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Old 2012-01-06, 15:21   Link #1721
00-Raiser
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He did. I imagine what makes her an 'artificial mage' is that she was enchanced scientifically rather than created from scratch.
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Old 2012-01-06, 15:30   Link #1722
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We don't really understand all the details about what makes an artificial mage. They aren't always clones, though.
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Old 2012-01-06, 16:35   Link #1723
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Well, Lutecia is an artificial mage; that's been confirmed. I'd still like to know why people keep thinking Lutecia and Ginga were implanted with Relics; if they were, it would've been brought up somehow.
It keeps getting mentioned because Zest and Lutecia are referred to as "Relic weapon experiments"; emphasis on "relic".
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Old 2012-01-06, 16:38   Link #1724
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Process to create them may have used a relic, so much left to us to answer heh
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Old 2012-01-06, 17:10   Link #1725
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This is an amateur tournament for people who've trained independantly. Having Bureau members, who have been highly trained on government money, participate wouldn't be right. You don't let professionals participate in amateur tournaments.

In Lutecia's case there probably isn't a regulation that says "No scientifically enhanced child soldier's allowed."
Problem is , Lutecia is a very experienced fighter . Even if she's not participating at S Rank ( Indeed , is she still stuck at S , after all these years), under a limiter. I recalled she was limited to D rank....

So yes , it's a tad bit unfair for most of her earlier opponents. I'd say she has a fair chance of Representing Mid-Childa. A very good chance.

How far have a limiter restrictions been lifted? If Lutecia could do ... that at D rank , she must be really , really broken at S rank. Probably only Nanoha level mages have a chance against her , solo , in actual , real combat , if she has no limiter and was allowed to use her abilities to the max.

Though based on Striker S , I'd say the key to defeating Lutecia is to pile on her with multiple dangerous opponents from every direction. Of course , this is Vi-vid , and is likely quite different here.

I assume the Relic has something to do with her Circuits and her S class rank at age 10. (Frankly , I think Lutecia could easily be a monster on par with Hayate in terms or raw power, but that'd be too boring) . Though she was 2 years old when the Combat Cyborg Incident occurred.

Wait. Fridge Horror. It means that she was experimented upon not as an embryo , but as a fully aware human....
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Old 2012-01-06, 17:21   Link #1726
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Wait. Fridge Horror. It means that she was experimented upon not as an embryo , but as a fully aware human....
which also gives more justification for her silent, almost authistic behavior back in StrikerS.
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Old 2012-01-06, 17:27   Link #1727
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which also gives more justification for her silent, almost authistic behavior back in StrikerS.
I wonder whether that personality still lies buried , somewhere. We've not yet seen Lutecia in intense combat yet, or under severe pressure. We can't say that her normal personality now is the same personality she has under severe stress.

Though I acknowledge that her normal personality has shifted.
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Old 2012-01-06, 17:30   Link #1728
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^ I don't think being "pressured" in hard combat will be enough to trigger such a sudden change of personality, but i agree that probably such traits are still hidden in ther, probably if she faces something that trigger memories or feelings similar to those times she will revert or show some seriousness, but in a friendly tournament like this? I doubt so xDU.
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Old 2012-01-06, 20:04   Link #1729
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So, on a note unrelated to this discussion, I've come to the conclusion that Klaus and Olivie either had a platonic relationship, or one of unrequited love on Klaus' part.
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Old 2012-01-06, 20:06   Link #1730
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So, on a note unrelated to this discussion, I've come to the conclusion that Klaus and Olivie either had a platonic relationship, or one of unrequited love on Klaus' part.
Shhhhh . The Yuri fans would come after you with torches and pitchforks!

More seriously , it's a plausible theory. But considering the proclivities of the authors....
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Old 2012-01-06, 20:08   Link #1731
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Seeing how Klaus is male, I really doubt they'd come after me.
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Old 2012-01-06, 20:14   Link #1732
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Do you have something that to say that isn't about sex, dude?

I think that sounds plausible enough, too. They didn't really act like proper lovers.
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Old 2012-01-06, 20:21   Link #1733
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Sex is the crux of the matter for this conclusion, actually. Essentially, Olivie and Klaus couldn't have been married or in some kind of relationship (legally) because Einhart is not the Sankt Kaiser.

