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View Poll Results: Bakemonogatari - Episode 12 Rating
Perfect 10 271 79.94%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 41 12.09%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 13 3.83%
7 out of 10 : Good 5 1.47%
6 out of 10 : Average 2 0.59%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 2 0.59%
4 out of 10 : Poor 2 0.59%
3 out of 10 : Bad 0 0%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 0 0%
1 out of 10 : Painful 3 0.88%
Voters: 339. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2009-09-29, 01:07   Link #241
Master Chibi
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Quote:
Originally Posted by epl View Post
The arc is 5 episode. Ep 12 is also part of it, and it was in the novel. The arc is probably the longest in the 2 volume books that the anime is doing. Shinobu might be part of it unless you are talking about the Koyomi Vampire arc, which is a prequel.
Wow, instant turn off.

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Old 2009-09-29, 01:28   Link #242
Marion
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To be honest some things annoyed me about this episode.

Spoiler for Rantish:


I give it a 7/10.
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Old 2009-09-29, 02:36   Link #243
sirn
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marion View Post
Spoiler for Rantish:
Remember when Koyomi brags about his knowledge of stars in episode 2 and Hitagi went "hmp"? This is Hitagi's answer to him. There's more to it in Nadeko Snake, but it has been omitted in the anime (which I hope they'll restore them back in the BD version.)

Quote:
Originally Posted by Marion View Post
Spoiler:
In a limited space such as inside a car or lying on the sheet stargazing, what is there to animate, really?
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Old 2009-09-29, 02:39   Link #244
Clarste
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Also, the ED was apparently written with this scene in mind, so you've got your causality reversed.
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Old 2009-09-29, 02:55   Link #245
Joe_fh
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Well there's an easy answer for most of those
1) They could only broadcast 12 episodes and they wanted to star true to the novel so there was really no way around this. Maybe they spent a bit too much time on this (I don't think so though) just to give it sort of an edning without distractions - and Hanekawa would ahve been one in this episode. After all it was a kind of ending. If they showed us an episode with Hanekawa the story would have gotten nowhere since the arc is 5 episodes and they only had one to give the TV broadcast some kind of end. Otherwise it would have been way to open, even though the story isn't finished. Besides they followed the chronological order of the novel

2) Actually they picked that ED so it could match this moment - not the oposite^^

3) Well the only reason she ignored her for two years was because of her "illness" . She was clearly avoiding everyone - she would have avoided Araragi as well if he didn't show that healed wound. So after all Senjougahara never said anything bad about Tsuruga. There were no bad feelings in their relationship so way not call her cute? After all they are friends and she is cute XD

4) Well basically yes - this was the way they were acting. That was due to the fact that Senjougahara had no idea what to do and Koyomi missed all the important moments when she was honest since he thought she was just teasing him. That's all the more why the last part of the episode was so great. It was in contrast to the way they acted until now. And that was one of the best scenes for me. Great character development in my opinion.

5) The animation was good. The style of animation was one of the things that got me interested in Bakemonogatari since the first scene in episode one. Though that aspect ration was strange.

About the stargazing scene - I agree with sirn. It was mentioned in episode 2 so this was indeed a kind of answer to that. Wish I could find the novel in english >.> Anyways...

