2008-05-12, 13:38 | Link #41 | |
Illegal Additives
Join Date: Jun 2004
|
Quote:
Seriously, I'm wondering how a bad @SS military able to take on millions of enemy ships on a song suddenly find it difficult to run recon missions or a proper rescue operation. It's not possible that they've gone soft in the last 14 years that only a professional soldier is what goes for a proper job. |
|
2008-05-12, 13:42 | Link #42 |
Holy Beast ~Wuff!~
Scanlator
|
Zentradi's are borned soldiers, sure culture has soften them, but put them in the right situation and genetics will come forth.
Also i won't be surprised if they don't have full size zentradi space suits and weapons about just incase of an attack. After all they are in an unknown part of space and they must have manadatory evacuations and in dire situation plans to provide self defence for all colonist.
__________________
|
2008-05-12, 14:00 | Link #43 |
Macross Lifer!
Join Date: Jan 2008
|
does look like Nuns is getting cheaper. Haven't seen one VF 171 with a super pack yet
Also i wonder if they lost a lot of money from the VF-19 mass production line. Supposedly the VF-19 was supposed to become the next main style fighter of NUNS and yet we see the mass produced 171 instead . also anyone notice how that stage hand guy seem to kinda freak out when Grace answered that call with her "head". Foreshadowing on a culture clash between Galaxy and Frontier? Last edited by squaresphere; 2008-05-12 at 14:06. Reason: culture |
2008-05-12, 14:09 | Link #44 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2006
|
Quote:
Macross 7 had a bulk of VF-11's, a few VF 17's and VF-19's and a couple of VF-22's. Megaroad 13 had VF-14 Vampires for it's mainstay. They don't just built these thing I suppose they will have to pay the manufacturer. That's capitalism for ya. If your fleet government is cheap sorry. |
|
2008-05-12, 14:10 | Link #45 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2004
|
Quote:
|
|
2008-05-12, 14:20 | Link #46 |
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2005
|
Another thing to note is that the Macross fleets are ridiculously far apart from one another. Even if Macross 7 had seen tons of combat, that wouldn't help the UN Spacy forces in Macross Frontier at all. I think that each fleet can be thought of as separate countries in the sense that each is commanded and organized differently from the others. Furthermore, Ozma was in NUNS himself, but he doesn't have a very high opinion of them - he obviously knows something the audience doesn't know.
__________________
|
2008-05-12, 17:35 | Link #48 | |
Catholic = Cat addiction?
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: MURICA!!
|
Quote:
Although in the 'canon', its indicated that the VF-19 was too damn expensive, and the VF-171 was easy to mass produce, easy to maintain and easy to handle. Moreover, VF-19s would have been at least 20 years old by the events of Frontier. Pretty outdated, if you ask me. - Tak |
|
2008-05-12, 17:48 | Link #49 | |
Not Enough Sleep
Join Date: Nov 2003
Location: R'lyeh
Age: 48
|
Quote:
__________________
|
|
2008-05-12, 18:03 | Link #50 | |
Rank-and-file poster
Join Date: Oct 2006
Age: 40
|
Quote:
F-4 Phantom, Introduction 30th December 1960, "retired" to target drone service in 2001 F-15 Eagle, Introduction 9th January 1976, Still in service, planned to continue service until 2025. F-14 Tomcat, Introduction September 1974, Retired September 2006 Conversely, Macross Variable Fighters seem to have shorter careers before being replaced by something else. 1st Generation VF-1 Valkyrie - Production Began Nov 2008 - Production Ended March 2015 2nd Generation VF-4 Lighting III - Production Began Feb 2012 - Production Ended 2022 3rd Generation VF-5000 StarMirage - Production Began 2020 - Production Ended 2029 VF-9 Cutlass - Production Began 2023 - Production Ended 2029 4th Generation VF-11 Thunderbolt - Production Began Dec 2030 - Production Ended ??? (Late 2040s likely?) VF-14 Vampire - Production Began 2028 - Production Ended ??? VF-17 Nightmare - Production Began ??? (Late 30s? First prototype flights in 2035) - Production Ended ??? 5th Generation VF-19 Excalibur - Production Began 2041 - Production Ended ??? VF-22 Sturmvogel II - Production Began Dec 2042 - Production Ended ??? Now granted the Macross stats are manufacturing production runs, compared to service lifetimes of the USAF fighters. Most of those Variable fighters are likely still in service SOMEWHERE, whether in the Military or a colony militia or whatever (VF-5000 StarMirage were shown in use by the Zola Police force in 2045). And just like real life US fighters, I'm sure the older models have received modernization upgrades to avionics, engines, and other systems. I'm sure a VF-19, with it's exceptional performance, could probably keep up, or at least hold it's own, with a VF-25 if it received a systems update. However, America and other modern nations update theirs fighters because it still has the same ones on hand, it isn't constantly shipping them off with colony fleets. As mentioned the VF-19 probably was a very expensive fighter, and it's easier to just build new fighters for your new colony fleets than to update older fighters. I'm sure older Colony Fleets are still going around with updated versions of older VF fighters serving alongside whatever more modern fighters their factories may have produced during their voyage. Wow, this was a lot more long-winded then I had intended it to be. |
|
2008-05-12, 19:57 | Link #51 | ||
Catholic = Cat addiction?
