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Old 2011-04-08, 15:48   Link #3001
roriconfan
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What's with these vague claims if the charactes are good or not? For me, characters are defined by five simple elements.

1 Presence (how interesting they look)
2 Personality (how interesting they behave)
3 Backdrop (their past story)
4 Development (how they change)
5 Catharsis (how they find a solution to their issues)

I say in SD the cast wins in 1 and 2 but messes up in the rest.
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Old 2011-04-08, 15:51   Link #3002
Haak
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That's an interesting idea but I'd still say it's pretty subjective considering there's no criteria for how to satisfy each one. For example I'd say Sugata satisfies all of them.
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Old 2011-04-08, 16:27   Link #3003
Kanon
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cyoti View Post
I'd recommend watching the show with the sound and the subs instead of just watching the pretty pictures moving and trying to lipread the characters.
Clearly, you've never read any of my previous posts in this thread. I shouldn't bother with such an obvious troll, but entertain me. Please remind me when:
  • It was revealed the Star swords were Samekh's wings
  • It was mentioned the aliens are divided in several factons, one of which wished to use Samekh's time manipulating powers. It was never even hinted at.
  • That the purpose of all cyobies, not just the maidens, was to seal up Samekh.
  • It was said that the only true Galactic pretty boy is Takuto. The other people with marks are "fake" GPB and can not sleep (yes, it's not just Head), for some unknown reason. Sugata and the maidens can sleep just fine though.
  • It was revealed Samekh is not the only King-type cybody. Ayingott, Betraida and another one were Kings as well.

And tons of other stuff I forgot.

Enokido said it himself: "There’s a whole lot of information in Star Driver’s background materials, but, the narrative itself only touched the surface of it."

Personally, I think it's a damn shame to create such a fascinating universe and neglect it. That's the reason I'm disappointed in Star Driver. It had an incredible potential and failed to realize it. This is such a waste...

Nevertheless, I still enjoyed the show for what it was. It's just that I'm sure it could have been a lot better if they had focused more on the plot/character development rather than the silly stuff and the repetitive, as well as utterly boring, fight scenes. The best arc for me remains Mizuno's. It was a lot more balanced than the other arcs, and Mizuno and Marino were more interesting than the rest of the cast combined (with a few exceptions).
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Old 2011-04-08, 18:56   Link #3004
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kanon View Post
Personally, I think it's a damn shame to create such a fascinating universe and neglect it. That's the reason I'm disappointed in Star Driver. It had an incredible potential and failed to realize it. This is such a waste...

Nevertheless, I still enjoyed the show for what it was. It's just that I'm sure it could have been a lot better if they had focused more on the plot/character development rather than the silly stuff and the repetitive, as well as utterly boring, fight scenes.
I said it before in a different way but oh well...
Utena is memorable for its aria towards sexual liberation. Even if you disliked the (also) episodic nature and boring battles, you would still love its symbolisms. It left something behind for you to think and care about.

The only thing SD left behind is confusion over: what who where and if and maybe it could have or has or maybe will do in a movie or this meant or not that and perhaps it could but didn't Gundam ending has been done bebore but show something if and where Tengen Toppa FABULOUS.
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Old 2011-04-08, 19:23   Link #3005
Funkatron
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kanon View Post
Clearly, you've never read any of my previous posts in this thread. I shouldn't bother with such an obvious troll, but entertain me. Please remind me when:
  • It was revealed the Star swords were Samekh's wings
  • It was mentioned the aliens are divided in several factons, one of which wished to use Samekh's time manipulating powers. It was never even hinted at.
  • That the purpose of all cyobies, not just the maidens, was to seal up Samekh.
  • It was said that the only true Galactic pretty boy is Takuto. The other people with marks are "fake" GPB and can not sleep (yes, it's not just Head), for some unknown reason. Sugata and the maidens can sleep just fine though.
  • It was revealed Samekh is not the only King-type cybody. Ayingott, Betraida and another one were Kings as well.

And tons of other stuff I forgot.

Enokido said it himself: "There’s a whole lot of information in Star Driver’s background materials, but, the narrative itself only touched the surface of it."

Personally, I think it's a damn shame to create such a fascinating universe and neglect it. That's the reason I'm disappointed in Star Driver. It had an incredible potential and failed to realize it. This is such a waste...

Nevertheless, I still enjoyed the show for what it was. It's just that I'm sure it could have been a lot better if they had focused more on the plot/character development rather than the silly stuff and the repetitive, as well as utterly boring, fight scenes. The best arc for me remains Mizuno's. It was a lot more balanced than the other arcs, and Mizuno and Marino were more interesting than the rest of the cast combined (with a few exceptions).
If they had revealed all those elements, the ending wouldn't have been such an asspull.

We never got hinted to the danger Samahk presented to the world. We never got any indication that Head had another motive other than the motives of the Crux ie world domination via Drivers in the real world. We never even had an inkling of thought as to the origins of the Driver system other than the explanation from the play ie aliens. If they properly hinted at any of the stuff left out, I would have enjoyed the ending a heck of a lot more and the plots points wouldn't have felt like copouts. Heck, Sugata's reasoning for putting Samehk to bed would have felt more believable to me.
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Old 2011-04-08, 21:56   Link #3006
Nobodyman9
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Originally Posted by Haak View Post
Nice straw man.

