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Old 2011-01-17, 15:49   Link #901
Darthtabby
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I also find it interesting that I like this episode so much now when I found it so problematically ridiculous in the past. I guess I wasn’t as heavily steeped in the Macross mythos back then. (I found DYRL ridiculously cheesy when I first watched it back around when Frontier aired but found I liked it a lot when I rewatched it more recently.)
I find Frontier more cheesy now. When Ranka sang I just smiled and shook my head. Maybe cheesy isn't the right word for it, but it definitely a different feeling than the first time around.
Well, you either buy wholesale into the Macross mythos, or you don't.
There may actually be such a thing as an in between stance on that issue actually. I know for instance that while I've come to accept the somewhat ridiculous events of this episode after rewatching I still have some issues accepting parts of Macross 7.

I suppose in my case I do tend to prefer it when there's at least a decent degree of logical explanation for things. I much prefer the TV series version of Sheryl's Music For Courage scene to the movie version for instance because I felt the TV series version made sense while the movie one didn't (on the other hand the fact that I prefer the TV version doesn't mean I didn't find the movie one cool).

Getting back to this episode specifically and my view on it -things are a bit of a stretch but there's at least some logic that can be put behind what happened (Ranka showing up made the rebels feel their demands were being taken seriously, and they didn't shoot at her when she first showed up because most of them were too shocked by how she entered). So I guess I tend to think "good enough" and don't let it bother me too much.
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Old 2011-01-17, 18:54   Link #902
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Wait, so you really don't get the whole "Zentraedi are all dere-dere for singing" aspect of Macross? That's one of the big points of the franchise, that the power of music can move worlds, nay, galaxies.

Of course you'd need to have seen Macross 7 to see this being taken to its maximum level.
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Old 2011-01-17, 20:34   Link #903
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I think of the Macross mythos as being related to music in general, not only in terms of music’s effects on Zentraedi specifically. And even with the Zentraedi there are different degrees. In the first Macross culture was brought to the Zentraedi fleet by their spies and a cultural mania spread there. In DYRL it was handled in a different fashion which was less logical. I tend to prefer it when there’s some sort of logical explanation behind what’s happening in the musical bits but I have also enjoyed a fair number of the more ridiculous musical bits even though I think they’re ridiculous. (To cite a particular example –I thought “Fleet of the Strongest Women” was ridiculous but I also found it very entertaining and one of the best parts of Macross 7.)

So I guess I enjoy Ranka’s scene in this episode but also like to think that there’s some sort of logic at work as well. (I’m not going to deny that the Zentraedi really liking Ranka and her singing contributed to the successful resolution, but I have thought that perhaps there were some “logic factors” at work too.)

Keep in mind to that there’s a fair number of people who think Macross shouldn’t have the musical aspects pretty much at all. Compared to those people I think it can be argued that I fit in between.
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Old 2011-01-18, 01:22   Link #904
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With the Zentradi in SDFM, the main point seems to be about cultural dominance. Although we're repeatedly told that the Zentradi lack culture (how barbaric!), they still have one nonetheless (even military organizations represent a form of culture). The end result of the cultural clash with humanity is that the Zentradi become a kind of vassal state, with those trying to return to their old way of life becoming viewed as "rebels". Overall, there's a rather dark undertone to the whole thing, especially when you consider that "colonization" is one of the ongoing themes of the franchise.

With the Vajra, the point was more about cultural tolerance. Although the Vajra don't look particularly human (although you could argue that there's still an element of anthropomorphism at work in their design), we're lead to believe that they still have their own culture. The end result is one of mutual acceptance (at least on the live and let live level), with an element of cultural exchange as well (think of how the Vajra song "Aimo" is disseminated through and modified by human culture as it takes on different forms throughout the series).

The reactions to music, as well as the blend of dogfighting and music serve as a convenient metaphor for the underlying cultural struggles. After all, wouldn't you rather watch mecha combat than witness the gradual assimilation of one culture by another over the course of a few hundred years? Personally, my own attention span is more designed for the former.

