AnimeSuki Forums

Register Forum Rules FAQ Members List Social Groups Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   AnimeSuki Forum > Anime Discussion > Older Series > Retired > Umineko

Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 2010-05-19, 23:24   Link #10241
Renall
BUY MY BOOK!!!
 
 
Join Date: May 2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by Judoh View Post
So Erika really did seal all the rooms? I thought it was Dlanor that did all of that.
Well, I don't know if it's even possible to demonstrate any physical seals in ep6, but Dlanor's guarantee means it doesn't matter either way.
Renall is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-05-20, 07:45   Link #10242
DaBackpack
Blick Winkel
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: Gobbled up by Promathia
Random Observations

Random observation:

Playing Episode 1 game me a tiny piece of foreshadowing:

By Kumasawa:

Quote:
Or perhaps a large thunderbolt fell one evening and smashed the shrine...... The fishermen whisper that having a thunderbolt fall upon our honored tutelary God would be a certain sign of misfortune. Lightning begone... lightning begone...
And, if I remember correctly, in Episode 2, there is lightning striking on the shrine when Shannon is there.

Ah, foreshadowing.
(I will update this in the future with more crap

Hmm. Liberated Liberater is the new Worldend Dominator!

Last edited by DaBackpack; 2010-05-20 at 09:23.
DaBackpack is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-05-20, 08:18   Link #10243
Raiza Sunozaki
Sorcerer of Uncertainty
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Canada! ... It's ALWAYS Canada...
Age: 21
Quote:
Originally Posted by Renall View Post
Well, I don't know if it's even possible to demonstrate any physical seals in ep6, but Dlanor's guarantee means it doesn't matter either way.
Which is why I said it might be seals of fear, armed people holding the others hostage.
For all we know, the culprit's accomplices could've seized the guns the husbands grabbed after their wives faked their death (which I think I remember happening), the husbands were the accomplices from the beginning.
Irregardless though. All we know is that no one could leave the cousins' room after it was sealed, and no one could leave the neighbouring room after it was sealed except through the windows.
Which begs the question, who is Erika and how did she end up outside the rooms? She is not Battler, and neither is she Kanon, as she is not the one who rescues Battler. Logically, unless she uses the same trick Kanon does and escapes the cousins' room before it is sealed, she can only be Hideyoshi, George, Shannon, Kumasawa or Nanjo, and left the room through the window.
This suit me fine though, since I believe Erika's movements to represent the movement of the mastermind in Episode 6, and I view George as the mastermind.
Raiza Sunozaki is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-05-20, 10:08   Link #10244
Laserworm
Maelstorm-Fenrir
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: On Rokkenjima (I'm the 19th person)
Age: 23
Send a message via AIM to Laserworm Send a message via MSN to Laserworm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Raiza Sunozaki View Post
Which is why I said it might be seals of fear, armed people holding the others hostage.
For all we know, the culprit's accomplices could've seized the guns the husbands grabbed after their wives faked their death (which I think I remember happening), the husbands were the accomplices from the beginning.
Irregardless though. All we know is that no one could leave the cousins' room after it was sealed, and no one could leave the neighbouring room after it was sealed except through the windows.
Which begs the question, who is Erika and how did she end up outside the rooms? She is not Battler, and neither is she Kanon, as she is not the one who rescues Battler. Logically, unless she uses the same trick Kanon does and escapes the cousins' room before it is sealed, she can only be Hideyoshi, George, Shannon, Kumasawa or Nanjo, and left the room through the window.
This suit me fine though, since I believe Erika's movements to represent the movement of the mastermind in Episode 6, and I view George as the mastermind.
I can't see her being anyone who was in the 'other room' when it was sealed. Because then, she should have known, only 5 people were in the room, her whole arugment that even though 5 names are in the room it is actually 6 people would be pointless and stupid.
__________________

Time ran out for the people on the island. All of them are dead. When the seagulls cry none shall be left alive. Sleep forever in a rest you will never be awakened from my beloved Beatrice. Persona: Project Mirror. http://persona-project-mirror.webs.com/ Check it out if you like the Persona series.
Laserworm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-05-20, 11:46   Link #10245
DgBarca
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Hey, look at this :
Spoiler for Img(EP1->EP5):

Is that foreshadowing or simple coincidence "What do you think, everyone? + mocking" ? Erikrauss ? What ? Let's just pray for the coincidence. And would it be possible with the red truth ?. But Krauss is said to be very sly too. But it's like the Shkanon theory, and thus, I don't like the sound of it.
IT'S A COINCIDENCE, RIGHT ?

