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Old 2010-07-09, 20:27   Link #3021
Judoh
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Originally Posted by Disz View Post
Do you know which chapter?I need to re read that.
I don't know the specific chapter, but it's Maria that mentions it at the very beginning so it shouldn't be hard to find. It's just a mention that the Shrine wasn't there though so it's nothing big.
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Old 2010-07-09, 20:32   Link #3022
Disz
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Yah,but I think it's after what Maria said.I think I remember battler saying something like

''Oh yeah..that used to be there..''

I don't know what he says after that.
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Old 2010-07-09, 20:38   Link #3023
Alan Wolfrau
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Greetings, everyone. I'm new to this forum, so before you allow me to speak, let me introduce myself.
Alan de Ouralfald de Wolfrau, the Heresy Inquisitor of Ordo Hereticus.
At your service.
Please, allow me to use blue when i need it.
That's all. Nice to meet you all /smile/

Now, allow me to ask - now you all talking about the mirror. But did you forget about the shrine? By the Jessica's words, it was crushed by lighting... but what if it was some kind of exploison, caused by Shannon? Or fire?
Allow me to use blue: By "breaking" Shannon means a complete destruction of something related to her past, personality and fate. And this "something" was in the shrine/shrine itself/building that looks like a shrine
That's all for now.
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Old 2010-07-09, 20:38   Link #3024
Sniesk
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Jan-Poo View Post
I asked you this question because you have already stated that you don't support shkanon.

The idea that someone died of some kind of natural cause or accident just in the middle of the game is extremely improbable.

The probability increases greatly if someone died before the start of the game. We know that's the case with Kinzo. If you think Kinzo was killed, then you are only left with the theory that Kanon died of some natural cause or accident before the start of the game. But that inevitably leads to shkanon.
I don't support "shkannon" as the theory that implies that one is disguising as the other. Battler sees one of them at a time in different occasion. But really, thinking that he cannot recognize the same person under a disguise of a different sex , given also the little time shkannon has to "change person", sounds really too stupid for me.
But i cannot deny the fact that something is definetly wrong with those two. To sum it up, i agree that there are MANY hints about them being... "strange", but i don't think they are the same person. It feels a bit too extreme...
To be honest i'm really confused about them, and i hope i'll get a better understanding when i read ep6 as given the game cover i assume they will have a central role in it.
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Old 2010-07-09, 21:38   Link #3025
Disz
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I read EP1 about the shrine...


I don't think it was destroyed by lightning,but this is all the evidence I have.Something here is clearly related to Sayo.My proof?I have none,except for this.


Maria was the first to notice the shrine gone,and Battler noticed it before George.They asked Jessica,and she says she doesn't know how it ''broke'',but she claims it broke sometime around last year.Then Battler says it probably broke due to waves,it was a small crag after all.Jessica says it probably disappeared during the summer.
Kumasawa claims it might have been a lightning bolt...but she only claims this because she said fishermen say that if lightning bolt fell on a tutelary God it would be of a great misfortune.

Let it be known,this is what the shrine was.




Why am I connecting this to Sayo,who wasn't even there?

If I remembered correctly,

Sayo and George had the date around last year,and I think I remember George speaking about blooming,and the summer during the date.
When Sayo ''threw'' the mirror,there was a sound of a lightning bolt at the second the screen spun,and then you hear the sound of a mirror breaking.

Two things could have happened there.

1.Sayo burned down the shrine!

With all the wind,I think it was possible.The only problem is that I find no motive for that at all,unless I keep reading.I'll keep this in mind.

or

2.When Sayo threw the mirror,lightning struck and blasted the Shrine away!

If you think this way,then it would mean a mirror did break,and lightning also.But the chance of that happening at the same time she threw the mirror would be almost like magic.Which could probably make her believe in ''Beatrice'' even more.

Time to go back to episode 2.


EP2:After you read about the lightning,she says the mirror broke into two equal parts.Then she says a very suspicious line ''after I've made sure I've accomplished my task, ......I scream up look at the enraged sky''.

If all she did was break a mirror.Mission accomplished.But it seems something else went down...

Then she talks to ''Beatrice''(yelling at the sky) and ask her to keep her promise.Bah.

Last edited by Disz; 2010-07-09 at 21:53.
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Old 2010-07-09, 21:51   Link #3026
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If Sayo's goal was to revive Beatrice, or create Beatrice, that shine would be something that would have to be destroyed, since it limits magic or something like that.
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Old 2010-07-09, 22:00   Link #3027
Judoh
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Originally Posted by Disz View Post
Then she talks to ''Beatrice''(yelling at the sky) and ask her to keep her promise.Bah.
It might have just been me, but when I reread that I thought the promise referred to Battler.

She does seem a lot like Kinzo in this scene though.
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Old 2010-07-09, 22:01   Link #3028
Disz
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Originally Posted by Laserworm View Post
If Sayo's goal was to revive Beatrice, or create Beatrice, that shine would be something that would have to be destroyed, since it limits magic or something like that.
:0 This.Where did you read this?

@Judoh: Hah.Me too.I would say she is Kinzo2.
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Old 2010-07-09, 22:32   Link #3029
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Disz View Post
:0 This.Where did you read this?