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: MURICA!!
|
Quote:
Quote:
That will definitely change in the near future, of course. But, unlike World War II, where, in a span of 5+ years, the Germans had progressed from propeller-driven fighters to the mass production of jet interceptors. Or the United States, rolling out a new chassis almost every year. Of course, that was war, there were fierce competitors, and that was then. The technical progression of Macross is like in-between World War II and the Cold War. While new fighters aren't produced every year (as in WWII), UN SPACY certainly doesn't have the luxury of sitting on their butts for the next 3 decades then decide what new toy they should bring to the public. You will note that the production span of VFs is usually around 10 years or less. Yeah, we've seen the VF-11 in action in Macross 7, but they've been relegated to a supportive role than an actual frontline fighter. Of course, we've also witnessed the VF-1J in action, but you know, Milia rules. Although from a production point of view, we've already seen the YF/VF-19s in two consecutive Macross franchises, even Mr. Kawamori would be crying foul if we had to see it... again. - Tak |
||
2008-05-12, 20:41 | Link #53 | |
Catholic = Cat addiction?
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: MURICA!!
|
Quote:
Max, notably, piloted a VF-22 near the end while how Basara hijacked a VF-19 remains a mystery to everyone. - Tak |
|
2008-05-12, 20:54 | Link #54 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2005
|
Quote:
In-universe, we can simply put it down to different fleets deciding to field different variable fighters. We already know that the laws aren't uniform between fleets, so it's not a very big stretch.
__________________
|
|
2008-05-12, 20:56 | Link #55 |
Rank-and-file poster
Join Date: Oct 2006
Age: 40
|
The military gave it to him (discretely) as part of Project M.
And no, right up until the end the VF-11 was the bread-and-butter fighter of the majority of the fleet. It was the elite squadrons going around in VF-17 Nightmares and eventually Emerald Force was given a trio of VF-19 Excaliburs. With Max and Miria obtaining a pair of VF-22s. Even during Operation Stargazer (ep 44 of 49 eps) the majority of the "elite" assault force was flying VF-11s. |
2008-05-12, 20:59 | Link #56 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2006
|
Quote:
More like an experiment for Operation M with a single pilot/singer in a Valkyrie. Not to mention VF-19's are a hard sell for the manufacturer. WTF UN Spacy was considering making a AI fighter as their next mainline fighter. They're a bunch of cheapskates. Shinsei Industry and General Galaxy got screwed over. |
|
2008-05-12, 20:59 | Link #57 | ||
Catholic = Cat addiction?
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: MURICA!!
|
Quote:
But anyway, Macross 7 was silly. I mean, guitar for controls? Project M? Its not like they knew they were fighting an alien army that would respond to sound energy! Quote:
Regarding the in-universe explanation, while different fleet does practice different laws, I believe various categories of VF fighters are available to all the fleets. After all, Macross 7 had just about the same fighter composition as the world of Eden, and they were quite far from each other. - Tak |
||
2008-05-12, 21:06 | Link #58 | ||
Rank-and-file poster
Join Date: Oct 2006
Age: 40
|
Quote:
Quote:
|
||
2008-05-12, 21:11 | Link #59 | |
Catholic = Cat addiction?
Join Date: Jul 2006
Location: MURICA!!
|
Quote:
That and given the fact that UN SPACY vessels can communicate with Zent vessels directly, Project M seems... well, pointless. You know, they've done all that during Space War I. - Tak |
|
2008-05-12, 21:18 | Link #60 | |
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2006
|
Quote:
Nekki Basara can perform the G crunching qm-69 manuever without breaking a beat. That said I'm waiting for confirmation on my suspicion that the mysterious Valkyrie and pilot , who will also attend Mihoshi academy. Leon did say whether or not they will let the Vajra hear their songs which implies Macross Frontier has it's own version of Operation M. |
|
|
|