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View Poll Results: Macross Frontier: Sayonara no Tsubasa Movie Rating
Perfect 10 40 42.11%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 33 34.74%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 12 12.63%
7 out of 10 : Good 5 5.26%
6 out of 10 : Average 3 3.16%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 2 2.11%
4 out of 10 : Poor 0 0%
3 out of 10 : Bad 0 0%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 0 0%
1 out of 10 : Painful 0 0%
Voters: 95. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2010-12-24, 21:56   Link #441
Yot-chan
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Swampstorm View Post
Presumably that is why people feel that the claim that both characters are "too popular to choose between" is such a cop-out. If someone wants to believe that Alto's decision has the power to make one girl spontaneously become a lot more awesome, and the other a lot less awesome, then that's their prerogative. (The same holds true of their VAs, as well, although I can't for the life of me think of why anyone would think of a VA as being a "winner" or "loser" simply by virtue of the characters they voice.)
Very true, but that's what Yoshino said that Kawamori said.

Really, when you get down to it, ANY ending is going to cause a huge amount of rage, as we saw with the finale of the show. There's no way they can please everybody.

Quote:
Originally Posted by darkplataform View Post
source: unknown
Source: Macross Ace.
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Old 2010-12-24, 22:32   Link #442
raile
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Originally Posted by darkplataform View Post





source: unknown
*Cough Cough* I feel sick Nurse Sheryl... ()

Oh and Merry Christmas to all!
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Old 2010-12-25, 02:36   Link #443
darkplataform
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Uhmm... if its macross ace, then my copy is arriving in 7 days. I cant wait for that lovely sheryl card

And Merry Christmas for 4all of you too!`
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Old 2010-12-25, 03:01   Link #444
moncikoma
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Originally Posted by justavisitor View Post
Can you find it to me? can't find it anywhere
Thanks in advance
http://forums.animesuki.com/showpost...postcount=6597
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Old 2010-12-25, 03:05   Link #445
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my analysis :

Alto got HIT...and almost die...
sheryl transform into an ero nurse...

she inject him with some xxx .... Alto rOCK HARD... back on the field....
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Old 2010-12-25, 07:15   Link #446
John117xCortana
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Originally Posted by darkplataform View Post
Uhmm... if its macross ace, then my copy is arriving in 7 days. I cant wait for that lovely sheryl card

And Merry Christmas for 4all of you too!`
Is that May'n ?
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Old 2010-12-25, 07:35   Link #447
Westlo
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Originally Posted by Yot-chan View Post
Going by fan polls is always a tremendously bad way to tell a story.
Well like Swampy said isn't that what they're effectively doing with the "They're both too popular to choose one" approach? And boy I don't think being the VA/Singer of Minmay hurt Mari Iijima's career...

I don't know what worse, this approach or omnibus, such a pity anime directors are losing their balls, Amagami SS would've been better if it had focused on Tsukasa as the main girl and this is from someone who liked Ai and Risa better but I have to admit that Tsukasa has the better story, not that you would know from the anime.. thanks to the omnibus format we get 4 episode arcs that just weaken the entire thing. Yay for that and yay for harem endings for shows that clearly shouldn't have harem endings period

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Originally Posted by BetoJR View Post
Who are you and what did you do to Westlo?
Hahah what do you mean!

Damn I wish I could find a way to not get spoiled on this and still post on anime forums... hm catch a flight to Tokyo and just watch in in the cinema raw?

Last edited by Westlo; 2010-12-25 at 07:48.
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Old 2010-12-25, 08:43   Link #448
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Well like Swampy said isn't that what they're effectively doing with the "They're both too popular to choose one" approach?
It was my friend Tochiro who said that, not a staff member. I connected it with what Yoshino said in the interview, but he had a different point.

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Originally Posted by Westlo View Post
And boy I don't think being the VA/Singer of Minmay hurt Mari Iijima's career...
Heh. You've never talked to Mari about it, have you?
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Old 2010-12-25, 10:06   Link #449
magnuskn
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Originally Posted by Yot-chan View Post
Very true, but that's what Yoshino said that Kawamori said.