It shall be the Eva => Eva-Beatrice but with Krauss => Erika. But...that's...sound SO wrong
DgBarca is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-05-20, 11:59   Link #10246
Laserworm
Maelstorm-Fenrir
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: On Rokkenjima (I'm the 19th person)
Age: 23
Send a message via AIM to Laserworm Send a message via MSN to Laserworm
Quote:
Originally Posted by DgBarca View Post
Is that foreshadowing or simple coincidence "What do you think, everyone? + mocking" ? Erikrauss ? What ? Let's just pray for the coincidence. And would it be possible with the red truth ?. But Krauss is said to be very sly too. But it's like the Shkanon theory, and thus, I don't like the sound of it.
IT'S A COINCIDENCE, RIGHT ?

It shall be the Eva => Eva-Beatrice but with Krauss => Erika. But...that's...sound SO wrong
So.... what Krauss hates his daughter?
__________________

Time ran out for the people on the island. All of them are dead. When the seagulls cry none shall be left alive. Sleep forever in a rest you will never be awakened from my beloved Beatrice. Persona: Project Mirror. http://persona-project-mirror.webs.com/ Check it out if you like the Persona series.
Laserworm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-05-20, 12:12   Link #10247
DgBarca
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
"Before the family conference, Erika, George, Jessica, Maria, Nanjo, Gohda, and Kumasawa left the mansion and moved to the guesthouse."
"Of those who remain, only Krauss, Natsuhi, and Genji were in the second floor corridor, while all others were in the dining hall."


Anyone wonder how Erika managed to exist in the red truth ? If she is dead in the beginning of all the games, she couldn't "left" the mansion. Or maybe Nanjo and Gohda carried her corpse to the guesthouse.

And for Erikrauss...would it be possible for this theory to exist between the red truth ?
DgBarca is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-05-20, 12:20   Link #10248
Oliver
Back off, I'm a scientist
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: In a badly written story.
Quote:
Originally Posted by DgBarca View Post
And for Erikrauss...would it be possible for this theory to exist between the red truth ?
The knock-related red firmly places Krauss in the mansion at the moment Erika is in the guesthouse, so probably not.

That said, Krauss is very much underestimated as an active agent in any theories, if you ask me.
__________________
"The only principle that does not inhibit progress is: anything goes."
Paul K. Feyerabend, "Against Method: Outline of an Anarchistic Theory of Knowledge"

This link has been determined hazardous for the spoiler averse
by the Department of Education.
(updated 2010-08-24)
Oliver is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-05-20, 12:22   Link #10249
Laserworm
Maelstorm-Fenrir
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: On Rokkenjima (I'm the 19th person)
Age: 23
Send a message via AIM to Laserworm Send a message via MSN to Laserworm
Quote:
Originally Posted by DgBarca View Post
"Before the family conference, Erika, George, Jessica, Maria, Nanjo, Gohda, and Kumasawa left the mansion and moved to the guesthouse."
"Of those who remain, only Krauss, Natsuhi, and Genji were in the second floor corridor, while all others were in the dining hall."


Anyone wonder how Erika managed to exist in the red truth ? If she is dead in the beginning of all the games, she couldn't "left" the mansion. Or maybe Nanjo and Gohda carried her corpse to the guesthouse.

And for Erikrauss...would it be possible for this theory to exist between the red truth ?
It is the all else. Anyone who was in the dinning room could be Erika, or one of those who went to the mansion with her at the same time. Because if Erika is just another name of the one of those people as long as she stays with that person. As long as there isn't a red which says Erika is not the the same room as them, Erika could be that person. Example. Erika could be Jessica. X Erika was in the lounge, Jessica was upstairs. That is not a real red, so discard it.
__________________

Time ran out for the people on the island. All of them are dead. When the seagulls cry none shall be left alive. Sleep forever in a rest you will never be awakened from my beloved Beatrice. Persona: Project Mirror. http://persona-project-mirror.webs.com/ Check it out if you like the Persona series.
Laserworm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-05-20, 12:39   Link #10250
Oliver
Back off, I'm a scientist
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: In a badly written story.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Laserworm View Post
Example. Erika could be Jessica.
That actually makes some sense... especially when we consider that Jessica could be a Beatrice and Erika emerges when Beatrice is 'dead'.
__________________
"The only principle that does not inhibit progress is: anything goes."
Paul K. Feyerabend, "Against Method: Outline of an Anarchistic Theory of Knowledge"

