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View Poll Results: Claymore - Chapter 107 rating
Perfect 10 21 14.89%
9 out of 10 : Excellent 14 9.93%
8 out of 10 : Very Good 16 11.35%
7 out of 10 : Good 20 14.18%
6 out of 10 : Average 8 5.67%
5 out of 10 : Below Average 3 2.13%
4 out of 10 : Poor 3 2.13%
3 out of 10 : Bad 2 1.42%
2 out of 10 : Very Bad 1 0.71%
1 out of 10 : Painful 53 37.59%
Voters: 141. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 2010-09-05, 01:12   Link #1001
Ryus
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Tevourious View Post
Here's a horrible notion, what if Miria is alive, and has been dismembered? Meaning, the Orgz had those Claymore's hack her limbs off so they can run experiments on her.

Worst still, what if they use NO.10s abilities and whatever horrible techniques to brainwash her back under their control. They are skilled at breaking people obviously.


O.o


Though Honestly I think she met her end there.....
Yeah... the issue with this is that she was clearly a traitor so the standing orders are to kill. Since we heard no orders being issued we can only assume that they didn't spare her. Well, not entirely true since we can assume whatever we want but general logic suggests they killed her or at least tried to. So like you, I fear she's gone.

Now, I too have speculated quite a few ways she could be alive and of those the her being captured makes the most sense to me. I don't see Miria being brain washed... the process to break her would take far too long and I don't think #10 can keep using this technique indefinitely. My best speculation, imho, for her being capture involved Dea showing up and halting her execution... she still gets heavily injured and is near death... Dae then states that he's planning on implant her with one of the two rods in Raki (Dae orders #10 to yoki heal just enough to keep her alive until Rakis hellcat rod can be extracted, This way she stays out cold but doesn't die). The effects of the rod on such a wounded warrior, partially awakened or no, would likely destroy much of her mind... meaning maybe she could then be brainwashed. As horrible as this would be for Miria, I find myself hoping for it since the execution of all this was just not as good as it could have been. The writing felt far too forced in my mind, there was some nice ideas in the chapter but the set up for it killed me.

Edit: My logic for this is that Dae called Raki the host and not the specimen. So to me that means Dae views Raki was a bonus but the rods as the weapon he so needs. His first priority will be infecting someone with a rod to gain more of them... then weaponize them. A helpless traitor lying at org hq is a perfect person to infect for him (convenient too) since if she awakens she'll likely be able to shoot more rods... when a human child being infected might not be powerful enough to do that. Followed by studying Raki and figuring out just what he is.
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Old 2010-09-05, 01:33   Link #1002
SagaraSouske
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Korinov View Post
I don't see it that way. At all. Her hesitation about killing the twins causes her to not fight at full force, what gives advantage to the twins, what forces Miria to release yoki to not be killed, what allows Raftela to mindfuck Miria. Had she killed the twins without hesitation, she probably wouldn't have needed to release yoki and then, after sensing Raftela (who went unnoticed because Miria was fighting two people who release a huge yoki due to awakening), she would have kicked her ass the same way she did to Audrey, Rachel and the others.
I don't dispute she hesitated. But as I said, she would be forced to release youki even if she didn't hesitate. It is just as easy to construct another scenario to force her to raise youki. So her death really isn't cause by hesitation but by the fact that #10's ability existed and she is alone.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Korinov View Post
You seem to forget that Miria only took the decision of attacking Staff after she got interesting info from Dietrich. If she hadn't known Alicia and Beth were off, she would have never attacked. As I've said many times, she just saw a chance and bet hard on it... it was risky, but again, knowing #3 and #5 were no match for her, Miria's decision was not illogical, not even emotional then. A successful attack would have destroyed the Org... too tempting for someone who has made revenge her ultimate goal.
I didn't forget that fact at all. What I am saying is as the leader of the ghost, knowing your friends are at risk, knowing that you can either go help them or go solo against the org, and knowing the info about the AFs and Isley's death, how can she not evaluate the chances of the Org not having something else in store and how can she not see that saving her friends and have the full force of ghost together give her much better odds? She clearly didn't know about the existence of AFs even if she did know about Alicia and Beth prior to 7 year skip. A far more wise decision and one that Miria's character would have made is go help Clare and co. Revenge is her goal but not at the expense of her friends. Otherwise she would not have injured Tabitha so that she cannot go with her, nor would she spare claymores in the Org if revenge was her ultimate goal. And seeing that the impetus of her revenge came from how claymores are being used and tossed away by the Org like Hilda was, she would put priority on saving her friends and claymores over exacting revenge in a high risk situation.