Really, when you get down to it, ANY ending is going to cause a huge amount of rage, as we saw with the finale of the show. There's no way they can please everybody.
Really? Will it cause any more rage than the hugely popular romance animes? What possible argument is there, besides some marketing guys fearing that the studio will lose some $$$ from merchandising? The argument that the character or VA will suffer from the fact that Alto chose the other character is incredibly preposterous and stupid, sorry. I am truly at a loss how anybody can even come up with such terrible reasoning.
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Old 2010-12-25, 10:22   Link #450
Yot-chan
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Really? Will it cause any more rage than the hugely popular romance animes?
I don't follow any of them, so I don't know. But there was a HUGE amount of rage about the ending of Macross F, was there not?

Quote:
Originally Posted by magnuskn View Post
What possible argument is there, besides some marketing guys fearing that the studio will lose some $$$ from merchandising? The argument that the character or VA will suffer from the fact that Alto chose the other character is incredibly preposterous and stupid, sorry. I am truly at a loss how anybody can even come up with such terrible reasoning.
I'm afraid I can't answer you. You'll have to ask Yoshino.
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Old 2010-12-25, 12:06   Link #451
Elazul
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Westlo View Post
Well like Swampy said isn't that what they're effectively doing with the "They're both too popular to choose one" approach? And boy I don't think being the VA/Singer of Minmay hurt Mari Iijima's career...

I don't know what worse, this approach or omnibus, such a pity anime directors are losing their balls, Amagami SS would've been better if it had focused on Tsukasa as the main girl and this is from someone who liked Ai and Risa better but I have to admit that Tsukasa has the better story, not that you would know from the anime.. thanks to the omnibus format we get 4 episode arcs that just weaken the entire thing. Yay for that and yay for harem endings for shows that clearly shouldn't have harem endings period
I’ve been thinking the same thing recently. While the omnibus format may be better for the sales, but for the storytelling, quality-wise, it seems quite the opposite in my humble opinion. I completely agree with you about Amagami SS, it had such a great potential, given the original material, plus the staff was sure skilled. In just four episodes they delivered as least interesting stories. But as you’ve said, Tsukasa clearly had the most interesting storyline and there’s more interesting ideas for character development in her arc.
Yosuga no Sora suffered from the same fate too. Sora was clearly the main girl, and her arc was the only one that ended up really above the average in the whole series. Because it was evident that the staff put much more effort while making her arc, and consequently the anime got a huge increment in quality when her arc came. So, I think if they had more episodes to develop her arc, Yosuga no Sora probably would have become a masterpiece of its genre.
I couldn’t help but remember of KimiKiss. An anime that the director really got the balls to split the main character in two, it was a pretty good move. Talking more about it would be quite spoilerish, but it worked really well in the end, because they are really different and had opposite “approaches” while they’re pursing a relationship, and so on the most interesting girls ended up as winners, it was sure a satisfying ending to me.
But sadly, I heard somewhere that KimiKiss anime ended up as a commercial failure. Is it a sign that the Japanese otaku community are against new ideas in romance anime?


I think in Macross case things are a bit different. I agree 100% with the most counter-arguments presented here. The idea of having a “loser” at the end affecting the sales makes no sense to me, because in Macross there’s always a winner when there’s romance. Actually, it would be more dangerous, from the commercial point of view, to leave an unsolved triangle, coz it’s uncharacteristic of the Macross franchise, then the producers will be assuming new risks. Furthermore, Macross always has a very loyal fanbase supporting it. Maybe only a huge mess in a future series could affect the sales to the point of making it a commercial failure. I think that, in the long run, the successive mistakes in character development and storytelling would create a much more negatively impact to sales, because there’ve got higher chances to displease the fanbase. And probably the companies behind the Macross series are rational enough to minimize the risks and secure the fanbase at the first place. Extending the fanbase is too a very important thing to do, but while doing this they also need to move carefully, always trying to minimize those risks.
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Old 2010-12-25, 12:08   Link #452
magnuskn
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Originally Posted by Yot-chan View Post
I don't follow any of them, so I don't know. But there was a HUGE amount of rage about the ending of Macross F, was there not?
Yeah, because it was a cop-out non-resolution. You'd think they would have learned from that, but it sounds as if they are truly clueless or want epic lulz on cost of their viewers.