Of course that is just my opinion and everyone has one ^^
But I haven't really seen something this good in a long time so this one's a solid 10/10 for me
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Old 2009-09-29, 02:58   Link #246
Ice Block
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marion View Post
How do you not even show an image of Hanekawa. They briefly mentioned her in the car and that's it. Seriously, they center an entire arc around her so shouldn't she at least appear in this episode. Yes, I know the arc is like 4-5 episodes long, but still it's kinda silly that you don't even show a single picture of the character that the arc is centered around
There are reasons why it's 5 episodes long. Has it not occurred to you that this is one of those reasons?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marion View Post
Star-gazing. Why do I feel like they pulled that just so they could have the ED relate to what was going on.
Other way around. That stargazing verse in the ED was made specifically for this one scene.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marion View Post
Hitagi calling TSuruga her 'cute junior'. What? You pretty much ignore her for two years, she tries to kill your boyfriend, so you start talking to her again and you're suddenly calling her your cute junior. What kind of messed up thing is that? Araragi and TSuruga are more bros and the latter tried to kill the former.
This is when you need to rewatch episodes 8 and 9. Pay more attention this time around.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marion View Post
Almost the entire episode is spent in that car. And almost the entire time they're just going back and forth at each other. Honestly, the way they talked and acted around each other (besides Hitagi nibbling his ear and coming close to his *ahem* area) reminded me more of how friends would tease each other. This is how they've been acting towards each other pretty much the entire 12 episodes. Honestly, it doesn't make me feel like they've evolved as a couple, despite what the father says about seeing her happy.
Perspective. Was the father watching with us all the previous episodes? And BTW this relationship evolution happens at the stargazing scene.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marion View Post
Lazy animation this episode. Felt like I was watching a slideshow more than ever. I know that's the style of the show, but even then this episode probably had the least animation quality for me.
True. They even cut it down to cinema ratio. Not much to animate though.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Marion View Post
Although I have to say I did like the up-do Hitagi had at the start of the episode and the father talking was nice. But to be honest, despite that I love Koyomi and Hitagi's relationship, this episode just didn't do it for me. And stopping the season in the middle of the beginning of an arc, just so they could have that stargazing episode end leaves me with an unsavory feeling (and again, I know that there are 3 more episodes going to be shown online, but broadcasted is what I mean) If they did something like this at the end of Tsubasa arc I wouldn't be so miffed but whatever.
Sticking to the source material. It just so happens that they managed to pace the other arcs just right so that we end the broadcast here. So what do you suggest they do here? Show things out of order and end on a cliffhanger? Rush through TsubasaCat or the other arcs? Show us your wonderful suggestions, please.
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Old 2009-09-29, 03:01   Link #247
zzeroparticle
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Well, I definitely felt charmed by the episode since it brings together Senjogahara's various aspects and ties it really nicely. The conversations between Araragi and Senjogahara are always interesting to watch since it has the potential to go many distances given Senjogahara's mastery of rhetoric and the witty repartee, but even then, her actions in this episode exceeded that by showing her charming side. If there's ever a show that manages to work its dialogue really well from start to finish, Bakemonogatari would definitely be it.
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Old 2009-09-29, 03:02   Link #248
epl
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Joe_fh View Post
Well there's an easy answer for most of those
1) They could only broadcast 12 episodes and they wanted to star true to the novel so there was really no way around this. Maybe they spent a bit too much time on this (I don't think so though) just to give it sort of an edning without distractions - and Hanekawa would ahve been one in this episode. After all it was a kind of ending. If they showed us an episode with Hanekawa the story would have gotten nowhere since the arc is 5 episodes and they only had one to give the TV broadcast some kind of end. Otherwise it would have been way to open, even though the story isn't finished. Besides they followed the chronological order of the novel
You are correct in most part, except that episode 12 is part of the arc and not just a standalone since the novel had it in the Tsubasa Cat arc.

Spoiler:


As for the aspect ratio in this episode, it could be that SHAFT did this so they had less to animate and would not create an ep 10 disaster. It may get fixed in the DVD/Bluray.
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Old 2009-09-29, 04:05   Link #249
zato_1one
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Or you can see it as the opposite. The entire series actually centers around Araragi. The name of each arc just shows that whose problem he "will" get involved in the "future".

And if the conversation + the expression they've shown when they watched the star still wasn't enough to convince you to believe that they were lover then it really couldn't be helped.
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Old 2009-09-29, 04:27   Link #250
sirn
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Quote:
Originally Posted by epl View Post
As for the aspect ratio in this episode, it could be that SHAFT did this so they had less to animate and would not create an ep 10 disaster. It may get fixed in the DVD/Bluray.
I wonder how the "less to animate" has something to do with cinemascope ratio; even if they've done it in 16:9 and decided to letterbox it to 2.39:1 at the end, the amount of frames they have to work on doesn't change. In fact, judging from some scenes (such as eye shot or long-wide shot), they've seems to do the whole episode in cinemascope ratio from the beginning.
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Old 2009-09-29, 06:52   Link #251
ac195
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Originally Posted by Marion View Post
To be honest some things annoyed me about this episode.

Spoiler for Rantish:


I give it a 7/10.
Hahaha,

SHHHHHH!!! You can't say anything negative about this series... unless you wanna be gang raped by an angry mob...