If the Miria that just saw Hilda dies is making this decision, I will agree it makes sense. But her character has grown past that. She makes rational decisions based on saving other first as a leader, shown in both slasher arc and pieta, and even against Agatha. Yet some how she pulls an 180% here.
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Old 2010-09-05, 01:39   Link #1003
SagaraSouske
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Quote:
Originally Posted by MalakTawus View Post
@Sagara:
Well,going to "save" her friends at that moment would have been REALLY useless,a lot more useless than attacking the org......and it seems you don't understand a simple fact:Miria attack happens BEFORE her friends are in deep sh*t,not after,so there was absolutely no real reason to go help the others........
......but even if that wasn't the case (and it is) in a scenario with A&B,Riful,AF,the destroyer with her minions and a bit later even Priscilla,there is nothing that Miria can do,she is strong,but those powers are on a completely other level.
Between the ghosts only Claire has the potential to fight at that level thanx to her mysterious powers,no one else.

I absolutely don't agree that Miria acted out of char,in previous page (pag.48) i explain why,if you are interested take my reply from there.
I read your rational on page 48. We as readers know that if she goes to help Clare and co, it may not do much. She however does not have that information. All she knows that her friends are in danger and the org is vulnerable. So as the way you described her that her friends are important to her, it should not even be a contest on what choice she should have made. By your characterization of her, she is acting out of character.
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Old 2010-09-05, 02:04   Link #1004
SagaraSouske
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Aimless View Post
1. The Org., as has been amply demonstrated in past threads, chronically and severely underestimated Teresa's skill. They thought Irene et. al. would be enough to win (especially with Priscilla). You don't show your trump card if you don't need it.
So they don't need it against Teresa but need it against Miria? Miria is actually stronger then Teresa? Even if they underestimated Teresa, she is still a No.1 and Miria was only a No 6 (remember that Org still didn't know about half awakening).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aimless View Post
2. Rafaela was #1 strength in her own right, was cloaked, and was being sent against warriors who posed no threat to her. You don't show your trump card if you don't need it.
If #1 str warrior is all you need to counter rebel claymores, why create #10? Just create more Rafaela or #1 str warriors to be counters. The cloaking can be learned by any claymore as Rafaela and ghost showed. She was sent to eliminate Irene, who would have posed a serious threat to Rafaela if she didn't give her arm to Clare. Org doesn't know Irene has no arms.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Aimless View Post
3. The difficulty in catching Galatea is in approaching her without her sensing you. To have any chance of getting close at all, you must approach while taking youki suppressants (and even that fails). Ergo, the Org. sent a warrior who could be effective while taking the suppressants (and her minder), rather than a warrior who would be completely useless under those circumstances. You don't show your trump card if it doesn't work.
Is it hard for Miata/Clarice to find Galatea and report back to the org and then send #10 with them to track Galatea down? Galatea sensed them anyways and the pill being a way to avoid being detected doesn't stand as a reason.

