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View Poll Results: The Disappearance of Haruhi Suzumiya - Rating
Perfect 10 231 64.35%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 92 25.63%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 25 6.96%
7 out of 10 : Good 7 1.95%
6 out of 10 : Average 3 0.84%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 1 0.28%
4 out of 10 : Poor 0 0%
3 out of 10 : Bad 0 0%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 0 0%
1 out of 10 : Painful 0 0%
Voters: 359. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2011-01-06, 14:42   Link #581
Gamer_2k4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant View Post
If Kyon died then no one would have saved him. But he didn't, so he was saved. The only problem was that Kyon did not immediately perform the rescue mission after the fact, but instead delayed it until later. This causes problems, because if he end up dying for ANY other reason before he could perform his own rescue mission, then he wouldn't just die; he would rip a hole in space-time by creating a paradox.
So this in itself is yet ANOTHER example of that freaking bootstrap paradox that keeps coming up. Kyon receives the healing from his time-divergent variant that allows him to go back in time to provide that healing in the first place. It's absolutely no different from a guy building a time machine because his future self comes back to deliver the instructions to him, or a guy digging up an object, then, ten years later, travelling back in time to bury it in that spot. In other words, predetermined or not, what happened in the movie was very definitely still a paradox.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Vallen Chaos Valiant View Post
What happened was that Kyon was saved by himself in a pre-determined event. It's like borrowing money to pay a debt; you didn't "make" money, you just borrowed it, and you have to pay it back later. Kyon was never meant to die at any stage of the film, because Adult Mikuru knew the rescue was going to happen.
So Kyon COULDN'T have died for any other reason (despite what you say in your first paragraph), because he was observed saving himself. Therefore, he must have stayed alive. Unless observation doesn't matter as much as you seem to think it does...
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Old 2011-01-06, 15:40   Link #582
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I don't want to be spoiled about details, but a yes/no question: Are the details of the "Kyon getting pushed down the stairs by a disappearing girl"-thing explained in a later novel, or was that just some kind of vague "hiccup" in the timeline when the world got restored?
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Old 2011-01-06, 18:30   Link #583
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sparvid View Post
I don't want to be spoiled about details, but a yes/no question: Are the details of the "Kyon getting pushed down the stairs by a disappearing girl"-thing explained in a later novel, or was that just some kind of vague "hiccup" in the timeline when the world got restored?
I think is explained in vol7 prologue, but it's really so important? I don't see why it should be different from Nagato's "I specialize in data manipulation" from Melancholy.
Spoiler for size:
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Old 2011-01-06, 18:52   Link #584
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This movie was by far the best anime movie I have seen all year!
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Old 2011-01-07, 03:45   Link #585
larethian
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I think people are over-stepping into spoiler territory beyond speculative discussion. The only thing confirmed thing is that Kyon will go back and save himself, and he mentioned it himself at the end that he needed to do that. There's no need to add on who knows what or who doesn't know what, and how which event will tie up with which. And if there are some seemingly plot holes in the time travel, can't people just accept the possibility that things might be cleared up at a later date since the story is still ongoing? *Twiddling for volume 10*
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Old 2011-01-07, 07:34   Link #586
Sparvid
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Originally Posted by Rungelunge View Post
I think is explained in vol7 prologue, but it's really so important? I don't see why it should be different from Nagato's "I specialize in data manipulation" from Melancholy.
Nope, not important, just curious if it's some kind of ongoing plot point or just some random occurance.
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Old 2011-01-07, 11:11   Link #587
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Spoiler:

Last edited by KeroKai; 2011-01-07 at 16:06.
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Old 2011-01-07, 13:34   Link #588
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So much for "Impressions and Reviews"...
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Old 2011-01-07, 17:19   Link #589
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Quote:
Originally Posted by s07195 View Post
So much for "Impressions and Reviews"...
Basically what I was thinking its all about discussion now.
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Old 2011-01-07, 18:16   Link #590
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The paradox thing can be solved in two words! Who cares!...........in the end he just speculates that he has to go back and save himself......what if the past version of him was the one that saved himself and Nagato erased his memory of that or something to that effect. Either way it can be an issue that is resolved at a latter date because there are solutions to the situation that might not be apparent yet.
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Old 2011-01-07, 19:44   Link #591
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its all about discussion now.
Well that's what should be expected, seeing as though this is a discussion thread, and there is a lot to discuss about the film and it's content.
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Old 2011-01-08, 11:09   Link #592
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hands down, best movie ever.
Spoiler for movie:
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Old 2011-01-08, 12:19   Link #593
Haak
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I finally saw this film a few days ago, and I must say that it's certainly great. This is coming from someone that isn't even a fan of the series. In fact I don't particularly like Haruhi all that much but I decided to give this film a try since it was getting so many positive reviews.

