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Old 2009-08-26, 14:17   Link #101
cheese4u
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Originally Posted by james0246 View Post

Also, was Oars a member of Whitebeard's crew? He called Whitbeard 'father' for some reason, and so far only crew members talk to Whitebeard so personally.
I believe so, I recall Moria saying that Whitebeard was "hiding Oars amongst his ranks," so that sort of implies that Oars is a member of Whitebeard's crew. Although, I could be wrong.
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Old 2009-08-26, 16:29   Link #102
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Originally Posted by james0246 View Post
Took three...? Nah, that was overkill. Either DoFlamingo or Kuma could have destroyed him easily, Moria...maybe (still unclear how his "Horned Lizard" technique works), but DoFlamingo and Kuma definetly...

That being said, when did the Shichibukai move to a position near Ace (or at least close enough to Ace that when Oars fell, he was just meters away from freeing his friend)?

Also, was Oars a member of Whitebeard's crew? He called Whitbeard 'father' for some reason, and so far only crew members talk to Whitebeard so personally.
Tag combo look better than just one Shichibukai taking him out . From what we saw kuma alone or DoFlamingo could beat him by there self . But it look awesome to see the Shichibukai work together to do something.
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Old 2009-08-26, 16:35   Link #103
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By the way, I forgot to mention that we can add Doflamingo's ability to the list of "powers that won't affect Buggy".




Speaking of Buggy, I'm hoping that we at least get a glimpse of him (and the rest of Luffy's group) somewhere within the next few chapters. Yeah, it's cool to see all of the top world powers duking it out, but I care for the "little guys", too! I care, dammit! Well, in the end, I think we can be certain that the world won't see Buggy as such a "small-timer" anymore after this storyline is over..... he's going to achieve a status that even goes beyond that of Pirate King. Yes, my friends, I believe that by the end of this series, Buggy will become a PIRATE GOD.



Oh, and I guess that he can make Ace his bitch underling after the storyline's over. Lord knows that the poor boy's going to need a shoulder to cry on anyway when his old man bites the dust......
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Old 2009-08-26, 21:11   Link #104
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Originally Posted by drummania View Post
Perhaps he wasn't trying to kill Luffy? Have anyone thought of that? .
There's no reason to think when the story already gave us the answer. Moria tried to stall for the sun to come up, that alone would insta-kill the SH crew.

I'm seriously wondering if any of you read the story you put in such high regard.

Oh and BTW, Moria formed a spear out of Brick bat in the spoiler pics like I assumed..It's over with.

Last edited by Phenomenal; 2009-08-26 at 21:21.
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Old 2009-08-26, 22:00   Link #105
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Originally Posted by Phenomenal View Post
There's no reason to think when the story already gave us the answer. Moria tried to stall for the sun to come up that alone would insta-kill the SH crew.
That being said, does it really matter? Why can't we just enjoy the current chapter? Moria's recently revealed technique doesn't appear to have served any purpose in a fight with Luffy (a giant spear, or really just a giant congregation of exploding bats, doesn't necessarily help against Luffy), nor are any other details available to indicate otherwise. So, let's cool our jets and wait for additional info in the future before deciding anything.

Last edited by james0246; 2009-08-27 at 01:23. Reason: took out all the old Moria stuff...
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Old 2009-08-26, 22:05   Link #106
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Originally Posted by james0246 View Post
I don't understand. I do not remember Oda directly stating that Moria was trying to kill Luffy and the gang.
Quote:
Zoro: The only fight that's left is one against time: the morning sun.
Moria wants to use his insane powers to use up the time we have

Zoro: Will we be destroyed first...?
Or will Moria destroy HIMSELF first...?
Oda said it in his story........chapter 482 Moria even told Odz to crush the Sh crew before then as well.
You guys seriously need to read your favorite.


Quote:
That being said, does it really matter? Why can't we just enjoy the current chapter? Moria's recently revealed technique doesn't appear to have served any purpose in a fight with Luffy (a giant spear, or really just an exploding bat, doesn't really help against Luffy), nor are any other details available to indicate otherwise. So, let's cool our jets and wait for additional info in the future before deciding anything.
LULZ a spear would gash Luffy...It's like a blade for heaven sakes...