@Judoh: Hah.Me too.I would say she is Kinzo2.
I believe it was in the scene where Beatrice tempts Shannon with the offer and asks her to destroy the mirror.
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Old 2010-07-09, 22:42   Link #3030
Disz
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Yah,I'm looking for that,I think I'm almost there.I'm reading about when Jessica is teasing George and tells him to go out with Sayo,in her face.In the rose garden.
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Old 2010-07-09, 22:53   Link #3031
Laserworm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Beatrice Ep2
"Actually there is a mirror kept inside that shrine. I want you to break that. The magic power of that mirror opposes my magic power. ... I can not explain it well with human words. For example, let us speak of the differences between utensils. That mirror is the fork, and my power is soup. You can not drink soup with a fork, correct? If only the push of that mirror was gone, the could prepare a spoon perfect for drinking soup. . . . . If only that were to happen, I could drink soup, and even dig my way out of a rocky prison. . . . I could even scoop eyeballs out . . . Is that what it was?
I noticed Shannon also talks about loving children's stories.
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Old 2010-07-09, 23:01   Link #3032
Disz
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Ahh....after reading a bit, I thought changed my mind..

I thought Sayo is the murderer,but not because of Battler.There might have be a new theory,probably suggested along time ago.

It seems a bit more logical to think that Sayo arranged murders and used the servants.She probably killed Kannon due to betrayal.I think the motive is to be with George.With that,it's easy to come up with a motive.To take down the Ushiromiya Family and marry George with no problems at all.He'll have no burden.He'll have all the money.She probably uses the epitaph so that she can kill off one more family member,to remind them that they need to solve the mystery.After they do,Sayo could kill them,take the gold,marry George and live an awesome life.

Although I can't help think there's a red that contradicts this.When ''Beatrice'' says ''After you find the gold,no more people will die''.

So I'll go back to the Sayo the killing killer theory.
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Old 2010-07-09, 23:10   Link #3033
Jan-Poo
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Originally Posted by Disz View Post

EP2:After you read about the lightning,she says the mirror broke into two equal parts.
There! There's the symbolism. A mirror reflects your own image. According to certain superstitions a mirror reflects your own soul.
The reason it's said breaking a mirror brings misfortune is related to the fact you break your own reflected image.

Shannon broke the mirror into two equal parts, that means she broke herself into two parts, she broke her soul into two parts.

So the act of breaking the mirror into two symbolizes the split of her soul, and of course the other part is Beatrice.

By splitting the mirror, by splitting her soul, Shannon indeed created the conditions for Beatrice to resurrect and materialize in Rokkenjima.
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Old 2010-07-09, 23:13   Link #3034
Disz
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Woot woot!It seems I know what to bold.
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Old 2010-07-09, 23:20   Link #3035
Disz
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Oh and to clear off what some person said,pages and pages ago,when Sayo says ''Even though Kannon gave me words of comfort when I was down.Even so,I was dejected again because it wasn't 'him'.That itself was a sin.''

While by itself,it looks as a reference to battler and 6 years ago,it is better to read what's under it.

''That went far beyond any dream the likes of me could be permitted to see.,I don't know my place''

She recently got ownd by Eva and Nahstuhi,so I'm sure it was about George and his inheritance,and why he shouldn't be with her.


Oh I hit it.Jack-o-pot-o!
Spoiler for Sayotrice:

That crackle was louder than you think.

Last edited by Disz; 2010-07-09 at 23:41.
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Old 2010-07-09, 23:23   Link #3036
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Skimming ep2 I realized there are so many facts I forgot about. Natsuhi being the head of the PTA. Jessica not returning to Rokkenjima until late.

Edit: This is a strange statment by Kanon
Quote:
Originally Posted by Kanon Ep2
We are furniture. We serve on Rokkenjima, and end our lives on Rokkenjima. So I had come to think that Rokkenjima itself was our world.
What the heck!? It is stated only two servants work on Rokkenjima at a time except under certain conditions. So Kanon should be home or whatever a few days a week at least. And second they say they can quit after a certain age or whatever, so how does that statment "we die on Rokkenjima" fit at all.
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Old 2010-07-09, 23:40   Link #3037
Kaisos Erranon
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Originally Posted by Laserworm View Post
What the heck!? It is stated only two servants work on Rokkenjima at a time except under certain conditions. So Kanon should be home or whatever a few days a week at least. And second they say they can quit after a certain age or whatever, so how does that statment "we die on Rokkenjima" fit at all.
The furniture supposedly view their purpose as being sacrificed for Kinzo's ceremony, remember?
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Old 2010-07-09, 23:44   Link #3038
Laserworm
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Originally Posted by Kaisos Erranon View Post
The furniture supposedly view their purpose as being sacrificed for Kinzo's ceremony, remember?
Kanon being there only two years can't of had much time with Kinzo. And there is the fact that we have no really clear facts the Kinzo talked about such a ceremony.
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Old 2010-07-09, 23:44   Link #3039
Oliver
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It is still an unanswered question whether Shannon and/or Kanon have any off-island lodgings, actually get paid, or even actually exist as far as the law is concerned. We imagine they have to, but none of the stuff is ever mentioned.

I wonder though, could it be that neither of them actually exist in the first place, not even a Sayo to play both...
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Old 2010-07-09, 23:48   Link #3040
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Originally Posted by Oliver View Post
It is still an unanswered question whether Shannon and/or Kanon have any off-island lodgings, actually get paid, or even actually exist as far as the law is concerned. We imagine they have to, but none of the stuff is ever mentioned.

I wonder though, could it be that neither of them actually exist in the first place, not even a Sayo to play both...
Wouldn't that be a big twist in ep7 if we get Shannon and Kanon don't exist. The same goes for Sayo.
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