~

The way I see it, this No 10 didn't exist from the start (at least when Yagi first create the story). It existed now as a plot device to eliminate Miria and create another "shocking death". Just like AF is a plot device to eliminate Isley - what other use did the AF have since then?
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Old 2010-09-05, 02:23   Link #1005
germanturkey
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Quote:
Originally Posted by WhiteWings View Post
Claymore is one of those series where its monthly production as compared to weekly production is driving me crazy. At this rate I'm going to sending my kids to college by the time it is finished and I'm not even married yet!
.
this. i've been reading it since middle school, and now i'm a senior in college.

either way, until we get conclusive evidence that she's dead, (ie, body) she'll be in doubt. for all we know, maybe she became so good that she's able to make a shadow form of herself. its reasonable to think that they became much more powerful than we know in the time skip, and very little of their potential had actually be shown.
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Old 2010-09-05, 02:27   Link #1006
Jean Claymore
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Answer to Kinematics

Spoiler for size:
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Old 2010-09-05, 02:27   Link #1007
An4rchy99
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Spoiler for Some points abt Raftafy:


This is my collective/rationale about the introduction of no.10. She maybe a plot device to kill off Miria, but it is not illogical or bad plot mechanism to introduce her. In fact it just enlightened us on two things:

1) The org has special measure to deal with rebels or internal threats.
2) Overall battle potential of the org is very weak as things are at the moment.

Now I know why most people find it hard to digest Miria's death. Not just coz of her character inconsistency but her decision to go alone. IF we take a moment to analyze who Miria is it would make sense.

1)Early days she was an ambitious loyal soldier like any other (I don't see why Yagi would show us Miria's past if we aren't to conclude that Miria has her share of emotional trauma).
2)Overly emphatic at the loss of her friend (where she took her oath of vengeance).
3)Created an exterior shell of calmness to mask her burning desire to take revenge and followed orders normally.
4)Overly protective of comrades and friends and again overly emphatic over their loss.
5)Cry over when things don't go according to plan and relies on friends to comfort.
6)Her impulse to take revenge took precedence over logic to wait for allies is not totally out of character considering she is like Clare in her heart not to burden others with her personal vendetta.

This character evaluation doesn't make it too strange that she took the course of action she did, did she? Now I am not saying that she is a bad strategist or a leader... she just couldn't resist the opportunity presented to her.

Now my only argument is why didn't Miria take a precautionary measure before she left? For all we know she might even fall to simply yoki manipulation aka bodyfrak. I only wish there was some kind of explanation to that. Even in Pieta battle it's clearly implied the weakness to body manipulation and only Clare could overcome it with her berserk hand. Now Miria for a fact living with Taby and Cynthy or after meeting Gala would know surely of the uberness of this ability. Why didn't she prepare herself, like take a suppressant pill. Its not like the ghosts need yoki to disperse the new generation claymores. And Miria excels at yoki sensing as well. Can someone counter this argument?

EDIT: ah Jean Claymore you beat me to a response. I would check out your long post a bit later.
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Old 2010-09-05, 02:51   Link #1008
Gooral
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SagaraSouske View Post
So they don't need it against Teresa but need it against Miria? Miria is actually stronger then Teresa? Even if they underestimated Teresa, she is still a No.1 and Miria was only a No 6 (remember that Org still didn't know about half awakening).
Teresa didn't invade Organization's HQ. #10 would have been left in HQ precisely for such emergency. They wouldn't leave themselves completely defenceless, and they wouldn't go for overkill since they were sure #2-5 will be enough for Teresa. What you're suggesting is that they used everything they've got to kill Teresa that wasn't even a bother to them and tried to stay low. As Aimless said, you don't use your trump card if you don't need to, he wrote that 3 times and you still don't get it . MiB used on Miria warriors #3-47, then shrimps and then their trump card. They wouldn't even use shrimps if they didn't need to. On Teresa they also used some random warriors first, when that didn't work they used more drastic measures.
Besides, they wouldn't risk losing this trump card to Teresa. They knew she was exceptionally good in youki sensing and #10 would stand no chance in a fight against her. It would be a gamble that she wouldn't detect her, maybe she would, maybe she wouldn't but losing their #10 and revealing to other Claymores they have mind scrambler wasn't a good idea. If Claymores knew there was sth like that it wouldn't be their trump card and rebellious warriors would be prepared for her.

