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Old 2010-03-20, 09:22   Link #781
Waven
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Sometimes violence is the only way, that's true, however the key is to know when to use it. I don't think it would have been a good idea for Utsu to fight back here. First of all we don't know if Ryou is one of those "baddies" that only understands violence, it was a single deed, it's not like he bullies him 24/7, other than that we know nothing about him.
Secondly, what would Utsu have achieved? Ryou's respect? He doesn't care what this guy thinks of him, all that was important to him was Yuki ... so would she have liked it if Utsu had hit him back? Think not. This has nothing to do with her previous comment about spinelss boys, that was a mere statement about being brave, not being violent - Utsu didn't chicken out, he never had any intention to use violence to begin with since he actually felt guilty.
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Old 2010-03-20, 09:25   Link #782
HayashiTakara
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Well Ryou DOES pick on him every time he sees him so far. Always referring to him as a pathetic loser.
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Old 2010-03-20, 09:44   Link #783
Iron21
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Spoiler for Ch 29:
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Old 2010-03-20, 11:13   Link #784
Zwei
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Spoiler for #29:
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Old 2010-03-20, 11:34   Link #785
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Chapter 29 spoilers:

Spoiler:
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Old 2010-03-20, 12:06   Link #786
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This fanservice is getting a little big ridiculous.
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Old 2010-03-20, 12:16   Link #787
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Spoiler for 29:
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Old 2010-03-20, 12:25   Link #788
KLGChaos
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Spoiler for 29:
Spoiler:
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Old 2010-03-20, 12:26   Link #789
HayashiTakara
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Actually men are more quick to accept their girl is cheating on them (even when they're not). Girls are more likely to be in denial.
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Old 2010-03-20, 13:22   Link #790
Darknemo2000
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This manga is really desperate if it pulls covers like that. Its the only chance to show some fanservice but I think it is ridiculous.
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Old 2010-03-20, 13:24   Link #791
Cinocard
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Yeah, I was also like "what the heck" when I saw that cover. It was totally out of place. Doesn't fit the manga a twee bit.
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Old 2010-03-20, 13:28   Link #792
Darknemo2000
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Waven View Post
Utsu didn't chicken out, he never had any intention to use violence to begin with since he actually felt guilty.
Just because he feels guilty doesn't really make it better, because there are some ridiculous examples to feel guilty for and be loser for life and Utsu is an example for what you should not feel guilty for. And not to the level allowing some overjealous incest paranoic punching you.

Over-excessive feeling of guilt can also be a bad thing. You could say 'Wow but he feels guilty thats so noble" but the truth is that too stretched feeling of guilt kills such effect and makes you look sort of pathetic.
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Old 2010-03-20, 13:49   Link #793
Cinocard
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Wasn't as drastic as feeling "guilty." It was just: "I made a mistake, but now I will explain and show that you just made it too by punching me, so stop it or I will retaliate."

And Ryou punching Utsumi doesn't have anything to do with his conception about Utsumi at the time. He would explode and punch any boy that Yuki took home, then lying about staying in a girl friend house yet slept overnight with him somewhere else.

And of course Ryou would normally have to stop after one punch if Utsumi didn't punch back right away. It was public place, the punch was a sudden burst of anger, Yuki was stopping him. Even if Utsumi stared back and "wtf did you just do jerk" the natural follow up from Ryou would not be to give Utsumi another combo, but to dread him back by words.

I have no idea why you read it as Utsumi was too pathetic Ryou "had" to leave. Ryou most likely isn't even a brawler in the first place. In real life most would stop after the first punch.
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Old 2010-03-20, 14:06   Link #794
Darknemo2000
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If opponent doesn't fight back you leave him. But they will punch him without hesitation next time as well, push him around and so on, if now Utsu would have gotten into a conflict it may not made him look all that good in your and few other pacifists eyes but it would certainly improve things with Ryou who would not treat him as piece of trash anymore. Yes, no friendship, but at least he would not view him as a weak shit and would think twice before getting into another conflict. Now though, he would go into another conflict without any hesitation.

Now Utsu will have to go "Yuki. lets talk outside. I don't want Ryou to see me." all the time.

Now even for a wrong look Utsu may get it because Ryou views himself as much better/stronger guy thus will allow himself more, and less for Utsu.
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Old 2010-03-20, 14:13   Link #795
Xagzan
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Wonder why everyone's whining about the fanservice. Yeah, cause there's just been sooooo much of it lately. /sarcasm

Seriously, the fanservicey covers are far less frequent now than they were in the beginning, and I don't remember much fanservice in the chapters anyway. Unless of course you're complaining about Yuki's clothes being too revealing or sexy or whatnot, in which case it must be terrible for you that she's not dressed up in a nun's habit or something.
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Old 2010-03-20, 14:21   Link #796
Waven
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Darknemo2000 View Post
Just because he feels guilty doesn't really make it better, because there are some ridiculous examples to feel guilty for and be loser for life and Utsu is an example for what you should not feel guilty for. And not to the level allowing some overjealous incest paranoic punching you.