Last edited by Phenomenal; 2009-08-26 at 22:17.
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Old 2009-08-26, 22:26   Link #107
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Originally Posted by Phenomenal View Post
Oda said in in his story........

You should have used this quote from Zoro:

"The battle against Moria... We've already won.... unless Moria has a giant bat spear, if he does we're screwed!"


Zoro is saying that they already defeated Moria during his time using Odz, and the only way for him to make a comeback from his barely conscious state is if he had a giant bat spear to toss at them.

Clearly a plot hole that he now turns out to have exactly that.
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Old 2009-08-26, 22:37   Link #108
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Originally Posted by Phenomenal View Post
LULZ a spear would gash Luffy...It's like a blade for heaven sakes...
And what if the size of the spear is fixed (i.e. its always a giant killer)? Or, what if it does not have a real edge (a person falling on a stick could still cause the stick to be force through the body if they are falling fast enough)? Additionally, what if he can't use the technique outside of his body (i.e. the "Spear" is directly connected to Moria in the pics, who’s to say that it can be separated?)? Or what if he can only make simple structures (i.e. edged weapons cannot be made, but pointed weapons can (imagine a pointed stick))? Or, what if instead of cutting, the Brick Bats form the object, but instead of piercing through the object, they instead eat their way through (they do have teeth after all)? Et cetera...

To put it another way, if Moria could always use "edged" or "bladed" shadows, why did he have scissors to cut other people's shadows?

There are plenty of other questions that need to be answered before you can say definitively one thing or another about Moria and his recent ability.

Last edited by james0246; 2009-08-27 at 01:32. Reason: took out all the old Moria stuff...
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Old 2009-08-26, 22:45   Link #109
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Originally Posted by james0246 View Post
Again, that is just your interpretation of the events. I can just as easily say that Luffy called Moria's bluff (in regards to him trying to force them to hide).
No you can't, cause the statement from Zoro is BLATANT [No need of interpretation] and there is nowhere for the crew to hide. Moria was trying to kill.

Quote:
Ultimately, I do not care. As Rurik and I said earlier, the Shounen universe is rife with this kind of event. Consequently, complaining about an enemy using a new ability in the next fight that they could have used in the previous fight is kind of a par for the course moment, especially considering that if a former enemy is used again they almost always receive some sort of power-up, even if the power-up doesn’t necessarily make sense…
Bad writing is bad writing it happens and it's just getting pointed out in this particular shonen...One Piece.

Quote:
And what if the size of the spear is fixed? Or, what if it does not have a real edge (a person falling on a stick could still cause the stick to be force through the body if they are falling fast enough)? Additionally, what if he can't use the technique outside of his body (i.e. the "Spear" is directly connected to Moria in the pics, who’s to say that it can be separated?)? Or what if he can only make simple structures (i.e. edged weapons cannot be made, but pointed weapons can (imagine a pointed stick))? Et cetera...

There are plenty of other questions that need to be answered before you can say definitively one thing or another about Moria and his recent ability.
Sigh, the spear Went into the giant and that huge spear would pulverize Luffy.. your questions are not needed.
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Old 2009-08-26, 22:57   Link #110
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Originally Posted by Phenomenal View Post
No you can't, cause the statement from Zoro is BLATANT [No need of interpretation]

Yes, it is blatant that Zoro says they already won at the part of the story you are talking about.

Moria has already been rocked by Nightmare Luffy and more.



By the way, Luffy did already fight someone with a powerful cutting attack. Crocodile with desert sword.

And Luffy dodged it. Perhaps he dodges cutting attacks because he knows they can hurt him.

So there is absolutely no reason to think Moria could have even hit him with a spear at that point. Especially since Zoro said the fight was over.
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Old 2009-08-26, 23:09   Link #111
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Originally Posted by Ermes Marana View Post
Yes, it is blatant that Zoro says they already won at the part of the story you are talking about.

Moria has already been rocked by Nightmare Luffy and more.
You can't read where Zoro said "Will we be destroyed first?" Lord have mercy....


Quote:
By the way, Luffy did already fight someone with a powerful cutting attack. Crocodile with desert sword.