This link has been determined hazardous for the spoiler averse
by the Department of Education.
(updated 2010-08-24)
Oliver is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-05-20, 12:41   Link #10251
Laserworm
Maelstorm-Fenrir
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: On Rokkenjima (I'm the 19th person)
Age: 23
Send a message via AIM to Laserworm Send a message via MSN to Laserworm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oliver View Post
That actually makes some sense... especially when we consider that Jessica could be a Beatrice and Erika emerges when Beatrice is 'dead'.
That would make no sense. Erika can't be someone who dies. If Jessica was Erika she would know about the whole 'not corpses' thing.
__________________

Time ran out for the people on the island. All of them are dead. When the seagulls cry none shall be left alive. Sleep forever in a rest you will never be awakened from my beloved Beatrice. Persona: Project Mirror. http://persona-project-mirror.webs.com/ Check it out if you like the Persona series.
Laserworm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-05-20, 13:15   Link #10252
Laserworm
Maelstorm-Fenrir
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: On Rokkenjima (I'm the 19th person)
Age: 23
Send a message via AIM to Laserworm Send a message via MSN to Laserworm
Sorry for the double post but there is a question that has been bugging me about the 1st twilight of the 3rd game.

Is it even possible for another theory besides; The culprit pretended to find the key in the victims pocket.

Or the Boiler room's other door doesn't have a lock so they just used that to get out.
__________________

Time ran out for the people on the island. All of them are dead. When the seagulls cry none shall be left alive. Sleep forever in a rest you will never be awakened from my beloved Beatrice. Persona: Project Mirror. http://persona-project-mirror.webs.com/ Check it out if you like the Persona series.
Laserworm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-05-20, 13:20   Link #10253
Judoh
Mystery buff
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Gone Fishin!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Laserworm View Post
That would make no sense. Erika can't be someone who dies. If Jessica was Erika she would know about the whole 'not corpses' thing.
I think he means you know "dead" as in "meta world dead". Erika appeared after "Beatrice died" in 4 and Erika was "killed" after Beatrice was "revived" in 6.
Judoh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-05-20, 13:21   Link #10254
Oliver
Back off, I'm a scientist
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: In a badly written story.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Laserworm View Post
That would make no sense. Erika can't be someone who dies. If Jessica was Erika she would know about the whole 'not corpses' thing.
What I mean is that if Jessica is a Beatrice, and one 'Beatrice' 'dies' in the end of Ep4, stopping being Beatrice in subsequent games, and reducing Meta-Beatrice to vegetative state, Jessica is free to 'be' someone else in Ep5 and Ep6. And Erika being wiped off the board would mark Beatrice-in-Jessica being resurrected.
__________________
"The only principle that does not inhibit progress is: anything goes."
Paul K. Feyerabend, "Against Method: Outline of an Anarchistic Theory of Knowledge"

This link has been determined hazardous for the spoiler averse
by the Department of Education.
(updated 2010-08-24)
Oliver is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-05-20, 13:23   Link #10255
Laserworm
Maelstorm-Fenrir
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: On Rokkenjima (I'm the 19th person)
Age: 23
Send a message via AIM to Laserworm Send a message via MSN to Laserworm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oliver View Post
What I mean is that if Jessica is a Beatrice, and one 'Beatrice' 'dies' in the end of Ep4, stopping being Beatrice in subsequent games, and reducing Meta-Beatrice to vegetative state, Jessica is free to 'be' someone else in Ep5 and Ep6. And Erika being wiped off the board would mark Beatrice-in-Jessica being resurrected.
I meant dies in the first twlight of game 5 and 6. Why would anyone believe that Jessica is dead when she is standing right in front of them accusing her mom.

Oh yeah and what the heck is so special about Kanon, that only he could rescue Battler from the logic error?
__________________

Time ran out for the people on the island. All of them are dead. When the seagulls cry none shall be left alive. Sleep forever in a rest you will never be awakened from my beloved Beatrice. Persona: Project Mirror. http://persona-project-mirror.webs.com/ Check it out if you like the Persona series.
Laserworm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-05-20, 13:26   Link #10256
Oliver
Back off, I'm a scientist
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: In a badly written story.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Laserworm View Post
Sorry for the double post but there is a question that has been bugging me about the 1st twilight of the 3rd game.

