate, which is required to defeat a filibuster, a method used to delay or block the passage of legislation.

To avoid a second Senate vote, the House also approved on Sunday evening a package of reconciliation "fixes" - agreed beforehand between House and Senate Democrats and the White House - amending the bill that senators adopted in December.
The president could sign the House-approved Senate bill as early as Tuesday, after which it will be officially enacted into law. However, the bill will contain some very unpopular measures that Democratic senators have agreed to amend.
The Senate will be able to make the required changes in a separate bill using a procedure known as reconciliation, which allows budget provisions to be approved with 51 votes - rather than the 60 needed to overcome blocking tactics.
The Republicans say they will seek to repeal the measure, challenge its constitutionality and co-ordinate efforts in state legislatures to block its implementation.
The White House plans to launch a campaign this week to persuade sceptical Americans that the reforms offer immediate benefits to them and represent the most significant effort to reduce the federal deficit since the 1990s.
According to the Congressional Budget Office, the healthcare bill will cost about $940bn (£626bn over 10 years, and will cut the federal deficit by $138bn (£92bn) over the same period.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cors8 View Post
When GOP leadership offered their alternative plan, it was like 13 pages with no numbers. Rep. Paul Ryan of Wisconsin offered a more detailed plan that would reduce the deficit. However, it involved getting rid of Medicare/Medicaid or SS (I think) over the next few years to do it.

Of course, the GOP leadership definitely wouldn't go for that.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Healthy_Americans_Act

You're referring to that I believe. ;D
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Old 2010-03-22, 11:38   Link #779
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nosauz View Post
I'm pretty sure it was all the governments fault that we have recessions because growth in the sub prime markets was just the genius plan of the government to wreck the bubble economy we have that is based on non real intangible products such as derivatives and mortgage backed securities.
I find it amusing that in your sarcasm you have unintentionally spoken the actual (albeit partial) truth.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mentar View Post
The conduct of the Republicans was nothing short of a disgrace. 99% destruction and obstruction, with zero effort to present a rivalling model. Sorry, but whoever really believes that tort reform is going to fix your broken medical system needs his head examined, and preferably in a country where you can actually afford that. So, not in the US.
I'm really, really ticked off at the GOP for not even trying to come up with a counterstrategy. "Tort reform" my ass. Seriously I believe the lot of them were trying to kill the bill because they wanted to one-up the Dems rather than actually block something they found harmful.

These guys act so stupid and malicious sometimes I feel ashamed. It's really shitty that the only fiscally conservative parties that anyone knows about are both filled with moronic assholes. =/

Oh well, I'll just keep waving my minarchist "small ell" libertarian flag all by my lonesome. =/

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mentar View Post
The congressional budget office forecasted that the bill was still a major improvement over the status quo, as in "hundreds of billions of dollars are saved, not a trillion spent extra". This whole "screwed economy for 15 years" is pretty much based on mere GOP propaganda with no real basis in reality. And how giving 38 million people health insurance isn't considered a worthy cause in itself only shows the glorified selfishness which permeats major parts of the American society. Sorry. "It doesn't help me, so I'm against it".
I'm somewhat suspicious of what the CBO said, but I have nothing substantial so I'm going to try to just take what they say at face value.

Giving 38 million uninsured people (including myself) health insurance is definitely a good thing. What's not a good thing is whether this will further slow hiring. But now that it's done and decided, businesses shouldn't be paralyzed by the unknown and should be able to move forward with whatever it is they're going to do.

A lot of companies have been holding off on hiring decisions until this thing finished. Now that it's done, for good or for ill, these businesses will be able to make hiring decisions.

Quote:
Originally Posted by cors8 View Post
When GOP leadership offered their alternative plan, it was like 13 pages with no numbers. Rep. Paul Ryan of Wisconsin offered a more detailed plan that would reduce the deficit. However, it involved getting rid of Medicare/Medicaid or SS (I think) over the next few years to do it.

Of course, the GOP leadership definitely wouldn't go for that.
Their alternative plan was just some bullshit tossed together to show people they had an alternative plan. They just wanted to kill it merely to shove the knife in the Dems' ribcage and twist. I'm so disgusted with the GOP I can't even think straight.

Abe Lincoln must be spinning in his grave so fast it's tearing a hole in the fabric of space-time.
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Old 2010-03-22, 12:29   Link #780
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Both the people who are sing the bills praise and those that are condemning it will be saverly disappointed at how little things will change. According to the CBO the issuance premiums for the majority of Americans will not change (aka go up at the same rate as normal) and for a minority it will go up. If you remove the creative accounting that was used for the budget figures the deficit will increase a little. The issues that were plaguing the American health care system still remain:
There is still a lack of general practitioners, which will be made worse by adding more people to the pool. The pay difference between a GP and a specialist for the same procedure still remains. The current trend of big companies running family practice clinics will expand, with the primary care giver being a physicians assistant.

The cost of health care will not change and we will continue to see rates increase for no real reason.

People will still be uninsured the and states AG are not going to actually go around fining people for nor having insurance. The headline "AG office fines recent college grad into bankruptcy" looks really bad.

Both parties got what they wanted the Democrats can now say that they are standing up and doing what is right for the American people. The Republicans can go on screaming that the Democrats are a bunch of Communists that don't reflect "Americas values" what ever that means. Libertarians are left wondering what they got for increasing government influence. Never mind Libertarians got nothing in the deal.
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