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Old 2010-06-07, 14:01   Link #121
MikaMiaka
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LKK View Post
The second context may be more tenuous, but in terms of Yuki & Luka's relationship, it makes a great deal of sense. We could say that they're destined to be together in this lifetime because of their relationship in Yuki's previous life. Thank you for looking into this for me. I doubt I would've understood the difference on my own. Cookies to you!
For some reason, I read "destined" as "restricted" the first time around. They are restricted to be together! Which, well, is kinda true. and literal, as far as the OP goes.

On the issue of it being a cultural thing (ease of acceptance of previous sex) -- I can see that. I also can see it as Yuki just being really complacent and self-involved ("Naze boku?! Doshte?!"!!) so this is another thing to emo about!
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Old 2010-06-08, 06:47   Link #122
karice67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LKK View Post
The second context may be more tenuous, but in terms of Yuki & Luka's relationship, it makes a great deal of sense. We could say that they're destined to be together in this lifetime because of their relationship in Yuki's previous life. Thank you for looking into this for me. I doubt I would've understood the difference on my own. Cookies to you!
Well, you're quite welcome (munches ^^), but I have to warn you that it really is tenuous. I've asked a few Japanese language teachers, and none of them have heard anything about it, so it might even be something very recent. Personally, I'd like to hear about it from the songwriter him/herself...
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Old 2010-06-10, 04:26   Link #123
KaedeF
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Spoiler for Ep9:


That really caught me off guard.
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Old 2010-06-22, 13:07   Link #124
White Manju Bun
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Ill have to say for a series Ive been on the fence on epi 9 was probably my fave so far. The backstory btwn Shusei and Hotsuma was great and their relationship is probably my fave of the series. Great epi.

Now to catch up!
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Old 2010-06-29, 10:45   Link #125
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Le gasp, I'm behind for a whole month! What "base" have our bishies reached by now?

Need to get back into track with everything
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Old 2010-06-30, 12:31   Link #126
White Manju Bun
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Spoiler for epi 12:
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Old 2010-06-30, 14:51   Link #127
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Originally Posted by White Manju Bun View Post
Spoiler for epi 12:
Yeeeeeey, I'm not the only one who is still watching this show

Spoiler for ep 12:
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Old 2010-07-05, 08:12   Link #128
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zaseka View Post
Yeeeeeey, I'm not the only one who is still watching this show

Spoiler for ep 12:
Im hanging in there

Ok so Kanata as Reiga was pretty obvious now that I look at it again but Ill admit I having really been paying the most attention to the last few epis <_< Minus the Shusei/Hotsuma stuff

Ok seriously is it me or does Kanata look like he's cosplaying Kaname from VK when he walks down the steps???

Way OT but: *looks at our icons* Danna-sama!
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Old 2010-07-12, 04:27   Link #129
MikaMiaka
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Originally Posted by KaedeF View Post
Spoiler for Ep9:


That really caught me off guard.
I thought he died like that guy from Nabari. Glad he's okay.

So Luka thinks Yuki came back as a guy because he doesn't want to be a woman, and hence, be with him, any longer.

But I bet the reason would be just to protect Luka by being with him, or something.
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Old 2010-07-12, 05:51   Link #130
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Originally Posted by White Manju Bun View Post
Im hanging in there


Ok seriously is it me or does Kanata look like he's cosplaying Kaname from VK when he walks down the steps???

Way OT but: *looks at our icons* Danna-sama!
This is just it!! I have been always saying that the mangaka is kinda plagiarising Vk. From the manga covers, to the character design, to the characters themselves.
-Kanata/Luca: Kaname The resemblance is really uncanny! Particularly Kanata, dude, even the name sounds similar
Tsukumo- : looks like Zero, has a gun of similar design, the personalty is totally different tho
-Hotsuma: Pretty much a direct copy of Kain, down to his design, character and element affinity.
-Takashiro: looks like the serious side of Cross Kaien
-Touko chan- looks like Luka, dresses like Luka as well
And let me not get started on the main's name

Although it's not fair, really not, I'm still happy that this serie exists in the style it is. The mangaka is doing exactly what I want the vk mangaka to do..more bl fanservice Ah, I'm so evil, i know


Oh, my creepy little Alois <3
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Old 2010-07-13, 06:26   Link #131
karice67
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Originally Posted by Zaseka View Post
This is just it!! I have been always saying that the mangaka is kinda plagiarising Vk. From the manga covers, to the character design, to the characters themselves.
...
And let me not get started on the main's name