Things like... SHAFT = the best tracing "animation" studio ever... are not welcomed apparently, even though it's true.
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Old 2009-09-29, 06:55   Link #252
DragoZERO
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Clarste View Post
Also, the ED was apparently written with this scene in mind, so you've got your causality reversed.
That was one of my favorite parts for this episode. It really shows that they planned ahead - and that is key to having a good story.

It would have been good to see them kiss at the end, or at least move close to each other. Koyomi could have botched it up at the last minute, you never know.
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Old 2009-09-29, 07:36   Link #253
zato_1one
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Originally Posted by ac195 View Post
Hahaha,

SHHHHHH!!! You can't say anything negative about this series... unless you wanna be gang raped by an angry mob...

Things like... SHAFT = the best tracing "animation" studio ever... are not welcomed apparently, even though it's true.
Allow me to borrow dialogue from the series once again.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Oshino Meme from episode 1
My dear, it pisses me off to see you act as if you're the victim here.
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Old 2009-09-29, 07:38   Link #254
Raiga
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Originally Posted by zato_1one View Post
Allow me to borrow dialogue from the series once again.
I was considering saying something but I think you just won with that one.
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Old 2009-09-29, 07:45   Link #255
Ice Block
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Originally Posted by ac195 View Post
Things like... SHAFT = the best tracing "animation" studio ever... are not welcomed apparently, even though it's true.
With source material this good, how can you go wrong?

Case in point: Higurashi. Umineko even. DEEN's sub-par animation was (is being) carried by excellent plot.

And to quote an interview reported on sirn's blog:
Quote:
Originally Posted by Shinbou
If I’m to put Bakemonogatari into one word, that’d be ‘pressure’. To be honest, even if this series weren’t made by us, it would still be popular. We can’t really feel proud even when it is, because it’s hard for us to brings out our style in the series.
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Old 2009-09-29, 08:52   Link #256
Zetsubo
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Originally Posted by Azuma Denton View Post
She will have to overcome the barrier of her trauma first if she wanna name the children for real.
You know she will right ?

Given her character she is destined to fix the 'problem'.

The first and most important reason is that Senjougahara is terrified of loosing Koyomi to another woman because of her trauma.

Secondly she doesn't seem like the kind of person to be statisfied with giving Koyomi just the stars, her intellect, her blunt father and her cute kohai. She wants to give him more.

She is definitely on a mission
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Old 2009-09-29, 09:34   Link #257
Azuma Denton
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Originally Posted by Zetsubo View Post
You know she will right ?

Given her character she is destined to fix the 'problem'.

The first and most important reason is that Senjougahara is terrified of loosing Koyomi to another woman because of her trauma.

Secondly she doesn't seem like the kind of person to be statisfied with giving Koyomi just the stars, her intellect, her blunt father and her cute kohai. She wants to give him more.

She is definitely on a mission
Mission to stapler Hanekawa and Nadeko??

Yeah i bet she will.
We all know that she is not a weak-willed woman. If she want something, she is not afraid to chase it until she gets it. Not to mention she's cunning.

Love to see a scene where she will say this to Araragi.
"Mate with me tonight. No, that's wrong. Make love... Be gentle with me..."
"Love me tonight."
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Old 2009-09-29, 11:06   Link #258
Zetsubo
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I think the Sage Wolf Horo has patents on
"mate with me tonight !"
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Old 2009-09-29, 11:11   Link #259
Shiroth
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Originally Posted by DragoZERO View Post
It would have been good to see them kiss at the end, or at least move close to each other. Koyomi could have botched it up at the last minute, you never know.
The way the episode ended, and not seeing the kiss made it all the more sweet in my opinion. The fact that we know they're going to kiss adds to this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Raiga View Post
I was considering saying something but I think you just won with that one.
Indeed, zato_1one get's a cookie for that one.
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Old 2009-09-29, 11:13   Link #260
Miyuki-ism
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Originally Posted by Shiroth View Post
The way the episode ended, and not seeing the kiss made it all the more sweet in my opinion. The fact that we know they're going to kiss adds to this.


Indeed, zato_1one get's a cookie for that one.
I agree, just leave it to your own mind, did Araragi screw up? Who knows, I haven't read the novels. XD
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