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Old 2009-10-30, 21:27   Link #121
Blackbeard D. Kuma
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Originally Posted by MihawkXGP View Post
Although frankly, I'll NEVER acknowledge Blackbeard as being superior to Whitebeard even if he does come out victorious, because i have no doubt WB in his prime would annihilate Teach.
Blackbeard has been foreshadowed to be one of the last, if not the final villain in the story. With that being said, there's a very strong chance he'll surpass Whitebeard later on as the story progresses. In Shonen manga, the newer generations tend to have higher potential than those that came before them.
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Old 2009-10-31, 02:41   Link #122
Nightmare-Kun
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-sigh- if only he had the ability of Mantra(does anyone other than me still remember this ability?) he could have prevented it possibly
oh well like some of you said
his death will allow the story to move forward
i was surprised by this move from squad someone who was trusted
but it shows you cant trust someone who claims to be a ally yet appear weaker than you
because they may just be out to get you obviously.
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Old 2009-10-31, 03:08   Link #123
james0246
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That's the point: This attack is just too random.
This is a battlefield. Enemies fighting against each other. And then WB gets killed by a comrade? Somehow this doesn't make much sense, from the author's viewpoint.
If he wanted to kill WB, why not let him be killed by an admiral? Or a few Pacifista? The way this is presented is just too strange...
...But that way is expected. A story becomes more interesting if you do not know exactly how it will play out, and a comrade betraying Whitebeard in the midst of battle (to be explained later) is a far more interesting storyline than a known enemy striking him down. Why else do you think Judas was invented...? (j/k)

That being said, this is, obviously, not a death blow. It'll probably be the blow that ends his life, but it is not the blow that will end the battle.
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Old 2009-10-31, 09:07   Link #124
AddiKtioNn-BlaCk
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Originally Posted by Blackbeard D. Kuma View Post
Blackbeard has been foreshadowed to be one of the last, if not the final villain in the story. With that being said, there's a very strong chance he'll surpass Whitebeard later on as the story progresses. In Shonen manga, the newer generations tend to have higher potential than those that came before them.
I doubt that Blackbeard will ever be stronger than Whitebeard. White is the King of the Seas, the only way I'll acknowledge Blackbeard being strong enough to be considered a candidate for that title is if he's the final villain. Not one of the last, but the final.

If he's not the final villain, then Blackbeard will only be Yonkou-level IMO.
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Old 2009-10-31, 10:07   Link #125
d' airscapez
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could it have been Daflamingo that is controlling squado?
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Old 2009-10-31, 10:30   Link #126
james0246
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Originally Posted by d' airscapez View Post
could it have been Daflamingo that is controlling squado?
Considering that Squado was talking to Whitebeard as he prepared to strike him, I find it hard to believe that Squado was being controlled...
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Old 2009-10-31, 10:46   Link #127
Blackbeard D. Kuma
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Considering that Squado was talking to Whitebeard as he prepared to strike him, I find it hard to believe that Squado was being controlled...
Yeah. Doflamingo's victims usually try to put up some kind of resistance when they're being controlled. They'll also tell their comrades to get away from them (like the 13th Division Commander) or tell Doflamingo to stop it (like Sarquiss and that Vice Admiral from the Shichibukai replacement meeting). Squado looked perfectly relaxed and as if he wasn't forced to do anything.
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Old 2009-10-31, 10:54   Link #128
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Additionaly, in every case we saw Doflamingo control someone, he was rather close by, however, it's highly unlikely that he got past all the pirates lines so close to Whitebeard.
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Old 2009-10-31, 10:56   Link #129
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Originally Posted by Blackbeard D. Kuma View Post
Yeah. Doflamingo's victims usually try to put up some kind of resistance when they're being controlled. They'll also tell their comrades to get away from them (like the 13th Division Commander) or tell Doflamingo to stop it (like Sarquiss and that Vice Admiral from the Shichibukai replacement meeting). Squado looked perfectly relaxed and as if he wasn't forced to do anything.
Then again, he could have unsheathe to prepare for battle but unexpectedly didn't know Doflamingo's wires were on him and he'll probably show resistance in the next chapter. They didn't show Squado's face at the end of the chapter so his actions are questionable. Then again, that will make the story uninteresting and I don't get why he didn't bring the huge sword to fight in the first place and it's ridiculously huge for a man his size.
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Old 2009-10-31, 13:24   Link #130
marvelB
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I still have the feeling that Squado stabbed Whitebeard entirely of his own volition. There was definitely nothing so far that suggests that Doflamingo was controlling him, and frankly I think it would have a much bigger impact on the story if one of Whitebeard's most trusted allies turned out to be a traitor......