Over-excessive feeling of guilt can also be a bad thing. You could say 'Wow but he feels guilty thats so noble" but the truth is that too stretched feeling of guilt kills such effect and makes you look sort of pathetic.
Alright let's pick a single statement out of my post and, twist the meaning and dismantle it. again, it's not like I'm not used to it by now , was my statement about Utsu only caring about Yuki not good enough for the actual topic about him not using violence?
Besides I never commented on whether it was good for him to feel guilty just why he didn't use violence, but it's easier to just turn the argumentation around to another point, isn't it? You seem to take Utsumi's actions, mix in your own point of view, generalise and try to make an ideal rule for everyone, seriously i don't read your posts as opinions but doctrines.
Please, you are not Utsumi, try not to identifiy with this fictional situation so much. You seem so bothered with every aspect of GE that I'm seriously wondering how this series is still entertaining for you, it can't believe you're waiting every new chapter for Risa, a side side side character, to appear again.
Think I've already said enough and I'll probably be regretting to got into this argument again.
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Old 2010-03-20, 14:27   Link #797
Rainrir
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Every romance manga has fanservice covers from time to time. Seo Kuji is the master of fanservice, Boys Be has tons of fanservice. Adachi's early works have quite a bit of eye candy and Rumiko...well....there was....some (quite rare though...unless it is Ranma 1/2 or Urusei Yarsuraa you are talking about...then there are shit-tons of fanservice).

Maybe if you consider Tenshi no Konamaiki/Angel Densetsu as shounen romances...then yeah those are romance manga with no fanservice. I can't think of any other romance manga with no fanservice covers. Don't forget that some of the audience are horn-dog teenagers, you sometimes pander to what the audience wants. Even the revered Ichigo 100% and other series by Mizuki Kawashita have fan service (and it is by a lady no less, just like GE).

The Seinen mangas are seinen...those are closer to softcore porn rather than fanservice.

So what was the problem again? The fanservice is on the covers...not in the actual story itself. So it doesn't seem that bad to me.
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Old 2010-03-20, 14:32   Link #798
Cinocard
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Xagzan
Wonder why everyone's whining about the fanservice. Yeah, cause there's just been sooooo much of it lately. /sarcasm
It's the cover fanservice that annoys me. They are very out of place.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Darknemo2000 View Post
If opponent doesn't fight back you leave him. But they will punch him without hesitation next time as well, push him around and so on, if now Utsu would have gotten into a conflict it may not made him look all that good in your and few other pacifists eyes but it would certainly improve things with Ryou who would not treat him as piece of trash anymore. Yes, no friendship, but at least he would not view him as a weak shit and would think twice before getting into another conflict. Now though, he would go into another conflict without any hesitation.

Now Utsu will have to go "Yuki. lets talk outside. I don't want Ryou to see me." all the time.

Now even for a wrong look Utsu may get it because Ryou views himself as much better/stronger guy thus will allow himself more, and less for Utsu.
Assumed that Utsumi had always been viewed as pathetic trash by Ryou.
Either Utsumi:
-Punch and don't give a damn about explaining it to Ryou. Ryou would punch back and causes a scene. Then what Ryou would think of Utsumi: tough trash that must be handle not by hands but by stick. Tought, but doesn't change the fact that Utsumi is trash that need to be "handled."

-Punch then try to explain things. Yeah, except that Ryou would punch back and cause a scene, or at the least would try his best not to hear a damn thing from Utsumi's mouth. And farewell the explanation. Back to option 1. Trash that need to be handled.

And the girl Utsumi like, whom he thought was being sad and shocked since yesterday, now has to watch her close cousin and her close friend going at each other.

-Explain things first sincerely and say Ryou better stop it, because Ryou was also wrong for punching, and if he insisted on, Utsumi will fight back. Ryou of course had to step down, and he did step down. Ryou now thinks Utsumi is reasonable trash that at least seemed to be a little sincere at times.

-Explain things then punch when Ryou already stopped. It would be weird, really.

The bottom line is punching may make Ryou hesitated in pushing Utsumi next time around. But only because he would be thinking: "I need to get a weapon first." It's definitely better in the long run even for Ryou to think of Utsumi as "pathetic shit that does not have the gut to cheat," rather than "tough shit that may cheat and I have to go all the way to deter him from Yuki."
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Old 2010-03-20, 14:40   Link #799
Darknemo2000
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Why do you think Utsu would have his ass handled to him? He could win or it simply end up in clutch situation without a clear winner but it would have Ryou from thinking he can go away punching Utsu for the smallest reasons (because he considers him to be weak).

Utsu never explained things, Yuki tried but failed because she got in an argument besides Ryou would hardly believe with his paranoid mind anyway.

Now Ryou will just keep pushing Utsu around and will make smaller reasons to do that just because he thinks of himself as stronger.

Rainrir, imagine OP cover Luffy having a hot kiss with Boa Hancock and depressed and jealous Robin watching from afar... how much would that make sense?

Yeah it is romance fanservice and some of Boa/Luffy supporters would cheer but it is completely random and out of place.

Mangka just basically sluts out her manga instead of trying to sell it for its values as if admitting that those values are just not good.
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Old 2010-03-20, 14:59   Link #800
Rainrir
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Haha really? Then what are these?

Cover 27

Cover 20

Cover 19

Cover 15

Cover 12

Cover 11

Except you know, she does do fanservicey covers from time to time. You don't have to see it as "suddenly" she is whoring her manga out. I am sure she squeeze everyone (in the running for Utsumi...since there is no Eri) the colour cover because she might not get another so soon (though that will depend on how the series does). It is not the same as suddenly seeing LuffyxHancock on One Piece covers.

(Also LuffyxHancock ship has been sunk by Oda himself I think)

Last edited by Rainrir; 2010-03-20 at 22:11.
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