On an unrelated note, Alto's fight with the rebel leader this episode isn't so much about culture as it is about whether a person's actions are determined by their "blood" (i.e. their inheritance). Alto declares war on his heritage, wins, and flies happily off into the sunset, girl in tow. Take that, Yasaburo.

The end? We shall see.
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Old 2011-01-18, 20:25   Link #905
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Mmm...while there certainly *are* issues with a real-world mirror in relation to the Zentradi, issues which Macross doesn't delve into, the situation in SDFM isn't like that.

The pre-SW1 Zentradi aren't a "warrior culture" as many of their theoretical counterparts in other SF series are. Instead, they are merely doing what they are told to do. Individvual Zentradi may take joy in their military accomplishments, but they were never given a choice in having those occupations. Their war has no ritual, no ceremony, and no honour. It's just fight and fight until they die.

I view the SDFM story instead as one in which the Zentradi are discovering that there is more to life than an empty war. They react to it as long-surpressed drives are unlocked, yadda, yadda yadda, you know the story.

They aren't "assimilated" because they weren't brought low by a weapon. They *choose* to collaborate with the miclones, and Warera, Rori, and Konda *chose* human culture, and so did many others. Not all of them were able to hack it, unfortunately, but the race wasn't crushed under the miclone boot heel.

If we're discussing "Fastest Delivery", remember that the Zentradi marines were livng a life simliar to their ancestors apparently unmolested *until* Temujin tried to start something. If he hadn't, those forces would likely have been left alone.

And those Zentradi labelled "rebels" are not simply living a life different from their acculturated norm. They, like Kamjin, Temujin, and the countless rogue forces in video games and alternate continuities, are posing an active threat to humanity. That is why they are being fought, not because they don't follow a party line.

I do have problems with the episode, namely that while I can buy some factions of Zentradi living at the fringes of the alliance, trying to adopt the way of their ancestors, I can't think that they would act just like the grunt Zentradi characters from the original series, only without being as interesting. It all looks set up to do a homage to the original series, regardless of how much sense it makes in context.

That, and it treats the friendly Zentradi as weak and disposable, which is pretty sad, even if they're minor characters.

(And while clone types of Zentradi are theoretically possible, clones of significant Zentradi characters popping up bugs me in a weird way.)
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Old 2011-01-18, 23:31   Link #906
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Episode 12 commentary
with Kawamori Shouji, Nakajima Megumi and director Kikuchi Yasuhito.

Starting with a little comment made at the end of this commentary:
12 was probably the most important episode of the series for Ranka, wasn't it?

Zentradi language:
created by Kawamori, it even has a script, which he had a senior designer help him with. A stamp of it was actually produced as merchandise in a bygone era.

Kawamori basically brought the Zentradi in just to be able to have a cross-universe trip. Of course the Vajra can't react to Ranka's song this early, and the Zentradi would give the best fan reaction (nosebleeds and all).

3:03 "Kira!☆"
This actually started off as part of the music
Megumi: (I was surprised) that I'd have to say "Kira" during the song
(but it ended up have a big impact. The creation of the music and dance was rather taxing for both Kanno Youko and the animators, what with Kawamori saying "It's still very weak" etc, that it didn't pack enough of a punch (it was very smooth at one stage).)
Megumi: I didn't know, someone told me, that internationally, that sign means "I love you"
Kawamori: really? That was a complete coincidence.
...[a bit later]...
Kawamori: ah, but I knew it right from the word go too (LOL).


04:39 Alto trying to do something
Megumi: Alto at this time was still quite cool.
Kawamori: So when did he (stop being cool)?
Megumi: hm...(a few episodes later?) but it was at this point that I started thinking that he'd been cool right from the start
Kawamori: true, something about how he keeps saving (Ranka). Perhaps him helping Sheryl is where you don't approve.
Megumi: Ah, that might be it. I might just be jealous.