Quote:
If #1 str warrior is all you need to counter rebel claymores, why create #10? Just create more Rafaela or #1 str warriors to be counters. The cloaking can be learned by any claymore as Rafaela and ghost showed. She was sent to eliminate Irene, who would have posed a serious threat to Rafaela if she didn't give her arm to Clare. Org doesn't know Irene has no arms.
And they are creating more of them. They can't overdo it however since they wouldn't be able to control all of them. Their ranking system and diversity of warriors make it harder for Claymores to rebel. If #1 rebels you send #2-5, if #2 rebels you send #1. If however there would only be Claymores of Rafaella's strength they would have too much of an advantage over MiB (if they were able to do that they wouldn't do it on the island but on a continent, it was their experimenting ground and they didn't need such big power here). Claymores would have too much power and in case they awakened the island would be overpopulated with abyssals. In case they rebelled they wouldn't be able to stop them. With Raftela is a different story. She was weak enough to deal with her in case sth happened.

Quote:
Is it hard for Miata/Clarice to find Galatea and report back to the org and then send #10 with them to track Galatea down? Galatea sensed them anyways and the pill being a way to avoid being detected doesn't stand as a reason.
You're missing the point. You don't use your trump card if you don't need to. Why go such roundabout way if you have enough power to take Galatea down? Unless you want to say that someone stronger than Alicia wouldn't be enough to kill Galatea from MiB's point of view?

Edit:

Quote:
Originally Posted by An4rchy99 View Post
Now my only argument is why didn't Miria take a precautionary measure before she left? For all we know she might even fall to simply yoki manipulation aka bodyfrak. I only wish there was some kind of explanation to that. Even in Pieta battle it's clearly implied the weakness to body manipulation and only Clare could overcome it with her berserk hand. Now Miria for a fact living with Taby and Cynthy or after meeting Gala would know surely of the uberness of this ability. Why didn't she prepare herself, like take a suppressant pill. Its not like the ghosts need yoki to disperse the new generation claymores. And Miria excels at yoki sensing as well. Can someone counter this argument?
Miria most probably assumed that for this ability to work on her she would have to release youki (which she didn't do voluntarily in this fight). As for taking a suppressant pill, didn't she give it all to everyone in Pieta? Plus she couldn't have known she wouldn't need to release her youki (and even if it was possible to break through suppressant pill's effect it would take some time). And about Clare being the only one that could overcome turtle's youki manipulation - not true. Undine could do it also. The problem was this turtle could also make Claymores awaken but for partially awakened Claymores it wasn't much of a problem.
Also, saying that Miria excels in youki sensing is a stretch.

Last edited by Gooral; 2010-09-05 at 03:19.
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Old 2010-09-05, 03:41   Link #1009
clarakiss~
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i don't see why the org would want to keep miria alive. she's a traitor and rubel wants her dead since she's an half awakened claymore. they made that perfectly clear to everyone by chopping her up.
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Old 2010-09-05, 04:07   Link #1010
LONEWOLF13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by clarakiss~ View Post
i don't see why the org would want to keep miria alive. she's a traitor and rubel wants her dead since she's an half awakened claymore. they made that perfectly clear to everyone by chopping her up.
Thats true but.

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Old 2010-09-05, 04:43   Link #1011
Lynn Alstreim
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Is there any possibility that #10 got moved when seeing Miria's memory?? Maybe there's some creatures and #10 wants to save Miria. So she create a scene that makes everyone think that Miria is dead. Then Miria can survive this.
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Old 2010-09-05, 05:25   Link #1012
MalakTawus
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SagaraSouske View Post
I read your rational on page 48. We as readers know that if she goes to help Clare and co, it may not do much. She however does not have that information. All she knows that her friends are in danger and the org is vulnerable. So as the way you described her that her friends are important to her, it should not even be a contest on what choice she should have made. By your characterization of her, she is acting out of character.
...........did you miss the part where i say that her friends weren't in danger 'cause this happened BEFORE that?
i admit that if she knew that her friends were in danger she would have gone to help (even if quite useless),but since they weren't in danger Miria didn't act out of character at all.

