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View Poll Results: Umineko no Naku Koro ni - Episode 11 Rating
Perfect 10 37 20.67%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 47 26.26%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 41 22.91%
7 out of 10 : Good 27 15.08%
6 out of 10 : Average 18 10.06%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 3 1.68%
4 out of 10 : Poor 2 1.12%
3 out of 10 : Bad 0 0%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 2 1.12%
1 out of 10 : Painful 2 1.12%
Voters: 179. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2009-09-10, 20:50   Link #221
plzd0ntkeelme
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Wow the pacing and animation couldn't have been worse. I guess one extra episode is just way too much for the studio.

A couple of hilarity in this ep. The room where Rosa, Battler, and Maria were in supposed to be barricaded with stack of furnitures but they completely disappear in this ep with zero explanation. Also Genji's supposed to be the most loyal to the Ushiromiya but his character completely changed in this ep. Not to mention Battler's last comment about being inspired by Rosa's perseverance, when she just acknowledged Beatrice right at that very moment. Anyways hopefully second season will have more budget.
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Old 2009-09-10, 21:03   Link #222
momobunny
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I'd post the uploaded (by hitomi04) clips of Rosa VS Goats and the Hidden Tea Party scenes for the anime-only viewers to see... but I'm not sure if that's allowed.
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Old 2009-09-10, 22:00   Link #223
orangejuicetang
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You did more than enough in mentioning that it's by hitomi04. A quick trip to youtube is all it took for me.

*edit
How interesting. I don't know whether the anime banquet or the VN banquet disturbed me more. One was more visual, but the other had those descriptions and such.
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Last edited by orangejuicetang; 2009-09-10 at 22:20.
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Old 2009-09-10, 22:47   Link #224
Diedrupo
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Quote:
Originally Posted by plzd0ntkeelme View Post
Also Genji's supposed to be the most loyal to the Ushiromiya but his character completely changed in this ep. Not to mention Battler's last comment about being inspired by Rosa's perseverance, when she just acknowledged Beatrice right at that very moment. Anyways hopefully second season will have more budget.
This was all in the VN, so what are you really complaining about? That it doesn't make sense?
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Old 2009-09-10, 22:52   Link #225
Leo_Otaku
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Quote:
Originally Posted by June 1983 View Post
The artwork is actually fine in the game. Worlds better than Higu's art. It's very clean and simple. There's some characters whose designs I'm not a fan of, but honestly? It's nothing that important, even if you are a fine arts student. The most wonderful part of playing the game is the combination of the amazing music, the pace of the story, and the content of the story. It's truly amazing when you happen to time crescendos in the music with really dramatic scenes and transitions. (I have to admit, I've played the Banquet and Musou Rosa chapter multiple times just to experience it again. I love timing the final gunshots/"When the seagulls cry ..." card up with a certain point in the music.

Anyway, I would recommend the game to any anime viewer. Not because it's omgbetter than the anime, or whatever. I'd recommend because it's FUN, it's exciting, and it will further increase your understanding of the story and appreciation of the characters and the music.
It has improved since Higurashi. I really do want to play the games but I want to wait until after the anime at least. But I would prefer to play them on the DS. I really liked what they have done for Higurashi in those terms. I want a really good experience of playing it. I love the soundtracks I managed to get a hold of them. I'm a big fan of Dai and ZTS from Higurashi as well.

As for fine arts, it does have to do with that. After drawing models after models upon models of people. You get a better understanding of the body, shading, and so forth. I can see lacking of this. Again don't want to start flame wars, just my opinion.

Though I commend you on going to great lengths to encourage those to play the game. Rest assured I will play it someday ^-^

Quote:
Originally Posted by NeoWorm View Post
I hope that with nice art you dont mean generic looking style like in most VN/anime. I am in similar position as you - I studied arts most of my life and I draw as well - and I must say that only thing that is bad about novel art are the poses. Art in Umineko is simple but it have style, design is original and the expressions are flawless. Only if the characters would move sometimes. Only Battler have his "Objection!" pose and few characters have rifles.
I would expect the company to be like type-moon keeping their design but uping the quality of graphics. They were small like them but are now on the same level of popularity. They do have the funding. It doesn't have to be generic to be better quality. I'm not knocking down anyone or dis-agreeing with opinions.
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Old 2009-09-10, 22:54   Link #226
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Originally Posted by plzd0ntkeelme View Post
Not to mention Battler's last comment about being inspired by Rosa's perseverance, when she just acknowledged Beatrice right at that very moment.
Lack of Lamda speech bites anime-only viewer's butts.
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Old 2009-09-10, 22:56   Link #227
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Eh. The episode was so-so..but..