In any case, making yet another bullshit non-resolution ending would be a huge mistake.
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Old 2010-12-26, 01:21   Link #453
ippus
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Actually I wouldn't call it a mistake. I might not have LIKED the cop out ending, but the fact remains I'm still rabidly checking forums on the movie simply in hopes of knowing if they'd come to a conclusion in the movie. Macross F is still fun for me because of that cop out :/

That being said I do really want a resolution just because this is suppose to be the end T_T THIS IS SUPPOSE TO BE THE END DAMMIT. I can't take another cop out hit, just can't Q_Q

And no I totally won't go with a Ranka/Alto ending :'D Movie-verse or not, the fact remains that if her side of the argument won, it would be on the basis that the ENTIRE environment and reaction of that one character is completely changed just for the sole purpose of making her look good. That's just too pathetic for me. IT'S PATHETIC.


My ideal ending....is Alto chooses Sheryl, and Ranka re-triangulates by going for Sheryl instead. It's the only polygamy I can support lalelalela~ *SHOT*
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Old 2010-12-26, 04:40   Link #454
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Westlo View Post
Damn I wish I could find a way to not get spoiled on this and still post on anime forums... hm catch a flight to Tokyo and just watch in in the cinema raw?
Everyone used spoilers tags when the first film was released in cinema, so you should be alright. You just gotta know where to dodge.
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Old 2010-12-26, 04:53   Link #455
magnuskn
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Originally Posted by ippus View Post
Actually I wouldn't call it a mistake. I might not have LIKED the cop out ending, but the fact remains I'm still rabidly checking forums on the movie simply in hopes of knowing if they'd come to a conclusion in the movie. Macross F is still fun for me because of that cop out :/
Oh, I think the inconclusive ending was the cause of much furious discussion for the next year, no dobut, but my point was not that it was good for this forum, but that it was simply incredibly bad storytelling and a repeat of that would be even worse.

Point in case:

Quote:
Originally Posted by ippus View Post
That being said I do really want a resolution just because this is suppose to be the end T_T THIS IS SUPPOSE TO BE THE END DAMMIT. I can't take another cop out hit, just can't Q_Q
As for Ranka:

Quote:
Originally Posted by ippus View Post
And no I totally won't go with a Ranka/Alto ending :'D Movie-verse or not, the fact remains that if her side of the argument won, it would be on the basis that the ENTIRE environment and reaction of that one character is completely changed just for the sole purpose of making her look good. That's just too pathetic for me. IT'S PATHETIC.
It doesn't speak to confidence into the appeal and the storyline of the original character, true enough.
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Old 2010-12-27, 03:29   Link #456
pinoy78
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TRAILER IS UP!!!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GugClf1Em1M&
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Old 2010-12-27, 04:47   Link #457
magnuskn
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Seems to be 99.9% new material.

Hm, clever inversion of the grand image of Sheryl and Alto hugging before the big panorama window in ep 24. Also much teasing of Sheryl and Alto being in danger of dying. Funnily, it seems that Ranka seems to be the one who is least in trouble in this trailer.

They seem to still have kept the Vajra storyline, although it is very clear how much the fighting will be with them. Sheryl in her military outfit with the bird-human flag still makes the further storyline seem pretty new.