Although it's not fair, really not, I'm still happy that this serie exists in the style it is. The mangaka is doing exactly what I want the vk mangaka to do..more bl fanservice Ah, I'm so evil, i know
You know...shoujo mangaka all tend to do so many similar things that I really wouldn't have linked the two series myself.I mean, how exactly do Touko and VK's Luca (might want to use the official spelling to avoid confusion) dress alike other than that they wear school uniforms, which, as a general rule in Japan, look extremely similar? And it's Yuki vs. Yuuki - not to mention totally different kanji - not exactly a small difference.

Hm...I know Odagiri-sensei does, but has Matsuri Hino-sensei actually done any BL?

On another note,
Spoiler for ep 13 spoilers:
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Last edited by karice67; 2010-07-13 at 06:44.
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Old 2010-07-13, 07:32   Link #132
White Manju Bun
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Originally Posted by karice67 View Post
Hm...I know Odagiri-sensei does, but has Matsuri Hino-sensei actually done any BL?
Unless she did it under a fake name, Hino-sensei has never done a BL series or doujin. Its a difficult argue since yes parts of UraBoku do remind me of VK but Odagiri has been publishing since 96 where Hino started in 99. But Im sure shoujo artists get ideas from eachother and draw eachothers stuff from time to time. I know Hino did a WONDERFUL vers of Bisco Hatori's Haruhi and Tamaki. Oh gawd I just love that pic! I dont think Odagiri and Hino style are similar though, I mean you look at each and can tell theyre drawn by different people but their are similarities. Its not like Fairy Tale and One Piece were its nearly a carbon copy.
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Old 2010-07-13, 08:17   Link #133
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I don't see much resemblance between UraBoku and VK myself. I've always thought that UraBoku was similar to Shiho Sugiura's manga Silver Diamond though, especially after learning that Odagiri & Sugiura are good friends who even toured the US together. UraBoku is like a slightly more angsty version of Silver Diamond. It's not a carbon copy of SD or anything but there's an obvious influence in my opinion.
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Old 2010-07-13, 08:42   Link #134
White Manju Bun
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Originally Posted by LKK View Post
I don't see much resemblance between UraBoku and VK myself. I've always thought that UraBoku was similar to Shiho Sugiura's manga Silver Diamond though, especially after learning that Odagiri & Sugiura are good friends who even toured the US together. UraBoku is like a slightly more angsty version of Silver Diamond. It's not a carbon copy of SD or anything but there's an obvious influence in my opinion.
I didnt even think of SD! Youre right it is closer to that then VK, plus I think the anime (though different studios) makes the character design look a bit more like VK to me. I do find the guys attractive but I like their manga counterparts better. Plus I think female!Yuki looks ALOT better in the manga. In the anime she reminds me of Yuki in drag
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Old 2010-07-13, 10:44   Link #135
Irkalla
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Quote:
Originally Posted by karice67 View Post
You know...shoujo mangaka all tend to do so many similar things that I really wouldn't have linked the two series myself.I mean, how exactly do Touko and VK's Luca (might want to use the official spelling to avoid confusion) dress alike other than that they wear school uniforms, which, as a general rule in Japan, look extremely similar? And it's Yuki vs. Yuuki - not to mention totally different kanji - not exactly a small difference.


The Touko-chan-Luca and Yuuki-Yuki case is just about the smallest similarity you picked yourself out of all those Shoujo mangaka do indeed, seek inspiration in other series, but they do it more subtly to say the least, they cover their tracks, so that people won't directly see the similarities. And most of all, they don't take so many ideas/designs from one single work, way too obvious. You can check out some covers/images of Vk and UraBoku if you have excess time, some of them are practically identical in composition/props/setting etc. So yeah, for me, definitely over the top similar. But as I said, I don't mind if Hino doesn't mind. For all I know they could be friends irl.
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Old 2010-07-13, 17:39   Link #136
karice67
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Zaseka View Post
The Touko-chan-Luca and Yuuki-Yuki case is just about the smallest similarity you picked yourself out of all those
....
You can check out some covers/images of Vk and UraBoku if you have excess time, some of them are practically identical in composition/props/setting etc. So yeah, for me, definitely over the top similar. But as I said, I don't mind if Hino doesn't mind. For all I know they could be friends irl.
Just pointing out that some of the examples you gave really shouldn't have been given, because it then looks like you're just looking to pick holes.