I'll enjoy good character depth, background and development if that's what you mean. I made my point that Sugata is blatantly not emotionally stagnant, gives a damn about a lot of things, and does a some very interesting things. You see? Your way of judging a character completely leads to the wrong conclusions...
I love how you always go back to that "character depth" and "background and development" stuff as if any of that shit matters when Sugata is as interesting as a rice cracker. Emotionally reserved and stoic. Yeah, real life of the party that guy.

You know, you can't just state that a character does these things and feels this way about things. You do have to show some kind of reaction and some kind of emotion.

BTW, correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't it you who said you gave up on One Piece after 200 chapters? And yet you still continue to read Naruto?
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Old 2011-04-08, 22:29   Link #3007
cyoti
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Originally Posted by Funkatron View Post
We never got hinted to the danger Samahk presented to the world.
That it was sealed away in the first place? That it was a giant cybody? That it put Sugata and almost anyone that apprivoised with it in a coma? That Head wanted it? Plenty of signs were there pointing to its danger.

Quote:
We never got any indication that Head had another motive other than the motives of the Crux ie world domination via Drivers in the real world.
Head:But if I become truly powerful powerful...I could get back everything I lost. No I will get it all back.

That line was in the flashback episode with Ryunosuke and Takuto's mother. So yes there were indications that he had more than world domination in mind.

Quote:
We never even had an inkling of thought as to the origins of the Driver system other than the explanation from the play ie aliens.
The aliens used the system and Samekh in the far off fish world. It ended up on Earth after one of them (the one that was Sam the Squid Piercer) took it here. That was all in the play and the fish girl story.

Quote:
Heck, Sugata's reasoning for putting Samehk to bed would have felt more believable to me.
All of that was established.

Fact:the Samekh driver could become immortal after a longterm apprivoise
Fact:the maidens are born with the Samekh driver and stuck on the island
Fact:Sugata didn't like the system.

Last edited by cyoti; 2011-04-08 at 22:50.
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Old 2011-04-09, 00:07   Link #3008
wandering-dreamer
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To break up all the debating, it looks like SD is going to be licensed in the US by Bandai. They have this teaser image up for a new license to be announced at Sakura Con (in two weeks) and it looks like SD to me!
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Old 2011-04-09, 02:43   Link #3009
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Is this show ever going to be dubbed in English and aired on tv? It's context is somewhat not approved for western mass viewing.
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Old 2011-04-09, 02:58   Link #3010
Nobodyman9
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Originally Posted by roriconfan View Post
Is this show ever going to be dubbed in English and aired on tv? It's context is somewhat not approved for western mass viewing.
Are you talking about Greece, America or somewhere else? Content-wise, I really don't see any reason they wouldn't air it here, state-side.
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Old 2011-04-09, 03:31   Link #3011
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I'm talking in general. I doubt Greece will ever dub anything not aimed at 10yo again. And come on, it has some really sensitive imagery.
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Old 2011-04-09, 04:22   Link #3012
Haak
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Originally Posted by Nobodyman9 View Post
I love how you always go back to that "character depth" and "background and development" stuff as if any of that shit matters when Sugata is as interesting as a rice cracker. Emotionally reserved and stoic. Yeah, real life of the party that guy.
Yeah go ahead and completely ignore everything I just said...

Quote:
You know, you can't just state that a character does these things and feels this way about things. You do have to show some kind of reaction and some kind of emotion.
No shit Sherlock. That's exactly what they did:

Spoiler for space:


No it's not a lot, but then that's the whole point. He's emotionally reserved so that when he does react, you know it's something big. They can only do so much with a character that's supposed to be emotionally reserved, which is why they have to rely on other techniques aswell, such as how his reaction contrasts with other characters. "Just stating that a character does these things and feels this way about things" is only what was done to explain why he's emotionally reserved in the first place. Everything else was done completely differently

Quote:
BTW, correct me if I'm wrong, but wasn't it you who said you gave up on One Piece after 200 chapters? And yet you still continue to read Naruto?
Yes. I find One Piece simply impossible to find interesting. Naruto can be really crap but I'm still slightly interested in seeing what happens. I'm not sure what that has to do with anything though. As you can see I'm not totally disregarding your opinion just because you like One Piece...
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Old 2011-04-09, 05:12   Link #3013
Nobodyman9
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Originally Posted by Haak View Post
Yeah go ahead and completely ignore everything I just said...
Sound advice.

Quote:
No shit Sherlock. That's exactly what they did:

Spoiler for space:


No it's not a lot, but then that's the whole point. He's emotionally reserved so that when he does react, you know it's something big. They can only do so much with a character that's supposed to be emotionally reserved, which is why they have to rely on other techniques aswell, such as how his reaction contrasts with other characters. "Just stating that a character does these things and feels this way about things" is only what was done to explain why he's emotionally reserved in the first place. Everything else was done completely differently
Last thing I'm gonna say on the matter.