6:35 Ai-kun, quarantine issues
Megumi: at first, I didn't know it was a vajra larva.
Kawamori & Kikuchi: Ah, good. It worked!
Megumi: When I realised it later, I wondered if it was ok that I didn't know.
Kawamori: Well, if you had known, you'd have been nervous/worried about it (and it would have showed).
Megumi: Other people asked me: "You didn't know!?", I was like "No, I didn't"
Kikuchi: We thought it'd be good if it could be seen as a lovable species.
Megumi: as if I was keeping a pet like a cat or dog - so that's what you did

from ~7:15, they talk about bit about storytelling, about creating engaging stories
Megumi: do you ever not know how a story will turn out?
Kawamori: Well, rather than setting a goal, we say that we want to ge tto the other side of the "mountain" [i.e. the trials and tribulations, I think]. E.g. we know what we'll be putting the character through, and on the other side of the mountain lies the answer. But not knowing 100% what's going to happen actually ends up making it more interesting. If you prepare too much/set too much in stone, you can't respond to other opinions.
Kikuchi: Even Yoshino-san (the writer) would discuss things with everyone, but what happens next might still be different.
Kawamori: sometimes, you get people who have to do things step by step according to a plan. It just so happens that we don't have any staff like that this time.

10:10 scene with Sheryl and Alto

Megumi: I didn't expect a scene between these two here. It's like there are a lot of threads running parallel to each other, and (why they're all here is) not something you'd understand from the first viewing.
Kawamori: Ahh, yeah, it happens quite often. The first time you watch something, if you compare it to watching it after you know what the conclusion is, you can see it completely differently. When you see plays and so on, different actors bring different things to their roles. But for TV and film, where that's not possible, (people) try to create scenes that you'd look at differently the next time around.

10:50 Michel and Luca talking about the new fold pack
Megumi: I love it whenever Michel-kun comes on.
Kawamori: Then next time, let's put you with Michel
Megumi: Because, I'm a fan of Michel-kun.
Kawamori: Then let's think of some ways to have you appear with him.
Megumi: Yay!
Kikuchi: he (Michel) does have some good points after all.

The eye catches are pretty amazing - the staff worked hard at them

Kikuchi: Kawamori-san is pretty unreasonable, just telling them "Please make one" and leaving it at that
Kawamori: Usually I have them make it, then take a look and ask them to change a little bit here and there. It's better this way, because the staff will usually make something that suits the material covered in the episode.

12:15 Alto in action
Megumi: I like this scene quite a lot.
...
Kikuchi: If you think about it, Alto was the most proactive protagonist that season.
Kawamori: you could say we were aiming for Basara levels. But in the end, the appeal of the two songstresses was too great [i.e. everyone was focused on them that they forgot about what Alto actually did/tried to do!]

13:55 Ranka's grand entrance
Kawamori: Ah, she's here she's here.
Kikuchi: Never thought we'd have to do (this kind of descent)
Kawamori: At first, we'd talked of her being in the palm of the Valkyrie, but of course, that'd be impossible
Kikuchi: Everyone was opposed to it
Kawamori: Of course they'd be annoyed. And if you look carefully, she's got a seat belt on.
Megumi: What what?
Kikuchi: Around the waist
[You can actually see this a bit later in the video]


The catch phrase was a bit of a challenge (acting, and in thinking it up)
Megumi: I asked if it was like Sheryl's "Listen to my song!" and was lightly told "Yup!"
Kawamori: It was actually "Please listen to my song" ("watashi no uta wo kiite!" following Sheryl's "watashi no uta wo kike!!") but we wanted something different from Sheryl's. So let's use "embrace"! And "everyone" and "the galaxy" got added after that
Kikuchi: "Everyone, let's embrace" didn't feel like enough, so we added "to the ends of the galaxy!"
Megumi: "Let's embrace" has the nuance of "let's cherish each other" - very Ranka-ish.
Kawamori: and there's a bit of duality here too, it could be "embrace me!" or "everyone, let's embrace each other"