WIN ON THE TEN YEARS TO EARLY FOR EATING MARIA LINE!<3

EDIT:
I really DO NOT like Lambda's voice. at all. I honestly hear Mika Kanai 's voice everytime I look at Lambda and I'm kinda heart broken they went with Fuyuka Ōura :/
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Last edited by HaizuUsa; 2009-09-10 at 23:01. Reason: watched the end of ep P:
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Old 2009-09-10, 23:14   Link #228
plzd0ntkeelme
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Originally Posted by Diedrupo View Post
This was all in the VN, so what are you really complaining about? That it doesn't make sense?
wtf First of all, who claim this is NOT in the VN? Not that I care cause I don't play the VN. Secondly, who's complaining? I simply think these stuff as inconsistent, that's all.
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Old 2009-09-10, 23:16   Link #229
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Man... just finished watching it...
To be eaten alive... it's fine...
But to be eaten alive, BUCK-NAKED!
Shiet! THAT'S bad.

~Travis
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Old 2009-09-10, 23:27   Link #230
TheForsaken
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Quote:
Originally Posted by plzd0ntkeelme View Post
A couple of hilarity in this ep. The room where Rosa, Battler, and Maria were in supposed to be barricaded with stack of furnitures but they completely disappear in this ep with zero explanation. Also Genji's supposed to be the most loyal to the Ushiromiya but his character completely changed in this ep. Not to mention Battler's last comment about being inspired by Rosa's perseverance, when she just acknowledged Beatrice right at that very moment. Anyways hopefully second season will have more budget.
Genji always treats Beatrice as someone of the same rank as Kinzou (you've already seen that in ep 7). So now when Beatrice's with Kinzou, it's not that strange if he acts as if she is his master.
And about Battler, he's not inspired by Rosa's perseverance. He got angry and returned to fight after seeing Rosa's bullied by Beatrice.
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Old 2009-09-10, 23:48   Link #231
chronotrig
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Quote:
Originally Posted by plzd0ntkeelme View Post
Also Genji's supposed to be the most loyal to the Ushiromiya but his character completely changed in this ep. Not to mention Battler's last comment about being inspired by Rosa's perseverance, when she just acknowledged Beatrice right at that very moment. Anyways hopefully second season will have more budget.
Yeah, there's quite a few things to complain about, but these are not them. Genji's behavior is like that for a reason. Since no one even knows his true motives now, calling his character inconsistent seems a bit odd to me. If you just assume weird things mean something is wrong with the storytelling, then it's impossible for you to see any clues.

Battler was probably talking about Rosa Musou and how she was willing to give up everything to save Maria in the end. In other words, what happened before that Tea Party scene. In the game, there's also a more convincing reason, but that got left out of the Ura Tea Party here.

......However, the thing about barricade magically disappearing is a clear anime slip up. Not impossible or even unbelievable, but sloppy...unless it's a well hidden clue (you never know with Ryuukishi).
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Old 2009-09-10, 23:59   Link #232
Arbane the Terrible
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Mildly worrisome question--after (meta?)-Battler tells off Beatrice at the end, what happened to Rosa and Maria('s head)? (Chess explanation: "They went back in the box for the next game.")

On that note, it seems like Meta-Battler and regular Battler kind of merged there for a bit, if I understand what happened correctly.
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Old 2009-09-11, 00:06   Link #233
plzd0ntkeelme
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If Genji treats Beatrice as the family head, he shouldn't throw knife on the golden butterfly, shouldn't press the spider web on "Kanon" to destroy Beatrice's magic, instead should be respecting and submitting to them as a servant should.

It's nice for Rosa to fight the goats and all but still at the end she submit to Beatrice and crying. I personally don't find this as perseverance, if anything it just shows that Rosa got great fighting skills.
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Old 2009-09-11, 00:33   Link #234
_dk
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Yeah, the episode is rushed, can't do much about it.
Instead, I'll complain about what they left out like everyone here!

Spoiler for game spoilers and thoughts:
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Old 2009-09-11, 00:37   Link #235
gameboy234
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Agreed that this episode is poor. Quite weird that buttle decide to fight on without much plot explaining why he decided to do so.

I don't understand the logic, why buttle is still trying to deny the witch existence. I will be freaked out seeing maria head alive..
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Old 2009-09-11, 00:46   Link #236
chronotrig
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Quote:
Originally Posted by plzd0ntkeelme View Post
If Genji treats Beatrice as the family head, he shouldn't throw knife on the golden butterfly, shouldn't press the spider web on "Kanon" to destroy Beatrice's magic, instead should be respecting and submitting to them as a servant should.

It's nice for Rosa to fight the goats and all but still at the end she submit to Beatrice and crying. I personally don't find this as perseverance, if anything it just shows that Rosa got great fighting skills.
About Genji, my point exactly. How can you possibly know that that's a mistake and not a clue?
For example, maybe the Beatrice at the end is not the "Beatrice" behind the spider's web and the fake Kanon. Or else, maybe there's no need for Genji to obey Beatrice until her resurrection ceremony is complete (which is the time he switches over). Or, it could be that either the final scene or the previous scenes have a lie in them, either because "Genji" was a fake in one of them, or because the entire scene is somehow bogus. Or, you could argue that Genji is an opportunist and only switched to Beatrice's side after it's clear she's won (if you believe in anti-fantasy).
So yeah, I think I've made my point It's literally impossible for you to make the argument that his behavior is out of character until we've seen the end of the series.
While finding errors in the anime isn't so hard, you'd better have a hell of an argument before trying to find an error in the VN, with a few exceptions. That's what Ryuukishi's best at.

