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Old 2010-09-03, 03:42   Link #161
Marcus H.
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If Kubo does remember how Soi Fon failed to touch Aizen using her Shikai, the same can apply with Ichigo right now.

Aizen can't use his Shikai to Ichigo as of this moment.
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Old 2010-09-03, 03:55   Link #162
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marcus H. View Post
Aizen can't use his Shikai to Ichigo as of this moment.
Care to explain?
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Old 2010-09-03, 04:25   Link #163
Hov
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Originally Posted by roriconfan View Post
Care to explain?
Remember Gin's explanation on how to evade aizen's shikai?

Ichigo stopped aizen's sword this chapter using his hand
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Old 2010-09-03, 04:43   Link #164
Knjaz
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Quote:
Originally Posted by roriconfan View Post
Care to explain?
Battle between shinigami is a battle of reiatsu. (c) Aizen

If "X" shinigami reiatsu is singificantly higher then "Y", then Y attacks, special abilities and everything else wont work on "X". This is how Soi Fon shikai was stopped. (Bleach manga chp 391 pg 15-17. )
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Old 2010-09-03, 04:44   Link #165
ESkizzle
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Am I the only one who thinks all of this will come together and that it is useless asking all these petty questions?

I will feel like a fool if I'm wrong though
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Old 2010-09-03, 04:56   Link #166
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but ichigo has no reiatsu! meaning he is vulnerable to even a level 1 kidou from a drunken renji.
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Old 2010-09-03, 05:55   Link #167
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Originally Posted by ESkizzle View Post
Am I the only one who thinks all of this will come together and that it is useless asking all these petty questions?

I will feel like a fool if I'm wrong though
the point of a discussion forum is lost on this one...
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Old 2010-09-03, 06:05   Link #168
felix
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Originally Posted by DarkHollowIchigo View Post
I'm not sure if his bankai would make any difference at this state.
Is Ichigo even in bankai himself? Doesn't look like it. Frankly it's like we got a new character, seems some of the head smashing finally worked.

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Originally Posted by Freya View Post
Maybe secretly Jump has decided to slowly cancel Bleach.
The way the writing has been for a while now I wouldn't be surprised. Though unless someone can confirm bleach is not favored anymore by jump readers then even if the series were to become complete garbage if it sells they won't care, and it will just claw its way forward. Though I don't think bleach has been anywhere close to number one spot there anyway, 3 years ago it was at 14th place for Jump readers. However, last year it was 2nd best seller in Japan, so if it does end soon that would be some epic move.

I'm not sure how the relationship of mangaka-publisher works, but I'm sure Kubo has the power to put it on hold or end it right now, if he wanted. He does seem to be in a sort of slump given how bleach is pretty much going in circles (new Ichigo = Ichigo before conversion to shinigami training/powers) and copy/pasting characters from his earlier work Zombie powder; though arguably that's been going on for a while now.
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Old 2010-09-03, 06:10   Link #169
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lendial View Post
but ichigo has no reiatsu! meaning he is vulnerable to even a level 1 kidou from a drunken renji.
Good point. Do I see another Kuboic storytelling in the making?
Quote:
Originally Posted by felix View Post
3 years ago it was at 14th place for Jump readers. However, last year it was 2nd best seller in Japan, so if it does end soon that would be some epic move.
The mangaka really doesn't care about quality if it sells and the readers are content with BS. ZONK!
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Old 2010-09-03, 06:12   Link #170
poolfan
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Originally Posted by roriconfan View Post
Care to explain?
Unlike most of the Gotei 13, Ichigo has not seen Aizen's Shikai, and therefore is immune to the hypnosis.
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Old 2010-09-03, 06:14   Link #171
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^ That does not explain why Aizen doesn't just show it to him too.
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Old 2010-09-03, 06:23   Link #172
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Originally Posted by roriconfan View Post
^ That does not explain why Aizen doesn't just show it to him too.
Because Ichigo can easily avoid the hypnosis by closing his eyes if Aizen re-releases it? Aizen is pumped full of arrogance right now (actually a moment before). He probably thought it'd be beneath him to keep trying to release his Shikai in front of Ichigo.
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Old 2010-09-03, 06:25   Link #173
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Quote:
Originally Posted by roriconfan View Post
^ That does not explain why Aizen doesn't just show it to him too.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hov View Post
Remember Gin's explanation on how to evade aizen's shikai?