Spoiler for my review:


Overall Score 8/10.
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Old 2011-01-09, 02:19   Link #594
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Originally Posted by Haak View Post
Spoiler:
The reason for that, as well as most of the other background for the time-travel-related events in Disappearance, come from "Bamboo Leaf Rhapsody", if you care to check it out.

Spoiler:
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Old 2011-01-09, 10:46   Link #595
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Now I'm confused with event that happen at 18th December, midnight . That mean there is three Kyon at the same world, but with time variant.
1. Kyon that sleeping in his house and had no idea that he will going through Shoushitsu event.
2. Kyon who prepared to cancel Nagato action, but got stabbed by Asakura.
3. "Future" Kyon who do the rest of the job.

Assuming the world is fixed to its original state and time is linear, what happened to Kyon who is still sleeping?
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Old 2011-01-09, 13:18   Link #596
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Originally Posted by kimpleng View Post
Now I'm confused with event that happen at 18th December, midnight . That mean there is three Kyon at the same world, but with time variant.
No. You should watch BLR again and you will see Kyon is already unfrozen from Nagato's room in December 18th .
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Old 2011-01-09, 15:49   Link #597
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rungelunge View Post
No. You should watch BLR again and you will see Kyon is already unfrozen from Nagato's room in December 18th .
So there should only be 2 Kyons then right? When he got unfrozen, and the future Kyon?
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Old 2011-01-09, 16:38   Link #598
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kimpleng View Post
Now I'm confused with event that happen at 18th December, midnight . That mean there is three Kyon at the same world, but with time variant.
1. Kyon that sleeping in his house and had no idea that he will going through Shoushitsu event.
2. Kyon who prepared to cancel Nagato action, but got stabbed by Asakura.
3. "Future" Kyon who do the rest of the job.

Assuming the world is fixed to its original state and time is linear, what happened to Kyon who is still sleeping?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rungelunge View Post
No. You should watch BLR again and you will see Kyon is already unfrozen from Nagato's room in December 18th .
I believe what kimpleng is referring to is the Kyon that we see around 18-20 minutes into the movie where he is sleeping in his own room who is unchanged by the changes of the world. Barring any off-scene events, there is indeed three versions of Kyon in the world at around 04:25 AM (JST) December 18th in precisely the exact roles mentioned, but a little later than the time given.

As for kimpleng's question, there is not enough evidence in the movie as well as the time frame your third Kyon comes from to give a satisfactory answer. I have my theory that require spoilers to discuss, so I cannot say them here.
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Old 2011-01-09, 16:45   Link #599
Rungelunge
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Yes, sorry. I thought he meant Kyon sleeping in Nagato's room.
Indeed at the end of the movie there are 3 Kyon as one of them is sleeping in his room.

Quote:
Assuming the world is fixed to its original state and time is linear, what happened to Kyon who is still sleeping?
Exactly. time is linear, so if you want to know what happened with sleeping Kyon you only have to see the beginning of the movie. I think from December 18th to 21st the world is changed always. And they always return to 21th with their heads full of new memories about those days inculcated by Nagato.

Also if you think this has no logic, remember Nagato bites Kyon and Mikuru so everything is possible after that.
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Old 2011-01-12, 12:12   Link #600
ninryu
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Rungelunge View Post
Yes, sorry. I thought he meant Kyon sleeping in Nagato's room.
Indeed at the end of the movie there are 3 Kyon as one of them is sleeping in his room.


Exactly. time is linear, so if you want to know what happened with sleeping Kyon you only have to see the beginning of the movie. I think from December 18th to 21st the world is changed always. And they always return to 21th with their heads full of new memories about those days inculcated by Nagato.

Also if you think this has no logic, remember Nagato bites Kyon and Mikuru so everything is possible after that.
I think it's makes sense. If the time is cyclic then in every timeline Kyon wakes up to the alternated world, gets the world back to how it was, getting stabbed by Asakura and wakes up after "falling the stairs", only to get back in time to see himself stabbed.
Then another Kyon in another timeline wakes up to alternated world and it goes over and over again. It means no matter what he'll do it will have the same conclusion because it's already been made. Quit depressing.

Kyon is destined to wake to an alternate world and Yuki is destined to change the world. I guess the only one who can escape this cycle and change both past and present is Haruhi.

Lol, your last line. Vampire!Yuki is much sexier than Edward Cullen. And it's a girl saying that.
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