And on that note, I mentioned this before, but I think there's a good chance that Squado may have coated that sword of his with poison. I guess you can say it's sort of a failsafe in case Whitebeard doesn't die from the stab would alone (which he most likely won't). Besides, it would only make sense for a spider-themed pirate to attack with poison, would it not?
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Old 2009-10-31, 13:47   Link #131
Blackbeard D. Kuma
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I think that some people are just having a hard time accepting that the all-mighty Whitebeard can be wounded. He was totally caught off guard and therefore did not see that sword thrust coming. That's all there is to it. The only thing that's remaining is an explanation for Squado's actions next chapter.

The moral of the message in this chapter was, it doesn't matter how omnipotent you are, for if you let your guard down even for a second on a battlefield, it could potentially cost you your life. One must always be at the ready in case of such contingencies.
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Old 2009-10-31, 14:00   Link #132
james0246
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Originally Posted by marvelB View Post
And on that note, I mentioned this before, but I think there's a good chance that Squado may have coated that sword of his with poison. I guess you can say it's sort of a failsafe in case Whitebeard doesn't die from the stab would alone (which he most likely won't). Besides, it would only make sense for a spider-themed pirate to attack with poison, would it not?
Silly Marvel, Big Swords never contain poison. It is only the little swords that you have to worry about...
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Old 2009-10-31, 16:46   Link #133
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i feel this chapter was both awesome and dissapointing

awesome for all the stuff going on but dissapointed that we wont see whitebeard going at it wound free from the get go, w/e he does now i dont feel itll show his true potential but o wel nvm
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Old 2009-10-31, 18:52   Link #134
'Pryde
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yea i know he was just about to join the fight before he got stabbed
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Old 2009-11-01, 02:02   Link #135
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Originally Posted by Fipskuul View Post
Right now, from what we were told in the early chapters, there are currently two known ways for the crew to unite. Rayleigh(common for all) and Revolutionaries (Robin, when she was saved, Sanji, for Okama Kinque). Chopper can receive the help of the birds, Franky can do everything on his own, Nami can use a sky-island technique (flying on a cloud, for instance), Brooke and Usopp, no idea. I am also looking forward to learn how that meeting happens, as by itself the process to reunite would show some exciting scenes. Especially since the locations they landed are very different, even though all are 3-days flight away from the original location.

But, the way they arrive will also be a shocking end-scene in some of the future chapters.
They are all three days flight from the perspective of the speed they travel that Kuma sent them. It could be more or even less time. Also, that doesn't mean by other means it would take equal time to return.

It seems plausible that Robin would return by the Revolutionaries assistance. Providing they want to do so.

Who knows what's going to happen with Franky after he found Vegapunks old lab. I'm thinking some major upgrades there.

I'm not sure if Nami would ride of a cloud. Those kinds of clouds can't remain their density at lower altitudes. The way the Cloud Dials Usopp got wouldn't work at sea level. I do remember that Nami still has the Vivre Card from Lola's mother, but is she even on that side of the Grand Line? This does mean that Nami and Luffy are the only people in the crew that carry two different Vivre cards.

About Sanji, can he ever show his face again after he wore a dress and pranced around??? Heaven help him if Zoro ever got hold of that bit of intel.

Right now, Luffy is the closest to his destination. Marineford isn't too far off of Shabondy Archipelago.

I'm really curious if the reunion will be everyone at once, or will they have to go and find a few at a time?

I don't see how Rayleigh could find everyone, by himself. The Vivre Cards that were handed out only lead to him, since they were most likely made from his fingernails. Luffy is easy enough to find right now. I'm unsure if the news of Luffy was also broadcasted, and if any of the crew are watching?
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Old 2009-11-01, 09:27   Link #136
mtarzaim
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Originally Posted by SMASHERJACKSON View Post
i feel this chapter was both awesome and dissapointing

awesome for all the stuff going on but dissapointed that we wont see whitebeard going at it wound free from the get go, w/e he does now i dont feel itll show his true potential but o wel nvm
I noticed since a few chapters that WB was always drawn with shrouded eyes (vertical lines on the occular globes). When Oda uses this representation, it's for weaken/dying character.
The fact he never moved from his ship, standing still, letting his men getting crushed without reacting, adds to this theory.
So maybe WB was already dying from unknown disease.
And this betrayal was in fact a secret order from WB himself. He prefers to die by the sword on the battlefield, than an old dying man in front of the enemy.
Like a pirate version of Benkei.