Is it even possible for another theory besides; The culprit pretended to find the key in the victims pocket.

Or the Boiler room's other door doesn't have a lock so they just used that to get out.
Chapel door lock does not have a 'locked' state at all and is simply broken or not really a lock but something else is mine.

Also, None of the victims are actually dead at the moment of discovery, instead being sedated into unconsciousness of their own volition and playing dead after locking themselves inside the rooms. One of the discovering adults later goes along the chain and kills them for good is what I would call the strongest one.
__________________
"The only principle that does not inhibit progress is: anything goes."
Paul K. Feyerabend, "Against Method: Outline of an Anarchistic Theory of Knowledge"

This link has been determined hazardous for the spoiler averse
by the Department of Education.
(updated 2010-08-24)
Oliver is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-05-20, 13:29   Link #10257
Laserworm
Maelstorm-Fenrir
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: On Rokkenjima (I'm the 19th person)
Age: 23
Send a message via AIM to Laserworm Send a message via MSN to Laserworm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oliver View Post
Chapel door lock does not have a 'locked' state at all and is simply broken or not really a lock but something else is mine.

Also, None of the victims are actually dead at the moment of discovery, instead being sedated into unconsciousness of their own volition and playing dead after locking themselves inside the rooms. One of the discovering adults later goes along the chain and kills them for good is what I would call the strongest one.
Unless all of the adults do it together the only people who could do the second one are Rosa and Nanjo.
__________________

Time ran out for the people on the island. All of them are dead. When the seagulls cry none shall be left alive. Sleep forever in a rest you will never be awakened from my beloved Beatrice. Persona: Project Mirror. http://persona-project-mirror.webs.com/ Check it out if you like the Persona series.
Laserworm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-05-20, 13:29   Link #10258
Judoh
Mystery buff
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2010
Location: Gone Fishin!
Quote:
Originally Posted by Laserworm View Post
I can't see her being anyone who was in the 'other room' when it was sealed. Because then, she should have known, only 5 people were in the room, her whole arugment that even though 5 names are in the room it is actually 6 people would be pointless and stupid.
It was pointless and stupid though.

The people who were in the neighboring room at the time it was sealed were Hideyoshi, George, Kumasawa, Shannon, and Nanjo. And, there were exactly five people in the neighboring room. No one other than the people corresponding to those five names existed! All names refer only to the actual people!

Plus if she had confidence in who her own piece is she wouldn't need to ask this.

[Request: I am not the rescuer.] Of course not! You're the detective, aren't you? Relax, I'll respect that!
Judoh is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-05-20, 13:29   Link #10259
Oliver
Back off, I'm a scientist
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: In a badly written story.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Laserworm View Post
I meant dies in the first twlight of game 5 and 6. Why would anyone believe that Jessica is dead when she is standing right in front of them accusing her mom.
Well, who else other than Natsuhi refers to Jessica being dead anyway? Though yes, it would be a stretch.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Laserworm View Post
Oh yeah and what the heck is so special about Kanon, that only he could rescue Battler from the logic error?
His location somehow remained undefined, if my spoiler memory serves me right.
__________________
"The only principle that does not inhibit progress is: anything goes."
Paul K. Feyerabend, "Against Method: Outline of an Anarchistic Theory of Knowledge"

This link has been determined hazardous for the spoiler averse
by the Department of Education.
(updated 2010-08-24)
Oliver is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2010-05-20, 13:32   Link #10260
Laserworm
Maelstorm-Fenrir
 
 
Join Date: Apr 2010
Location: On Rokkenjima (I'm the 19th person)
Age: 23
Send a message via AIM to Laserworm Send a message via MSN to Laserworm
Quote:
Originally Posted by Oliver View Post
His location somehow remained undefined, if my spoiler memory serves me right.
That is only because she suspects Kanon to be someone else or something. I think she thinks he is George...
__________________

Time ran out for the people on the island. All of them are dead. When the seagulls cry none shall be left alive. Sleep forever in a rest you will never be awakened from my beloved Beatrice. Persona: Project Mirror. http://persona-project-mirror.webs.com/ Check it out if you like the Persona series.
Laserworm is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 02:51.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
We use Silk.