AnimeSuki Forums

Register Forum Rules FAQ Members List Social Groups Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read

Go Back   AnimeSuki Forum > Anime Related Topics > Manga & Light Novels > To Aru... Index [LN/M]

Notices

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 2013-04-21, 16:41   Link #1461
tsunade666
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: In my room
Well Kamachi sets lot of rule but at the same time he doesn't break it which makes it awesome. Kamachi sets rules but to overrule it you need to find the loophole on what he sets.

For an example is Touma, Fiamma and Othinus.

Fiamma can overwhelm and instant win anybody

Touma returns distortion or changes in real world into the original form

Othinus bends reality and turn impossible to possible.

Fiamma fighting anyone will result into instant win. Touma can only manage to survive in their fight because imagine breaker despite that it can't match holy right can at least deflect it or shield it. With the setting that perfect fiamma or holy right can only be used to "save the world"

when people who Fiamma brought into despair by his plan are united against him. The despair turn into hope and will to overcome the enemies tyranny thus Fiamma isn't saving the world but being the enemy of the world. The power of the holy right is being sucked away from it.

With diminishing power imagine breaker who is set to correct error can evenly match it.

see the ingenuity? he didn't break his rules but find loopholes on it.

Then there is Fiamma, Orrelus vs Othinus. Fiamma has power to win and Orrelus is someone who almost become a majin but Othinus has the power to bend reality.

Even if the chances are 0.00000000000000000000000000000000000000001% of winning. Othinus will over rule it and turn it into 50/50 chances of winning. So even if you line up all the enemy against her. the chances of her winning is 50/50 while you has the same probably of 0.00000000000000000000000000000000000000001% to even beat her.

Another example is Accelerator's absolute control on vectors. Kihara use the loophole when his trying to attack him by pulling the punch back and since he is the one who created the ability. He knew it like the back of his hands. The same can be said for Kakine with an unknown matter. Which isn't registered on Accelerator's defense but after its been registered then he curb stomp the guy.

For all the volumes that's been released on Index's story. I still find it fascinating when he is playing with the rules of the game. he set rules. different rules but he doesn't bend it like other authors who are absolute horror when writing. I find it entertaining when they are using power levels to beat others.

Here in tamni power levels aren't necessary needed to win. There are lots of factors to think of when a fight occurs.
__________________

tsunade666 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-04-21, 16:50   Link #1462
Dyingbreath
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Can Othinus do things that have a 0% chance of happening? THat is to say, can he do impossible things?
Dyingbreath is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-04-21, 17:06   Link #1463
Chaos2Frozen
:)
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: The Moon that Wizard came from
Age: 25
You mean like turning the world's ocean into orange juice?
Chaos2Frozen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-04-21, 18:00   Link #1464
Dyingbreath
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen View Post
You mean like turning the world's ocean into orange juice?
No because that is logically possible.
What I meant was can she make an object both completely red and completely green at the same time? Can she do things that are logically impossible?
Then again even if she can't she still runs into the other God paradox: An omnipotent being can grant themselves omniscience but doing so means they lose their omnipotence since they can no longer take any course of action other than what their omniscience says will happen thus depriving them of the possibility free will, their supposed omnipotence, and chance, none of which can exist in a world where omnipotence, omniscience, or destiny exist.
Simply said there are some things which the failure rate must be 100% or the whole 50/50 concept cannot exist.
Dyingbreath is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-04-21, 18:03   Link #1465
Haigon
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Recife
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dyingbreath View Post
No because that is logically possible.
What I meant was can she make an object both completely red and completely green at the same time? Can she do things that are logically impossible?
Then again even if she can't she still runs into the other God paradox: An omnipotent being can grant themselves omniscience but doing so means they lose their omnipotence since they can no longer take any course of action other than what their omniscience says will happen thus depriving them of the possibility free will, their supposed omnipotence, and chance, none of which can exist in a world where omnipotence, omniscience, or destiny exist.
Simply said there are some things which the failure rate must be 100% or the whole 50/50 concept cannot exist.
The 50/50 dilemma is Kamachi's response to the divine paradox.
Haigon is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-04-21, 18:05   Link #1466
Chaos2Frozen
:)
 
 
Join Date: Nov 2006
Location: The Moon that Wizard came from
Age: 25
....She's clearly not true omnipotence to begin with.

Otherwise she wouldn't need Gremlin.
Chaos2Frozen is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-04-21, 18:05   Link #1467
Okashira
Honos628
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Chile
Quote:
Originally Posted by Dyingbreath View Post
No because that is logically possible.
What I meant was can she make an object both completely red and completely green at the same time? Can she do things that are logically impossible?

Simply said there are some things which the failure rate must be 100% or the whole 50/50 concept cannot exist.
It has been stated over and over that one shouldn't fit a Majin into the realm of common sense, the first definition that we got of Majin was someone who can bend the rules of reality just like a true God would.
__________________
Now sponsoring : video game analogies (ES)
Last update : Chapter 25 as of 31/08/12
Okashira is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-04-21, 18:06   Link #1468
Flere821
Lurker
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by tsunade666 View Post
Not necessarily. If the connection is severed then his doomed.

The sisters are spread worldwide so Accelerator's connection is worldwide but there are places where one can interfere connections.