17:28 Alto's flashback to his conversation with Yasaburo
Kawamori: Ah, he's here he's here
[I first listened to this part of the commentary last week when we were all discussing it in episode 11, so I kinda expected Kawamori to say something about it, but...]
Kikuchi: Speaking of (Yasaburo), is it true that he appeared in your dream?
Megumi: Yes, it's true.
Kikuchi: What happened?
Megumi: Ah, you don't know?
Kikuchi: I haven't heard (the details).
Kawamori: Well, it was on your blog, wasn't it?
Megumi: Well, Yasaburo-san asked me to marry him.
Kikuchi: Ohh!!
Megumi: He proposed to me.
Kikuchi: How did he ask?
Megumi: "Please marry me." (Boku to kekkon shite kudasai)
Kawamori & Kikuchi: Ohhhh...
Megumi: So I said, "is it ok to marry someone I don't love?"
(laughter)
Megumi: Then he replied "It's ok if love develops after marriage." And it ended as I was contemplating that.
(Ahhh)
Megumi: Actually, Yasaburo-san is my type of guy.
Kawamori: Really? Which parts?
Kikuchi: That you can't tell what he's thinking from his expression?
Megumi: Yeah, something like that. He's quiet, but it's like he's hiding a black heart.
(laughter)
Megumi: A nice person, but it feels like there's something there
Kikuchi: like, he has two faces.

19:50 The gorgeous sunset

Kawamori: At first, it was meant to be Aimo, but after I listened to Nekonikki, I thought it'd be nice and switched it
Kikuchi: yeah, (Aimo) didn't really match.
[hm...it might be just my ears, but are they calling this a 'date'?]
Megumi: There is an air of loneliness about it, but there's also happiness.
Kawamori: it's a cute song

Kawamori: and we just had to throw something in to ruin this nice moment.

And finally: the Macross ship
Kawamori: I was afraid that would would get the wrong impression, and be annoyed when the next episode didn't turn out like they expected.
Kikuchi: but we can't talk about that here.

And the ending sequence:
Kawamori: If we'd gone with the flow, it'd have ended up being really similar to the first Macross ending, so someone suggested this (following a valkyrie through the clouds).
Kikuchi: it was a really fresh idea.

[Yeah, it was kinda pretty]

[Hm...somehow, this commentary wasn't all that interesting to me. For example, I'm not all that impressed by the Zentradi language, because even though Kawamori made up a few sentences so that we don't just hear Japanese, it's not of the scale of Tolkein with elvish and dwarvish, which have pretty extensive grammars. Well...that's the linguist in me talking. I did find the Yasaburo thing amusing, even after they betrayed my expectations to talk about it. And yay! 3 week break (for me) - boy am I going to need it!]
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Last edited by karice67; 2011-02-26 at 03:40.
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Old 2011-01-19, 03:24   Link #907
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Thanks Karice! Well, we certainly didn' talk much about the Alto-Yasaburo thing this week.
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Old 2011-01-19, 08:10   Link #908
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@karice67 where did u get that from? may i clone it?

any source?
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Old 2011-01-19, 21:02   Link #909
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I like Sheryl's catch phrase better... or maybe I am just bias?

Well, Ranka really did stir things up here. I laughed at how the adviser or whatever Zentradi knew who Ranka was like he follows that kind of stuff every day.
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Old 2011-01-19, 23:19   Link #910
karice67
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^
I quite prefer Sheryl's too. Though Ranka's one is quite nice in the "everyone, let's embrace!" interpretation.


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Originally Posted by magnuskn View Post
Thanks Karice! Well, we certainly didn' talk much about the Alto-Yasaburo thing this week.
Yeah, I think we pretty much dealt with it last week. If there'd been anything relevant from the commentary, I'd have brought it up then, but there wasn't ^^;


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@karice67 where did u get that from? may i clone it?
Just for the record for everyone else: since I haven't really checked it, I'd prefer if you don't copy and paste the whole 'summary-translation' for another community, but feel free to link or quote portions of it (at your own risk, of course ).
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Old 2011-01-20, 19:23   Link #911
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The pre-SW1 Zentradi aren't a "warrior culture" as many of their theoretical counterparts in other SF series are. Instead, they are merely doing what they are told to do. Individvual Zentradi may take joy in their military accomplishments, but they were never given a choice in having those occupations. Their war has no ritual, no ceremony, and no honour. It's just fight and fight until they die.
There's a fairly substantial challenge involved in convincing the audience that a culture that is significantly different from their own is still, in fact, a culture. The concept of the "noble savage" as is typically presented in sci-fi and fantasy is still an exercise in anthropomorphism (re-humanizing the dehumanized, if you will), seeing as they are invariably given cultural traits that allow us to relate to them. Do we need to agree with or even understand a particular way of life in order for it to be considered culture?