Ichigo stopped aizen's sword this chapter using his hand

lurk more plzz
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Old 2010-09-03, 06:39   Link #174
poolfan
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Aizen: It is done.
Ichigo: What?
Aizen: I've released Kyōka Suigetsu. You didn't blink once. You are now under my complete hypnosis.
Ichigo: You didn't do anything.
Aizen: It was too fast for your eyes to follow. I've perfected the speed of release for opponents like yourself. Now Ichigo! Face the wrath of 10,000 squirrels!
Ichigo: Lol FAIL. I've to actually see the release in order for it to work on me so try harder next...
Aizen (gotcha!): Shatter.....
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Old 2010-09-03, 07:44   Link #175
Kafriel
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Quote:
Originally Posted by poolfan View Post
Because Ichigo can easily avoid the hypnosis by closing his eyes if Aizen re-releases it? Aizen is pumped full of arrogance right now (actually a moment before). He probably thought it'd be beneath him to keep trying to release his Shikai in front of Ichigo.
Avoiding Aizen's shikai is impossible. Assume he attacks, what are you gonna do, close your eyes!? So he can release before or after you block, lock swords, fall for a freakin' lookie here, anything. It won't work on Ichigo only if the latter is touching KS the moment of the release, which is possible, since he can stop the sword with his bare hands.
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Old 2010-09-03, 08:59   Link #176
Sabaku Kyu
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Quote:
Originally Posted by felix View Post
The way the writing has been for a while now I wouldn't be surprised. Though unless someone can confirm bleach is not favored anymore by jump readers then even if the series were to become complete garbage if it sells they won't care, and it will just claw its way forward. Though I don't think bleach has been anywhere close to number one spot there anyway, 3 years ago it was at 14th place for Jump readers. However, last year it was 2nd best seller in Japan, so if it does end soon that would be some epic move.
I'm not sure exactly how it works either but, if a title isn't selling the numbers expected, the author can be forced to end the series early or put it on indefinite hiatus and in hope that the series can be picked up by another publisher eventually. Something like the former happened with Eyeshield 21 which rushed through a final tournament arc before ending (shame, because it was a pretty good series).

But the opposite can also happen and a mangaka can be pressured to extend the series past the intended ending if the series is at the height of popularity (DBZ).

Quote:
Originally Posted by Kafriel View Post
It won't work on Ichigo only if the latter is touching KS the moment of the release, which is possible, since he can stop the sword with his bare hands.
Yeah I wondered about that...

Does that mean anyone who touches the blade at release is immune to Aizen's shikai from that point on? Or does it mean just that particular attempt fails but they can still be hypnotized if Aizen releases again?
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Old 2010-09-03, 09:29   Link #177
Mr. DJ
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Quote:
Originally Posted by poolfan View Post
Aizen: It is done.
Ichigo: What?
Aizen: I've released Kyōka Suigetsu. You didn't blink once. You are now under my complete hypnosis.
Ichigo: You didn't do anything.
Aizen: It was too fast for your eyes to follow. I've perfected the speed of release for opponents like yourself. Now Ichigo! Face the wrath of 10,000 squirrels!
Ichigo: Lol FAIL. I've to actually see the release in order for it to work on me so try harder next...
Aizen (gotcha!): Shatter.....
hey...what is Squirrel Girl doing here!?
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Old 2010-09-03, 10:02   Link #178
sayde
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I've said it before and I'll say it again, avoiding Aizen's shikai should be nearly impossible (assuming Gin's method doesn't make one immune to it indefinitely). Since he can release without saying a shikai release command and his zanpakuto doesn't look any different in its' released state, you literally shouldn't be able to see or know it's coming. So Ichigo simply being able to close his eyes to avoid it shouldn't be possible unless he's now a telepath or Aizen decides to be stupid by announcing he's about to use it. Because otherwise, he shouldn't have anyway to know when he needs to close his eyes in the first place. For instance, he could've caught Ichigo with hypnosis on pg 11 of this very chapter and Ichigo would be completely oblivious to it.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Sabaku Kyu View Post
Does that mean anyone who touches the blade at release is immune to Aizen's shikai from that point on? Or does it mean just that particular attempt fails but they can still be hypnotized if Aizen releases again?
Basically this^^.
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Old 2010-09-03, 10:47   Link #179
Calca
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sayde View Post
I've said it before and I'll say it again, avoiding Aizen's shikai should be nearly impossible (assuming Gin's method doesn't make one immune to it indefinitely). Since he can release without saying a shikai release command and his zanpakuto doesn't look any different in its' released state, you literally shouldn't be able to see or know it's coming. So Ichigo simply being able to close his eyes to avoid it shouldn't be possible unless he's now a telepath or Aizen decides to be stupid by announcing he's about to use it. Because otherwise, he shouldn't have anyway to know when he needs to close his eyes in the first place. For instance, he could've caught Ichigo with hypnosis on pg 11 of this very chapter and Ichigo would be completely oblivious to it.



Basically this^^.
Gin was under the hypnosis, but he was touching the blade while the hypnosis was not active, thus for the time he was immune.

Aizen still has to perform a certain ritual to hypnotize someone which he has not done yet to Ichigo. For example, when Barragan was hypnotized Aizen asked him to look into his sword, in which time Aizen called out the swords name.

At the very least, Aizen has to call out the name of the sword to activate the shikai just as any Shinigami does.
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Old 2010-09-03, 10:55   Link #180
sayde
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I'm getting the impression that when some of you see the word "ritual" you imagine some sort of elaborate hard-to-miss sequence of events. When it comes to complete hypnosis, that's not the case.

The hypnosis ritual only involves one to
Quote:
show the enemy the release of Kyouka Suigetsu.
That's it. That's the entire ritual. In that sense, it doesn't feel like much of a ritual at all.

Quote:
At the very least, Aizen has to call out the name of the sword to activate the shikai just as any Shinigami does.
Shinigami who know Bankai don't have to say any commands to go shikai. *points to chapter 140.*
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