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Old 2012-03-04, 11:44   Link #3761
DragoZERO
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Spoiler for Chapter 117:
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Old 2012-03-04, 11:48   Link #3762
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Oh the drama, if their relationship survives this, they're gonna be together forever :<
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Old 2012-03-04, 12:25   Link #3763
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Originally Posted by LeaD36 View Post
Oh the drama, if their relationship survives this, they're gonna be together forever :<
Yeah right, Utsumi is going to go back on the Yuki bandwagon soon. It's just like KNIM all over again.
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Old 2012-03-04, 12:37   Link #3764
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It was obvious something was going to happen
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Old 2012-03-04, 14:29   Link #3765
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At least Shou gets into University so her hard work for her career paid off.
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Old 2012-03-04, 14:46   Link #3766
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Well at least she's not a wishy washy whiny bitch like a certain someone..."coughs" Yuki.
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Old 2012-03-04, 14:47   Link #3767
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Originally Posted by Deikan View Post
Yeah right, Utsumi is going to go back on the Yuki bandwagon soon. It's just like KNIM all over again.
I insistently hope the author mans up and doesn't pull us into the useless drama cycle, i've been pretty content with the plot so far.
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Old 2012-03-04, 15:00   Link #3768
Waven
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Well at least she's not a wishy washy whiny bitch like a certain someone..."coughs" Yuki.
Well, that's one way to describe someone with a trauma.
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Old 2012-03-04, 15:42   Link #3769
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Well, that's one way to describe someone with a trauma.
I can understand she's still upset about it, I just wish that the author can let her meet the ex and get it over with. While she was dating Utsumi she had his number and letter, but got rid of it because she claimed she didn't need it, so she lost her chance to see him and it's still haunting her.

I mean, we already met him so why not make a closure for her so she can figure out what to do from there. Hence why I say she's too wishy washy.
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Old 2012-03-04, 16:26   Link #3770
Waven
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Originally Posted by Deikan View Post
I can understand she's still upset about it, I just wish that the author can let her meet the ex and get it over with. While she was dating Utsumi she had his number and letter, but got rid of it because she claimed she didn't need it, so she lost her chance to see him and it's still haunting her.

I mean, we already met him so why not make a closure for her so she can figure out what to do from there. Hence why I say she's too wishy washy.
And later when she got the letter from Tooru and asked Utsumi whether to read it or not Utsumi shred it to pieces showing that neither could really deal with Yuki's drama , let alone trying to mend it. Just like Yuki did before Utsumi was repressing the problem instead of facing it. They both , even together, weren't prepared for this so in my opinion it's hard to blame someone individually instead of the situation itself.
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Old 2012-03-04, 16:26   Link #3771
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fan bellyaching aside.....

cueeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee Mountains out of Anthills

If Seiji has ANNNYYY skills, he'll lie and nothing will come of this, but this a shonen romance manga so............
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Old 2012-03-04, 16:38   Link #3772
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I think Shou will jump to a conclusion before Seiji can get a word out.
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Old 2012-03-04, 16:58   Link #3773
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Originally Posted by Waven View Post
I think almost all fictional series get to the point where the readers' initial hype and excitement turns into habit, being attached to single characters / single aspects of the series (like ecchi) or just wanting to know how it ends to have completed something.

The thing is if there are enough people that regularly watch/read/etc. such series even out of these secondary reasons then from a business perspective there's no need for the creators to stop. I think we rarely see series ending just because the author/creator thinks it's not high quality anymore.

This ofc only applys to series that you follow while they are still running (e.g. weekly , monthly...) and it mostly applys to works that are relatively long-running - you probably won't have the mentioned effect during a single-cour anime.

That is also why I think you can't compare new, weekly series that are scanlated regularly to older series like Ichigo100%, which, I assume, none of us read on a weekly basis. I can only imagine how people would've raged at Manaka and Aya or gotten tired of the triangle if they read it weekly.

If GE and KNIM were to end next week and would make place for other shounen dramas then the same people would get tired of them at some point sooner or later, not because the series are necessarily bad but the format itself doesn't work for these people (anymore), as KLGChaos seems to have realized for himself.
You're right. It's more the format than the drama itself. I quite enjoy seinen romance drama likes Hoshi no Furu Machi and Yesterday wo Utatte and personally find them light years ahead of most shounen dramas and here's why:

I think the big difference which makes Seinen RomDramas better comes down to one major thing-- focus. A shounen romance, especially dramas, are ALL about the romance and relationship. To the point that the characters very lives revolve around it. You remove the romance from the manga and suddenly the characters have nothing to do and there's no story. The romantic drama is the protagonist of the story and characters themselves just play a role to fulfill that protagonists needs. Conversely, a seinen romance drama, while the romance may play a major factor in the story (like in Yesterday wo Utatte), is about the characters and it's the characters that define the romance. You remove the romance from the story and the characters are still almost as well-defined as before. You remove Yuki and Utsumi's relationship from GE and what do you get? Not much.
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Old 2012-03-05, 15:01   Link #3774
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@KLGChaos: I agree that seinen series have their obvious advantages in that they present relationships on a more mature and rational level (while still being good romance) rather than impulse driven teenage crush plots.

The reason why I personally try to avoid running seinen manga, and afaik this is not the case with the two series you mentioned as of yet, though, is that often and obviously more than in shonen they incorporate heavy drama devices like NTR, rape and tragic death which are topics I don't look for in a medium that I for myself "consume" for light-hearted entertainment (yes, I'm numbering GE among that) . Such devices by all means can ruin the time and emotions invested in and ultimately the experience of a series for me and I know a lot of people avoid seinen for the exact same reason.