And Luffy dodged it. Perhaps he dodges cutting attacks because he knows they can hurt him.

So there is absolutely no reason to think Moria could have even hit him with a spear at that point. Especially since Zoro said the fight was over.
Moria hit Luffy with Brick bats and trapped him with a box the samething can be done with the spear.
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Old 2009-08-26, 23:16   Link #112
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Originally Posted by Phenomenal View Post
You can't read where Zoro said "Will we be destroyed first?" Lord have mercy....

Zoro is talking about the sun destroying them. Not Moria using a spear to destroy them.

It is stated clearly: Moria has already been physically defeated, his only hope is to wait for the sun.





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Originally Posted by Phenomenal View Post
Moria hit Luffy with Brick bats and trapped him with a box the samething can be done with the spear.

Not really. Crocodile hit him with other stuff too. Luffy dodged desert sword, he can dodge a spear.

Seems pretty clear he is more likely to go all out to dodge a cutting attack.
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Old 2009-08-26, 23:27   Link #113
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Originally Posted by Phenomenal View Post
Sigh, the spear Went into the giant and that huge spear would pulverize Luffy.. your questions are not needed.
Because Moria stomping on Luffy sure pulverised him . If it is a giant spear, and always a giant spear, then Luffy need have no fear. If Moria can make a bunch of throwing darts or kunai, though, then Luffy might have some problems. Until Moria makes those throwing darts/kunai, though, your accusations are a little unfounded.

Last edited by james0246; 2009-08-27 at 01:22. Reason: took out all the old Moria stuff...
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Old 2009-08-26, 23:28   Link #114
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Originally Posted by Ermes Marana View Post
Zoro is talking about the sun destroying them. Not Moria using a spear to destroy them.

It is stated clearly: Moria has already been physically defeated, his only hope is to wait for the sun.
Glad you acknowledge that Moria was trying to kill the SH crew.

Quote:
Not really. Crocodile hit him with other stuff too. Luffy dodged desert sword, he can dodge a spear.

Seems pretty clear he is more likely to go all out to dodge a cutting attack
Luffy couldn't dodge Brick bat or a box...

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Originally Posted by james0246 View Post
Considering that Zoro was asking question...yes it is interpretation.

Since you are so incessant:

This statement proves nothing about Moria wanting to kill Luffy and the gang. It is simply a summary of events - Moria, despite his injuries, wants to stay in control, so he is gambling on the sun. Whether the Sun kills them or not is left unsaid.

This second quote has far greater weight, but, first of all, Zoro is not saying "destroyed", but rather "extinguish", and the use of this word (in Japanese 消滅) does not necessarily mean death. Additionally, the use of "destroying" for Moria indicates a ruin (自滅; ruining one’s self) rather than death.

So death is not necessarily what Zoro was talking about.

Consquently, it is a matter of interpretation....
Zoro was simply asking who was gonna die first, the sh crew from the sun disintegrating them because they have no shadows or Moria. Moria was trying to kill by stalling for time for the sun to coem up. The gym isn't helping you....

Quote:
Because Moria stomping on Luffy sure pulverised him . If it is a giant spear, and always a giant spear, then Luffy need have no fear. If Moria can make a bunch of throwing darts or kunai, though, then Luffy might have some problems. Until Moria makes those throwing darts/kunai, though, your accusations are a little unfounded.
Spear=/=stomp..A spear has a shar pedge that will skewer luffy.
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Old 2009-08-26, 23:32   Link #115
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Originally Posted by Phenomenal View Post
There's no reason to think when the story already gave us the answer. Moria tried to stall for the sun to come up, that alone would insta-kill the SH crew.

I'm seriously wondering if any of you read the story you put in such high regard.

Oh and BTW, Moria formed a spear out of Brick bat in the spoiler pics like I assumed..It's over with.
yes I did read the manga and in no where did Moria said he wanted to go for the instant kill using the sun. As I have explained earlier, Moria did not expect Oz to set sail Thriller Bark away from the heavy fog that was blocking the sun. Let alone planning to use it to kill the SHs. He certainly wasn't expecting the SHs to chase after him while every single soul he met and stole shadows from chose to hide in the dark to keep living. Thirdly he was WAITING for Luffy's powerful shadow to use it on Oz. He had zero reason to kill him right after he got the shadow. He was defending the whole time until he lost his mind and used Shadow Asgard. Only then he went for the kill (or just wanted to finish them off quickly. Can't tell really.)