Thanks for posting the link!
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Old 2010-12-27, 05:06   Link #458
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I don't want to jinx it, though going by that trailer, it looks like the film will 100% deliver with what most of us want to see. Brilliant.
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Old 2010-12-27, 05:45   Link #459
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Well, somehow I think a AltoxRanka ending quite more likely than before, but we'll see.
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Old 2010-12-27, 06:22   Link #460
Westlo
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Originally Posted by Yot-chan View Post
Heh. You've never talked to Mari about it, have you?
Oh she certainly got typecast and I would hate for that to happen to anybody but I really doubt she would've had a more successful career sans Macross. So in the case of her being bitter about Macross is kinda like biting the hand that feeds you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yot-chan View Post
I don't follow any of them, so I don't know. But there was a HUGE amount of rage about the ending of Macross F, was there not?
Non resolutions tend to do that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Elazul View Post
I couldn’t help but remember of KimiKiss. An anime that the director really got the balls to split the main character in two, it was a pretty good move. Talking more about it would be quite spoilerish, but it worked really well in the end, because they are really different and had opposite “approaches” while they’re pursing a relationship, and so on the most interesting girls ended up as winners, it was sure a satisfying ending to me.
But sadly, I heard somewhere that KimiKiss anime ended up as a commercial failure. Is it a sign that the Japanese otaku community are against new ideas in romance anime?
Well Kimikiss was a commercial failure, Amagami has sold like 2-2.5 times as much if not more. I think the biggest mistake Kimikiss did was it tried to go above it's level (otaku lol), same deal as the Hatsukoi Limited manga... I do admit I was pretty invested in the Mao side of things.. that and True Tears really got me into shipping.. I seemed to get on a roll with every prediction (wished vk ended so I can see if I was right about zero.. hurry up and die kaname) I made and than Frontier just goes and kills it.. never again..

Quote:
Originally Posted by magnuskn View Post
Really? Will it cause any more rage than the hugely popular romance animes? What possible argument is there, besides some marketing guys fearing that the studio will lose some $$$ from merchandising? The argument that the character or VA will suffer from the fact that Alto chose the other character is incredibly preposterous and stupid, sorry. I am truly at a loss how anybody can even come up with such terrible reasoning.
And who's to say they didn't lose sales due to this terrible non resolution, personally I was ready to order the Bluray set but this ending left a very sour taste in my mouth and I doubt I was alone in feeling that way.

I also noticed how quickly Alto and Ranka dropped down in magazine popularity polls after the series finished, it usually happens but this was very quick for people who were constant figures in the polls for around 6 months. I mean geez Ranka out polled Sheryl in Animage for like 90% of the airing time and than dropped off the face of the earth in those polls. While Sheryl who was barely top ten for the same period than goes on to become the runner up of the last two Animage Grand Prix Female polls to C.C and Yui respectively.

Quote:
Originally Posted by magnuskn View Post
In any case, making yet another bullshit non-resolution ending would be a huge mistake.
Couldn't agree more, it's not fair on the fanbase period This is not a Macross 7 situation where the triangle was just their, this is something they have made that carried the show. To not give resolution to something that dominated the show to the detriment of many other parts of it is just wrong. In a way I'm just not pissed at the lack of resolution but at thinking of how much better the show could've been if they had reduced the triangle even by 10% to focus on other things.

Quote:
Originally Posted by ippus View Post
Actually I wouldn't call it a mistake. I might not have LIKED the cop out ending, but the fact remains I'm still rabidly checking forums on the movie simply in hopes of knowing if they'd come to a conclusion in the movie. Macross F is still fun for me because of that cop out :/
In that regard the cop out ending was brilliant because if Sheryl had won in the tv series a lot of interest in a alternate dies down and even if they switched it up and made Ranka win in the movie, fans would just write it off as AU bullshit.

But Sayonara no Tsubasa is more than likely the last Frontier related anime project we will see before they move onto the next Macross anime. To cop out again would just be terrible.. and I don't know if I'll even bother with another Macross series if they did that.. and Macross is my favourite franchise in anime.. why bother getting invested in a series if they will just cop out time and time again.

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Everyone used spoilers tags when the first film was released in cinema, so you should be alright. You just gotta know where to dodge.
I highly doubt my VM and PM will be left alone no matter what happens. I'll like to be wrong but I doubt it...

Quote:
Originally Posted by magnuskn View Post
Well, somehow I think a AltoxRanka ending quite more likely than before, but we'll see.
I've been saying this for a long time (ask cheesie), I'm not expecting this to go Sheryl's way at all and I'll rather see a Ranka win (and make no mistake a movie ranka win does not mean she won the tv series) than another copout.
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