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Old 2010-05-15, 10:06   Link #201
noobita
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen View Post
Brain power, you need more brain power to beat Accelerator.

Actually, it has been done before by one Kihara Amata. He was able to calculate the precise moment the [Redirection] takes place and alter the direction of his attacks at the last second to render his power useless.

But it's you're talking about outright overpowering his reflect with another power, it's difficult to say the least. Accelerator can 'hijack' other Esper's abilities even if they are in control of them. Case in point, Mikoto's Iron Sand Tornado or Kakine's Dark Matter Wings. In fact, if we were to follow the Author's constant reminder, anything less powerful than a Nuclear bomb isn't going to cut it.

You can't fight it head-on, unless you're Touma, but you can bypass it.
I'm aware of that but that was suppose to happen as they are weaker than him by default. I guess it is something we not going to know since there is no other esper actually stronger or stand equal with Accelerator.

Touma don't count.
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Old 2010-05-15, 10:14   Link #202
Chaos2Frozen
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Quote:
Originally Posted by noobita View Post
I'm aware of that but that was suppose to happen as they are weaker than him by default. I guess it is something we not going to know since there is no other esper actually stronger or stand equal with Accelerator.

Touma don't count.
The only thing more powerful than him in terms of AIM, is probably an Artifical Angel.

Then again, I won't be surprise if Accelerator can somehow delete her data through physical contact...
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Old 2010-05-15, 11:04   Link #203
Minagi Mikoto
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Do you think Kanzaki Kaori would be able to beat Accelerator? She was the only one in the series who potentially defeated Touma.
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Old 2010-05-15, 11:19   Link #204
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Originally Posted by Minagi Mikoto View Post
Do you think Kanzaki Kaori would be able to beat Accelerator? She was the only one in the series who potentially defeated Touma.
Shrugged.

On principle, Kaori is a melee fighter, the moment she tries to take a swing at him...
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Old 2010-05-15, 11:25   Link #205
Minagi Mikoto
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Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen View Post
Shrugged.

On principle, Kaori is a melee fighter, the moment she tries to take a swing at him...
Really?! Tsuchimikado said somthings about her being a saint or what once. What about that?
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Old 2010-05-15, 11:31   Link #206
noobita
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Originally Posted by Minagi Mikoto View Post
Do you think Kanzaki Kaori would be able to beat Accelerator? She was the only one in the series who potentially defeated Touma.
Actually, everyone can beat Touma easily if they are not under the PIS. Touma is just your regular brawler that don't have decent martial art skill. Even if you can't beat him at hand to hand combat...get a freaking gun or bow & arrow to kill him.
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Old 2010-05-15, 11:38   Link #207
Chaos2Frozen
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Originally Posted by Minagi Mikoto View Post
Really?! Tsuchimikado said somthings about her being a saint or what once. What about that?
It still doesn't change her style of fighting, it just makes her stronger, better, faster.

To be honest, because of the nerfing of vol 4 in the anime, I don't know what she can do when she activates her Saint powers. But like I've said, on principle, if Accelerator can touch it...
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Old 2010-05-15, 11:45   Link #208
Miraluka
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As a saint she is, she can beat Accelerator by using high class magic.
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Old 2010-05-15, 11:47   Link #209
Minagi Mikoto
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Originally Posted by noobita View Post
Actually, everyone can beat Touma easily if they are not under the PIS. Touma is just your regular brawler that don't have decent martial art skill. Even if you can't beat him at hand to hand combat...get a freaking gun or bow & arrow to kill him.
Yes, I know; that's the strange part about his power. A bunch of villains can easily kill him but Level 5s that each of them can fight an army, are no match to him!
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Old 2010-05-15, 11:49   Link #210
Minagi Mikoto
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Originally Posted by Wilfriback View Post
As a saint she is, she can beat Accelerator by using high class magic.
I think so as well; though I don't know what is "high class magic" (I don't read the light novels or manga)
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Old 2010-05-15, 11:53   Link #211
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Originally Posted by Minagi Mikoto View Post
Yes, I know; that's the strange part about his power. A bunch of villains can easily kill him but Level 5s that each of them can fight an army, are no match to him!
That because most of them under the plot influence.

Logically, even Misaka can destroy Touma easily. She just use her magnet power to lift few of huge iron bars and throw/impale at him.