So there two possiblilties.
1) Moria didn't want to kill Luffy hence didn't use the spear.
2) It is bad writing on Oda's part that he didn't come up with the spear when he was trying to make Moria attempt to kill Luffy.
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Old 2009-08-26, 23:34   Link #116
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^Zoro himself said what Moria tried to do and Moria tried to use the sun to kill the SH crew by stalling with his own powers. So no you didn't read the chapters.
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Old 2009-08-26, 23:43   Link #117
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Originally Posted by Phenomenal View Post
Spear=/=stomp..A spear has a shar pedge that will skewer luffy.
If the spear is always giant, which we have no way of saying it isn't, then it would simply be a giant stick with a point on the end. Consequently, Luffy need only dodge the point, and then he will be relatively safe (similar to Don Krieg's exploding spear from way back in the beginning). It is only if he can use smaller weapons (which we have no way of knowing), that any amount of discussion is needed (on whether this was "bad writing" or not).

Last edited by james0246; 2009-08-27 at 01:31. Reason: took out all the old Moria stuff...
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Old 2009-08-26, 23:46   Link #118
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Originally Posted by james0246 View Post
Obviously school didn't help you .

Zoro said nothing about death, that is merely your interpretation. The faster you can grasp that, the faster you can stop this needless conversation (or at least move it to a venue more suiting its content).
facepalm
Zoro: "Will we be destroyed first?"
Destroyed=death...

Quote:
If the spear is always giant, which we have no way of saying it isn't, then it would simply be a giant baseball bat with a point on the end. Consequently, Luffy need only dodge the point, and then he will be safe (think Don Krieg's exploding spear from way back in the beginning). It is only if he can use smaller weapons (which we have no idea about), that any amount of discussion is needed (on whether this was "bad writing" or not).
Yeah Luffy is gonna dodge it like he did brick bat and black box.....
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Old 2009-08-26, 23:47   Link #119
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Originally Posted by Phenomenal View Post
Glad you acknowledge that Moria was trying to kill the SH crew.

I didn't say anything either way about that.

Maybe Moria wants to wait for the sun to kill them, maybe he wants to wait for the sun to make them retreat, or maybe he is already losing consciousness and isn't thinking straight at all.

Chopper says Moria is already losing consciousness, so there is some evidence for the last one.



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Originally Posted by Phenomenal View Post
Luffy couldn't dodge Brick bat or a box...


When Crocodile uses desert sword Luffy notices what type of attack it is, and dodges it.

Crocodile hits him with other non-cutting attacks.

Luffy is more likely to try to dodge more dangerous attacks. Makes sense.


Also, Luffy isn't really "hit" by brick bats or shadow cage. The bats form into a cage around him. Maybe Luffy would have tried to dodge if they came right at him. Or maybe not, because it wasn't a dangerous enough attack to need to dodge.
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Old 2009-08-26, 23:52   Link #120
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Originally Posted by Ermes Marana View Post
I didn't say anything either way about that.

Maybe Moria wants to wait for the sun to kill them, maybe he wants to wait for the sun to make them retreat, or maybe he is already losing consciousness and isn't thinking straight at all.
There is no maybe's about it, Moria's motives were pointed out in the story CLEARLY and what happens to people without a shadow when the sun touches them...THEY GO TO HELL!!!!

Quote:
When Crocodile uses desert sword Luffy notices what type of attack it is, and dodges it.

Crocodile hits him with other non-cutting attacks.

Luffy is more likely to try to dodge more dangerous attacks. Makes sense.


Also, Luffy isn't really "hit" by brick bats or shadow cage. The bats form into a cage around him. Maybe Luffy would have tried to dodge if they came right at him. Or maybe not, because it wasn't a dangerous enough attack to need to dodge.
What do you know, Moria formed the spear out of brick bat as well...
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