A awful traitror being in fact a most loyal friend would totally be Oda's style.
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Old 2009-11-01, 11:22   Link #137
Talendra
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Originally Posted by mtarzaim View Post
I noticed since a few chapters that WB was always drawn with shrouded eyes (vertical lines on the occular globes). When Oda uses this representation, it's for weaken/dying character.
Could you show some evidence for that claim? I can't recall WBs eyes being anyhow different from the standard "omfg, im serious now" - eye-shrounding.

Quote:
The fact he never moved from his ship, standing still, letting his men getting crushed without reacting, adds to this theory.
Not at all, it adds to the theory, that Oda actually knows how to show are rather realistic war. The commander controling his forces instead of just jumping into the fight himself - which sure was tempting for WB, but he chose the better way and stood back to gave orders which - as proven by Sengokus comments - saved a lot of his sons lifes.


Quote:
So maybe WB was already dying from unknown disease.
We knew that all along, since he had these infusion thingies and all the nurses... but i hardly doubt thats the reason he stood on the Moby Dick all the time.


Also, given everything we know about Whitebeards values and behaviour, it would be extremely out of character for him, if he were to lead his forces into a fight without being able to take the toughest opponents himself. Thats just the nakama-thinking he, Shanks, Luffy and many more value so much: you gotta be able to protect your nakama, especially as the captain. No, i think Whitebeard saw himself as in proper condition to do some garp/sengoku/admiral-ass-kicking.
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Old 2009-11-01, 12:21   Link #138
mtarzaim
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Originally Posted by Talendra View Post
Could you show some evidence for that claim? I can't recall WBs eyes being anyhow different from the standard "omfg, im serious now" - eye-shrounding.
...
ch551 p18-19
ch552 p18-19
ch553 p3
ch556 p5
ch562 p16-17

But I recognize it's hard to determine if it's an indication of a decreasing life force or a dark state of mind.

I'm not sure it's a wise move to stay behind while your troops are being crushed by stronger opponents.
In this blitzkrieg type of battle, speed is determinant. You need to strike quick and strong, and get away with your objective as quickly as you came in.
Not really fancy for the shounen ways (you take down one enemy at a time with sheers numbers), but more realistic.

Continuing on the Benkei analogy, WB holds a naginata, is tall, share a fatherlike relationship with Ace/Yoshitsune and is facing an allout battle.
I can't help but feel a strong look alike with Benkei's rumored last battle.
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Old 2009-11-01, 15:39   Link #139
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I'm not sure it's a wise move to stay behind while your troops are being crushed by stronger opponents.
In this blitzkrieg type of battle, speed is determinant. You need to strike quick and strong, and get away with your objective as quickly as you came in.
Not really fancy for the shounen ways (you take down one enemy at a time with sheers numbers), but more realistic.
That's what Sengoku was hoping WB would do but didn't... rushing in is a damn good way to get yourself killed because you got no idea what the enemy has in store... They are charging in on an enemy who has spent the past week planning it's defense; the whole situation is ripe for traps and ambushes... Oars Jr, was actually an example of what happens to those that just charge in... and Had they just charged they probably would have taken even more damage by the kumas since they would not have taken the time to to look at the situation and spread out


Really, until the kuma's showed up, Whitebeard's side was doing alright... Jimbei and iva were covering two shicibukai's, Marco can counter an admiral, Vista could clash with Mihawk, and so forth... sure joze was in a bit of trouble, but they weren't by any means "being crushed"... it was only when the Kuma clones showed up did things start looking grim... and THAT's when Whitebeard decided to join the fight... and get betrayed...
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Old 2009-11-01, 16:41   Link #140
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It should be a real problem for those, who aren't even on the Grand Line anymore. The marines are the only ones known to have ships, that can enter the Grand Line without having to go the long way, and they surely don't take pirates with them.
It wouldn't surprise me if the Revolutionaries have ships that can cross the Calm Belt.
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