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Originally Posted by Pterobat View Post
I view the SDFM story instead as one in which the Zentradi are discovering that there is more to life than an empty war. They react to it as long-surpressed drives are unlocked, yadda, yadda yadda, you know the story.
While there is an underlying theme of "music soothes the savage beast" at work in the domestication of the Zentradi, it is difficult to separate out music from warfare in Macross. Culture may be shown to be a means of stopping war, but culture is equally shown as a means of waging war.

I think that the thematic variations of the song 'Aimo' provide an excellent representation of how music can become a cultural weapon with which to conquer and destroy. Perhaps I'll bring this point up in more detail in episode 16.

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They aren't "assimilated" because they weren't brought low by a weapon. They *choose* to collaborate with the miclones, and Warera, Rori, and Konda *chose* human culture, and so did many others. Not all of them were able to hack it, unfortunately, but the race wasn't crushed under the miclone boot heel.
Assimilation isn't necessarily a forced change. It's a gradual loss of cultural identity.

That being said, most of the Zentradi participating in uprisings towards the end of SDFM seemed to be dissatisfied members of the working class who wanted to return to their old way of life. So there did seem to be a bit of good old colonial oppression in the air, at least as I understand it.

All this is without going into Max's parallel (and symbolic) domestication of Milia in SDFM. But that's a story for another thread.

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Well, we certainly didn' talk much about the Alto-Yasaburo thing this week.
I did, but nobody took the bait. Which means that the point was either so obvious that everyone agreed with it (unlikely), or I've once again failed to properly express my irony (likely).
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Old 2011-01-20, 20:15   Link #912
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I did, but nobody took the bait. Which means that the point was either so obvious that everyone agreed with it (unlikely), or I've once again failed to properly express my irony (likely).
I mostly was too tired and busy already to look at it in detail. I fear the next days won't be better, I can't even view the coming episode until Monday.
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Old 2011-01-20, 21:21   Link #913
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There's a lot of fascinating stuff here, but to me it just doesn't apply to the Zentradi's story as I see it. They were not forced into cooperating with the miclones, they chose to make the ovetures themselves, in a chain of events starting with Warera, Rori, and Konda looking at things that were never intended to chain up or harm them. The trio *choose* to defect becuase they liked what they saw, not because they were coerced or even deliberately enticed.

Likewise, nobody forced Exsedol and Britai and their fleet to betray Bodolza to the miclones--and these Zentradi commanders understood already that what they originally thought of as "secret powers" were just mundane things, so they didn't defect just becasue they wilted at the sight of a more powerful force.

Furthermore, there's just no real-world analogue to the way the Zentradi lived pre-SW1, which is a bleak existence that pushed aside natural drives for a single purpose.

When issues of race and prejudice and humans exerting control over the Zentradi emerge in the Macross universe, it's farther forward in the timeline, after they've spent more time among humans. I don't deny these issues exist (though the series dwell little on them), but the case in SDFM is pretty much a cut-and-dried case of some small segment of a race realizing they hated their destiny and tried to change it. Far from being brought low, the Zentradi are made stronger by their experience.

For the record, I *do* have issues with how Max and Milia got together, huge ones that spoil the romance of the characters, but I don't find it a metaphor for forced asimilation, as much as something the writers *thought* was sweet and romantic but that looks horrid to certain eyes.
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Old 2011-01-21, 04:45   Link #914
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Again, assimilation doesn't need to be forced. But I suppose I should have clarified this earlier.