We know that Klaus died relatively shortly after his final battle with Olivie. He certainly never moved on, because it's implied (or stated, I'm not too clear on it atm) in time to find someone else to fall in love with, but he still was able to have descendants that carried his genes and memories--Einhart has to have some genetic link that is directly from Klaus to inherit her looks and problem.

Which means Klaus must've been had children with someone else before Olivie's death, and it wasn't with Olivie--if he had fostered children with Olivie, Jail simply would've needed to find whoever descended from that line into the current day to activate the Saint's Cradle--he was a pragmatist, if nothing else. But Einhart obviously didn't have the Sankt Kaiser genetic code in her, and Vivio's creation was necessary, so Jail stole the shroud and so on and so forth.

So either Klaus and Olivie had an entirely platonic relationship, or Klaus was in love with Olivie and she never returned his feelings/didn't find out about them.
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Old 2012-01-06, 20:29   Link #1734
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Sex is the crux of the matter for this conclusion, actually. Essentially, Olivie and Klaus couldn't have been married or in some kind of relationship (legally) because Einhart is not the Sankt Kaiser.

We know that Klaus died relatively shortly after his final battle with Olivie. He certainly never moved on, because it's implied (or stated, I'm not too clear on it atm) in time to find someone else to fall in love with, but he still was able to have descendants that carried his genes and memories--Einhart has to have some genetic link that is directly from Klaus to inherit her looks and problem.

Which means Klaus must've been had children with someone else before Olivie's death, and it wasn't with Olivie--if he had fostered children with Olivie, Jail simply would've needed to find whoever descended from that line into the current day to activate the Saint's Cradle--he was a pragmatist, if nothing else. But Einhart obviously didn't have the Sankt Kaiser genetic code in her, and Vivio's creation was necessary, so Jail stole the shroud and so on and so forth.

So either Klaus and Olivie had an entirely platonic relationship, or Klaus was in love with Olivie and she never returned his feelings/didn't find out about them.
Your arguments are perfectly legitimate from a meta standpoint. For the basis of Fanfiction , I'd take it as a reasonable stance. (And a well justified one at that)

But Authorial Fiat is another matter altogether.....
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Old 2012-01-06, 20:31   Link #1735
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...no, actually, that's pretty reasonable from what's been shown through the plot so far for those characters.

Saying 'the author would never do THAT, 'cause his fans are just crazy and unreasonable' is looking at it from a meta standpoint.
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Old 2012-01-06, 20:35   Link #1736
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Besides, Vivio and Einhart not being genetically related would only make a pairing between them more viable. So nyeh. Yuri fans shouldn't be all that upset over the idea of Olivie and Klaus not hooking up.
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Old 2012-01-06, 20:37   Link #1737
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...no, actually, that's pretty reasonable from what's been shown through the plot so far for those characters.

Saying 'the author would never do THAT, 'cause his fans are just crazy and unreasonable' is looking at it from a meta standpoint.
Unfortunately , Real Life can write the plot.

However , it depends on the mangaka. Does he want a well written and consistent work , or one that swings along to appease the fans? Professional Pride , in other words.

I don't disagree with you , in fact , I completely agree. But the question is , will the Author cave in to fan demands? That being said though , the author likely would go the Un-requited love route instead of platonic to appease those Yuri Fanatics that have hound Yuuno out of the franchise.
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Old 2012-01-06, 20:42   Link #1738
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If anything, ViVid seems to be based on fan demands(from japanese fans at least xDU). the results vary from arc to arc. I wasn't taking ViVid all seriously until the Torunament Arc started to run and more and more awesome stuff started appearing chapter after chapter.

Force on the other hand seems to be a more solid project refering to the fact that it have a planned story and plot twsts interconnected as also follows an apparenlty more stable structure than ViVid. Of course, how good the results are is in the eye of the beholder xD.
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Old 2012-01-06, 20:43   Link #1739
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If anything, ViVid seems to be based on fan demands(from japanese fans at least xDU). the results vary from arc to arc. I wasn't taking ViVid all seriously until the Torunament Arc started to run and more and more awesome stuff started appearing chapter after chapter.

Force on the other hand seems to be a more solid project refering to the fact that it have a planned story and plot twsts interconnected as also follows an apparenlty more stable structure than ViVid. Of course, how good the results are is in the eye of the beholder xD.
It would have been better had they animated Force , but that's off topic. But Force will make an awesome Fourth Season , IMO.
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Old 2012-01-06, 21:04   Link #1740
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It's been stated in the manga that Olivie and Klaus were like brother and sister, so...
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