Quote:
I read your rational on page 48. We as readers know that if she goes to help Clare and co, it may not do much. She however does not have that information.
Well,this is just plain wrong.Even if Miria is not very good with sensing yoki,you can bet that she can feel the immense Yoki from all those monsters and since she's not stupid she knows that she is too weak,said that she would have gone anyway......but since this happens after she is gone to attack the org, this in not even a real problem.


About why the org didn't use n.10 agains Teresa Gooral and others gave you a perfect answer so it's useless to repeat it again.

OUT OF TOPIC:
@Shiek:You got a neg rep for that post?
Ahahaha!This is getting really ridiculous,the same thing happened to me (and probably others).
It seems that there is someone that is totally unable to accept different opinions,but anyway we shouldn't bother with someone that doesn't even have the backbone to put a sign.
Sometimes i even give rep to a post even if i don't agree with it, if i think that it's an interesting post that leads to good discussions.

Last edited by MalakTawus; 2010-09-05 at 05:43.
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Old 2010-09-05, 05:30   Link #1013
Blaat
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I have to admit the high amount of people who rated this chapter 1 out of 10 is rather amusing to see.
I've never knew there were so many Miria fans.
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Old 2010-09-05, 05:49   Link #1014
An4rchy99
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gooral View Post
Miria most probably assumed that for this ability to work on her she would have to release youki (which she didn't do voluntarily in this fight). As for taking a suppressant pill, didn't she give it all to everyone in Pieta? Plus she couldn't have known she wouldn't need to release her youki (and even if it was possible to break through suppressant pill's effect it would take some time). And about Clare being the only one that could overcome turtle's youki manipulation - not true. Undine could do it also. The problem was this turtle could also make Claymores awaken but for partially awakened Claymores it wasn't much of a problem.
Also, saying that Miria excels in youki sensing is a stretch.
Ok First off. Didn't two warriors with pills defect quite recently? (ie Miata and Clarice, I would assume they would carry extras, this is just a speculation though). Secondly she already met no.3 of the org wetting herself after sensing the real Riful, no.4 a mental nutcase and no.5 an impulsive muscle head; all of whom Miria could dispose with minimal effort. She already thought during her time that from no.5 up is a greater difference and why would she think otherwise now? Like you mentioned if this was the case why would she need yoki right? About the turtle yoki manipulator: Undine could not overcome it easily she went nearly went over her limit, and just managed to overcome death through sheer will and muscle force which I assume Miria won't have (I assume she isn't as strong physically). Second for HA to overcome him they had to go over the limit and comeback. Now this feat is only easily achieved by Clare and then by Deneve (as no one else from the ghost go over the limit like that as far as we have seen). Miria's own conclusion is that this is very difficult to achieve plus I would not assume someone who is a claymore would have that much power to manipulate. The level would be similar to Gala level of tweaking. This would still mess things up I would assume. And finally during the encounter with the turtle Flora concluded that Clare overcame it with QS attack (ie berserk right hand). And Miria is a good yoki sensor (I am not implying she has PYS or anything, she just detect other claymores well, just to clarify things).

And hey this is just a speculation, it raises a valid argument don't you think. I would agree she didn't take this measure only if she had no access to it. Otherwise I find no reason to it.
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Old 2010-09-05, 05:52   Link #1015
MalakTawus
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Quote:
Is there any possibility that #10 got moved when seeing Miria's memory?? Maybe there's some creatures and #10 wants to save Miria. So she create a scene that makes everyone think that Miria is dead. Then Miria can survive this.
Imo it's not a possibility.......not to mention that there is a good chance that Rafty doesn't see her target memories,she simply mess with their subcounscious "from outside" (i don't know if i'm clear here).