A more contemporary (and perhaps more similar) example has to do with the import/export of cultural products (such as television, music, and movies). If one country's media is saturated with the cultural products of another, the original, local culture tends to fade away in favor of the one being widely disseminated. When that happens, you're bound to find the odd person who resents the loss of their old way of life, at which point cultural protectionism starts to creep into the picture.

You can't say that it's forced: after all, nobody made you turn on the TV. Likewise, nobody forced the Zentradi to watch Minmay. Yet there's a distinctly one-way transfer of information as it gets "broadcast" from one culture to another, from producer to passive consumer.

Contrast this with the Vajra in MF, where there's a bit of an ongoing exchange between the two cultures: the Vajra mating song, Aimo, gets disseminated widely throughout human culture when Ranka sings it. It's later appropriated by Grace, who turns it into a propaganda piece and a song of war against the Vajra. Later on, the same song becomes a point of reconciliation between the two species. There is no one "producer" and "consumer" in the classical sense.

I suppose this is also a reflection of the times. Cultural products aren't static, and they don't simply move passively from producer to consumer. A member of the audience can appropriate media that they encounter, and re-purpose it to give it new, previously unexplored meanings. The consumer is the producer. You only need to look to media on the internet to see countless examples of this.

I think the biggest issue that I have with the SDFM's presentation is that I just can't agree with the statement that "the Zentradi lack culture": it sounds like rhetoric. I can agree that it doesn't seem to be a very fun way to live (speaking now from my own cultural bias), and I can see why some of them would want to give up their old culture in favor of the glamorous one in front of them. But that unspoken attitude of "let's bring civilization to the savages" strikes a chord with some of the more disturbing trends in human history (without pointing fingers).

My point in passing about Max and Milia had to do with the politics of the situation; namely, that their public union was intended to symbolize the union of humanity and the Zentradi. Which is why their courtship and Milia's subsequent domestication (at least within the bounds of SDFM) also struck me as an unintentionally appropriate parallel.

I say unintentionally here because I recognize that both the issues that I raised regarding the Zentradi as well as Max and Milia's courtship are the product of a different time and a different place, so perspectives on gender and culture are bound to be different. Regardless, I do think that there is an interesting thematic contrast between SDFM and MF with regards to how culture is portrayed, setting aside my personal feelings on the matter. A "then and now", if you will.
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Old 2011-01-21, 10:33   Link #915
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IMO, assimilation requires intent, an active desire to suppress the wills of the smaller group that is being introduced to the larger group. If the smaller group adapts the traits of the larger group voluntarily, it's acclimation instead. The Zentradi have acclimated themselves to human culture, not been forcibly assimilated into it.

As I've tried to say, I simply can't conflate the Zentradi's situation with the various human-human oppressions in real-world history, because I do believe the Zentradi didn't have a culture, and because the Zentradi largely chose to follow humanity of their own free will.

Milia's situation is the only one where a Zentradi did not, but unfortunately had to be "awakened" to what her "true" desires were, in a way that is upsetting, partially because it is so far from the Zentradi norm.

Even then, I would guess Milia's thought of "I want to meet that man" while in the Miclone Chamber, was meant to suggest that she subconsciously desired Max from the instant she was shot down, which is another kind of unnerving.

The reason that the Zentradi don't have a culture is that, unlike all other civilizations, they are only dedicated to a single institution, that of the military machine. They have no choice in the matter, are not even instructed to think of a choice--they are the *product* of a civilization (the Protoculture) rather than a civilization itself.

Basically, since the pre-SW1 Zentradi had no choice in being what they were, and lead an extremely simplistic lifestyle, I can't think of them having a culture equivalent to the miclones, and being merely "different".