I did. And besides a couple of images and a others that I've seen done by a number of other artists (both shoujo and not), I didn't see anything that was overly similar. You can say that they all share ideas, and that Hodagiri-sensei may have gotten ideas from Hino-sensei, but I feel that attaching the word "plagiarism", even if you soften it with "kinda", is going too far, especially since you're saying you don't actually mind.
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Last edited by karice67; 2010-07-13 at 17:55.
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Old 2010-07-14, 01:49   Link #137
MikaMiaka
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Well, I think that it does share traits with Vampire Knight, as well as 07Ghost (though the pink thing didn't turn into Mikage -- unless he does so at the end of the manga?(!), and sodom turned into what i thought was a girl at first, but reminded me of the cat in Escaflowne but without the jealousy.

I think it borrows from a lot of sources, but I think the other series pull from other sources too, though you may think the similarities are too overt here, I tend to disagree.

I think the mood is different, and the sexual undertones are different (but REALLY engaging, LOL) and the story is a bit different, as far as I can see. And this Yuki is so much more emo than Yuki in VK. The emoness belonged to Zero in that one. (Oi. >.<)

anyhow, I am enjoying this series in its own right, and i think it's pretty good so far, though the last episode was a bit lackluster.
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Old 2010-07-14, 05:46   Link #138
Irkalla
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Originally Posted by karice67 View Post
Just pointing out that some of the examples you gave really shouldn't have been given, because it then looks like you're just looking to pick holes.

I did. And besides a couple of images and a others that I've seen done by a number of other artists (both shoujo and not), I didn't see anything that was overly similar. You can say that they all share ideas, and that Hodagiri-sensei may have gotten ideas from Hino-sensei, but I feel that attaching the word "plagiarism", even if you soften it with "kinda", is going too far, especially since you're saying you don't actually mind.
Oh my, I wasn't aware that I was talking to Odagiri's lawyer :P No, I'm just pointing out my observations, if you can't see the "accidental similarities", then that is up to you. And for me, that is a form of plagiarism, maybe I'm over critical duo to being an artist myself, but it's just my 5 cents on the topic.

I don't really see any obvious plot similarities between uraboku and vk, tho. Now that would have really been a tad too much. It's just that we have all read a pile loads of fiction that deals with reincarnation, dragons, vampires, demons and such things, so we always like to relate things. But that is just how our minds work. I agree with MikaMiaka that it's a compiled work of various sources. And that is really what an original story is, you just have to make sure nobody else can directly trace back your sources.
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Old 2010-07-14, 10:00   Link #139
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remind me if i'm wrong ... i just watched the latest episode. Yuki knows he & Luka were bound by a contract?

I don't think the anime has addressed that question yet.... i know the manga did in volume 2 or 3 (can't remember)
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Old 2010-07-15, 08:06   Link #140
karice67
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^I think Luka (or someone) did mention it at some stage...but I haven't been keeping this, so I can't really check...

Quote:
Originally Posted by Zaseka View Post
Oh my, I wasn't aware that I was talking to Odagiri's lawyer :P No, I'm just pointing out my observations, if you can't see the "accidental similarities", then that is up to you. And for me, that is a form of plagiarism, maybe I'm over critical duo to being an artist myself, but it's just my 5 cents on the topic.
Un, still putting the documents together, but you'll find the papers in your mailbox soon enough

Seriously though, I really think that word is too strong. I looked up plagiarism last year after finding odd things about a certain composer's work, and the one line that sums it up best for me is "you can't copyright an idea, just the expression of it".

Whilst I can see some similarities, if you consider all the different character design archetypes, props, and whatnot that shoujo mangaka seem to use, if what one artist uses is off bounds to others, then there really wouldn't be many options left, right? I'm far more inclined to see them both as coming from the same school of 'art' rather than saying that one is 'stealing' ideas off another. Whilst I don't draw now, that's what I learned in art history back in the day.

/end tl:dr
--------

Back to Uraboku though, I just skimmed through the chapters that are covered in this latest episode...am I the only one who thinks that it made more sense in the manga because of the detail they went into about how Yuki was feeling? (Although I'll admit that I probably don't want to hear "Pappi" angsting too much...)
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