The key on winning is

"Low Bat and no signal"

Those who use gadgets can probably understand what this means.
Even then, this is assuming Accel walks right into this situation. Vol19 had a base filled with Capacity Down decked out ready to do this to Accel, and Accel just wrecked the place by bombardment from afar
Flere821 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-04-21, 18:22   Link #1469
Okashira
Honos628
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: Chile
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flere821 View Post
Even then, this is assuming Accel walks right into this situation. Vol19 had a base filled with Capacity Down decked out ready to do this to Accel, and Accel just wrecked the place by bombardment from afar
Didn't he mention that he would go vegetable if he had to enter and underground tunnel with strong interference? (in NT1?)

There are other theories on how to stop his chocker, but he has pretty much out smarted all of them (like that signal method that Worst & Mizutani used, or using excess of magnetism like Shiage tried to do). In theory he can't fight of Last Order level of authority from within the network (shown in volume 8, I think), I'm expecting that something like that would eventually be used against him in battle at some point.
__________________
Now sponsoring : video game analogies (ES)
Last update : Chapter 25 as of 31/08/12
Okashira is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-04-21, 18:34   Link #1470
leukrota
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2011
Quote:
Originally Posted by Chaos2Frozen View Post
....She's clearly not true omnipotence to begin with.

Otherwise she wouldn't need Gremlin.
Yeah... You really can't call that omnipotent... it's more like halfpotent.
leukrota is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-04-21, 19:08   Link #1471
tsunade666
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: In my room
Quote:
Originally Posted by Flere821 View Post
Even then, this is assuming Accel walks right into this situation. Vol19 had a base filled with Capacity Down decked out ready to do this to Accel, and Accel just wrecked the place by bombardment from afar
Quote:
Originally Posted by Okashira View Post
Didn't he mention that he would go vegetable if he had to enter and underground tunnel with strong interference? (in NT1?)

There are other theories on how to stop his chocker, but he has pretty much out smarted all of them (like that signal method that Worst & Mizutani used, or using excess of magnetism like Shiage tried to do). In theory he can't fight of Last Order level of authority from within the network (shown in volume 8, I think), I'm expecting that something like that would eventually be used against him in battle at some point.
True Accelerator is too smart to fall for petty schemes or plans but I'm just stating one of the possibilities.

In NT 6 the battle for battery life is mentioned but Accelerator used his weakness as an advantage. he knew his weakness and he knew what to do exploit it. his weakness with time limit for battery is charging it in between battles. In battle where he might lost signal then he won't charge in it its stupid to enter a battle where your disadvantage

a fool will only charge head first without thinking of a battle plan though it fits Kamijou Touma but Touma uses the battle field into his advantage so it doesn't count.
__________________

tsunade666 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-04-21, 19:13   Link #1472
Dyingbreath
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by Okashira View Post
It has been stated over and over that one shouldn't fit a Majin into the realm of common sense, the first definition that we got of Majin was someone who can bend the rules of reality just like a true God would.
Not even God can create a stone so heavy He can't lift it. Omnipotence only allows things that are logically possible.

Quote:
Originally Posted by leukrota View Post
Yeah... You really can't call that omnipotent... it's more like halfpotent.
That's because that element of probability exists, but if she can do things which are impossible, like giving herself omniscience, then she still falls into the paradox.
Dyingbreath is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-04-21, 21:51   Link #1473
Phibrizzo
Honos628
 
 
Join Date: Aug 2010
Location: Mexico
I honestly don't place kakine to high vs magic. While physical dealing with his body can be hard, how about dealing with him mind and soul, the spell pope use on Fiamma seems a good counter to Kakine for example
Phibrizzo is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-04-21, 22:35   Link #1474
FiveOVER
Daydreamer
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: in the windowless building
Age: 21
Not very effective when he can create multiple brains......
__________________
FiveOVER is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-04-21, 22:48   Link #1475
Dyingbreath
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by FiveOVER View Post
Not very effective when he can create multiple brains......
Scientifically he can't or at least he shouldn't be able to. The cells in the brain need to be composed of numerous elements to function and could not be made of one material.
Dyingbreath is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-04-21, 22:49   Link #1476
FiveOVER
Daydreamer
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: in the windowless building
Age: 21
Dark matter is hardly a normal material.
__________________
FiveOVER is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-04-21, 22:56   Link #1477
Dyingbreath
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by FiveOVER View Post
Dark matter is hardly a normal material.
note the "a" in that sentence. Even taking into account its fantastic properties doesn't change the fact that it's still one single material, and multiple materials are necessary for brain function.
Dyingbreath is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-04-21, 23:05   Link #1478
tsunade666
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Mar 2009
Location: In my room
brain damage isn't really much of a problem for Kakine. He is just a system. He is the whole dark matter and every cell of dark matter is he.
__________________

tsunade666 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-04-21, 23:16   Link #1479
FiveOVER
Daydreamer
 
 
Join Date: Jan 2013
Location: in the windowless building
Age: 21
But the novels did mention dark matter creating brains.
__________________
FiveOVER is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 2013-04-21, 23:18   Link #1480
Haigon
Senior Member
 
 
Join Date: Feb 2013
Location: Recife
Quote:
Originally Posted by FiveOVER View Post
But the novels did mention dark matter creating brains.
In NT6 Kakine say if they destroyed his brain he would just create a new one.
Haigon is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply

Tags
hard science, magic

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 07:36.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2014, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.
We use Silk.