Quote:
She already thought during her time that from no.5 up is a greater difference and why would she think otherwise now?
This is valid ONLY for her generation,it's not a general rule.....

@An4rchy99:
Bringing pills is obviously quite useless.Consider this:Miria has completely suppressed her yoki,so IF she decide to use her yoki it means that she has no other option,so why should she bring pills if using them gives you problems (problems that you absolutely DON'T WANT while you are in the middle of enemy's HQ).
Anyway risking to use yoki and being a target for yoki manipulation was only one of the 1000 things that potentially could have gone wrong atacking alone the HQ(and it wasn't even the greatest risk),and probably she didn't aspect that the org had someone as good as Gala in yoki manipulation.

Last edited by MalakTawus; 2010-09-05 at 06:04.
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Old 2010-09-05, 06:04   Link #1016
An4rchy99
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@ Malak. Im not implying it as a general rule. Im saying from Miria's perspective she assumed her generation like that, and probably had a similar view of this one after witnessing the other claymores of this generation.

Hey I just wanted to put in an alternative idea here. It gets a bit tired when people go on on about "why Miria? why????" Its just better to ponder on other ideas and move on don't you think?

EDIT: Ok I admit attacking the org at all at this point in the set of of circumstances was a mistake itself. Im arguing for the sake that she didn't make a bad choice by going in like she at that point of time with the information she had. She already was confident with the current skill set she had (ie meeting with 3,4,5). She COULD already dispose them without yoki. But SHE already have seen yoki manipulation, so out of a 1000 things that could go wrong, she knew one of them and why not she take some measure about it? Ok its a stretch. Im just saying she didn't make a stupid choice by making the decision to attack at that point of time. Obviously like you said if she needed yoki, she is screwed. But then she would also know that no yoki, no yoki manipulation. I guess in the end, all we can say is she got too confident in herself.

Last edited by An4rchy99; 2010-09-05 at 06:35.
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Old 2010-09-05, 06:15   Link #1017
Ryus
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lynn Alstreim View Post
Is there any possibility that #10 got moved when seeing Miria's memory?? Maybe there's some creatures and #10 wants to save Miria. So she create a scene that makes everyone think that Miria is dead. Then Miria can survive this.
Since she's trained to kill fellow warriors, I'd say it's safe to assume no... That and the fact that she looks like Rimto impies she's an evil emotionless bitch who'd never spare Miria without personal gain.

Spoiler for joke pic:


Quote:
Originally Posted by Blaat View Post
I have to admit the high amount of people who rated this chapter 1 out of 10 is rather amusing to see.
I've never knew there were so many Miria fans.
A good number of Miria fans gave it higher ratings... almost all of those who rated it a one have been complaining about poor writing with the events leading up to her death. Everything from going off character, this being made to happen rather than feel natural, to using a power that likely won't have much effect on the rest of the ghost, etc... depending on the individual. On top of that many of them where speculating she'd die before this chapter happened.

In Claymore I'd personally rate most of the chapters people die in as among my favorites, even for characters I like more. However this one just felt too forced to me as if the author went out of his way to make it happen rather let it just happen naturally. There was many good concepts in this chapter but the way it was presented had too many examples of poor writing elements. That said her death was very emotional... and therefore successful, as much as it pained me greatly to watch (I felt like I was hit by a train then eaten alive while I was dying).
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Old 2010-09-05, 06:56   Link #1018
MalakTawus
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Quote:
@ Malak. Im not implying it as a general rule. Im saying from Miria's perspective she assumed her generation like that, and probably had a similar view of this one after witnessing the other claymores of this generation.
Well,it's possible.
Personally when dealing with the org i think it's always best to think the worst,especially after seeing someone as strong as Miata as n.4
For all she knew there could be some other weirdos a lot stronger than their ranking,and if you think about it even in her generation there were warriors a lot stronger than their number,and her friend Claire is the perfect example.
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Old 2010-09-05, 07:05   Link #1019
An4rchy99
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You do point out a valid argument. She was curios about other warriors to the point where she even inquired if current no.3 was Gala. So I guess she didn't totally rule out some weird case like Clare existing in this generation. But in the end, she was over confident and her vanity got to her. I would also add that, though I have tried well to justify her rush Kamikaze attack and the miraculous kick in the nuts introduction to Raftafy, I cannot help but think that the writing was a bit forced to bring the curtain down on Miria (as Ryus mentioned).