Sugata: Dull as shit. Generic bishonen. Cliche'd as hell.

"Hi, I'm Sugata. I'm emotionally reserved and I look like a generic pretty boy, but I swear to god I'm deep. I mean, I'm the heir to the Shindo Clan and I have this huge responsibility to not pilot a giant robot and bring about the end of the world or something, and that's why I'm emotionally reserved because............well, that sucks. Also, I can't leave the island, which is also part of the reason I'm emotionally reserved, even though the Four Maidens are in the same boat as me and it hasn't had the same effect on them. Look at how deep I am. I'm hurtin' inside. And I carry around a knife at all times, even on school grounds, to protect a girl I love for no specific reason, which isn't the least bit creepy. Deeeeeeeeeeeeeep!"

Quote:
Yes. I find One Piece simply impossible to find interesting. Naruto can be really crap but I'm still slightly interested in seeing what happens. I'm not sure what that has to do with anything though. As you can see I'm not totally disregarding your opinion just because you like One Piece...
Just wanted some clarification on the issue before wrapping things up. Also, I checked your MyAnimeList. You have terrible taste. We're done here.

@roricon: Not sure I catch your meaning, but I don't see anything on this show that wouldn't fly on Adult Swim.
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Old 2011-04-09, 08:02   Link #3014
Haak
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Originally Posted by roriconfan View Post
Is this show ever going to be dubbed in English and aired on tv? It's context is somewhat not approved for western mass viewing.
You mean the whole libido stuff and the homoerotic hints between Sugata and Takuto (aswell as Tokio and whatshisface)?

It'll be fine.
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Old 2011-04-09, 09:26   Link #3015
wandering-dreamer
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If the show is released by Bandai it will be dubbed (can't think of any series they've licensed over here that haven't been dubbed) and I don't see anything in SD that would prevent it from being shown on US TV. Will it? Probably not just because we don't have a lot of anime airing on regular cable television these days, but even with all the mentions of libido and such it's more more tame than other late night shows (which is where pretty much all anime that is on tv airs these days).
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Old 2011-04-09, 09:58   Link #3016
Kakkou
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Originally Posted by wandering-dreamer View Post
If the show is released by Bandai it will be dubbed (can't think of any series they've licensed over here that haven't been dubbed)
Off the top of my head: .hack//G.U. Trilogy, Kannagi, Sora wo Kakeru Shoujo, Hayate no Gotoku! and Tales of the Abyss weren't dubbed despite the Bandai license.
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Old 2011-04-09, 10:22   Link #3017
Wakan Tanka
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The female crux members are a bunch of masochists. The cosplay alone tells everything.
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Old 2011-04-09, 18:13   Link #3018
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Originally Posted by Wakan Tanka View Post
@ wandering-dreamer

The female crux members are a bunch of masochists. The cosplay alone tells everything.
Nah, I'd say the Crux girls are more like masochists most of them don't seem like a submissive type grated they're customs are BDMS meets Victorian but that hardly means then are into that sort of thing....
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Old 2011-04-09, 18:13   Link #3019
wandering-dreamer
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@Kakkou: Ah, the only one of those shows I'm familiar with is Kannagi and for some reason I'd thought it had gotten a dub at a later date. Point made, but I still stick by my gut feeling that SD will probably get a dub.

Also, finally got my huge Utena vs SD comparison post, erm, posted, so if anyone is curious about the similarities between the two this should help.
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Old 2011-04-09, 21:15   Link #3020
-KarumA-
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Quote:
Originally Posted by roriconfan View Post
What's with these vague claims if the charactes are good or not? For me, characters are defined by five simple elements.

1 Presence (how interesting they look)
2 Personality (how interesting they behave)
3 Backdrop (their past story)
4 Development (how they change)
5 Catharsis (how they find a solution to their issues)

I say in SD the cast wins in 1 and 2 but messes up in the rest.
I agree, I started watching this show after not watching anime for about a year maybe 2 even.
It was enjoyable but there were so many question marks left at many things.
Takuto is in my eyes a very flat character, the way he is at the start of the series is just about exactly the same as he is when he comes out of the series. He doesn't really have any reason to fight either, the cliché I'll kick my dad's but and mood he took from his old friend hardly count as a reason to throw you inside a battle to protect maidens, you hardly feel like he knows why he is even doing some things int he first place (or at least I did and when I felt like I did it felt very cliché).
This counts for many other characters also.

I watched it mainly for the music, we still have character songs to go right? For the 3 other maidens.

I also felt that it took 0% effort for Takuto to get to the start and to finish. Never any real battle that was on the losing streak, which is a mistake of the writers I'd say because they decided that if int he universe someone loses they lose their ability to fight so if Takuto loses then the story would be done for. No matter what happens, how beat up he gets he always gets up and does the same attack 1-3 to defeat the opponent and when things do get exciting like with Window Star then Sugata or Wako has to ruint he party, which made me very sad >:
And that made it very rehashed and predictable.
I did like the music.
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