I *do* admit that it's also too simplistic to have allied Zentradi functioning as merely an extension of human culture, and would like to have seen a distinct Zentradi culture arise from their past and present experiences, one that was a little more nuanced than turning them into the stereotypical "proud warrior race". But perhaps that's too complex for Macross material.
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Old 2011-01-21, 12:29   Link #916
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This was the first time watching macross frontier or any of the macross series but I have to say I did enjoy watching infact so much that I marathoon the whole show before I had to work. the only reason I even caught this was cause I caught the first movie while tring to find something to watch while I was waiting for new IS epsode and then I saw the first movie in blue ray format so I took a gamble and I loved the movie mostly because of Sheryl and her music. Really awesome music and the whole ost was great. Even Ranka had some good songs in there even though I didnt quite like her charater disign I hated those like dog eared things she had but I couldnt get myself to hate her as a charater cause she seem like a nice and sencier girl(i cant spell and im to tired right now.) But I really liked the series the mecha fights where pretty good and I found them to be better then gundam series. The music is just amazing and saying that is a understantment to how good it was. Hell practly all of Sheryls songs have been stuck in my head for days now and Ive found myself humming to the songs at work. I also cant wait to see the second movie and more Sheryl and hopefully more music.
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Old 2011-01-22, 21:24   Link #917
DragoZERO
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Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: USA
Age: 28
Episode 13 - Memory of Global

Alto needs to take his own advice and not HIS past tie him down.

Alto and Ranka being stranded reminded me of the original Macross. I'm sure that was intended too. I really liked the scene with them near the stream. The music was superb, especially that playful score.

Sheryl always wears stylish lingerie. <3

Okay. So that Macross was found somewhere and then retrofitted and named "Global" or did they make it based on the original??

The air battle reminded me of Macross Plus so much... I have to watch that again.

Once again... someone stands there doing nothing waiting to be killed. What the heck people!?

And if the Vajra ship was already leaving the planet, wouldn't you be following it!?

Alto is... so stupid. I am really disappointed that he wasn't made a little stronger.
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Old 2011-01-22, 23:26   Link #918
woodearth
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Join Date: Oct 2009
Quote:
Originally Posted by DragoZERO View Post
Okay. So that Macross was found somewhere and then retrofitted and named "Global" or did they make it based on the original??
This one is suppose to be SDF-4. So it is another ship based on the design of SDF-1.
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Old 2011-01-23, 07:15   Link #919
Yot-chan
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Join Date: May 2009
Location: Tokyo
Quote:
Originally Posted by DragoZERO View Post
Okay. So that Macross was found somewhere and then retrofitted and named "Global" or did they make it based on the original??
I already answered that, didn't I?

Here:

Quote:
Originally Posted by Yot-chan View Post
No, that's not it, either. Humanity, after the original Macross, made a bunch of SDF-1 replicas, the SDFN series. This one is the SDFN-04 Global.

It was all kind of mysterious in the show, but they explained it in Macross Chronicle Magazine.

Quote:
Originally Posted by woodearth View Post
This one is suppose to be SDF-4.
Nah...the SDF-4 is a completely different ship from the SDFN-04.
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Old 2011-01-25, 00:58   Link #920
Darthtabby
Senior Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2009
The thing I remember most about this episode is the ending. It qualified this as a wham episode.

That being said, there are a few things that bother me earlier on in the episode. One is the unsubtle writing on that pill of Sherly's (would you take a medicine tablet that had "639 Witch Craft" written on it)? Another would be that thing that showed up that scared Alto and Ranka so much before they got a good look at it. That looked to me like a second stage Vajra but it's awfully small for one -Ai-kun was much bigger than that when he finally emerged in his second stage form. Then there's Alto's escape from the area the Vajra semi-queen was in -he surfaced from underwater, is that really plausible if the area he was in was at any great depth?

On the other hand the standing still in Alto and Brera's fight at the end didn't bother me all that much. Yeah I know it's not handled too realistically but it made for good dramatic effect. Just imagine that everything happened much more rapidly in the real incident. :P Also I really don't think Alto is stupid or weak. Brera would be a difficult opponent for just about any pilot. Klan also though she had him only to be caught off guard by a nasty counterattack.

And on another note rewatching this episode made me realise how much one of the scenes in my current fanfiction project resembles one of the ones in this episode. I seem to be having that crop up a decent amount with this particular fanfic.
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