EDIT: Gooral (below).

I totally forgot about the AF factor. Well you have raised the missing points that I looked for. After all this was a wild card idea hehe... So in the end as I just mentioned here in the above statement ... I do hope that in the next chapter or so we all find some comfort in knowing for what Miria died and the implication or ramifications.

EDIT again:

Exactly my point Gooral. I understand your point. I was pulling in some wild ideas. Didn't you just hate the way Miria went (plot wise)? I just wanted some reasoning though how ridiculous length I went to justify it. I know it was like a 1/10000 shot of having such an uber being their lol.

Last edited by An4rchy99; 2010-09-05 at 08:09.
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Old 2010-09-05, 07:06   Link #1020
Gooral
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Join Date: Jun 2007
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@An4rchy99
I wouldn't assume it if I were you. Clarice was in a very tight spot in the woods when her claymore got stuck, if she had spare pills I would assume she would release her youki and take her sword out and later she would cloak again. Since she didn't do it and since we know she's not a complete idiot (e.g. she could learn weak point of Galatea's trick instantly and could add 2+2 when she saw the swords) I'm guessing they didn't have spare pills any more (they've had more than one pill, which Clarice had to give to Miata every 24 h or so). There is also possibility that Clarice was so faithful to the organization she would die for them (doubtful as we could see how easily she left them) or that she was too weak to overcome pill's effect (but then we wouldn't know if someone as weak as Miria would be able to overcome them either, Miata had surely much more youki than her).
And I think you misunderstood me. I was saying that she couldn't have known for sure that she wouldn't need to release her youki. Audrey and other warriors were of no match fo her - true, but she knew about AFs and she knew that MiB wouldn't leave themselves completely vulnerable. She also knew about soul-link project. I don't know, maybe she assumed that she could take care of one pair of twins or that they wouldn't complete another pair but still there was a chance she would need to release her youki.
About Undine - it wasn't easy for her, nonetheless she managed to do it so it's not like what you've written (i.e. that only Clare could do it). And Miria has her phantom which relies on short BURSTS of youma power (I'm not sure how exactly does it work, whether she releases all of her youki to her legs for an instant or she uses some other trick but since she can use it without visible youki release in her cloaked version it's probably the latter). No matter what mechanics of it are it would surely mess up manipulation ability. In addition it has a certain range since plain Deneve's kick could save Undine. So Miria would be very difficult to control since she could teleport. As for forced awakening, Miria would definitely have higher chances than average Claymores. She could do it then, she probably would be able to do it later. There's nothing that indicates otherwise (Deneve and Clare could do it at least 4 times, Clare even 5 or 6 so why would you think Miria wouldn't be able to do it again?).
As for Miria, she is (was?) at best better than average youki sensor. Worse than Clare or Tabitha definitely so saying she excels in youki sensing is a stretch IMO.

Edit:
I'm not sure that you will buy my justification but here it is. Alicia and Beth leaving HQ was the same as Priscilla appearing before Clare's eyes! There was no better chance for revenge than this. She was a great strategist if she could look at everything calmly, without rush but with Alicia gone she was in a rush. In this case Miria couldn't wait, she couldn't have known that Tabitha could help her (or not, we don't really know how useful she could be). Obviously she was expecting something like the twins not some turtle AB. And waiting on Clare, Helen and Deneve would take too much time (she could wait forever for all she had known). They were the only ones that could keep up with her (in fact only Clare could keep up with her but Helen and Deneve wouldn't be left so far behind as Tabitha).

Last edited by Gooral; 2010-09-05 at 07:18.
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