Touma : I going to use my right hand to block your att- DONG ! *hit by Iron bars from every direction*
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Old 2010-05-15, 12:04   Link #212
Miraluka
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Originally Posted by Minagi Mikoto View Post
I think so as well; though I don't know what is "high class magic" (I don't read the light novels or manga)
Usually magic above the human real and uses divine power based on energy like the telesma.

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Originally Posted by noobita View Post
That because most of them under the plot influence.

Logically, even Misaka can destroy Touma easily. She just use her magnet power to lift few of huge iron bars and throw/impale at him.

Touma : I going to use my right hand to block your att- DONG ! *hit by Iron bars from every direction*
Mundane logic is something which is totally out the way of thinking of powerful espers, they usually think "I'll blast my enemy with my awesome powaa!!", this causing an overconfidence which is blown away when I.B. ends surpassing them, even worse for then because they are relying a lot on their powers, they're physically weak.
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Old 2010-05-15, 12:10   Link #213
noobita
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wilfriback View Post
Usually magic above the human real and uses divine power based on energy like the telesma.



Mundane logic is something which is totally out the way of thinking of powerful espers, they usually think "I'll blast my enemy with my awesome powaa!!", this causing an overconfidence which is blown away when I.B. ends surpassing them, even worse for then because they are relying a lot on their powers, they're physically weak.
The problem is, Misaka actually displayed this kind of mundane logic when she was against Accelerator and Mugino in her own spin-off manga.

I guess that I.B didn't only negate the special attack..it also make his opponent dumber than usual..not....a lot of dumber. And not to mention that the cast of ToAru have the tendecy to grab Touma's right hand.

On second note...why is that Touma never grab his opponent with his right and and punch them with his left repeatedly? It is definitely would make a lot of work short instead of negate their ability first, then clench his right hand and punch again with it.

P/S: Am I wrong if I seriously believe that Kuroko can beat Touma easily...?
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Old 2010-05-15, 12:30   Link #214
Minagi Mikoto
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Wilfriback View Post
Usually magic above the human real and uses divine power based on energy like the telesma.



Mundane logic is something which is totally out the way of thinking of powerful espers, they usually think "I'll blast my enemy with my awesome powaa!!", this causing an overconfidence which is blown away when I.B. ends surpassing them, even worse for then because they are relying a lot on their powers, they're physically weak.
Telesma?

Quote:
Originally Posted by noobita View Post
The problem is, Misaka actually displayed this kind of mundane logic when she was against Accelerator and Mugino in her own spin-off manga.

I guess that I.B didn't only negate the special attack..it also make his opponent dumber than usual..not....a lot of dumber. And not to mention that the cast of ToAru have the tendecy to grab Touma's right hand.

On second note...why is that Touma never grab his opponent with his right and and punch them with his left repeatedly? It is definitely would make a lot of work short instead of negate their ability first, then clench his right hand and punch again with it.

P/S: Am I wrong if I seriously believe that Kuroko can beat Touma easily...?
Touma showed in fighting with Accelerator that he can dodge falling iron bars! And he can stop iron bars moving by a magnetic field using his right hand as he stops Railgun (its actually an ordinary piece of iron moving with high velocity) and iron sand.

p.s. This is going to be off-topic so please continue here if you want to.
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Old 2010-05-15, 13:49   Link #215
tsunade666
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Telesma... divine origin or divine energy. The only thing you should know about it is it packs a lot of punch. Imagine Naruto in sage mode when one invokes telesma to power up one self. though that's the only comparison I could make because everyone knows narutard.

Touma did win with the help of his immortal body and plot story but his big plot device is I.B. And people grabing his right hand isn't just plot device. It's most basic rule to grab or stop or even block your opponent's dominating hand because it's HIS DOMINATING HAND. Not minding the thing that will hit you is bad.

As for kuroko beating touma........... kuroko can't teleport touma and everyone see that in the anime and he can't teleport directly into touma. I think it's been explained something on vol 08 though not sure. Better ask Soul chaoz for this. And kuroko can't teleport something thats too heavier or bigger than her own size that's her limit.

As for Accel comparing against touma and people saying that everyone facing touma is getting dumb. ... ...... they are just shock. Who wouldn't be if your strongest attack doesn't even scratch your opponent. They would panic, shock and be confused and all and all. It's just that you just lost your trump card.