Also, if you think not giving up when dozens of goat monsters are chasing you isn't perseverance, I don't know what is. It's not like Rosa had any chance of beating them all.
It sounds like you define "perseverance" as not giving up no matter what happens to you, even after being forced to eat your siblings and seeing your daughter like that.
Come on, seriously?
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Old 2009-09-11, 01:14   Link #237
plzd0ntkeelme
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Originally Posted by chronotrig View Post
About Genji, my point exactly. How can you possibly know that that's a mistake and not a clue?
For example, maybe the Beatrice at the end is not the "Beatrice" behind the spider's web and the fake Kanon. Or else, maybe there's no need for Genji to obey Beatrice until her resurrection ceremony is complete (which is the time he switches over). Or, it could be that either the final scene or the previous scenes have a lie in it, either because "Genji" wasn't Genji in one of them, or because the entire scene is somehow bogus. Or, you could argue that Genji is an opportunist and only switched to Beatrice's side after it's clear she's won (if you believe in anti-fantasy).
So yeah, I think I've made my point It's literally impossible for you to make the argument that his behavior is out of character until we've seen the end of the series.
While finding errors in the anime isn't so hard, you'd better have a hell of an argument before trying to find an error in the VN. That's what Ryuukishi's best at.

Also, if you think not giving up when dozens of goat monsters are chasing you isn't perseverance, I don't know what is. It's not like Rosa had any chance of beating them all.
It sounds like you define "perseverance" as not giving up no matter what happens to you, even after being forced to eat your siblings and seeing your daughter like that.
Come on, seriously?
Obviously I can't confirm their facts since all that you said are nothing but your assumptions. Oh and what I mention is just an interpretation. This show is nothing but a person's imagination so the only truth can only come from the creator. So he can twist things around however he wants at the end. I simply interpret from what I see so far.
Secondly, so what makes her perseverance special if anybody would give up in that situation anyway?
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Old 2009-09-11, 01:14   Link #238
Shamisen
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Originally Posted by tcaz2 View Post
Did we get

Spoiler for Episode 2 Tea Party:
Damn. And you know I had been waiting up until that very moment. It was my favorite scene in episode 2. So badass. Well, atleast they kept Battler's lines from the VN.

Also, Rosa's fight scene with the goats at the end was a lot more intense in the VN. So was the .. tea party after that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by plzd0ntkeelme View Post
wtf First of all, who claim this is NOT in the VN? Not that I care cause I don't play the VN. Secondly, who's complaining? I simply think these stuff as inconsistent, that's all.
He assumes you're talking about the VN because you're complaining about things like pacing and the budget, which would only be a problem to those that are comparing it to the VN.
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Old 2009-09-11, 01:34   Link #239
chronotrig
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Originally Posted by plzd0ntkeelme View Post
Obviously I can't confirm their facts since all that you said are nothing but your assumptions. Oh and what I mention is just an interpretation. This show is nothing but a person's imagination so the only truth can only come from the creator. So he can twist things around however he wants at the end. I simply interpret from what I see so far.
I never said that any of those were true, so they aren't "my assumptions". I just said that those were possible. If any one of those guesses is true, then your 'interpretation' is simply mistaken.

Pretty pointless to call something a 'hilarious' inconsistency if you don't even fully understand the story here. The entire point of this series is figuring out why apparent contradictions actually make sense. If you're unwilling to do that, then you won't enjoy the best parts of the series.

Let me be clear, since additional information from the VN shows that this is true: there is an intended reason for Genji's switch in behavior, one that the author thought of before writing this game and which he intended to use as an indirect clue for the readers.


Quote:
Secondly, so what makes her perseverance special if anybody would give up in that situation anyway?
I'm pretty sure I made it clear that it was the previous section, "Rosa Musou" where she was fighting the goats, that Battler was talking about. Personally, if I saw dozens of goat monsters trying to kill me, I very much doubt I'd grab a handbag and try to whack them with it, even if it was to protect someone dear to me.
If you think Rosa's actions there are "ordinary" or "less than extremely brave", then I'm afraid you've been watching way too much Shounen anime
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Old 2009-09-11, 01:40   Link #240
plzd0ntkeelme
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Originally Posted by Shamisen View Post

He assumes you're talking about the VN because you're complaining about things like pacing and the budget, which would only be a problem to those that are comparing it to the VN.
I don't see how this would 'only' be a problem to those comparing it to VN. Things just happen so quickly one after the other. Things like why Genji is outside to find the corpses. How did Rosa claim that Battler puts the letter when they all just enter the room. I think you don't need the VN to find this ep to be quite rushed. And by budget I also mean the animation which I think doesn't even apply in the VN.
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