We had this some time ago that if SK was writing GE for a seinen mag it probably would've depicted Yuki being raped instead of just having consensual sex filmed and that's where I would've stopped, which I already mentioned by the time the flashback raw chapter was released. Gladly, some people were right to point out that the scenes shown were actually no rape scenes.
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Old 2012-03-05, 16:13   Link #3775
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Originally Posted by Waven View Post
@KLGChaos: I agree that seinen series have their obvious advantages in that they present relationships on a more mature and rational level (while still being good romance) rather than impulse driven teenage crush plots.

The reason why I personally try to avoid running seinen manga, and afaik this is not the case with the two series you mentioned as of yet, though, is that often and obviously more than in shonen they incorporate heavy drama devices like NTR, rape and tragic death which are topics I don't look for in a medium that I for myself "consume" for light-hearted entertainment (yes, I'm numbering GE among that) . Such devices by all means can ruin the time and emotions invested in and ultimately the experience of a series for me and I know a lot of people avoid seinen for the exact same reason.

We had this some time ago that if SK was writing GE for a seinen mag it probably would've depicted Yuki being raped instead of just having consensual sex filmed and that's where I would've stopped, which I already mentioned by the time the flashback raw chapter was released. Gladly, some people were right to point out that the scenes shown were actually no rape scenes.
I remember "Bitter Virgin" ... it was somewhat light hearted at first... then shit got REALLY adult quick... complete with surgical marks.
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Old 2012-03-05, 16:35   Link #3776
DragoZERO
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I remember "Bitter Virgin" ... it was somewhat light hearted at first... then shit got REALLY adult quick... complete with surgical marks.
Hey! That is a definitive seinen manga. Yes, it was a giant plot device but the character progression and ending was fantastic.

Seinen isn't always NTR, rape or tragic death. It's just more common, unfortunately. If you want one that doesn't stem on either then try Yume de Aetara and Ai Yori Aoshi.
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Old 2012-03-05, 18:31   Link #3777
KLGChaos
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Originally Posted by Waven View Post
@KLGChaos: I agree that seinen series have their obvious advantages in that they present relationships on a more mature and rational level (while still being good romance) rather than impulse driven teenage crush plots.

The reason why I personally try to avoid running seinen manga, and afaik this is not the case with the two series you mentioned as of yet, though, is that often and obviously more than in shonen they incorporate heavy drama devices like NTR, rape and tragic death which are topics I don't look for in a medium that I for myself "consume" for light-hearted entertainment (yes, I'm numbering GE among that) . Such devices by all means can ruin the time and emotions invested in and ultimately the experience of a series for me and I know a lot of people avoid seinen for the exact same reason.

We had this some time ago that if SK was writing GE for a seinen mag it probably would've depicted Yuki being raped instead of just having consensual sex filmed and that's where I would've stopped, which I already mentioned by the time the flashback raw chapter was released. Gladly, some people were right to point out that the scenes shown were actually no rape scenes.
I'm not into the Seinen series that depict NTR and such, either, which was why I dropped Hetakoi (which was more of a reverse NTR, in a way). I'm also not a fan of rape or tragedy. Which is why my poor reading list has become so small. >< Finding Seinen romances that deal with mature issues without the need to resort to cheesy shock value can be difficult and for some reason, people always associate "mature" with either lots of sex or lots of dark themes. That's why I tend to go for the series that are more Slice of Life romance than pure dramatic romance. The slice of life gives a much bigger focus to characters just living their lives as people instead of just being plot devices. Some may find those series boring, though (like Pastel, which even I admit is going nowhere fast). I enjoy them because they really do depict the ups and downs of life without forcing things towards one extreme or the other.

I've never read Bitter Virgin. I can deal with the rape as background plot, but from I hear, the characters never really move on and that's what I'm not a fan of. Yume de Aetara was good, though it definitely can fit into more of a shounen role in that it the story follows many typical shounen tropes just in a more adult business setting. Ai Yori Aioshi was also good. Though I'm not a fan of Umi no

I suppose not having much to read is fine, though, as my life will be tied up in Mass Effect 3 for quite a while anyway.
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Old 2012-03-05, 19:44   Link #3778
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but from I hear, the characters never really move on
most people seem not to understand the ending and think this, but it isn't true, btw the author wrote this manga (Bitter Virgin) to overcome the trauma of losing her own baby and it is a wonderful story in my humble opinion.
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Old 2012-03-05, 20:06   Link #3779
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Originally Posted by KLGChaos View Post
I suppose not having much to read is fine, though, as my life will be tied up in Mass Effect 3 for quite a while anyway.
Then you will learn about shitty ending and that there is no good/perfect ending at all and your choices don't matter at all ^^. And then you will join the shitstorm in BSN spoilers section. Have fun I'm prepared for big disappointment.



As for seinen series, I can survive NTR as long as its properly done.
Spoiler for major plot point for Nozoki Ana:


Now if GE could do the same thing with it story, I would still consider reading it weekly.
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Last edited by monir; 2012-03-06 at 22:38. Reason: added marked spoiler tags
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Old 2012-03-05, 20:25   Link #3780
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what is it with Seiji and cargo, checkered pants?

that photo plot device was obvious, now the question is, does the author go the traditional, KNIM route or something fresh?
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