And beating touma is easy. Look at the hound dogs. Touma is afraid of the hound dogs submachineguns and pistols.

While giving accelerator shotgun is bad idea. His just getting more psycho and freaky while playing with it.
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Old 2010-05-15, 13:56   Link #216
Miraluka
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Minagi Mikoto View Post
Telesma?
Telesma = angelic energy

Quote:
Originally Posted by noobita View Post
The problem is, Misaka actually displayed this kind of mundane logic when she was against Accelerator and Mugino in her own spin-off manga.
Misaka never noticed that Touma's power only works on his right hand and that time against Mugino she used her powers, Frenda's bombs were her last backup in case of she couldn't handle the situation.
With Accelerator, when he noticed Touma's power only works on his right hand, he already was freaked out...
Accelerator: What the hell is wrong with your right hand??!!!
.... that someone who is supposed to be a level 0 can beat him(Accelerator's power only works by contact).


Quote:
I guess that I.B didn't only negate the special attack..it also make his opponent dumber than usual..not....a lot of dumber. And not to mention that the cast of ToAru have the tendecy to grab Touma's right hand.
Not really. Some examples: Kanzaki, Tsuchimikado, Acqua of the Back, Fiamma of the Right.

Quote:
P/S: Am I wrong if I seriously believe that Kuroko can beat Touma easily...?
Yes, you are. If she wants to teleport Touma away, she needs to to touch him but her AIM can't work on him because her power will be disipated and if she tries to teleport something against him, first she needs Touma to stay quite. And actually Touma dispelled Awaki's power, who is more powerful teleporter than Kuroko.
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Old 2010-05-15, 19:30   Link #217
Chaos2Frozen
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Actually, I kinda agree to a certain extend that some of Touma's fights were ridiculous coincidences, that if things would have happen in any other way he definitely wouldn't have survived. Though I'm not going to chalk Mikoto's fights as anything serious cause well... My biggest beef are the fights with Accelerator, if I were to assume that Touma some how has developed super, SUPER human reflexes (Anybody watched Seto no Hanayome?), I might just let it slide.

Anyway, that's why I'm crossing my fingers for some grand awakening in Vol 21...
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Old 2010-05-15, 19:50   Link #218
Miraluka
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Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen View Post
Actually, I kinda agree to a certain extend that some of Touma's fights were ridiculous coincidences, that if things would have happen in any other way he definitely wouldn't have survived. Though I'm not going to chalk Mikoto's fights as anything serious cause well... My biggest beef are the fights with Accelerator, if I were to assume that Touma some how has developed super, SUPER human reflexes (Anybody watched Seto no Hanayome?), I might just let it slide.

Anyway, that's why I'm crossing my fingers for some grand awakening in Vol 21...
Maybe just a very very little awakining at the end of the vol.21.
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Old 2010-05-15, 20:07   Link #219
Eliminator
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen View Post
Actually, I kinda agree to a certain extend that some of Touma's fights were ridiculous coincidences, that if things would have happen in any other way he definitely wouldn't have survived. Though I'm not going to chalk Mikoto's fights as anything serious cause well... My biggest beef are the fights with Accelerator, if I were to assume that Touma some how has developed super, SUPER human reflexes (Anybody watched Seto no Hanayome?), I might just let it slide.
I don't think the To Aru series even has logic to begin with anyway, they've got to keep Touma alive somehow, right, since he's the main character.

Quote:
Anyway, that's why I'm crossing my fingers for some grand awakening in Vol 21...
Maybe. But I'd probably expect some bullshit twist, like Mikoto dying in her attempt to save Touma or something.
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Old 2010-05-15, 20:27   Link #220
Miraluka
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Maybe. But I'd probably expect some bullshit twist, like Mikoto dying in her attempt to save Touma or something.
Bullshit twist?? .... Jiraiya and Ace are crying mmmm... its you babohtea??
Well, only the author knows who is going to die, but even if Mikoto dies(something that I doubt so much, at max. she'll badly injured like Touma/Accelerator/Index ended lately) thats not going to be enough to awake Touma's powers.
Why??
Because in order to control an overwhelming power an overwhelming knowledge is required(by Fiamma), and actually Touma lacks of it.
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